Kawasaki is bringing the two stroke back!

wfopete
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Dover, AR, USA
1/30/2025 6:18pm

Never seen so much hype come from a 20 second clip with call outs and ring dinging noises. 

No bike, no firm details; just page after page of fantasy and speculation.

2 stroke fans are desperate! for a fix.

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burn1986
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bossier city, LA, USA
1/30/2025 6:31pm Edited Date/Time 1/30/2025 6:45pm

The KTM fuel injection and mapping for 2-strokes was not successful. It was/is problematic and combined with electric start added about 10lbs to the bike. Maybe with time the bugs would get worked out. Hopefully Kawi doesn’t do the same.

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12
1/30/2025 6:36pm

Gonna be a lot of bummed dudes when Kawasaki rolls out the all new 65!

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17
1/30/2025 6:57pm

Gonna be a lot of bummed dudes when Kawasaki rolls out the all new 65!

My money's on an updated KX85!

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13

The Shop

Team403
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1/30/2025 7:07pm Edited Date/Time 1/30/2025 7:11pm

IMG 5120.jpeg?VersionId=Gx9 YamjegfOk I race a ‘22 KTM 250XCF FI bike and a 98 KX 250 in two different classes twice a month - we do dead engine starts  - 9 out 10 times I pull a better start on the carbed kickstart 2T bike.  IMO unless you are riding at drastically different altitudes a 2T carbed bike that is jetted correctly is an amazing combo - low tech / bombproof 🤙🏼

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BRX-WRX
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Blue Springs, MO, USA
1/30/2025 7:15pm Edited Date/Time 1/30/2025 7:16pm

What if it's ORANGE ?? I remember seeing Orange KDX's in mid 80s when I bought my 87 kx500. Unfortunately the KX's were only available in green or I would have choose orange cause I liked my 1980 Can-Am 400 color.

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wfopete
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1/30/2025 7:19pm
BRX-WRX wrote:
What if it's ORANGE ?? I remember seeing Orange KDX's in mid 80s when I bought my 87 kx500. Unfortunately the KX's were only available in...

What if it's ORANGE ?? I remember seeing Orange KDX's in mid 80s when I bought my 87 kx500. Unfortunately the KX's were only available in green or I would have choose orange cause I liked my 1980 Can-Am 400 color.

In 1984 and 85 Kawi offered the KDX200 in RED.

I have one.

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1/30/2025 7:38pm
BRX-WRX wrote:
What if it's ORANGE ?? I remember seeing Orange KDX's in mid 80s when I bought my 87 kx500. Unfortunately the KX's were only available in...

What if it's ORANGE ?? I remember seeing Orange KDX's in mid 80s when I bought my 87 kx500. Unfortunately the KX's were only available in green or I would have choose orange cause I liked my 1980 Can-Am 400 color.

wfopete wrote:

In 1984 and 85 Kawi offered the KDX200 in RED.

I have one.

You could get a KDX200 in white from 1988-1992.

Screenshot at 2025-01-30 22-38-22.png?VersionId=THQtSpKYprpQ66tcB0yBD3dI7qdKt
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Magoofan
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1/30/2025 7:52pm

We already have KTMs etc......    Yeah, because $11k 2 strokes are a great idea.   NOT.

Yamaha has it dialed and it's been working for them for years.

Keep it cheap and simple.

You don't need the added weight, complexity on a motor you can start with your hand.    Get real. 

You don't need FI...  learn how to jet a carb for cyring out loud.

 

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Magoofan
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1/30/2025 7:56pm Edited Date/Time 1/30/2025 7:57pm
Team403 wrote:
Ok I race a ‘22 KTM 250XCF FI bike and a 98 KX 250 in two different classes twice a month - we do dead engine...

IMG 5120.jpeg?VersionId=Gx9 YamjegfOk I race a ‘22 KTM 250XCF FI bike and a 98 KX 250 in two different classes twice a month - we do dead engine starts  - 9 out 10 times I pull a better start on the carbed kickstart 2T bike.  IMO unless you are riding at drastically different altitudes a 2T carbed bike that is jetted correctly is an amazing combo - low tech / bombproof 🤙🏼

Real world experience for the win ^^^^^^ 

icegif-912-460237040
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Bearuno
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1/30/2025 8:14pm Edited Date/Time 1/30/2025 9:27pm

I really hope this Kawasaki 'thing' does turn out to be the re-introduction of full sized, Competition level 2 strokes.

There's a gap in the market, that the Japanese Factories, baring Yamaha, and the retention, barely, of Minis by Kawi and Suzuki, have ceded to European manufacturers.

I remember, each time, with the first reports of both Beta and Sherco developing 2 strokes, those that said it would never happen - even when 1st pictures and videos came out of them. Well, it happened, and they expanded both companies production / horizons. TM , in their tiny way, have always been around, and Reiju, have kept the (original) Gas Gas 2ts going.

Logically, a 250 /300 motor is a good 're-start' for Kawi, being it's really, just the same module - just square up a 66 / whatever bored 72mm stroked engine, there you've got a 300, or, 'near abouts' for sweet buggerall  effort. Though, I think that either Beta or Sherco have a '300' with a different configuration than the common 72 / 72. Note, 'Buggerall Effort', when considering the effort to develop a 4 stroke, and so bloody many variations of them, even in the same capacities, that factories have done since the '4 Stroke Revolution'. 

I'd personally like to see what Beta are supposedly doing with their '350'. They have gone to a 73.6mm stroke, with a 78mm Bore , for 351.7mm capacity. That's less over square than my ancient CRE500, by the way. Now, the Beta 350 may or may not happen, though, it Is said to be coming mid '25, but the minimal extra stroke, could mean there is no need for new case castings, just a new crank, and top end / pipe. 

So, such a 350 'solution'  might mean a minimal increase in costs, when compared to the common, and, admittedly, incredibly cheap, squaring up of a 250 2T that has garnered Huge sales over so many years for 300s

Why a 350 - well, a 300 is too 'scary' a thing to be allowed to race with 450s, so, really, there's no official ( in MX / SX - I think E3 in Enduro GP does specify 300s, and up, with the over 450 4ts?) Class for a 300 , so, why not a 350? As, it's an 'Orphan' sized bike for many Series. I've always said, a Modern 350 / 400 / 450 2 Stroke would be an absolutely Wonderous thing. 

Though, I doubt they - Kawasaki - will do a bigger than 300 2t - as the 'formula' for an "Open Class 2 Stroke", is so long established now, and so bloody easy, and profitable , to do.

I'd love to see a 125, and, a 200 - derived from a 125 base as the KTM 200 was. But, it's all just Fantasy Land, on All  of our parts. Until whatever Kawasaki are up to, is shown.

Here's the Spec Board for the Beta 350, shown at EICMA last year, if any have not seen it:

Beta 350RX 2t at EICMA 2024 -  Specifications
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agn5008
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Fantasy
1/30/2025 10:38pm
38special wrote:
Correct. There's already a variety of high-tech Austrian EFI electric start models, and the good old YZ's.  If someone really wanted a 2 stroke, they'd put...

Correct. There's already a variety of high-tech Austrian EFI electric start models, and the good old YZ's.  If someone really wanted a 2 stroke, they'd put green plastic on one of those.

 

agn5008 wrote:
We all love the KTM 300 platform but hate the suspension. We all love the Yamaha suspension but wish it was more like a 300s engine...

We all love the KTM 300 platform but hate the suspension. We all love the Yamaha suspension but wish it was more like a 300s engine, e start, counterbalanced etc. 

I think most of us are hoping the Kawi is a cross between the Yamaha and KTM. 

JazzyJJ wrote:

Rieju comes with KYB suspension 

I know. So does the Beta RE. I’ve been considering a Beta for a while now. 

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tek14
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1/31/2025 12:27am

Keefer said it will be ”trail” related. 

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JaumeTGO
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1/31/2025 12:35am

My bets?................KX 65

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agn5008
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1/31/2025 12:43am
JaumeTGO wrote:

My bets?................KX 65

I’ll take that bet. $500 to Saint Jude’s? 

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1/31/2025 3:43am
Then there was also the lesser known DXC.  I had a '92 550 DXC.  That bike was a beast off road and was all low end...

Then there was also the lesser known DXC.  I had a '92 550 DXC.  That bike was a beast off road and was all low end and mid range.  If you tried to rev it out like a KX500, CR500 or YZ490 you were rewarded with a lot of top end vibration that made it feel like it was going to blow up.  I think I would like the feel of a 300 2t and would probably even add more flywheel weight to it to make it more of a tractor. 

I remember the DXC; definitely a short-shift motor. Can't imagine they built more than a handful of those and it would be hard to find one...

I remember the DXC; definitely a short-shift motor. Can't imagine they built more than a handful of those and it would be hard to find one nowadays, much less one in good shape.

I believe Kaplan Cycles had one of them in one of their videos.  I believe they made them from 1990 thru 1996 or so.  You're right...

I believe Kaplan Cycles had one of them in one of their videos.  I believe they made them from 1990 thru 1996 or so.  You're right though, it was definitely a short shifter.  I think I heard back in the day that the engine evolved from a sidecar platform.

Yes the 550 startet  as a Sidecar Engine but back in 1985

What i heard  some Americans put that Engine in a 500 Frame and the 550  was born , an Produced in small numbers as a 540 DXC and later 550 MXC

 

I build my own 550 MX  with a very early 1986   Engine in a 1988 Chassis 

 

IMG-20250131-WA0001IMG-20250131-WA0000.jpg?VersionId=04AIX

 

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1/31/2025 3:52am
Timo wrote:
There's all these people saying they'd jump and buy a new bike just because it's a 2-stroke, when there's already bikes you could buy today 😂...

There's all these people saying they'd jump and buy a new bike just because it's a 2-stroke, when there's already bikes you could buy today 😂. Yamaha, Austrian, beta, Chinese... You can buy 125's, 150's, 200's, 225's, 250's, 300's, AF conversions, MX, XC, Enduro, trials, whatever the xtrainer is. Seriously, stop lying to sound cool, if you want a new 2-stroke just go buy one already. 

38special wrote:
Correct. There's already a variety of high-tech Austrian EFI electric start models, and the good old YZ's.  If someone really wanted a 2 stroke, they'd put...

Correct. There's already a variety of high-tech Austrian EFI electric start models, and the good old YZ's.  If someone really wanted a 2 stroke, they'd put green plastic on one of those.

 

agn5008 wrote:
We all love the KTM 300 platform but hate the suspension. We all love the Yamaha suspension but wish it was more like a 300s engine...

We all love the KTM 300 platform but hate the suspension. We all love the Yamaha suspension but wish it was more like a 300s engine, e start, counterbalanced etc. 

I think most of us are hoping the Kawi is a cross between the Yamaha and KTM. 

New KTM suspension is awesome. 

1/31/2025 3:53am
burn1986 wrote:
The KTM fuel injection and mapping for 2-strokes was not successful. It was/is problematic and combined with electric start added about 10lbs to the bike. Maybe...

The KTM fuel injection and mapping for 2-strokes was not successful. It was/is problematic and combined with electric start added about 10lbs to the bike. Maybe with time the bugs would get worked out. Hopefully Kawi doesn’t do the same.

It’s been a huge success. No idea where you came up with that. 

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1/31/2025 3:54am

Back to the Kawasaki Topic, would be great to see a New Green Twostroke 

Hope a Keihin Carburatet ,Kickstartet 250/300  or 500 KX 

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SonofThor32
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Corryton, TN, USA
1/31/2025 3:57am
PRM31 wrote:

RacerX article by Weege says they were told it is a 300. 

https://racerxonline.com/2025/01/28/kawasaki-is-making-a-new-two-stroke

I know we are all just rumors and speculation, but did anybody actually listen to what the bike sounded like in the commercial?  If it was a mini or a 125, they would have used a small bore 2 stroke in the video.  It definitely sounded more like a 300 to me as well.

4
1
sandman768
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1/31/2025 5:29am
burn1986 wrote:
The KTM fuel injection and mapping for 2-strokes was not successful. It was/is problematic and combined with electric start added about 10lbs to the bike. Maybe...

The KTM fuel injection and mapping for 2-strokes was not successful. It was/is problematic and combined with electric start added about 10lbs to the bike. Maybe with time the bugs would get worked out. Hopefully Kawi doesn’t do the same.

Correct on the 125. & 250 , but the 300”s are very good for a first generation effort…with a simple remap you can tune to your liking… if I could only afford 1 bike, it would be my 300SX… I can ride Mx and within 30 minutes, switch to woods/Gncc”s just by swapping to larger Xc tank and bark busters…Electric start & FI seem excessive on a 2T but once you have them, its easy to get used to… I don’t miss trying to jet my previous carbed 300”s, they were tricky to get right for different disciplines…

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AMetts
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1/31/2025 6:19am

Do you guys think Kawasaki is going to spend all this time and resources to come out with a carbed, kickstart budget 250?

I would say there is a 95% chance its electric start and about a 90% chance its some kind of fuel injected. Companies don't put money and time into developing a new bike to come out with a "budget" bike. 

 

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sjodin73
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SE
1/31/2025 6:28am

125 guaranteed + maybe more

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Press516
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Fantasy
1/31/2025 6:36am

Mitch said that FI can’t compete yet with carb on the 2T…. But it will get there and I feel like Kawi will be part of the development.  And max HP on an offroad bike isn’t top priority.  So a focus on a wide power band 300 seems to support the possibility/likelihood of FI.

But yes, I demand a full on KX125SR effort from them!!!

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crmx105
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Dunnellon, FL, USA
1/31/2025 7:08am
Magoofan wrote:
We already have KTMs etc......    Yeah, because $11k 2 strokes are a great idea.   NOT.Yamaha has it dialed and it's been working for them...

We already have KTMs etc......    Yeah, because $11k 2 strokes are a great idea.   NOT.

Yamaha has it dialed and it's been working for them for years.

Keep it cheap and simple.

You don't need the added weight, complexity on a motor you can start with your hand.    Get real. 

You don't need FI...  learn how to jet a carb for cyring out loud.

 

MSRP on a 25 KTM 300 SX is $9600. Pricey but not $11k

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MOTORSPORTFOX
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Fairview Park, OH, USA
1/31/2025 7:16am
IMG 9742.jpg?VersionId=y9jThUcM V2SDfnyNi

Ready for an update...

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AMetts
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Lincolnton, NC, USA
1/31/2025 7:18am Edited Date/Time 1/31/2025 7:30am
Magoofan wrote:
We already have KTMs etc......    Yeah, because $11k 2 strokes are a great idea.   NOT.Yamaha has it dialed and it's been working for them...

We already have KTMs etc......    Yeah, because $11k 2 strokes are a great idea.   NOT.

Yamaha has it dialed and it's been working for them for years.

Keep it cheap and simple.

You don't need the added weight, complexity on a motor you can start with your hand.    Get real. 

You don't need FI...  learn how to jet a carb for cyring out loud.

 

crmx105 wrote:

MSRP on a 25 KTM 300 SX is $9600. Pricey but not $11k

Everyone blindly shits on KTMs cost but MSRP on a new YZ250 is 8,400, what looks like the better value? 

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4
1/31/2025 7:22am
Magoofan wrote:
We already have KTMs etc......    Yeah, because $11k 2 strokes are a great idea.   NOT.Yamaha has it dialed and it's been working for them...

We already have KTMs etc......    Yeah, because $11k 2 strokes are a great idea.   NOT.

Yamaha has it dialed and it's been working for them for years.

Keep it cheap and simple.

You don't need the added weight, complexity on a motor you can start with your hand.    Get real. 

You don't need FI...  learn how to jet a carb for cyring out loud.

 

crmx105 wrote:

MSRP on a 25 KTM 300 SX is $9600. Pricey but not $11k

The 2025 base model 300 XC-W is $11,599. I'm not sure why it's $2000 more, but it is.

 

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AVL28
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Asheville, NC, USA
1/31/2025 7:26am Edited Date/Time 1/31/2025 7:28am
AMetts wrote:

Everyone blindly shits on KTMs cost but MSRP on a new YZ250 is 8,400, what looks like the better value? 

Where are you seeing $9,400? MSRP is $8k but shop around or get an identical outgoing 2024 and you can easily come in under that. I think you’re confusing it with the KTM which does have a $9,400 MSRP.

IMG 0143 0IMG 0144 2

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MOTO13
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Elkhorn, WI, USA
1/31/2025 7:29am Edited Date/Time 1/31/2025 7:34am

1979 kdx 175

I still think the best looking KDX was the 1979 KDX 175. I had one...bought it used less than a year old for $900. They were around $1,200 new BITD. Bring that back. 

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