The great dirtbike price reset- currently ongoing?

nch209
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486
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NoVa, VA, USA
5/12/2024 2:05am

Back the the point if the thread… might have to grab a 24 kx.  Lack of time to ride is holding me back, but the discounts are pushing me to make a buy…

 

Spoonguy
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Mc Kean, PA, USA
5/12/2024 4:23am
National debt was rising during those periods faster than when Obamas spent and spent and spent post GFC.  so please finish reading a sentence, I specifically...

National debt was rising during those periods faster than when Obamas spent and spent and spent post GFC. 

so please finish reading a sentence, I specifically wrote ‘long term’, because receiving a healthy budget from Obama then putting the country in debt - DURING AN ECONOMIC BOOM -  to artificially inflate the economy is the most insane idea of how to manage an economy.

 

almost every single graph is worse in 2019 than in 2016 — https://www.factcheck.org/2021/10/trumps-final-numbers/

SPYGUY wrote:

This is where your credibility goes out the window because you're acting like C19 didn't exist and affect those numbers.

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right?    From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt...

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right? 
 

From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt… faster than anytime in history… during a boom… an absolute economic disaster and if you can read a graph click the link… 2016-2019 was an utter failure… he took a functioning economy, cut taxes, increased spending, cut services and only enriched the rich — then covid hit and the fastest wealth transfer in history occurred.  
 

record debt - then record transfer of wealth to the rich…

 

yet the trump dick riders still think that dick do be fire 🔥 

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

19
3
yak651
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Location
Appleton, WI, USA
Fantasy
5/12/2024 4:48am
SPYGUY wrote:

This is where your credibility goes out the window because you're acting like C19 didn't exist and affect those numbers.

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right?    From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt...

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right? 
 

From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt… faster than anytime in history… during a boom… an absolute economic disaster and if you can read a graph click the link… 2016-2019 was an utter failure… he took a functioning economy, cut taxes, increased spending, cut services and only enriched the rich — then covid hit and the fastest wealth transfer in history occurred.  
 

record debt - then record transfer of wealth to the rich…

 

yet the trump dick riders still think that dick do be fire 🔥 

Spoonguy wrote:
What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to...

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

Nothing wrong with rich getting rich but he does have a point. When the economy was booming before Covid we should’ve been raising interest rates back then to cool things off but we were all focused on higher stock returns. Anyhow back to bike prices, should even out. You get less for your used bike but get your new bike cheaper. New riders can get in at lower price point and hopefully we get away from paying $10k for a bike

3
2
Chris_Buehler
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Location
PORTLAND, CT, USA
5/12/2024 5:07am

Let's get this thread on track. Should we buy bitcoin? 

3

The Shop

AussieParaMX
Posts
1724
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Location
Mount Waverley, VIC, AU
5/12/2024 4:53pm
SPYGUY wrote:

This is where your credibility goes out the window because you're acting like C19 didn't exist and affect those numbers.

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right?    From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt...

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right? 
 

From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt… faster than anytime in history… during a boom… an absolute economic disaster and if you can read a graph click the link… 2016-2019 was an utter failure… he took a functioning economy, cut taxes, increased spending, cut services and only enriched the rich — then covid hit and the fastest wealth transfer in history occurred.  
 

record debt - then record transfer of wealth to the rich…

 

yet the trump dick riders still think that dick do be fire 🔥 

Spoonguy wrote:
What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to...

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation. 

With a great wealth transfer — if you don’t print more money, then people starve and the country erodes into a third world country. If you have ever been to a third world country you would see that.  
 

A functioning society requires a careful balance of the ability to generate wealth and the ability for the working class to afford to participate in such sport as motocross. Look at any wealth gap or wage gap between CEO and the working class from 1960-2024. 

 

The transfer of wealth means the gov must backfill the economy with new cash to maintain any societal standard, thus creating inflation, and as that backfilled money transfers to the rich, another backfill is required because the taxes and wages paid aren’t sufficient to maintain a functioning economic system. 

 

With this inflation the ‘middle class’ wage requirement becomes higher but the amount of people attaining it is a lower percentage, and those in the working class or working poor struggle more.  Things like 70-80% of a wage directly transferred from a working poor person to a wealthy person for rent… is a direct transfer of wealth and a direct result of economic decisions that provides no societal value and only TAKES from society.

 

The wealth transfer and the 30 some trillion dollar national debt and inflation are all directly linked to the same economic decisions, and as with everything it comes back to lobbying   

 

Here’s an example, one of the biggest employers in the country is Walmart. And one of the biggest group of food stamp users are Walmart and McDonald’s workers… why is that?  Why is it acceptable that the government subsidies some of the richest people in the country to keep their workers in poverty? Why hasn’t the minimum wage kept up with inflation?  Lobbyists it’s always lobbyists.
 

https://blog.ucsusa.org/alice-reznickova/how-big-food-corporations-take….



why is the wealth transfer bad? Because an economy needs to be circular not a funnel. Currently it’s a funnel and America is burning money while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and infrastructure falls apart and societal cohesion erodes and lobbied for urban sprawl shuts down riding areas.   
 

But I’m sure this is all a bit too complicated for you to comprehend. 

 

6
8
Spoonguy
Posts
3699
Joined
2/28/2022
Location
Mc Kean, PA, USA
5/12/2024 6:12pm
You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right?    From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt...

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right? 
 

From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt… faster than anytime in history… during a boom… an absolute economic disaster and if you can read a graph click the link… 2016-2019 was an utter failure… he took a functioning economy, cut taxes, increased spending, cut services and only enriched the rich — then covid hit and the fastest wealth transfer in history occurred.  
 

record debt - then record transfer of wealth to the rich…

 

yet the trump dick riders still think that dick do be fire 🔥 

Spoonguy wrote:
What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to...

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation.  With a great wealth transfer —...

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation. 

With a great wealth transfer — if you don’t print more money, then people starve and the country erodes into a third world country. If you have ever been to a third world country you would see that.  
 

A functioning society requires a careful balance of the ability to generate wealth and the ability for the working class to afford to participate in such sport as motocross. Look at any wealth gap or wage gap between CEO and the working class from 1960-2024. 

 

The transfer of wealth means the gov must backfill the economy with new cash to maintain any societal standard, thus creating inflation, and as that backfilled money transfers to the rich, another backfill is required because the taxes and wages paid aren’t sufficient to maintain a functioning economic system. 

 

With this inflation the ‘middle class’ wage requirement becomes higher but the amount of people attaining it is a lower percentage, and those in the working class or working poor struggle more.  Things like 70-80% of a wage directly transferred from a working poor person to a wealthy person for rent… is a direct transfer of wealth and a direct result of economic decisions that provides no societal value and only TAKES from society.

 

The wealth transfer and the 30 some trillion dollar national debt and inflation are all directly linked to the same economic decisions, and as with everything it comes back to lobbying   

 

Here’s an example, one of the biggest employers in the country is Walmart. And one of the biggest group of food stamp users are Walmart and McDonald’s workers… why is that?  Why is it acceptable that the government subsidies some of the richest people in the country to keep their workers in poverty? Why hasn’t the minimum wage kept up with inflation?  Lobbyists it’s always lobbyists.
 

https://blog.ucsusa.org/alice-reznickova/how-big-food-corporations-take….



why is the wealth transfer bad? Because an economy needs to be circular not a funnel. Currently it’s a funnel and America is burning money while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and infrastructure falls apart and societal cohesion erodes and lobbied for urban sprawl shuts down riding areas.   
 

But I’m sure this is all a bit too complicated for you to comprehend. 

 

But I'm sure this is all too complicated for you to understand.....nice, sorry I am not cosmopolitan or sophisticated enough to understand basic economics like you. I have been to third world countries, and Wal Marts. Remarkable similarieties, many people standing around doing nothing, many on drugs, waiting for someone to give them something or do something for them. If you are driven and motivated in this country, you don't work at WalMart. It is not even an option. There are many other opportunities that are better, but require more work, but are much more rewarding. Of course if you want a job with no input, you can be high at, and not give a single shit about, you can work at WalMart and be subsidized.

1
5
Spoonguy
Posts
3699
Joined
2/28/2022
Location
Mc Kean, PA, USA
5/12/2024 6:33pm
You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right?    From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt...

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right? 
 

From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt… faster than anytime in history… during a boom… an absolute economic disaster and if you can read a graph click the link… 2016-2019 was an utter failure… he took a functioning economy, cut taxes, increased spending, cut services and only enriched the rich — then covid hit and the fastest wealth transfer in history occurred.  
 

record debt - then record transfer of wealth to the rich…

 

yet the trump dick riders still think that dick do be fire 🔥 

Spoonguy wrote:
What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to...

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation.  With a great wealth transfer —...

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation. 

With a great wealth transfer — if you don’t print more money, then people starve and the country erodes into a third world country. If you have ever been to a third world country you would see that.  
 

A functioning society requires a careful balance of the ability to generate wealth and the ability for the working class to afford to participate in such sport as motocross. Look at any wealth gap or wage gap between CEO and the working class from 1960-2024. 

 

The transfer of wealth means the gov must backfill the economy with new cash to maintain any societal standard, thus creating inflation, and as that backfilled money transfers to the rich, another backfill is required because the taxes and wages paid aren’t sufficient to maintain a functioning economic system. 

 

With this inflation the ‘middle class’ wage requirement becomes higher but the amount of people attaining it is a lower percentage, and those in the working class or working poor struggle more.  Things like 70-80% of a wage directly transferred from a working poor person to a wealthy person for rent… is a direct transfer of wealth and a direct result of economic decisions that provides no societal value and only TAKES from society.

 

The wealth transfer and the 30 some trillion dollar national debt and inflation are all directly linked to the same economic decisions, and as with everything it comes back to lobbying   

 

Here’s an example, one of the biggest employers in the country is Walmart. And one of the biggest group of food stamp users are Walmart and McDonald’s workers… why is that?  Why is it acceptable that the government subsidies some of the richest people in the country to keep their workers in poverty? Why hasn’t the minimum wage kept up with inflation?  Lobbyists it’s always lobbyists.
 

https://blog.ucsusa.org/alice-reznickova/how-big-food-corporations-take….



why is the wealth transfer bad? Because an economy needs to be circular not a funnel. Currently it’s a funnel and America is burning money while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and infrastructure falls apart and societal cohesion erodes and lobbied for urban sprawl shuts down riding areas.   
 

But I’m sure this is all a bit too complicated for you to comprehend. 

 

Also, if it pisses you off what CEOs make, apply for their job. Their wages are controlled by market forces, not unions, if you are more qualified you can get their job. Happwns every day. Of course if you are a pussy who can't compete with the shark tank that is corporate CEO employment opportunities you can belly ache and cry about how life is unfair, while the CEOs get to bull doze the trailer park you live in to build the next factory they need to increase the dividend for his/ her shareholders who participate and grow wealthy in a system nutless wonders deem unfair because spouting platitudes is easier than applying themselves.

3
6
JM485
Posts
5826
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Location
Davis, CA, USA
5/12/2024 6:52pm

Let's get this thread on track. Should we buy bitcoin? 

Personally, I believe we’re in a consolidation period before another major run up as liquidity increases towards the election.  That’s purely my speculative opinion but I am fully invested at this point so I do have significant skin in the game.  

2
JM485
Posts
5826
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Location
Davis, CA, USA
5/12/2024 6:59pm
yak651 wrote:
Nothing wrong with rich getting rich but he does have a point. When the economy was booming before Covid we should’ve been raising interest rates back...

Nothing wrong with rich getting rich but he does have a point. When the economy was booming before Covid we should’ve been raising interest rates back then to cool things off but we were all focused on higher stock returns. Anyhow back to bike prices, should even out. You get less for your used bike but get your new bike cheaper. New riders can get in at lower price point and hopefully we get away from paying $10k for a bike

This is correct, two things can be true at once.  It was irresponsible to pump an already hot economy to juice markets, and it’s also detrimental to society to have a systemic transfer of wealth from the lower classes to the higher classes.  That said, we shouldn’t be inhibiting people from achieving wealth by putting roadblocks in the way of business owners (corporations mean small businesses as well, the one I work for and am part owner of has 6 employees and we are a corporation, that doesn’t just mean big business like Amazon).  The reality is the greatest transfer of wealth ever created was caused by irresponsible and short sighted monetary policy, not because we didn’t tax corporations a few percent more.  Every time ill thought out regulations and taxes are pushed through it doesn’t nothing but harm small business owners, Home Depot can probably swallow a 10% tax increase and regulatory nightmare but your locally owned Ace Hardware store probably can’t, which would be yet another step in the direction of transferring wealth to the very top.  

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1
5/12/2024 7:42pm
dang472 wrote:
That was a great socialist utopian diatribe void of all reality. If handing out $7K to the “middle class” was so great, why don’t we do...

That was a great socialist utopian diatribe void of all reality. If handing out $7K to the “middle class” was so great, why don’t we do $10K? $15? How about we give everyone $20k a month basic income and everything will be sunshine and rainbows. Hell let’s forcibly confiscate all wealth from the top 1% and I think that will cover a few months of our expenses. After those greedy pricks are broke, the single payer health system will be running like a top with all this extra tax revenue the middle class will be paying in. Let’s make minimum wage $50/hr so the Wendy’s order will be $85 for a few double stacks. Unbelievable.

FYI…my union I belong to is one of the biggest lobbying organizations in the construction industry. 

A well managed economy is not a ‘socialist utopia’    Government policy is not socialism. Tax policy is not socialism. Banning lobbyist is not socialism.  Banning...

A well managed economy is not a ‘socialist utopia’ 
 

Government policy is not socialism. Tax policy is not socialism. Banning lobbyist is not socialism.  Banning companies from spending billions of dollars a year on union busting is not socialism.  Public transport is not socialism. single payer healthcare is not socialism. Taxes aren’t socialism. Public aren’t socialism. Walkable livable cities minimising endless urban sprawl encroaching on motocross land is not socialism.  
 

Why has wealth inequality risen drastically massively in the last 2 decades? 
 

Hint: It’s not because of socialism. 


But yeah keep using the socialist boogeymen’s to avoid actually Making American Great Again.
 

 

Spoonguy wrote:
Wealth or success is not a thing you get and capture from Scrooge McDuck's vault, it is an actual manifestation of you or your family's wits...

Wealth or success is not a thing you get and capture from Scrooge McDuck's vault, it is an actual manifestation of you or your family's wits, ambition, and achievements. If you do not have wits, ambition, or achievements you will not get wealth. Likewise if you have those attributes, no matter what happens to your wealth, you still will have wits, ambition, and achievements to regain your wealth. It is as simple as if I work more hours than you, most times I will have more than you. Many of those things you mentioned are actually socialist tenets. And it could be this country's socialistic policies that have contributed massively to wealth inequality. There are so many safety nets in this society that if you learn nothing, buy nothing, do nothing, earn nothing no bad will come of you. We all know a family that has an 18–30-year-old living in his/her parents basement playing video games and smoking weed all day waiting "for the economy to get better", or a "job in their field", or to "pay down student loans". Somehow our society has decided a person like this deserves healthcare and other benefits on par with someone who works 60 hour weeks. Ironically, I believe you would find most socialist countries have huge wealth inequality.

Before 96 when wotc was passed , yes the hardest working , the smartest, the go to guy. Went up the ladder fast. The biggest pipeline co in the world with 16 divisions. I was in charge of stuff no one ever heard of. We did 500-798 mil hhg project every 3+ weeks. The co was soo cheap they only paid an 1/3 of our union wages. I was in 3 unions there. I made my money doing stuff nobody wanted to do. Then I threatened them a flight home or an 2 dollar raise. After 96 it all went backwards. This country is not about who can out work or think anyone. It’s about the biggest tax credit people. At the ymca the buisness owners where gifted a co from there family. Brag that they don’t pay there people any where near what they could. They say I pay them just enough to survive. Anymore and they get ahead and leave for a better opportunity. Or they could be a small player against me. The more the competition the less there is of the pie- money. Trucking is a joke we hv no rights out here. I had a Pa. Officer yelling I,m a marine. He enters the cab illegally & starts taking my vitamin caps off & throwing them everywhere. I said that’s my personal property stop it. He said fu & started slamming my head against the window.the ac was acting up so I didn’t hv my button  tanker shirt on . I had a wife beater on. I think he was jealous. I said stop it what r you doing. I had to punch him sitting in the drivers seat with him on my rt. A short pop to the chin slowed him down then I grabbed his wrist . And said your criminal trespassing. Calm down and get out , or I snap your wrist like a tooth pick. In 04 you needed a search warrant to enter the cab. Obama took that right away.  How would you like a nut job officer entering your house and beating you for No reason.  I talked to a car sales man at the biggest dealership in the area. He said they didn’t sell hardly any cars in April. If no one is buying a car . Why would they buy a bike ?  It’s sooo boring in Sc. Outside of Charleston, Very depressing here. 

2
4
AussieParaMX
Posts
1724
Joined
7/30/2009
Location
Mount Waverley, VIC, AU
5/12/2024 7:47pm
Spoonguy wrote:
What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to...

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation.  With a great wealth transfer —...

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation. 

With a great wealth transfer — if you don’t print more money, then people starve and the country erodes into a third world country. If you have ever been to a third world country you would see that.  
 

A functioning society requires a careful balance of the ability to generate wealth and the ability for the working class to afford to participate in such sport as motocross. Look at any wealth gap or wage gap between CEO and the working class from 1960-2024. 

 

The transfer of wealth means the gov must backfill the economy with new cash to maintain any societal standard, thus creating inflation, and as that backfilled money transfers to the rich, another backfill is required because the taxes and wages paid aren’t sufficient to maintain a functioning economic system. 

 

With this inflation the ‘middle class’ wage requirement becomes higher but the amount of people attaining it is a lower percentage, and those in the working class or working poor struggle more.  Things like 70-80% of a wage directly transferred from a working poor person to a wealthy person for rent… is a direct transfer of wealth and a direct result of economic decisions that provides no societal value and only TAKES from society.

 

The wealth transfer and the 30 some trillion dollar national debt and inflation are all directly linked to the same economic decisions, and as with everything it comes back to lobbying   

 

Here’s an example, one of the biggest employers in the country is Walmart. And one of the biggest group of food stamp users are Walmart and McDonald’s workers… why is that?  Why is it acceptable that the government subsidies some of the richest people in the country to keep their workers in poverty? Why hasn’t the minimum wage kept up with inflation?  Lobbyists it’s always lobbyists.
 

https://blog.ucsusa.org/alice-reznickova/how-big-food-corporations-take….



why is the wealth transfer bad? Because an economy needs to be circular not a funnel. Currently it’s a funnel and America is burning money while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and infrastructure falls apart and societal cohesion erodes and lobbied for urban sprawl shuts down riding areas.   
 

But I’m sure this is all a bit too complicated for you to comprehend. 

 

Spoonguy wrote:
Also, if it pisses you off what CEOs make, apply for their job. Their wages are controlled by market forces, not unions, if you are more...

Also, if it pisses you off what CEOs make, apply for their job. Their wages are controlled by market forces, not unions, if you are more qualified you can get their job. Happwns every day. Of course if you are a pussy who can't compete with the shark tank that is corporate CEO employment opportunities you can belly ache and cry about how life is unfair, while the CEOs get to bull doze the trailer park you live in to build the next factory they need to increase the dividend for his/ her shareholders who participate and grow wealthy in a system nutless wonders deem unfair because spouting platitudes is easier than applying themselves.

I am talking societal level, you are talking an individual level.

And yes, Walmarts and third world countries are similar -- because they are operating on the same economic principles. Which seems to be the principles you hold -- Walmart employs 2.1 million people, many whom have to use SNAP benefits to survive while the employers becomes billionaires off the back of the welfare state, that is third world economic principles, principles that no other first world country holds -- The Walton family is who benefits from welfare.

But again, following your third world economic principles that's not only fine but ideal. And with those ideals its hard to argue from the basis of a first world society. So alas here we are.

America peaked right after the introduction of Reaganomics and has been backsliding ever since, because a quick injection of the wealthiest Americans spending power, borrowing power and deregulations creates a quick boost while being a long term economic disaster and backsliding into a third world economic theocracy - where wealth and lobbying influence decide laws and people such as yourself deify the CEO and ridicule the working poor required to enrich them. 

But again, that might be a bit too heady for you to grasp when you can't think beyond the individual and see society as a much larger system, a system of wealth, power and influence. And if it only fell on individuals why would the richest Americans spends $4.6Billion dollars a year to ensure laws are enacted ONLY to make them richer? 

Society influences you to deify the CEO, and society influences you to ridicule the working poor and economic and societal influences, influence the personal choices of every American, and the rich pay mightily to keep pushing that influence...  

https://www.statista.com/statistics/257337/total-lobbying-spending-in-t…

 

6
3
AussieParaMX
Posts
1724
Joined
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Location
Mount Waverley, VIC, AU
5/12/2024 7:55pm
yak651 wrote:
Nothing wrong with rich getting rich but he does have a point. When the economy was booming before Covid we should’ve been raising interest rates back...

Nothing wrong with rich getting rich but he does have a point. When the economy was booming before Covid we should’ve been raising interest rates back then to cool things off but we were all focused on higher stock returns. Anyhow back to bike prices, should even out. You get less for your used bike but get your new bike cheaper. New riders can get in at lower price point and hopefully we get away from paying $10k for a bike

JM485 wrote:
This is correct, two things can be true at once.  It was irresponsible to pump an already hot economy to juice markets, and it’s also detrimental...

This is correct, two things can be true at once.  It was irresponsible to pump an already hot economy to juice markets, and it’s also detrimental to society to have a systemic transfer of wealth from the lower classes to the higher classes.  That said, we shouldn’t be inhibiting people from achieving wealth by putting roadblocks in the way of business owners (corporations mean small businesses as well, the one I work for and am part owner of has 6 employees and we are a corporation, that doesn’t just mean big business like Amazon).  The reality is the greatest transfer of wealth ever created was caused by irresponsible and short sighted monetary policy, not because we didn’t tax corporations a few percent more.  Every time ill thought out regulations and taxes are pushed through it doesn’t nothing but harm small business owners, Home Depot can probably swallow a 10% tax increase and regulatory nightmare but your locally owned Ace Hardware store probably can’t, which would be yet another step in the direction of transferring wealth to the very top.  

Which is why anti trust laws are so important.

Consolidation is why the local Ace hardware store can't compete, so an economically unsustainable business model is the only choice... 

Look at consolidation in the farming sector - the sector that completely lives off of government subsidies - single family farms can't compete so they get bought, then barely subsist off of consolidated corporate company wages.

Pure capitalism leads to a consolidated ownership class and a lack of competition driving up prices and driving down wages. 

It is why Pure Capitalism has never ever ever worked as an economic model in any country ever in history. It needs guardrails to actually function, guardrails of legislation, of wage and worker protections, of progressive tax rates, of anti trust laws, of truth in advertising laws etc etc etc.

Don't blame the tax rate for an anti trust issue, it's like blaming welfare spending for a lobbied for minimum wage issue.

3
3
Spoonguy
Posts
3699
Joined
2/28/2022
Location
Mc Kean, PA, USA
5/13/2024 4:03am
An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation.  With a great wealth transfer —...

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation. 

With a great wealth transfer — if you don’t print more money, then people starve and the country erodes into a third world country. If you have ever been to a third world country you would see that.  
 

A functioning society requires a careful balance of the ability to generate wealth and the ability for the working class to afford to participate in such sport as motocross. Look at any wealth gap or wage gap between CEO and the working class from 1960-2024. 

 

The transfer of wealth means the gov must backfill the economy with new cash to maintain any societal standard, thus creating inflation, and as that backfilled money transfers to the rich, another backfill is required because the taxes and wages paid aren’t sufficient to maintain a functioning economic system. 

 

With this inflation the ‘middle class’ wage requirement becomes higher but the amount of people attaining it is a lower percentage, and those in the working class or working poor struggle more.  Things like 70-80% of a wage directly transferred from a working poor person to a wealthy person for rent… is a direct transfer of wealth and a direct result of economic decisions that provides no societal value and only TAKES from society.

 

The wealth transfer and the 30 some trillion dollar national debt and inflation are all directly linked to the same economic decisions, and as with everything it comes back to lobbying   

 

Here’s an example, one of the biggest employers in the country is Walmart. And one of the biggest group of food stamp users are Walmart and McDonald’s workers… why is that?  Why is it acceptable that the government subsidies some of the richest people in the country to keep their workers in poverty? Why hasn’t the minimum wage kept up with inflation?  Lobbyists it’s always lobbyists.
 

https://blog.ucsusa.org/alice-reznickova/how-big-food-corporations-take….



why is the wealth transfer bad? Because an economy needs to be circular not a funnel. Currently it’s a funnel and America is burning money while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and infrastructure falls apart and societal cohesion erodes and lobbied for urban sprawl shuts down riding areas.   
 

But I’m sure this is all a bit too complicated for you to comprehend. 

 

Spoonguy wrote:
Also, if it pisses you off what CEOs make, apply for their job. Their wages are controlled by market forces, not unions, if you are more...

Also, if it pisses you off what CEOs make, apply for their job. Their wages are controlled by market forces, not unions, if you are more qualified you can get their job. Happwns every day. Of course if you are a pussy who can't compete with the shark tank that is corporate CEO employment opportunities you can belly ache and cry about how life is unfair, while the CEOs get to bull doze the trailer park you live in to build the next factory they need to increase the dividend for his/ her shareholders who participate and grow wealthy in a system nutless wonders deem unfair because spouting platitudes is easier than applying themselves.

I am talking societal level, you are talking an individual level. And yes, Walmarts and third world countries are similar -- because they are operating on...

I am talking societal level, you are talking an individual level.

And yes, Walmarts and third world countries are similar -- because they are operating on the same economic principles. Which seems to be the principles you hold -- Walmart employs 2.1 million people, many whom have to use SNAP benefits to survive while the employers becomes billionaires off the back of the welfare state, that is third world economic principles, principles that no other first world country holds -- The Walton family is who benefits from welfare.

But again, following your third world economic principles that's not only fine but ideal. And with those ideals its hard to argue from the basis of a first world society. So alas here we are.

America peaked right after the introduction of Reaganomics and has been backsliding ever since, because a quick injection of the wealthiest Americans spending power, borrowing power and deregulations creates a quick boost while being a long term economic disaster and backsliding into a third world economic theocracy - where wealth and lobbying influence decide laws and people such as yourself deify the CEO and ridicule the working poor required to enrich them. 

But again, that might be a bit too heady for you to grasp when you can't think beyond the individual and see society as a much larger system, a system of wealth, power and influence. And if it only fell on individuals why would the richest Americans spends $4.6Billion dollars a year to ensure laws are enacted ONLY to make them richer? 

Society influences you to deify the CEO, and society influences you to ridicule the working poor and economic and societal influences, influence the personal choices of every American, and the rich pay mightily to keep pushing that influence...  

https://www.statista.com/statistics/257337/total-lobbying-spending-in-t…

 

Nobody forces anyone to work at WalMart. It is a job people aspire to because it demands little. Likewise many third world citizens do not remain third world citizens, they move. My own state's governor's chief of staff came from Pakistan, his father made $3.00 a day. Humans can be motivated by hardship. Government policy cannot change poverty, our country has spent billions and decades to curb it. Also there has never been this utopian government constructed that the well-off have not had a huge influence on, is there a reason successful people shouldn't have a say in governing? There will always be people who are completely satisfied barely subsisting, as there will always be people who consider anyone who has more than them "rich" therefore corrupt and evil and someone who took advantage of a fixed system.

5
Timo
Posts
1489
Joined
1/9/2021
Location
Wichita, KS, USA
5/13/2024 5:38am

So I've been building a project bike and looking for used parts on several sites. What's up with people wanting more money for used parts than you can buy new off of Rocky Mountain? I ended up buying an engine from Australia because it was half as much as buying it from the US, which makes zero sense to me. Then I ended up buying a throttle body and fuel pump from the land down under as well. I had to setup as a private importer, but it really wasn't a big deal. 

1
resetjet
Posts
2558
Joined
3/16/2012
Location
Tampa, FL, USA
5/13/2024 5:53am

I am hoping that the great all things price reset is happening.  I hope we float down a little on everything.  Somfar it has happened in real estate,  cars,  rv’s and alot of major purchases.  I dont expect much but a little would be nice.  All these baby boomers dying and leaving their money to kids is really screwing up this economy.

1
1
wrc777
Posts
3246
Joined
5/21/2020
Location
Greenwood, IN, USA
Fantasy
5/13/2024 5:54am
yak651 wrote:
Nothing wrong with rich getting rich but he does have a point. When the economy was booming before Covid we should’ve been raising interest rates back...

Nothing wrong with rich getting rich but he does have a point. When the economy was booming before Covid we should’ve been raising interest rates back then to cool things off but we were all focused on higher stock returns. Anyhow back to bike prices, should even out. You get less for your used bike but get your new bike cheaper. New riders can get in at lower price point and hopefully we get away from paying $10k for a bike

JM485 wrote:
This is correct, two things can be true at once.  It was irresponsible to pump an already hot economy to juice markets, and it’s also detrimental...

This is correct, two things can be true at once.  It was irresponsible to pump an already hot economy to juice markets, and it’s also detrimental to society to have a systemic transfer of wealth from the lower classes to the higher classes.  That said, we shouldn’t be inhibiting people from achieving wealth by putting roadblocks in the way of business owners (corporations mean small businesses as well, the one I work for and am part owner of has 6 employees and we are a corporation, that doesn’t just mean big business like Amazon).  The reality is the greatest transfer of wealth ever created was caused by irresponsible and short sighted monetary policy, not because we didn’t tax corporations a few percent more.  Every time ill thought out regulations and taxes are pushed through it doesn’t nothing but harm small business owners, Home Depot can probably swallow a 10% tax increase and regulatory nightmare but your locally owned Ace Hardware store probably can’t, which would be yet another step in the direction of transferring wealth to the very top.  

Which is why anti trust laws are so important. Consolidation is why the local Ace hardware store can't compete, so an economically unsustainable business model is...

Which is why anti trust laws are so important.

Consolidation is why the local Ace hardware store can't compete, so an economically unsustainable business model is the only choice... 

Look at consolidation in the farming sector - the sector that completely lives off of government subsidies - single family farms can't compete so they get bought, then barely subsist off of consolidated corporate company wages.

Pure capitalism leads to a consolidated ownership class and a lack of competition driving up prices and driving down wages. 

It is why Pure Capitalism has never ever ever worked as an economic model in any country ever in history. It needs guardrails to actually function, guardrails of legislation, of wage and worker protections, of progressive tax rates, of anti trust laws, of truth in advertising laws etc etc etc.

Don't blame the tax rate for an anti trust issue, it's like blaming welfare spending for a lobbied for minimum wage issue.

Anti-trust laws are not being enforced in the US. If they were, medical cost would shrink by up to 90% which would instantly make US manufacturing competitive with just about anywhere in the world. Of course a bunch of health care administrators would have to get factory jobs because their cush, no value added job would go away...

1
sam hain
Posts
1178
Joined
11/8/2011
Location
USA
5/13/2024 6:00am

I watch marketplace daily, I typically save any bikes close to me that seem like good deals. In my area RMZ's and KX's sit the longest until the prices are stupid cheap. YZ 2stks seem to sell pretty quick if clean and reasonably priced. In the last couple weeks I picked up a nice clean 2020 YZ250X with acerbis big tank (stock included) RK tek head, bark busters, full PC exhaust, and a box of spare parts for $5000. Bike was still on the stock tires. I felt like it was a good deal and seller was very honest and seemed like a good dude. I'm also watching another '22 250X in my town that's dropped $1000 in the last week, if it drops much more I may go pick it up lol.

2
5/13/2024 6:06am
You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right?    From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt...

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right? 
 

From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt… faster than anytime in history… during a boom… an absolute economic disaster and if you can read a graph click the link… 2016-2019 was an utter failure… he took a functioning economy, cut taxes, increased spending, cut services and only enriched the rich — then covid hit and the fastest wealth transfer in history occurred.  
 

record debt - then record transfer of wealth to the rich…

 

yet the trump dick riders still think that dick do be fire 🔥 

Spoonguy wrote:
What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to...

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation.  With a great wealth transfer —...

An ideal economy is circular because if it’s not the only solution is printing more money — bingo bongo inflation. 

With a great wealth transfer — if you don’t print more money, then people starve and the country erodes into a third world country. If you have ever been to a third world country you would see that.  
 

A functioning society requires a careful balance of the ability to generate wealth and the ability for the working class to afford to participate in such sport as motocross. Look at any wealth gap or wage gap between CEO and the working class from 1960-2024. 

 

The transfer of wealth means the gov must backfill the economy with new cash to maintain any societal standard, thus creating inflation, and as that backfilled money transfers to the rich, another backfill is required because the taxes and wages paid aren’t sufficient to maintain a functioning economic system. 

 

With this inflation the ‘middle class’ wage requirement becomes higher but the amount of people attaining it is a lower percentage, and those in the working class or working poor struggle more.  Things like 70-80% of a wage directly transferred from a working poor person to a wealthy person for rent… is a direct transfer of wealth and a direct result of economic decisions that provides no societal value and only TAKES from society.

 

The wealth transfer and the 30 some trillion dollar national debt and inflation are all directly linked to the same economic decisions, and as with everything it comes back to lobbying   

 

Here’s an example, one of the biggest employers in the country is Walmart. And one of the biggest group of food stamp users are Walmart and McDonald’s workers… why is that?  Why is it acceptable that the government subsidies some of the richest people in the country to keep their workers in poverty? Why hasn’t the minimum wage kept up with inflation?  Lobbyists it’s always lobbyists.
 

https://blog.ucsusa.org/alice-reznickova/how-big-food-corporations-take….



why is the wealth transfer bad? Because an economy needs to be circular not a funnel. Currently it’s a funnel and America is burning money while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and infrastructure falls apart and societal cohesion erodes and lobbied for urban sprawl shuts down riding areas.   
 

But I’m sure this is all a bit too complicated for you to comprehend. 

 

You know all graphs or tv , internet r controlled by the elite rich. Remember the wall talk ? The gov only had 20 mil of liquid money. The wall bid winner paid to win the contract. My old employer michels pipeline. They had pics of ovr 40,000 thousand track hoes as a sign of where the biggest in the world.  Ever see the sign on the semi trls saying . Where the top 25 or 100 paying co.s ? They pay for that to join a marketing co that runs the bs program.  Where is your dr from ? Mine is from India another is from Mouldova. 

1
3
MXRalph
Posts
427
Joined
11/13/2022
Location
Sacramento, CA, USA
5/13/2024 6:25am

Sold my 53hr  '21 KX450 for $5999 on Friday. Not a fan of dealing with tire kickers so I gave it to my local shop for consignment. They started high at $6799 hoping for the buyer that couldn't afford the $9-10k '24 so it took 2 months but when lowered to $5999 it was gone in 2 weeks. 

mx 219
Posts
4047
Joined
8/15/2010
Location
South Central, PA, USA
5/13/2024 6:34am Edited Date/Time 5/13/2024 6:38am

Let's get this thread on track. Should we buy bitcoin? 

Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months. I don't know as much about it as my brother, but it's been a good investment. I have a fair amount invested now, unfortunately, it's all been within the past 6 years so I'm not a millionaire from it, but I'm up about 4x right now overall. I have sold some to lock in some gains, but still have a lot invested.

If buying crypto scares you invest in crypto stocks.

1
burn1986
Posts
12246
Joined
4/16/2010
Location
bossier city, LA, USA
5/13/2024 11:30am Edited Date/Time 5/13/2024 11:31am

There is a lot going on with the economy, but also it’s no coincidence the biggest heaviest mxers are also the  least selling - RM KX. One reason the YZF sales took off was because Yamaha slimmed its bikes down, while the KX has gotten heavier and (reportedly) slower. How well do you think it would sell if it lost 15lbs and was noticeably slimmer?

LungButter
Posts
8684
Joined
1/9/2016
Location
Yellow Pine, ID, USA
5/13/2024 11:55am
dsoll703 wrote:
Amazing they can stay in business then….   Again, I talked to Kawi guys all the time at the track. Most are happy with the quality...

Amazing they can stay in business then….

 

Again, I talked to Kawi guys all the time at the track. Most are happy with the quality. I have to find one day that their bike was a POS.

Sure there are lemons, but there are for every manufacturer. 

We already had a thread on worst reliability brand awhile back.  Kawi was hands down mentioned more than any other brand.

Take that for what it's worth I suppose but lots of people who said that, myself included, had first hand experience.

 

1
Whip
Posts
381
Joined
6/24/2012
Location
England, GB
Fantasy
5/13/2024 12:02pm

Let's get this thread on track. Should we buy bitcoin? 

mx 219 wrote:
Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months. I don't know as much about it as my brother, but it's been...

Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months. I don't know as much about it as my brother, but it's been a good investment. I have a fair amount invested now, unfortunately, it's all been within the past 6 years so I'm not a millionaire from it, but I'm up about 4x right now overall. I have sold some to lock in some gains, but still have a lot invested.

If buying crypto scares you invest in crypto stocks.

> Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months.

Projected? Based on what? 

> but it's been a good investment. I have a fair amount invested now

Enron would like a word.

Please be careful. If you don't understand the potential mechanics behind the stablecoins (fake dollars posing as real dollars) driving the market then you should not be "investing". The level of wash-trading, spoofing and order book manipulation is unbelievable, that's beside the outright fraud at FTX, Celsuis, Bitfinex, Binance (and go back further to MtGox, BTC-e etc).

I don't actually want to get into a Bitcoin debate, it just frustrates me when someone so confidently says "yes, you should also buy this thing". The market has plummeted multiple times, it has a risk factor of 10/10. The risk level is on par with playing at the casino.

Used bike market is more interesting anyway.

1
mx 219
Posts
4047
Joined
8/15/2010
Location
South Central, PA, USA
5/13/2024 12:31pm

Let's get this thread on track. Should we buy bitcoin? 

mx 219 wrote:
Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months. I don't know as much about it as my brother, but it's been...

Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months. I don't know as much about it as my brother, but it's been a good investment. I have a fair amount invested now, unfortunately, it's all been within the past 6 years so I'm not a millionaire from it, but I'm up about 4x right now overall. I have sold some to lock in some gains, but still have a lot invested.

If buying crypto scares you invest in crypto stocks.

Whip wrote:
> Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months. Projected? Based on what?  > but it's been a good investment. I...

> Right now, yes. Projected to really go up over the next 12-18 months.

Projected? Based on what? 

> but it's been a good investment. I have a fair amount invested now

Enron would like a word.

Please be careful. If you don't understand the potential mechanics behind the stablecoins (fake dollars posing as real dollars) driving the market then you should not be "investing". The level of wash-trading, spoofing and order book manipulation is unbelievable, that's beside the outright fraud at FTX, Celsuis, Bitfinex, Binance (and go back further to MtGox, BTC-e etc).

I don't actually want to get into a Bitcoin debate, it just frustrates me when someone so confidently says "yes, you should also buy this thing". The market has plummeted multiple times, it has a risk factor of 10/10. The risk level is on par with playing at the casino.

Used bike market is more interesting anyway.

Get back to me in 18 months brother.

1
early
Posts
10103
Joined
2/13/2013
Location
University Heights, OH, USA
5/13/2024 12:53pm

Sprinkling a little bitcoin hype really completes this thread.

On the used market, it still seems like there are alot less bikes for sale than there were 5 or more years ago. People hanging on to them because replacement cost is too high?

2
ATKpilot99
Posts
10502
Joined
4/13/2010
Location
Lake Geneva, WI, USA
5/13/2024 1:17pm

Vintage bikes are still up there . People want 1500 + for non running pieces of crap .  " It ran when parked " . Lol

3
AussieParaMX
Posts
1724
Joined
7/30/2009
Location
Mount Waverley, VIC, AU
5/13/2024 2:48pm
JM485 wrote:
This is correct, two things can be true at once.  It was irresponsible to pump an already hot economy to juice markets, and it’s also detrimental...

This is correct, two things can be true at once.  It was irresponsible to pump an already hot economy to juice markets, and it’s also detrimental to society to have a systemic transfer of wealth from the lower classes to the higher classes.  That said, we shouldn’t be inhibiting people from achieving wealth by putting roadblocks in the way of business owners (corporations mean small businesses as well, the one I work for and am part owner of has 6 employees and we are a corporation, that doesn’t just mean big business like Amazon).  The reality is the greatest transfer of wealth ever created was caused by irresponsible and short sighted monetary policy, not because we didn’t tax corporations a few percent more.  Every time ill thought out regulations and taxes are pushed through it doesn’t nothing but harm small business owners, Home Depot can probably swallow a 10% tax increase and regulatory nightmare but your locally owned Ace Hardware store probably can’t, which would be yet another step in the direction of transferring wealth to the very top.  

Which is why anti trust laws are so important. Consolidation is why the local Ace hardware store can't compete, so an economically unsustainable business model is...

Which is why anti trust laws are so important.

Consolidation is why the local Ace hardware store can't compete, so an economically unsustainable business model is the only choice... 

Look at consolidation in the farming sector - the sector that completely lives off of government subsidies - single family farms can't compete so they get bought, then barely subsist off of consolidated corporate company wages.

Pure capitalism leads to a consolidated ownership class and a lack of competition driving up prices and driving down wages. 

It is why Pure Capitalism has never ever ever worked as an economic model in any country ever in history. It needs guardrails to actually function, guardrails of legislation, of wage and worker protections, of progressive tax rates, of anti trust laws, of truth in advertising laws etc etc etc.

Don't blame the tax rate for an anti trust issue, it's like blaming welfare spending for a lobbied for minimum wage issue.

wrc777 wrote:
Anti-trust laws are not being enforced in the US. If they were, medical cost would shrink by up to 90% which would instantly make US manufacturing...

Anti-trust laws are not being enforced in the US. If they were, medical cost would shrink by up to 90% which would instantly make US manufacturing competitive with just about anywhere in the world. Of course a bunch of health care administrators would have to get factory jobs because their cush, no value added job would go away...

Exactly

AussieParaMX
Posts
1724
Joined
7/30/2009
Location
Mount Waverley, VIC, AU
5/13/2024 3:01pm
Spoonguy wrote:
Also, if it pisses you off what CEOs make, apply for their job. Their wages are controlled by market forces, not unions, if you are more...

Also, if it pisses you off what CEOs make, apply for their job. Their wages are controlled by market forces, not unions, if you are more qualified you can get their job. Happwns every day. Of course if you are a pussy who can't compete with the shark tank that is corporate CEO employment opportunities you can belly ache and cry about how life is unfair, while the CEOs get to bull doze the trailer park you live in to build the next factory they need to increase the dividend for his/ her shareholders who participate and grow wealthy in a system nutless wonders deem unfair because spouting platitudes is easier than applying themselves.

I am talking societal level, you are talking an individual level. And yes, Walmarts and third world countries are similar -- because they are operating on...

I am talking societal level, you are talking an individual level.

And yes, Walmarts and third world countries are similar -- because they are operating on the same economic principles. Which seems to be the principles you hold -- Walmart employs 2.1 million people, many whom have to use SNAP benefits to survive while the employers becomes billionaires off the back of the welfare state, that is third world economic principles, principles that no other first world country holds -- The Walton family is who benefits from welfare.

But again, following your third world economic principles that's not only fine but ideal. And with those ideals its hard to argue from the basis of a first world society. So alas here we are.

America peaked right after the introduction of Reaganomics and has been backsliding ever since, because a quick injection of the wealthiest Americans spending power, borrowing power and deregulations creates a quick boost while being a long term economic disaster and backsliding into a third world economic theocracy - where wealth and lobbying influence decide laws and people such as yourself deify the CEO and ridicule the working poor required to enrich them. 

But again, that might be a bit too heady for you to grasp when you can't think beyond the individual and see society as a much larger system, a system of wealth, power and influence. And if it only fell on individuals why would the richest Americans spends $4.6Billion dollars a year to ensure laws are enacted ONLY to make them richer? 

Society influences you to deify the CEO, and society influences you to ridicule the working poor and economic and societal influences, influence the personal choices of every American, and the rich pay mightily to keep pushing that influence...  

https://www.statista.com/statistics/257337/total-lobbying-spending-in-t…

 

Spoonguy wrote:
Nobody forces anyone to work at WalMart. It is a job people aspire to because it demands little. Likewise many third world citizens do not remain...

Nobody forces anyone to work at WalMart. It is a job people aspire to because it demands little. Likewise many third world citizens do not remain third world citizens, they move. My own state's governor's chief of staff came from Pakistan, his father made $3.00 a day. Humans can be motivated by hardship. Government policy cannot change poverty, our country has spent billions and decades to curb it. Also there has never been this utopian government constructed that the well-off have not had a huge influence on, is there a reason successful people shouldn't have a say in governing? There will always be people who are completely satisfied barely subsisting, as there will always be people who consider anyone who has more than them "rich" therefore corrupt and evil and someone who took advantage of a fixed system.

Continuing to focus on the individuals and not on the societal level. Somehow you ignore policy as a driver of the economic divide while the rich spend $4.6 billion a year to maintain the policy.

 

Why shouldn’t rich people decide policy? Because a government is voted in by the people for the people, rich people are rich for themselves off of the back of people. 
 

see Walmart, they influence gov to see their workers - as many as 2.1million - as less than people that deserve a livable wage, so they get rich off of the back of them, yet in a democratic system, 2.1 million votes outweighs the 11 votes of the board.  But in your anti democracy pro third world economic ideals, the 11 board members should control gov for their benefit because they are rich and their workers are… losers? Pathetic? Subhuman?

 

again it’s third world economic thinking and why America has the worst public transport, public education, infrastructure and health outcomes in the developed world. 
 

while the rich pay for your gov to maintain and exacerbate that divide you have been conditioned to think that the rich are some form of deity, while they only take from society.  In every single other developed country a checkout server is required by law to be paid a livable wage in America you celebrate the opposite, while society backslides and you blame the poors for every issue when the rich and their lobbying are to blame for societal level issues 100% of the time. 
 

but you are too indoctrinated and brainwashed to see that.  Poor thing.  

1
4
8tensolutions
Posts
3545
Joined
11/15/2009
Location
Salt Lake City, UT, USA
5/13/2024 3:24pm
SPYGUY wrote:

This is where your credibility goes out the window because you're acting like C19 didn't exist and affect those numbers.

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right?    From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt...

You know C19 didn’t begin in 2019 right? 
 

From 2016-2019 the countries economic false boom was built entirely on debt debt debt rising the debt… faster than anytime in history… during a boom… an absolute economic disaster and if you can read a graph click the link… 2016-2019 was an utter failure… he took a functioning economy, cut taxes, increased spending, cut services and only enriched the rich — then covid hit and the fastest wealth transfer in history occurred.  
 

record debt - then record transfer of wealth to the rich…

 

yet the trump dick riders still think that dick do be fire 🔥 

Spoonguy wrote:
What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to...

What exactly is wrong with wealth transferring to the rich? If I own a factory, employ people, pay suppliers, innovate and produce, shouldn't wealth "transfer" to me? Shouldn't being rich be a goal rather than a scarlet letter of shame? Or do you think wealth should transfer to the trailer parks? The poor already have free school lunches, food programs, free health insurance, housing programs, education programs, isn't all that a wealth transfer from the rich? The poor pay no taxes, actually with EIC many get extra back in taxes by the thousands, so money for the programs for the poor comes from the people you describe as "rich", and actual transfer of wealth. Do you think this country builds aircraft carriers based on the taxes paid by fast food workers?

Nothing is wrong with it......it's no different than Jett being the best rider in the world currently.  He has the skills, drive, and work ethic to be the best and if that drive continues for the next decade he will likely crush every record we know.  Anyone can decide to work hard, grown themselves, and become whatever they want......but those who don't want to blame everyone else and ask for "equality".  

You are exactly right about the poor, weak, not skilled, or "less fortunate" already have a shit ton of programs that cost those of us who work a pile of money already......but the weak will ALWAYS ask for more.  

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8tensolutions
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5/13/2024 3:31pm
I am talking societal level, you are talking an individual level. And yes, Walmarts and third world countries are similar -- because they are operating on...

I am talking societal level, you are talking an individual level.

And yes, Walmarts and third world countries are similar -- because they are operating on the same economic principles. Which seems to be the principles you hold -- Walmart employs 2.1 million people, many whom have to use SNAP benefits to survive while the employers becomes billionaires off the back of the welfare state, that is third world economic principles, principles that no other first world country holds -- The Walton family is who benefits from welfare.

But again, following your third world economic principles that's not only fine but ideal. And with those ideals its hard to argue from the basis of a first world society. So alas here we are.

America peaked right after the introduction of Reaganomics and has been backsliding ever since, because a quick injection of the wealthiest Americans spending power, borrowing power and deregulations creates a quick boost while being a long term economic disaster and backsliding into a third world economic theocracy - where wealth and lobbying influence decide laws and people such as yourself deify the CEO and ridicule the working poor required to enrich them. 

But again, that might be a bit too heady for you to grasp when you can't think beyond the individual and see society as a much larger system, a system of wealth, power and influence. And if it only fell on individuals why would the richest Americans spends $4.6Billion dollars a year to ensure laws are enacted ONLY to make them richer? 

Society influences you to deify the CEO, and society influences you to ridicule the working poor and economic and societal influences, influence the personal choices of every American, and the rich pay mightily to keep pushing that influence...  

https://www.statista.com/statistics/257337/total-lobbying-spending-in-t…

 

Spoonguy wrote:
Nobody forces anyone to work at WalMart. It is a job people aspire to because it demands little. Likewise many third world citizens do not remain...

Nobody forces anyone to work at WalMart. It is a job people aspire to because it demands little. Likewise many third world citizens do not remain third world citizens, they move. My own state's governor's chief of staff came from Pakistan, his father made $3.00 a day. Humans can be motivated by hardship. Government policy cannot change poverty, our country has spent billions and decades to curb it. Also there has never been this utopian government constructed that the well-off have not had a huge influence on, is there a reason successful people shouldn't have a say in governing? There will always be people who are completely satisfied barely subsisting, as there will always be people who consider anyone who has more than them "rich" therefore corrupt and evil and someone who took advantage of a fixed system.

Continuing to focus on the individuals and not on the societal level. Somehow you ignore policy as a driver of the economic divide while the rich...

Continuing to focus on the individuals and not on the societal level. Somehow you ignore policy as a driver of the economic divide while the rich spend $4.6 billion a year to maintain the policy.

 

Why shouldn’t rich people decide policy? Because a government is voted in by the people for the people, rich people are rich for themselves off of the back of people. 
 

see Walmart, they influence gov to see their workers - as many as 2.1million - as less than people that deserve a livable wage, so they get rich off of the back of them, yet in a democratic system, 2.1 million votes outweighs the 11 votes of the board.  But in your anti democracy pro third world economic ideals, the 11 board members should control gov for their benefit because they are rich and their workers are… losers? Pathetic? Subhuman?

 

again it’s third world economic thinking and why America has the worst public transport, public education, infrastructure and health outcomes in the developed world. 
 

while the rich pay for your gov to maintain and exacerbate that divide you have been conditioned to think that the rich are some form of deity, while they only take from society.  In every single other developed country a checkout server is required by law to be paid a livable wage in America you celebrate the opposite, while society backslides and you blame the poors for every issue when the rich and their lobbying are to blame for societal level issues 100% of the time. 
 

but you are too indoctrinated and brainwashed to see that.  Poor thing.  

Bro, look in the mirror with your last sentence.  I agree lobbyists are a major problem and a huge issue in what happens in Washington, but you are out of touch with it being the only problem.  What is your solution?

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