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Front of c absolutely runs with back of a. And even if it’s not the back of a you are missing my entire point… the slowest in b should be faster than the fastest in c…. Agreed? Are you with me still? And that’s most definitely not the case , national, local, chicken licks, anywhere….
I don’t know why I even bother on here lol
In hare scramble racing peewee is up to 10 years old because the Jr class races on the big bike loop for an hour. The peewee A, B, and C races are 15 minutes long on a short course, usually less than a mile long.
Oh I'm following you, but you aren't understanding. I go to Lorettas and Mini O's. All you have to do is look at the lap times at Lorettas. The winner in the C class didn't run the same lap times as anyone in Pro Sport.
Anyone that is referring to local racing is lost here. When someone is talking about their kid racing PeeWee A class I honestly don't know what to say.
I'm trying to make an argument that if the rules allowed these Lorettas kids to move up a class at local races, but still stay in the C or B class at the national races then local Johnny's dad wouldn't have to lose their mind when their kid gets worked by a national level kid.
Most of the guys that are arguing about if you win at your local track you should move up have never been to regional qualifiers and Mini O's and stuff and experienced what it's like to watch people you have never heard of go crazy fast and think where does that guy even race? There's this whole under world of talent that exists that most of the local moto world doesn't even know about.
I would argue that if your kid can't make it by 14-16 on the national level they're not going to. Everyone has a speed limit, the Travis Pastrana's, RC's, Eli's, ext were all able to beat pro riders when they were on 80's. Even people without titles like Nick Way could have top 40'd a national by 14. You arguing that they should be able to race the c class nationally but the a class locally is the same damn thing as a parent letting their kids sand bag the local races. Johnny can't win in that class so he's gonna ride this class.
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This is why they have all the age group classes. None of the fast kids race the skill level classes until LL. Race the age group classes at local races and they can't move you up.
I never understood people not wanting to move up . Me and my buddies couldn't get the a class fast enough
There is learnable moments here….lets have an “ ask Dazzy” segment on Vital mx….
He doesn’t get enough mentions on the broadcasts let’s have a few segments on here with him.
One of things these riders and mainly their parents don't understand. I have been seeing this now for a long azz time. The ones the set back, the ones that "manipulate" the system to get recognized etc etc etc. Usually percentage wise never attain the next level. Then falter, why? Because they are racing against riders they shouldn't be. The riders that rise to the competition level, they are the Next Tomacs, Sextons, Lawerences, etc etc. Look back to who wins, who has won, etc. They look for competition, they go find it and excel. Today this silly game makes millions to the places who support it. With that said. here are a couple points.
A is not "pro". Do some local old pro guys ride the class sure, but it's not pro.
Age. I don't think ANY rider who is in "A" class should be younger then 16. And I do believe "PRO" riders should have been 18 like 25 years ago. Never should a rider have to have a guardian release to race Pro. ( i am talking nationals, and supercross)
Ability. Every rider should get their "year" in a class they compete in. Which they do by current rules. But the second they pull off a few times, that should be reviewed and stopped. Want to sand bag, go down by the river and help save a community, no place for it in real racing. And riders who do it, never win. sorry that is the way it is.
Don't like the system that is used which has evolved for years help find a better one as it's the only game in town. so to speak. and the people that do it sure the hell aint in it for the money.............. carry on I shouldn't read this stuff.
I am old i forgot a few things. IN mx racing the Biggest class should be B. there shouldn't be a C class championship process sorry, it's where beginners should be. A class should be where all the Contingencies, and money goes. They earned it. that should pretty much cover it. If the system was not manipulated there would be a hell of a lot more competition where it belongs. Not competeing to find a parking spot along the track in the second moto of C. But on the track.
I am not in a position to say who is right and wrong but there is more to it than my son was moved up to A by the AMA for no reason.
The kid can race the 125 (12-17) and Schoolboy 1 and 2 (12-17) on the 125 and 150. Those are a Age classes not skill based except exclude Beginners at AMA events.
If he was racing the 250B class on the 125/150cc and scored enough RPV to be moved up then he has to move up at regardless of his weight if that was why the dad was keeping him off the 250 4T. The Supermini class is up to 16 yrs old which is ridiculous but the Mini classes are in need of revision anyways.
Again, you're talking about local racing and seem to be out of touch with the skill level at national races vs local races. The class structure works at the national level. If you never raced Lorettas you can race C. If you have raced Lorettas you move up to B. Top 5 in B you move up to A if you are over 16 years old. It's where the Loretta structure meets the RPV rule at the local level that you get the locals complaining.
You guys are saying the kids should just move up a class. I'm saying that if the rules where changed they would move up at the local level. You would have fast kids happily move up to A and race for money if they could still race B at Lorettas for a year or two at age 16 or 17.
250 novice is crazier than 250b. That class is the worst you'll get taken out just as bad.
There are a hundred other things that are hurting local racing more than a kid not being able to sandbag.
You have to read the rule book. To be considered for advancement a rider must have a minimum of six points-paying finishes in a class within the rider’s classification within a RPV category. He raced 8 races in Open B and won them all. Most of the schoolboy kids stay out of the C/B classes locally until they do lorettas in the C and B classes. Too easy to get bumped up. Not saying I agree with it all, but that's how it goes.
https://results.americanmotorcyclist.com/riders/159712-logan-kresal/results/MOTOCROSS/2025
The sooner the Coombs can be removed from the sport the better. Especially at the amateur lever.
This would have been 2002 (Maybe 03'?). I would love to know who your boy is because I'd bet anything we know each other.
Both Jeff Alessi & Michael LaPaglia raced Ponca in the C class while getting full support from Honda & Suzuki - Granted that was NMA not AMA. The following week at Lorretta's saw what had to be the largest Pre-Race Disqualification event in the history of LL. My brother, along with several others, were informed at sign-up that they would be unable to compete nor would they receive a refund.
The early 2000's read like a fever dream when reminiscing about just how far some dads went when it came to sandbagging/chasing a C-Class title.
I agree to some extent on the revisions needed to mini classes; but, I have to hold out for those teen agers that are still small enough at 14-16 y/o.
The ranking system is truly messed up and allowing these “peek-a-boo” racers to ONLY show up at certain events and INTENTIONALLY “manipulate the system” seems to be lost on some that are arguing that the current system works.
It doesn’t.
The simple fact is this: we’re arguing about an AMATEUR RANKING SYSTEM FOR THE NATION. Go look up how that’s “supposed to work” versus what we have here. Most hi-ranking Cs should be Bs and most hi-ranking Bs should be As…etc., etc., etc.
Signed,
A regular Joe who went to the 1st ever LL’s and saw the writing on the wall. I love this sport. I love the people in it. We just need to make some honest and legitimate adjustments for the betterment of “sport within our sport”.
Same thing for vet riders race 50+ then drop down & race a slower class 40b. But do too many & you get moved up to 40a. This is me after hole shot in the 12+ 125 class. Like an Olympic Gold medal New World record. Ski jumps R Super pumped to nail it. My only chance of leading 1 of the big races. Is on the start so why not get the lead to start the race.
Pit Row
I was always amazed back in the 90s we would go to the high point pro Nationals and run amateur day and then find out how many guys were top level b that only showed up at high point to run c class so they could get a High Point plaque
Logan was advanced via his RPV in Open B. The threshold for advancement is a 15 RPV and Logan was a 15. Advancement is automatic if you meet the threshold and are of the correct age which Logan was. There is an appeal process where three independent AMA Motocross Commission members evaluate the riders results and any extenuating circumstances. In this case in the 2025 advancement season which runs from November 1st, 2024 to October 31st, 2025, Logan had 38 wins including wins in all 8 of the Open B classes he rode. Logan's appeal was denied by the committee based on the following language in the rulebook:
Riders who wish to contest advancement or
classification are only those who are considered
completely non-competitive in the class they are
leaving and will not dominate the class in which they
are returning.
While Logan may not be competing for wins at the highest level of the sport in the A, to say he will be completely non-competitive is a stretch. If he is allowed to go back to the B class where he won all of his 8 races (at the local level) and had 30 wins in other classes including the 125 classes (at the local level). This is the definition of domination.
While there is no appeal to the appeal, I have sent this on back to the committee to re-evaluate. At the end of the day the committee's decision will be predicated on, can they overlook 38 wins last year and allow him to come back and dominate those classes again.
You can say the rules are inadequate and my answer will be, "Get involved in the commissions and come up with something better." What you can't say is we are not following the rules as written.
End thread.
Chad Johnson,s daughter Isabella finished 2nd in 450 B points & won every women’s race . And I think 4th in 250 B points. In D16 Wi. & The UP of Mi. She’s an Amazing rider not sure if she belongs in the A class. I think she should be able to race B class yet , because she didn’t dominate the B class. Not many race A class unless it’s a pro am or the track throws a 4k purse out. I think the winner at Xmas got 2k something & a 2,200 gas gas e-bike.
I think there is some serious irony here about the kid not being nationally competitive in the A class...
Okay, so race it regionally first... You know... Local racing...
Would it be too much paperwork and logistics to run seperate class levels for national, or big races like LL and then a different class level for local races?
Like National Class A, B, C. Call them something like AA, BB or CC.
Then have a different ranking at local levels that are just A, B, C. This can allow riders to run higher classes at their local levels but still be eligible for a respective class at the national level?
Say you're a local super star running A class at your home track, but at a national race level you could still race B?
If you're talking about AMA events, there is a one class difference allowed between disciplines. A class motocrossers can race B in harescrambles, and vice versa. Same goes for C class. they can run B in another discipline without penalty
People try to do this all the time in off-road. They'll race A locally and enter B at a national event. "Because it's harder, the race is longer, there's more competition," their vag is bleeding, etc ... If you're an expert rider, you're an expert rider, whether it's local or nationally. Same goes for every other class.
What you suggested simply makes it legal to sandbag.
Not an easy solution. It seems there should be some flexibility with 14 to 16 year olds. They are fast but are their muscles aren’t fully developed to handle impacts etc Just my two cents. I quit racing long ago but when I did there were way too many classes as-is. Perhaps flexibility in rules would help w/o adding classes.
I've never raced the A class, nor at Loretta's, but I did race against Travis Pastrana in the 125 B class at the World Mini one year... the year he later turned pro and won the 125cc National Championship. The B class was faster than the A class that year, for sure.
It sucks that the kid got forced into 250A, but he'll get over it. Either race locally in B until it's time to move up, or jump in feet first. He may find that he's better off in A.
You get two 1-1's or 3 Overall Wins in any class, then it's time to move up.
We don't advance 14-16 year olds to A. This kid was 17. The appeal committee took a second look at his appeal at my request. They have decided to let him stay back in B.
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