Our sport is guna die if we don’t start racing

RONJ OSE
Posts
352
Joined
3/15/2019
Location
USA
3/21/2019 6:13am
What we have to look at is how much does it cost to go to a national and be competitive.

Ok so every one has 2 bikes a class, If you run 2 classes thats 40k in bikes. then you have to have oils fluids and spare parts 10k a mechanic 30k then you need a RV or a truck/ trailer 50k minimum. And most people also end their kids to train so MTF 25k.

To be competitive (with no support) you are looking at 155k to go to a national! That is total BULLSHIT!

The blue collar guy who works 10 hours a day just cant afford A car payment a house payment food and all sorts of other crap.
This is a joke, just like buying trucks now. Ram wants 50k for a stripped down 4x4 2500 diesel! More bull shit.

Talked to a buddy at my local dealer. They make 2500 of a new 250/450 and the manufacturer make upwards of 3k! bikes only cost 2500-3000 to make and they sell for 10k plus. They are screwing us over!
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11
zippytech
Posts
1513
Joined
9/8/2018
Location
Bethesda, OH, USA
3/21/2019 6:13am
The biggest reason I quit going was ,

The hours of travel just to get to the track and like many have said here, the lack of track time. and the fact that it was always dark by the time we got home.
3
BobKerr
Posts
910
Joined
11/3/2017
Location
Nowheresville, TN, USA
3/21/2019 6:14am Edited Date/Time 3/21/2019 6:17am
I blame internet connected video games. There are kids in my neighborhood, but I RARELY ever see them outside. Many kids today just sit in front of the TV playing video games against their friends who are sitting in front of the TV at their house while all talking to each other over headsets.

That garbage is now being called Esports. If your body isn't moving, then it isn't a sport!
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1
Looby321
Posts
543
Joined
12/23/2018
Location
USA
3/21/2019 6:18am
Motocross is plenty affordable even for most people. Like any hobby or sport, you make it as expensive as you want it to be. People just...
Motocross is plenty affordable even for most people. Like any hobby or sport, you make it as expensive as you want it to be. People just have to be realistic with their finances and be real with what they can comfortably afford. Nowadays you can spend $2k and go race. You don't need to spend upwards of $10-15K starting out just to go to the track. You can find a decent used 125 for $1500 and get a full kit of gear for $500. My gear is not the latest and greatest. I usually buy new gear at the end of the season or when gear is on clearance at BTO sports because it is last years or the year before's styles. At the point we are at right now in this sport, gear companies have really stepped up their game in terms of providing great quality mid level to beginner riding gear at an affordable price. Where I think this whole, "motocross is too expensive" mentality is coming from is the fact that people see factory bikes online or these ridiculous bike builds and think that they need the latest and greatest in order to go to the track. As far as race fees go, quit eating out at lunch and pack one instead. That $50 that you would spend eating out at lunch each week is your race fee for the weekend. If people really want to get into this sport they will find a way. I know I have curbed my spending in other areas so that I have enough money to dedicate towards my hobby. If you need to, work overtime or find a better job to support your hobby. I have done both to support my moto addiction.
I’m a police officer, doubled my income because of overtime last year. Bring a lunch daily, I don’t have the luxury of eating out like a normal 9-5’er. There is a vast difference between cutting corners and getting in the sport dirt cheap, and doing it right with proper gear and having the bike set up for you. I stopped the MX racing scene years ago, I’ll go to a track during open practice with friends and have fun, as I get older, new hobbies are pursued. There is no reason to deny this sport is pricey.
1

The Shop

BobPA
Posts
8337
Joined
10/31/2013
Location
USA
3/21/2019 6:20am
RONJ OSE wrote:
What we have to look at is how much does it cost to go to a national and be competitive. Ok so every one has 2...
What we have to look at is how much does it cost to go to a national and be competitive.

Ok so every one has 2 bikes a class, If you run 2 classes thats 40k in bikes. then you have to have oils fluids and spare parts 10k a mechanic 30k then you need a RV or a truck/ trailer 50k minimum. And most people also end their kids to train so MTF 25k.

To be competitive (with no support) you are looking at 155k to go to a national! That is total BULLSHIT!

The blue collar guy who works 10 hours a day just cant afford A car payment a house payment food and all sorts of other crap.
This is a joke, just like buying trucks now. Ram wants 50k for a stripped down 4x4 2500 diesel! More bull shit.

Talked to a buddy at my local dealer. They make 2500 of a new 250/450 and the manufacturer make upwards of 3k! bikes only cost 2500-3000 to make and they sell for 10k plus. They are screwing us over!
Your “buddy” is full of it. No dealer is making $2500 off the sale of a 250/450. Divide that by 5 and most dealers would be thrilled....
11
RONJ OSE
Posts
352
Joined
3/15/2019
Location
USA
3/21/2019 6:22am
RONJ OSE wrote:
What we have to look at is how much does it cost to go to a national and be competitive. Ok so every one has 2...
What we have to look at is how much does it cost to go to a national and be competitive.

Ok so every one has 2 bikes a class, If you run 2 classes thats 40k in bikes. then you have to have oils fluids and spare parts 10k a mechanic 30k then you need a RV or a truck/ trailer 50k minimum. And most people also end their kids to train so MTF 25k.

To be competitive (with no support) you are looking at 155k to go to a national! That is total BULLSHIT!

The blue collar guy who works 10 hours a day just cant afford A car payment a house payment food and all sorts of other crap.
This is a joke, just like buying trucks now. Ram wants 50k for a stripped down 4x4 2500 diesel! More bull shit.

Talked to a buddy at my local dealer. They make 2500 of a new 250/450 and the manufacturer make upwards of 3k! bikes only cost 2500-3000 to make and they sell for 10k plus. They are screwing us over!
BobPA wrote:
Your “buddy” is full of it. No dealer is making $2500 off the sale of a 250/450. Divide that by 5 and most dealers would be...
Your “buddy” is full of it. No dealer is making $2500 off the sale of a 250/450. Divide that by 5 and most dealers would be thrilled....
thats what i was told they were making on a new ktm 450sxf.

dont know if its true just what i was told
7
zippytech
Posts
1513
Joined
9/8/2018
Location
Bethesda, OH, USA
3/21/2019 6:24am
I live in a small town, when I was a kid you could get bikes, sleds, bats, balls, all kinds of bike parts to fix bikes and more than a few stores in town had them. I don't even think you could buy any of that in the same town today..

You are right I never see kids out side, and the 20 year olds just want to huff fumes, and smoke there fake weed or what ever.

1
3/21/2019 6:25am
Lots of talk about cost in here. 25 years ago nobody had a $100 cell phone bill or $60 internet bill. There’s more expenses now. It’s may be as affordable inflation-wise as it once was, but the inflation of wages doesn’t match the inflation of the dollar.
6
Forty
Posts
3088
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Location
Saint Paul, MN, USA
3/21/2019 6:27am
If it’s your passion you’ll find a way to do it. It’s not a passion for as many people now as it once was. Any activity out doors is not an activity frequented by as many people as it used to. The kids aren’t interested.

On the other end the older people have the means and are retaining their physical abilities and are doing things and going places we never thought possible.

Our sport is in a low spot in its rhythm of popularity for sure.
3
RONJ OSE
Posts
352
Joined
3/15/2019
Location
USA
3/21/2019 6:31am
or that the issue is that 78% or americans live pay check to pay check.

if you live paycheck to pay check its simple you do not have 8k to drop on gear bikes and gas then entry fees.

I bet there is some kids who would love to race but their parents cant afford it
5
1
3/21/2019 6:36am
Motocross is plenty affordable even for most people. Like any hobby or sport, you make it as expensive as you want it to be. People just...
Motocross is plenty affordable even for most people. Like any hobby or sport, you make it as expensive as you want it to be. People just have to be realistic with their finances and be real with what they can comfortably afford. Nowadays you can spend $2k and go race. You don't need to spend upwards of $10-15K starting out just to go to the track. You can find a decent used 125 for $1500 and get a full kit of gear for $500. My gear is not the latest and greatest. I usually buy new gear at the end of the season or when gear is on clearance at BTO sports because it is last years or the year before's styles. At the point we are at right now in this sport, gear companies have really stepped up their game in terms of providing great quality mid level to beginner riding gear at an affordable price. Where I think this whole, "motocross is too expensive" mentality is coming from is the fact that people see factory bikes online or these ridiculous bike builds and think that they need the latest and greatest in order to go to the track. As far as race fees go, quit eating out at lunch and pack one instead. That $50 that you would spend eating out at lunch each week is your race fee for the weekend. If people really want to get into this sport they will find a way. I know I have curbed my spending in other areas so that I have enough money to dedicate towards my hobby. If you need to, work overtime or find a better job to support your hobby. I have done both to support my moto addiction.
Kids who have had new bikes and gear from dad for the last 14 years aren’t going to ride a $2000 bike when they turn 18 and have to pay themselves. It’s not as affordable as it once was. There’s no doubt. The amount of people who get out when the financial burden falls on their shoulders is baffling. Just another of the hundreds of reasons not to continue.
1
captmoto
Posts
5907
Joined
4/22/2009
Location
Rancho Cucamonga, CA, USA
3/21/2019 6:37am
Dude run the 10 hour endurance race at Glen Helen with me in June. I’ll pay our gate fee. could use a teammate such as yourself...
Dude run the 10 hour endurance race at Glen Helen with me in June. I’ll pay our gate fee.
could use a teammate such as yourself

Edit: Wait never mind. It’s on Father’s Day and seeing you’re a dad, probably wouldn’t be the best to have you prioritize a race over your kids.
Why not? It's FATHERS day. Let dad do what he wants.
1
3/21/2019 6:40am
Most Mixed age UK clubs run:

1)65 class
2)85 class
3)250F youth
4)250F adult
5)450F adult
6)Vet open

Do what you like with the bikes.

Most classes full. 1 Practice and 3 races a day.

Vintage is simple too:

1) Twinshock If more than 80 entries this is sometimes split into over 50s and under 50s
2) Evo Pre 89

Are the most popular. There are some other classes like Pre 83 125.

No Pro, No A, No B, No C for every age or capacity..............

Keep it simple and get the riders back on the line.
3
Tarz483
Posts
6344
Joined
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Location
Mankato, MN, USA
3/21/2019 6:42am
RONJ OSE wrote:
or that the issue is that 78% or americans live pay check to pay check. if you live paycheck to pay check its simple you do...
or that the issue is that 78% or americans live pay check to pay check.

if you live paycheck to pay check its simple you do not have 8k to drop on gear bikes and gas then entry fees.

I bet there is some kids who would love to race but their parents cant afford it
I think this is a huge part of it , so they buy there kids phones and video games because they feel guilty
, but i think all of the reasons mentioned are valid, For me its financial, for others its other things.
Just because inflation numbers say it should work out about the same dont mean it does , you cant spend the money if you dont have it.
I also think safety is coming into play a lot , and thats is coming into play with side x side sales going up and with off Road gaining popularity while Motocross is declining.
1
BAMX
Posts
2902
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1/22/2012
Location
Fallbrook, CA, USA
3/21/2019 6:44am
kage173 wrote:
Urbanization is biggest cause. Alta would've saved moto but that's dead
I agree on the urbanization but not on Alta. It is all about places to ride. Growing up in Southern CA in the 80's, there were so many places to ride for free and right from your house. Just about every neighborhood had a canyon nearby with trails. There were always other neighborhood kids with bikes. Cops were few and far between and didn't care unless you were on the street or riding right next to the houses.

Now, most of the canyons are full of houses. The few canyons left have been designated wildlife sanctuaries where you are lucky to even be able to ride a mountain bike and only if you stay on trail while battling clueless hikers. If you want to ride moto, you will likely need to drive at least 30 minutes and pay for the privilege. Free riding areas are over an hour away. Instead of the cost of fuel and some chain lube, it is at close $50 bucks between gate fees and truck fuel. Plus, it is now a production. You can't just go rip for an hour behind the house. You have to plan your fun around track days and hours. If you are a kid, the parents now need to set aside time. All of these small things add up and the costs of bikes doesn't help either. If kids aren't even riding, they aren't going to race.
10
Erek_Kudla
Posts
40
Joined
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Location
Baltimore, OH, USA
3/21/2019 6:47am Edited Date/Time 3/21/2019 7:04am
Race Off-Road... most bang for your buck Wink

GNCC - 2-3hours straight
National Hare and Hound - 3-5 hours straight
National Enduro - 4-6 hours straight
National Grand Prix - 45minute races, big race 1.5 hours, as many races as you qualify for
East and West Hare Scramble - 2-3 hours straight
National Trials - ALL DAY
Full Gas Sprint Enduro - 1 hour of racing broken up over 6 tests
Extreme Off-Road - as long as it takes you

Baja 500 or 1000 - 1-2 days straight!

And ever local area has their local version of each across the entire country!
8
RONJ OSE
Posts
352
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Location
USA
3/21/2019 6:49am
RONJ OSE wrote:
or that the issue is that 78% or americans live pay check to pay check. if you live paycheck to pay check its simple you do...
or that the issue is that 78% or americans live pay check to pay check.

if you live paycheck to pay check its simple you do not have 8k to drop on gear bikes and gas then entry fees.

I bet there is some kids who would love to race but their parents cant afford it
Tarz483 wrote:
I think this is a huge part of it , so they buy there kids phones and video games because they feel guilty , but i...
I think this is a huge part of it , so they buy there kids phones and video games because they feel guilty
, but i think all of the reasons mentioned are valid, For me its financial, for others its other things.
Just because inflation numbers say it should work out about the same dont mean it does , you cant spend the money if you dont have it.
I also think safety is coming into play a lot , and thats is coming into play with side x side sales going up and with off Road gaining popularity while Motocross is declining.
Yes i understand the phone and video games thing, but the phones have just become a part of culture we are going to have to deal with it.

A top of the line phone and a x-box a few games is still less then a bike and gear also less risk in video games.

you know redbull sponsors gamers now
1
MNd23891
Posts
106
Joined
12/19/2011
Location
Minnesota, MN, USA
3/21/2019 7:02am
Here's a large part of the problem. There are far too many classes because everyone wants a shot at a plastic trophy, even if it means "racing" one other guy. Look at this list of classes from my district and tell me there isn't something wrong here. I count 45 classes total, which is insane. There is absolutely no reason at all to have all of these vet age classes. Have 25,35 and 45+ A and a combined B/C, and one super senior class with no classifications. No way should you race a different class every 5 years after you are 25 just because you can't beat the guys 5 years younger than you. At some point the older guys just need to drop their egos and simply have fun riding with each other and not get butthurt when they aren't capable of winning. All of this is just contributing to a day at the track that gets to be way to long for the effort and money involved. I've grown up in moto, but for the first time ever I think I will be trying my hand at offroad this year to get some bang for my buck and only racing select moto events.
13
Johnny Ringo
Posts
8219
Joined
1/11/2016
Location
Tombstone, AZ, USA
3/21/2019 7:07am
Moto may be dying, but offroad is strong as ever. That's what I try to do mostly. $45 for 2 hours of riding then I'm done. I go home. No sitting around all day.

Moto promoters need to seriously reevaluate their program. $40 membership fees, $20 gate fees, $30 per class to race 3 guys for 15 minutes spread over 10 hours. They need to restructure the day and make it affordable.

The bike prices aren't the issue. It's the fact that if I want to go do a weekend of racing 2 classes I'm out $200. $200 could be reasonable, but the product you get in return isn't worth that. Now, that's not to say other sports aren't like that. Have you guys seen how expensive baseball camps are or equestrian shows? Same type of thing.

8
3/21/2019 7:07am
I prefer to ride and enjoy myself in my own comfort zone. That's what makes me happy. I'm not paying double the $ for half the ride time to prove I'm the fastest in the 37 1/2 year old, pump gas, stock motor, no A kit, ABCD class. Makes no sense to me.
8
3/21/2019 7:10am
MNd23891 wrote:
Here's a large part of the problem. There are far too many classes because everyone wants a shot at a plastic trophy, even if it means...
Here's a large part of the problem. There are far too many classes because everyone wants a shot at a plastic trophy, even if it means "racing" one other guy. Look at this list of classes from my district and tell me there isn't something wrong here. I count 45 classes total, which is insane. There is absolutely no reason at all to have all of these vet age classes. Have 25,35 and 45+ A and a combined B/C, and one super senior class with no classifications. No way should you race a different class every 5 years after you are 25 just because you can't beat the guys 5 years younger than you. At some point the older guys just need to drop their egos and simply have fun riding with each other and not get butthurt when they aren't capable of winning. All of this is just contributing to a day at the track that gets to be way to long for the effort and money involved. I've grown up in moto, but for the first time ever I think I will be trying my hand at offroad this year to get some bang for my buck and only racing select moto events.
That's a big reason for the problems..............
3/21/2019 7:20am
1. Reduce race fees or give discounts if you sign up for multiple classes.
2. Increase race lengths
3. Reduce number of classes or double gate low turnout classes (see 2)
4. Encourage people to sign up for multiple classes (see 1)

That's what will bring me back.
DTR830
Posts
961
Joined
8/14/2017
Location
Mountain Top, PA, USA
3/21/2019 7:30am
Some tracks need to race on Saturdays & have open practice Sundays. I work nights so my work week starts Sunday @ 8-9pm, I can't be cutting travel that close.
kaptkaos
Posts
1087
Joined
11/17/2015
Location
Miami, FL, USA
3/21/2019 7:41am
yz133rider wrote:
Start making outdoor motocross tracks outdoor motocross again and not outdoor supercross where the risk and skill level is out of reach for 95% of the...
Start making outdoor motocross tracks outdoor motocross again and not outdoor supercross where the risk and skill level is out of reach for 95% of the riding community. Tracks are built for the top 5% a riders and are too intimidating/not fun for a good majority of riders. They end up not staying with it, going to off-road, or just fucking off in the woods or fields as opposed to going to tracks.
This x10
5
akillerwombat
Posts
3211
Joined
10/16/2013
Location
Los Angeles, CA, USA
3/21/2019 7:41am
Our sport is going to die if we don’t embrace electric.
1
12
FOSSILMOTO
Posts
39
Joined
5/1/2012
Location
Lakeland, FL, USA
3/21/2019 7:42am
darren7878 wrote:
That's a big reason for the problems..............
In the 70's starting lines were full. Classes were:
Mini
125 am
250 am
Open am
125 Pro
250 Pro
Open Pro

No trophy...more practice and better luck next time.
3/21/2019 7:44am
yz133rider wrote:
Start making outdoor motocross tracks outdoor motocross again and not outdoor supercross where the risk and skill level is out of reach for 95% of the...
Start making outdoor motocross tracks outdoor motocross again and not outdoor supercross where the risk and skill level is out of reach for 95% of the riding community. Tracks are built for the top 5% a riders and are too intimidating/not fun for a good majority of riders. They end up not staying with it, going to off-road, or just fucking off in the woods or fields as opposed to going to tracks.
This 100%!!! Can't put enough emphasis on this right here!
3
Stuntman949
Posts
2857
Joined
11/10/2015
Location
San Clemente, CA, USA
3/21/2019 7:46am
mattyhamz2 wrote:
I’d love to race and am planning on making things work for Big 6 in September. But with 2 young kids, a wife and a new...
I’d love to race and am planning on making things work for Big 6 in September. But with 2 young kids, a wife and a new house I really can’t afford to go racing. Just don’t have that extra income to make it happen. I miss racing so much, but I just can’t do it financially. It’s not possible right now.
Dude run the 10 hour endurance race at Glen Helen with me in June. I’ll pay our gate fee. could use a teammate such as yourself...
Dude run the 10 hour endurance race at Glen Helen with me in June. I’ll pay our gate fee.
could use a teammate such as yourself

Edit: Wait never mind. It’s on Father’s Day and seeing you’re a dad, probably wouldn’t be the best to have you prioritize a race over your kids.
mattyhamz2 wrote:
I could probably pull the “it’s Father’s Day and that’s what I want to do” card, but I’m so out of shape and I know it...
I could probably pull the “it’s Father’s Day and that’s what I want to do” card, but I’m so out of shape and I know it would be hard to keep the kids at the track that long. I’ll keep that offer in mind though!! It would be a blast
Extra water on Wednesday, hit the sauna on Thursday, Wheaties for breakfast on Friday (preferably with Dungey on the box) and Bob's your uncle- you guys are on the podium Sunday

#MakingFitness
2
Markopolo400
Posts
1430
Joined
7/24/2012
Location
St. Paul-ish, MN, USA
3/21/2019 7:48am
I wish more areas did J Day style racing. Two 30min motos and a track thats half woods and half moto made for an awesome day.
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1
JBecker 72
Posts
1811
Joined
3/25/2014
Location
Eastern Panhandle, WV, USA
3/21/2019 7:50am
I wish more areas did J Day style racing. Two 30min motos and a track thats half woods and half moto made for an awesome day.
I really want to give one of these a try.
2

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