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OMG, it’s gorgeous
That's what I was thinking there's many different ways to measure horsepower on a dyno and all dynos vary.
I don’t ever remember seeing that rhetoric but I do remember people saying the Desmo COULD be a real threat for the 250 class. So I guess we’ll have to wait and see.
ML512 - Any info on when first ride reviews will be? I'm super curious about initial impressions on this design.
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Anyone remember the Dixon Racing Cosworth / Bike It Yamaha YZF250s from 2013?
16,500RPM - 3spd Gearbox.
Numbers thrown about for it, of 54 / 56 HP.
Obviously, very, Very far from std, and, I don't know the rebuild schedule on them. I think it might have been somewhat 'demanding'.
Desmo Valve Actuation: In modern terms, with Far better Valve Spring Technology ( and Valve material) for many, many years now, it's not really much of an advantage when it comes to revs. Well, other than really high revs, ala MotoGP - where Ducati don't have to go to Pneumatic Valve actuation.
Ironically, with Moto3 - there's quite a low rev limit in the rules - 14,000.
Desmodromics: It's more about being able to open and close valves, very, very quickly. Giving a Lot of potential variation for valve timing / overlap . Revs for the 450s? - it was never about that - those bloody things (450s) can produce HP that is Unusable on the Dirt, without outrageous revs.
250s - well yes, those little blighters can use big revs, but still, we / they ( racers) are riding on the Dirt - for all intents and purposes, we've buggerall traction at hand, and having controllable power is still very much 'the thing'.
I've worked with Desmodromics, for decades now, so they are No mystery to me, unlike, I guess, the vast majority of people here. There's nothing scary, or that complicated to therm. And, interestingly, Ducati themselves are bringing out more engines with valve springs.
But, Desmo Heads certainly does give them a 'USP' to their venture into the DIrt Bike world.
At last, someone that understands and doesn't just parrot "desmo gives you unlimited revs" BS.
The major advantage is the ability to move valves quickly, without significant spring loads.
That marvel of technology died on the starting gate of the quali race at the italian GP minutes ago. Even the mechanics pushing it couldn't get it started.
I can tell you the valves weren't moving quickly. 🤣
They are being conservative with regards to the potential. (Left room for improvement later.)
The v4r can get to 16500 rpm with similar size cylinders, likely a factory race bike capable of it is already done, signed, delivered engineering wise. Why they didn't already? Perhaps not enough roll on and low end, too fragile for a consumer bike, or they would like the factory bike to at least be faster than the customer bike they sell. Which is all understandable. One things for sure: the currently available 250 two strokes have fallen behind due to lack of rpm capability compared to the 250f at this point. And its remarkable. The yz400f made 44hp and I bet despite its low end advantage(if there is any) couldn't overcome a modern 250f in a straight line. At least across flat ground. They should let the 250s go head to head now. The two stroke guys wont win the championship imho. Which neither will Ducati for probably quite some time, again just my opinion.
I remember the opposite, ppl were saying 450s already have enough power so 450 wont change much but the 250 is where it would shine cuz itll be able to rev even higher.
What’s it cost $32,000.00?
11000 euro i deliver those bikes to dealers
Oh wow, ok then. I was under the impression that the YZ250F was like 40(last I checked anyway) so Ducati's 44.5 shocked me. Didn't realize 250's were mid 40's these days.
The 450 is priced under KTM FE, Honda Works Edition, and Kawi SR
47.3 at the Crank....and they are the real numbers....
The Yamaha makes the lowest of most 250s ahead of only the zook I believe. So it probably is closer to 40 where some others are 2-4hp up on it.
Pit Row
STP or SAE corrected?
This also shows it matters more where the power is because the yamaha engine is universally loved even though being down a few ponies.
It also highlights how gearing effects feel as well. It’s geared much shorter than the Austrian trio and feels snappier. Add 5 teeth to the Austrians and I bet they have more barky response too!
Yamaha has been gearing their bikes down to make up for being down on power since the 2009 yz250f days. They love that truck.
I have no doubts that a dyno somewhere measured that, but claimed HP numbers mean very little unless they’re all done on the same dyno
Not hating on the Triumph, I’ve got one from the first deliveries and still love it. All I was saying is that claimed HP numbers mean very little especially in the 250 class
Damn... sounds and looks awesome!
"You gotta rev that sucker, Doug"
Kaplan will have one with a polished frame and a billet cr500 motor by next Wednesday.
To be clear though, the primary and achieved focus of Star has been to extend the revs on the Yamaha into this range.
I believe most of the top 250 teams are getting at least 15k
Yes. So it is clearly desirable.
I have a hypothesis.
The bike wont do as well in shootouts as most would expect it to do because the average Joe's wont get close to that RPM limit. One of the reasons why the Yamaha 250 has such a good reputation of being a monster of an engine is that novices and vets ride 250F:s like larger displacement 4-strokes.
I can believe that. The testers don’t know what they want either.
Yamaha 450s need 1000s spent to mellow them out
Kawi 450s too slow need 1000s spent to spice them up
Ktms the best becuase they’re light
Ktm gains weight, now they feel super planted more weight is better
Gets on any other brand , this brand needs to lose weight (same as Ktm now weighs)
It’s all a fucking joke.
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