STARK FUTURE VARG - An Electric Bike that is Faster and Lighter than a 450?

FWYT
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12/15/2021 7:41am
So the bike was developed in Spain... I recall Tortelli had moved to Spain a couple years ago, correct? I wonder if this is what brought him over there and he has been somehow secretly testing this whole time? Still amazing that they were able to keep it under wraps this whole time.
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SilverSpurs
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12/15/2021 7:45am
Chippy wrote:
Rosso391 is doing a great job trolling and derailing this thread off of the subject of the bike. Just stop responding to him. Many of us...
Rosso391 is doing a great job trolling and derailing this thread off of the subject of the bike. Just stop responding to him.

Many of us were bummed to see Alta not make it, and you gotta commend this new company to pull off what they did for some exciting progression of the sport and push past where Alta ceased. If you don't want the sport to progress, that's pretty sad really...
HonDawg17 wrote:
"I'm just here to stir $hit up" is my saying. Seems I got more than a few people riled up on here. Jeez. I'm for progression...
"I'm just here to stir $hit up" is my saying. Seems I got more than a few people riled up on here. Jeez. I'm for progression, BUT electric isn't the way to go. IN MY OPINION. And I only say that because the "zero emission" nonsense doesn't sell in reality. Your house is getting power from 60-70% coal or fossil fuel power plants. And if you are charging your bike at the track on your generator it's still using fuel. This bike DOES look better than Alta on paper. I just want to see the real head to head proof. Not a slow motion and chopped video showing nothing useful.
In 60 hp guise it will run for 8 minutes on the battery- if the electronics don't overheat.

Woke ethos with substandard battery technology for racing vehicle .

Also:

https://motorbikewriter.com/fire-electric-race-bikes/
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SilverSpurs
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12/15/2021 7:48am
FWYT wrote:
So the bike was developed in Spain... I recall Tortelli had moved to Spain a couple years ago, correct? I wonder if this is what brought...
So the bike was developed in Spain... I recall Tortelli had moved to Spain a couple years ago, correct? I wonder if this is what brought him over there and he has been somehow secretly testing this whole time? Still amazing that they were able to keep it under wraps this whole time.
What is amazing?

All the electrical components will be off the shelf. The supension parts and design wlll be cannibalized from an existing bike.

A competent back-yarder could build that bike easily in a few months.

Not so easy will be getting it to mass production.
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Bearuno
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12/15/2021 7:49am Edited Date/Time 12/15/2021 7:51am
PJRAUS wrote:
Well I ordered mine, it will be $17 000 AUD delivered...dunno about wether or not that includes import GST... Anyway a new KTM 450 is already...
Well I ordered mine, it will be $17 000 AUD delivered...dunno about wether or not that includes import GST...
Anyway a new KTM 450 is already $14,000 here..
This thing will give me the chance to ride at home whenever I want..

-MAVERICK- wrote:
There's no additional costs or taxes once you paid for it on their website. They're delievered duty paid.
Any serious OS seller into OZ knows now to charge our GST at their end. Even the 'under $1000 and no GST' break we had disappeared a year or two ago.

The 17K AUD delivered is great - I think the Altas from the (supposed) OZ distributor were to be just on 20K.

Thanks PJRAUS for getting in the line for the bike, and the info. I still have that 'magic drawer' that I put money into for an Alta, and have managed to only reduce it to 11K, so, I've 6K to skerrick away. I've big demands on my money for the next year, so, for me, it looks to be 2023 for a Varga at the rate I can sneak funds into said 'magic drawer'.

Or, by then, maybe mainstream manufacturers will have an answer to it, if they finally pull their fingers out - I really hope the Stark Varga forces their hand - I reckon they are sitting on what they have, especially Honda.

I'll have to investigate Rego on an E bike - I have to have a plate for my local riding.
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The Shop

early
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12/15/2021 8:11am
In 60 hp guise it will run for 8 minutes on the battery- if the electronics don't overheat. Woke ethos with substandard battery technology for racing...
In 60 hp guise it will run for 8 minutes on the battery- if the electronics don't overheat.

Woke ethos with substandard battery technology for racing vehicle .

Also:

https://motorbikewriter.com/fire-electric-race-bikes/
Fire was from the paddock charging system. Bikes weren't even connected to the chargers at the time.
https://drivetribe.com/p/motoe-reveals-cause-of-jerez-paddock-TIQ6GS_JT…
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m21racing
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12/15/2021 8:15am
I have a solar trickle charger for my car. Is this something that could work? Also, there are solar powered generators. I wonder if it's enough to charge between motos. Side note; bike would look better in green!
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stone881
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12/15/2021 8:23am
Toby259 wrote:
Soon you won't be able to charge them with a gas-powered generator in Kalifornia https://www.marketwatch.com/story/california-to-ban-gas-powered-leaf-blowers-and-mowers-adopts-tougher-emissions-standards-for-big-trucks-01639164073 Also on Thursday, the California Air Resources Board agreed to ban...
Soon you won't be able to charge them with a gas-powered generator in Kalifornia

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/california-to-ban-gas-powered-leaf-bl…

Also on Thursday, the California Air Resources Board agreed to ban the sale of new products run by small gas-powered engines, including leaf blowers, lawn mowers and portable generators — a rule recently mandated by the state’s Democratic-dominated state Legislature.
You could charge it off of your Ford truck.
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PJRAUS
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12/15/2021 8:25am
Stevehrc wrote:
$13470 usd in the article is $18943 Australian!! Nearly 20k mostly likely once landed on a dirtbike and everyone sooks about factory/works editions bikes 🙄🙄🙄 and...
$13470 usd in the article is $18943 Australian!! Nearly 20k mostly likely once landed on a dirtbike and everyone sooks about factory/works editions bikes 🙄🙄🙄 and then if somethings wrong how do you fix it? 😅 buy the time you put 100hrs on a ICE bike your in that ball park if left stock with just paying for fuel. And most people usually sell them around 100hrs give or take anyway.

I think its super interesting all the features from 125-450 power, engine braking, map settings ect don't get me wrong, very cool.

BUT all the vitards already whinge about 450s having to much power 🥲🥲🥲 so yeah 60-80hp on tap is a great idea 😂😂😂 Joe blow who buys a new 250 is restricted to the 250s power but with this bike he can be like fuck it let's try 60hp+ and whiskey it of the berm into the next state and its all good 😅 and it will happen.

Yeah understand the noise part but we all in the same boat, we are all in it. Its moto.

People will buy them with fuck all moto background and just tune it for power and really have no idea.

I'll argue black and blue, and your a fuck wit if you think otherwise such a power bike open to the market is "safe" when majority of vitards think 450s is to much 😂😂😂
Ive placed my order, I chose the 60 hp option. The price delivered including GST is $17k the 80 hp option would have been dearer and I didn't see the need for it ,so $17k Australian...no more to pay. The recommend retail price for a 22 model KTM 450 is $ 14,439 aud, so this emx bike is around 2.5 k more expensive.
This bike means one thing to me at this stage and that is the opportunity to ride at home on 2 really great tracks I have already mapped out, without causing any fuss with neighbors in 4 separate farm houses ranging from 200 to 600 meters away. This will mean the absolute world to me...
I'm anticipating a fairly low cost and easy care maintenance routine with this bike and a long service life without any great desire on my part to update to something newer and greater over time, but only time will tell.
I doubt this bike would suit the majority of people ,especially new or inexperienced riders based on price alone, so im not sure the claimed 80hp and the danger that might represent to the inexperienced will be that great of an issue...who knows though?
In short I am refraining from having any hard preconceptions about what this bike is really like until Ive owned it a fair while and logged many hours.
October 2022 is a long way off yet and in this crazy unstable world ,I see a significant risk for this company to fail to deliver due to matters completely out of their hands like new lockdowns or a global economic crash...maybe unavailability of components or materials due to supply chain shut downs...Ive only paid my $100 deposit, but I already have most of the $17k tucked away...no way Im paying in full until I see these bikes being produced and shipped.
So far Im impressed with the company's professionalism. I sent an inquiry as to availability in Australia and shipping cost, they replied overnight, they have their system in place already to land one on your doorstep for an all inclusive price, you also get to option the bike with the suspension set for your weight range.
We will see if this all comes together...Im so hopeful that it will...this winter Ill be down the back shaping upramps on natural terrain jumps and clearing fallen limbs and undergrowth from where my tracks are going, in anticipation of finally being able to ride where I live,any time I get the time to do so
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nate 415
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12/15/2021 8:28am
PJRAUS wrote:
Christ...I just blew my load....four times! Im in! I need one bad...they gotta be available in Australia! I dont give a flying fuck about zero emissions...just...
Christ...I just blew my load....four times! Im in! I need one bad...they gotta be available in Australia!
I dont give a flying fuck about zero emissions...just pure bullshit!
The only emission I care about is noise..no noise!
This bike would change my life because I could have 2 totally awesome natural terrain tracks on the 120 acre farm where I live...there are 4 houses within a 600 metre radius, so I cannot ride my gas bikes here...
Get home from work early on a weekday..go cut laps! Dream come true!
Im signing up!
I have always wanted to see Aus but Im started to form the opinon its crazy restrictive. 120 acres and you cant ride??
If its not the noise the goverment will find something else.
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gt80rider
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12/15/2021 8:29am Edited Date/Time 12/15/2021 8:30am
m21racing wrote:
I have a solar trickle charger for my car. Is this something that could work? Also, there are solar powered generators. I wonder if it's enough...
I have a solar trickle charger for my car. Is this something that could work? Also, there are solar powered generators. I wonder if it's enough to charge between motos. Side note; bike would look better in green!
LOL.... ya no

the real fun part is gonna be when they get 20 of those bikes at the same track..... gonna have to put a brass bar in place of that circuit breaker... LOL
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early
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12/15/2021 8:48am
gt80rider wrote:
LOL.... ya no the real fun part is gonna be when they get 20 of those bikes at the same track..... gonna have to put a...
LOL.... ya no

the real fun part is gonna be when they get 20 of those bikes at the same track..... gonna have to put a brass bar in place of that circuit breaker... LOL
Every mechanic and aftermarket company employee that gets put out of work because of the lack of parts/maintenance on electric bikes can just become an electrician. That job is going to be very important and in demand in the future.
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PJRAUS
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12/15/2021 8:50am
PJRAUS wrote:
Christ...I just blew my load....four times! Im in! I need one bad...they gotta be available in Australia! I dont give a flying fuck about zero emissions...just...
Christ...I just blew my load....four times! Im in! I need one bad...they gotta be available in Australia!
I dont give a flying fuck about zero emissions...just pure bullshit!
The only emission I care about is noise..no noise!
This bike would change my life because I could have 2 totally awesome natural terrain tracks on the 120 acre farm where I live...there are 4 houses within a 600 metre radius, so I cannot ride my gas bikes here...
Get home from work early on a weekday..go cut laps! Dream come true!
Im signing up!
nate 415 wrote:
I have always wanted to see Aus but Im started to form the opinon its crazy restrictive. 120 acres and you cant ride?? If its not...
I have always wanted to see Aus but Im started to form the opinon its crazy restrictive. 120 acres and you cant ride??
If its not the noise the goverment will find something else.
Well I wouldn't argue with any of your preconceptions about Australia...it is getting super restrictive here and the place is run by criminals and fuckwits...
But....in my particular case..my tracks will be nothing more than natural terrain with some shovel shaping of upramps etc ,so nothing to see on satellite spy imaging used by shire council rats to spy on what you are doing.
The property I live on isnt mine..Im a tennant and live here alone . My landlord is a top bloke and loves bikes..he said I cant ride my gas bikes here due to the noise complaints he will get..fair enough,its his property. However, I showed him a video of the Yamaha based EMX powertrain bike and he was blown away...he said I could ride a bike like that here all I want!
You should see the place where my main track will be...its a kind of a lose your load deal! 😛😛
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FahQ
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12/15/2021 9:00am
I wonder how many of the orders are put in by the competition
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PJRAUS
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12/15/2021 9:00am
Bearuno wrote:
Any serious OS seller into OZ knows now to charge our GST at their end. Even the 'under $1000 and no GST' break we had disappeared...
Any serious OS seller into OZ knows now to charge our GST at their end. Even the 'under $1000 and no GST' break we had disappeared a year or two ago.

The 17K AUD delivered is great - I think the Altas from the (supposed) OZ distributor were to be just on 20K.

Thanks PJRAUS for getting in the line for the bike, and the info. I still have that 'magic drawer' that I put money into for an Alta, and have managed to only reduce it to 11K, so, I've 6K to skerrick away. I've big demands on my money for the next year, so, for me, it looks to be 2023 for a Varga at the rate I can sneak funds into said 'magic drawer'.

Or, by then, maybe mainstream manufacturers will have an answer to it, if they finally pull their fingers out - I really hope the Stark Varga forces their hand - I reckon they are sitting on what they have, especially Honda.

I'll have to investigate Rego on an E bike - I have to have a plate for my local riding.
Yes this is going to be super interesting! Im proud of how Ive been able to tuck away the money lately..most 14 year old supermini riders can't do that! I think I have a great work ethic for my age.
Was riding the supermini last sunday at our local track and got into it with a couple of fast 85 big wheel riders, we all got bumped out of the juniors group and rode with the adults...we had so much fun.
At the end of the day,those 2 lads and their dads were hanging back in the carpark after everyone had left , so I went over to say gday and have a beer with the dads, cause the boys are underage and not allowed to drink, but underage drinking doesn't bother me ...I do it all the time!
Lets hope the Stark Varga really comes to fruition and that day comes when that wooden crate gets delivered!
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12/15/2021 9:08am
KONG wrote:
I hope I'm dead before I have no choice but riding some kitchen appliance.
The better they get, the more I hate them.
Sick
Same here. The day Supercross/motocross has a full gate of these electric bikes will be when I stop watching
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arr
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12/15/2021 9:17am
CR92 wrote:
That's way cool! I didn't see this in any of the info, but was there any mention of any system on the bike similar to a...
That's way cool! I didn't see this in any of the info, but was there any mention of any system on the bike similar to a clutch? I know electric doesn't have a need for a clutch, but I really hope they have a system that mimics one. Aside from obvious control, a clutch has saved my butt from whiskey throttling and crashing big more times than I can count. For this reason alone I hope they have a similar system.
I admittedly skimmed it, so I might have missed it, but this would be my only real concern over owning electric dirtbikes.
I have the same question. Note that bike in video doesn't have a "clutch" lever, but the one in photos does.

Yamaha developed a eletric Trial bike with clutch few years ago.
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Last Braaap
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12/15/2021 9:22am
arr wrote:
I have the same question. Note that bike in video doesn't have a "clutch" lever, but the one in photos does. Yamaha developed a eletric Trial...
I have the same question. Note that bike in video doesn't have a "clutch" lever, but the one in photos does.

Yamaha developed a eletric Trial bike with clutch few years ago.
You have torque from 0 up the wazoo with electric motor. Why use clutch?

The lever on the photos should be rear brake mounted on handlebars.
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Last Braaap
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12/15/2021 9:31am Edited Date/Time 12/15/2021 9:36am
KONG wrote:
I hope I'm dead before I have no choice but riding some kitchen appliance.
The better they get, the more I hate them.
Sick
Same here. The day Supercross/motocross has a full gate of these electric bikes will be when I stop watching
i see possibility to use "fake mufflers" aka military grade bluetooth speakers able to withstand the conditions and be controlled with your phone that has data (wheel rotation speed, throttle position) fed already into it.

Just use artificial sound made by mentioned speaker paired to the phone on your handlebars. It is safer for the race when you can hear people coming closer to you... okay maybe i also wanna ride dirtbike track accompanied by the sound of Aston Martin V12... go ahead sue me. Whistling
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early
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12/15/2021 9:34am
Same here. The day Supercross/motocross has a full gate of these electric bikes will be when I stop watching
By the time moto is electric only all TV will be streaming and all the old timers heads will have already exploded.
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1
12/15/2021 9:42am Edited Date/Time 12/15/2021 9:50am
EV will kill the moto industry when it comes to aftermarket and hard parts. I hope we just add these bikes as an option and don’t...
EV will kill the moto industry when it comes to aftermarket and hard parts. I hope we just add these bikes as an option and don’t wholesale move to electric. A lot of people will be out of work if that happens.
Welcome to capitalism.

They can either adapt or not. Their choice.
HonDawg17 wrote:
i don't think you spelled communism correctly...
POV: You have absolutely zero basic understanding of what those two words mean and just use them interchangeably as you see fit to try to "make a point" lol.

Introducing a ground breaking, disruptive product to the free market is now known as "communism"? Shit, I guess I need to brush up on my macroeconomics.

EDIT: Have now read back a few pages and realize this guy is just a full on clown trolling for responses.
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arr
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12/15/2021 9:58am
arr wrote:
I have the same question. Note that bike in video doesn't have a "clutch" lever, but the one in photos does. Yamaha developed a eletric Trial...
I have the same question. Note that bike in video doesn't have a "clutch" lever, but the one in photos does.

Yamaha developed a eletric Trial bike with clutch few years ago.
You have torque from 0 up the wazoo with electric motor. Why use clutch?

The lever on the photos should be rear brake mounted on handlebars.
Safety.

In a discipline where we see world class athletes like Villopoto, Paulin and Febvre looping out 60hp bikes, there's no way I will try to fully ride a 80hp bike with monster torque without this safety resource.

Plus i'm more confortable controlling the traction with one left finger than blipping the throttle.
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JCRacing822
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12/15/2021 10:01am
I could get into some trouble with 60hp even. I’d be down for like 35-45hp and some more range or less weight.
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early
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12/15/2021 10:07am
I could get into some trouble with 60hp even. I’d be down for like 35-45hp and some more range or less weight.
You can easily tune it to the peak power and delivery style of your choice.
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Freddy99
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12/15/2021 10:20am
POV: You have absolutely zero basic understanding of what those two words mean and just use them interchangeably as you see fit to try to "make...
POV: You have absolutely zero basic understanding of what those two words mean and just use them interchangeably as you see fit to try to "make a point" lol.

Introducing a ground breaking, disruptive product to the free market is now known as "communism"? Shit, I guess I need to brush up on my macroeconomics.

EDIT: Have now read back a few pages and realize this guy is just a full on clown trolling for responses.
People love watering the potato on vital. If this forum software wasn't as antiquated as the latest offerings from Suzuki maybe it would have a useful ignore list.
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davis224
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Fantasy
12/15/2021 10:37am
I could get into some trouble with 60hp even. I’d be down for like 35-45hp and some more range or less weight.
They cover that in the video, they gave it 80 hp so you can detune it to max efficiency, which would be around the power you mentioned. If it's the same weight as a 450, it will likely feel waaaaay lighter on track with no piston going up and down, I know the Alta was a lot heavier and felt like a 250 while riding it. I'm anxious to see if they live up to the hype in real life.
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12/15/2021 10:40am
"This is going to destroy the motocross industry"

Yeah, we heard that ~5 years ago when Alta announced their electric bikes. Back then, people were reacting like everyone was going to be forced to ride electric bikes. But here we are, 5 years later, you still have your gate full of gas bikes, and a plethora of gas bike options to choose from. Motocross is alive and well, perhaps the best it has been in recent history.

How can anyone complain about a new challenger entering a ring that has been dominated by the same 4 or 5 companies for many years? Competition in the marketplace is a good thing for all of us.
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RCMXracing
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12/15/2021 10:56am Edited Date/Time 12/15/2021 11:02am
"This is going to destroy the motocross industry" Yeah, we heard that ~5 years ago when Alta announced their electric bikes. Back then, people were reacting...
"This is going to destroy the motocross industry"

Yeah, we heard that ~5 years ago when Alta announced their electric bikes. Back then, people were reacting like everyone was going to be forced to ride electric bikes. But here we are, 5 years later, you still have your gate full of gas bikes, and a plethora of gas bike options to choose from. Motocross is alive and well, perhaps the best it has been in recent history.

How can anyone complain about a new challenger entering a ring that has been dominated by the same 4 or 5 companies for many years? Competition in the marketplace is a good thing for all of us.
Agree.

Would like one of our Vital member financial geniuses to do a deep dive into this company. Alta ran out of juice… would hate to see a repeat.
Magoofan
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12/15/2021 1:16pm
Guess I'm an old timer... No sound, no smell.... too clinical....just like the wooden CEO in that video.

Zero emissions....more bullshit. That power to charge it has to come from some generation plant.

The excitement of being a spectator just died for me.

A stadium filled with "Vvvvvvvvrrrr......vrrrrrrrr.....vrrrrrrrrr".

Bring on the thumbsdowns and roast....I don't give a crap.




Long live the BRAAAP.

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Kevin852
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Fantasy
12/15/2021 1:40pm
While the lack of the visceral experience will take some getting used to it seems that the bike is pretty awesome. Not sure i can stomach the price tag (see my post in the 2023 RMZ450 thread about cost of my current bike ...hint ... barley more than an exhaust system!)

But I if maintenance is minimized and that will offset the purchase cost a bit i would imagine.

Be interesting how this effects Honda's timeline on releasing their 450e (or whatever they are calling it?)

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