Environuts called my private track in.

stone881
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stone881 8/9/2019 12:55pm
8/9/2019 12:55pm
Do not let them on your property, period.
1
Chrissi 613
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Chrissi 613 8/9/2019 1:11pm
8/9/2019 1:11pm
stone881 wrote:
Do not let them on your property, period.
“By law, DEP has broad authority, within constitutional limits, to enter most private property at a reasonable time without a search warrant to conduct inspections or investigate possible violations of environmental laws, regulations, orders, or permits. But this authority does not extend to private homes. DEP also may apply for a search warrant to enter property when determining compliance with environmental laws, regulations, orders, or permits. Specific environmental laws also allow DEP to enter private property for particular purposes.“
dadofagun
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dadofagun 8/9/2019 1:19pm
8/9/2019 1:19pm
If you don't already have one, get a lawyer. Know your rights before one foot is set on that property outside of those you welcome in with open arms. You are not hurting a thing, and it's a shame it will end up costing you something because somebody has a chapped ass. But, sad as it is, even if you are doing NOTHING out of line, this WILL cost you something in the end. Stay strong, good luck.
Mx4life320
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Mx4life320 8/9/2019 1:23pm
8/9/2019 1:23pm
I wan to know the out come...

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Lip44
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Lip44 8/9/2019 1:24pm
8/9/2019 1:24pm
If I were to guess it looks like they’re going to be concerned about erosion & sediment leaving your property when it rains. I work as an engineer in PA and deal with the DEP / conservation districts all the time. If you disturb more than 5,000 SF of soil during any construction activity you need an erosion & sedimentation control plan and Best Management Practice’s (BMPs) installed onsite so you don’t discharge sediment from your property into the closest receiving waters (streams, lakes, wetlands, etc.). If you disturb more than 1 acre you will need a NPDES permit, which is very involved. Hopefully you didn’t blow out any wetlands or “sensitive environmental resources” as they put it when you built the track, that can cause some issues for you.

It looks like you’re in Edinboro which is in Erie County. Google Erie County Conservation District and go on their website. They are basically DEP’s branch organizations that handle E&S permitting on a local level (go under the permits & forms section, you might be able to get away with a low hazard plan if they bust your stones).

Good luck, DEP can be tough.
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gnarwhip
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gnarwhip 8/9/2019 1:24pm
8/9/2019 1:24pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2019 1:29pm
Psh how is that constitutional? DEP can go f off
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zehn
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zehn 8/9/2019 1:30pm
8/9/2019 1:30pm
When Vitards play constitutional lawyers Blink
8
oilman400
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oilman400 8/9/2019 1:30pm
8/9/2019 1:30pm
This shit is why kids sit and stare at a video screens all day, its destroying all the things that i did as a kid. I hope it works out for you!

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kkawboy14
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kkawboy14 8/9/2019 1:35pm
8/9/2019 1:35pm
Call the EPA they will tell you anything you want to know
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Red Crawford
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Red Crawford 8/9/2019 1:39pm
8/9/2019 1:39pm
Have your attorney there....that'll cut to the chase. 😁
Everyone on Vital is an "Esq.", so you came to the right place. 🎯

Red Crawford, Esq.
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Dtat720
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Dtat720 8/9/2019 1:43pm
8/9/2019 1:43pm
Ive dealt with them building a track within 500 feet of a federaly protected waterway. Basically we walked the property, looked at potential problem areas for erosion to contaminate the waterway and came up with a cost effective plan to prevent it. A few silt fences, a weekend worth of digging drainage trenches to divert to another waterway and problem solved, got epa approval to open and havent had an issue since.

Mine was the same scenario, neighbor was livid i was building a track next to his business. I was very polite and attentive and it was quite easy to come up with a solution that pleased the epa and pissed off my neighbor enough to move his business. 10 years later, track is still running and the epa has been a pleasure to deal with. Crazy sounding, but they really arent that bad
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willie838
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willie838 8/9/2019 2:00pm
8/9/2019 2:00pm
God damn people.

Stop snitching.

Fucking babies.
4
Kenny Lingus
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Kenny Lingus 8/9/2019 2:00pm
8/9/2019 2:00pm
Some good advice and some bad. Don't assume anything. If someone does show up that has official capacity in the matter, ask for proper I.D. and be polite. If you do have any violations being a dick will only make it worse. I wish you the best of luck.
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KMC440
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KMC440 8/9/2019 2:15pm
8/9/2019 2:15pm
yak651 wrote:
If nothing comes about this, I would plant a row of trees along the road to prevent people from seeing the track as they ride by...
If nothing comes about this, I would plant a row of trees along the road to prevent people from seeing the track as they ride by...

As others have said, try to find the reason for the visit and what they are looking for/want to see. Ask for an agenda for the visit.

Quick story that may or may not be relevant. A friend that has a track we ride at every Wednesday. The town constable came out one Wednesday saying he had complaints of races being held on the property. He said no, I know everyone of these people by name, no races, just a weekly ride session. The constable was then saying the neighbors complained the noise was scaring the wildlife away. A couple minutes after saying that a deer ran out into the track area, one buddy had to stop and wait for the deer to get off the track. The constable said ok, just try to keep the noise down and left. That was about 10 years ago. If it's in an agricultural district, most likely there are no noise restrictions. If there are, ask to see the ordinance because most likely every farmer in the area is breaking the rules during planting and harvesting season.
This wouldn't be near any drag strip would it ?
mx 219
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mx 219 8/9/2019 2:19pm
8/9/2019 2:19pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2019 2:21pm
Lip44 wrote:
If I were to guess it looks like they’re going to be concerned about erosion & sediment leaving your property when it rains. I work as...
If I were to guess it looks like they’re going to be concerned about erosion & sediment leaving your property when it rains. I work as an engineer in PA and deal with the DEP / conservation districts all the time. If you disturb more than 5,000 SF of soil during any construction activity you need an erosion & sedimentation control plan and Best Management Practice’s (BMPs) installed onsite so you don’t discharge sediment from your property into the closest receiving waters (streams, lakes, wetlands, etc.). If you disturb more than 1 acre you will need a NPDES permit, which is very involved. Hopefully you didn’t blow out any wetlands or “sensitive environmental resources” as they put it when you built the track, that can cause some issues for you.

It looks like you’re in Edinboro which is in Erie County. Google Erie County Conservation District and go on their website. They are basically DEP’s branch organizations that handle E&S permitting on a local level (go under the permits & forms section, you might be able to get away with a low hazard plan if they bust your stones).

Good luck, DEP can be tough.
This is what i was trying to get to previously.
1
Gilby122
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Gilby122 8/9/2019 2:21pm
8/9/2019 2:21pm
My old house had a small track on the bottom of the 17 acres. Coincidentally my closest neighbor was a lawyer. He left me a vm one time saying he wanted to discuss my "motorcycle track building activities." I returned his call and left him a message, but never heard back. Next two times I rode he stood by the fence and watched me. I tried to throw a whip to impress him, but I suck and I really can't so I don't think he was too amused.

Irrelevant story. Maybe someone is just trying to 'scare' you. Hope it works out with minimal cost or trouble!!
9
brimx153
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brimx153 8/9/2019 2:32pm
8/9/2019 2:32pm
Here in Ireland, you need planing permission to build anything over 1 m high . So many private track s have even been shut because of this . Its pure crap to say you cant do what you like even on your own land
2
captmoto
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captmoto 8/9/2019 4:37pm
8/9/2019 4:37pm
mikec265 wrote:
Has any dealt with the DEP/Environmental Protection Agency over a private track? I just got a call, and the guy is coming to inspect at 11am...
Has any dealt with the DEP/Environmental Protection Agency over a private track?

I just got a call, and the guy is coming to inspect at 11am Tuesday. Someone anonymous turned in a complaint about a race track being built.

The kids track has existed over a year with no complaints. No wetlands were disturbed. We don't ride after 5 pm out of courtesy. We don't ride if it's dusty. It was just a flat field of weeds that was cut.

Has anyone dealt with this and what are your experiences? I don't know what to expect.
Those government agencies don't deal on the phone. They will contact you by mail first. Tell anyone that shows up at your home to go piss up a rope.
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TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 8/9/2019 4:54pm
8/9/2019 4:54pm
1. No matter what.. “family use only”...as in the people that “live here”...that’s who’s riding there.
2. What’s “permitted” or allowed for the type of zoning you have...needs to be known.
3. Very quietly and carefully try to find out “who” snitched ya out!

Years ago...we found out it was a neighbor...we bought the land on the other side of said neighbor (near Merced, Ca out on hi-way 140) & built a really nice chicken coop complete with rooster and guard dogs...right up against the PL. Then...I put a pig pen on that side of the property, too. Me and my Hawaiian-Portuguese gram’pa...We were MEAN! We added goats in the summer, too.

Snitches get Stitches!
20
Blue flag
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Blue flag 8/9/2019 5:00pm
8/9/2019 5:00pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2019 5:02pm
MxKing809 wrote:
Their only angle can be soil erosion and run off. Make sure that if there are any ditches, you have some silt fence up to make...
Their only angle can be soil erosion and run off.

Make sure that if there are any ditches, you have some silt fence up to make it look like you’re conscience.
This right here. I work in construction, and although I’m in Ohio, and I typically deal with Ohio EPA, they primarily deal in soil erosion. I’ve been told by the EPA director that they look at 3 things. An engineer designed erosion plan, the designed plan infrastructure, and/or an honest effort by the contractor (or property owner in your case) to prevent soil erosion or runoff getting into waterways. Also, these practices are really only required if the disturbed area is over 1 1/4 acres. Hope this helps, oh, and contact the EPA/DEP directly and ask them about soil erosion practice requirements. They will tell you.

Oh, and throwing some silt fence downhill of the track, or along any waterway or ditchline will go a long way in appeasing an inspector.
2
dickjackson170 8/9/2019 5:24pm
8/9/2019 5:24pm
Water runoff into the storm system (creeks for those of us out of town) is real. Has nothing to do with fuel, oil, etc. It's about soil washout.
1
TbonesPop 8/9/2019 5:57pm
8/9/2019 5:57pm
Whatever you do, don't be a dick. You catch more flies with honey than you do with a sledge hammer. I've found that dealing with inspectors goes much better when you are polite and professional - and respectful. I've told some building inspectors they were idiots (because they were), it didn't end well. Got through it eventually, but it was a major PITA. just be nice. Find out what it takes to be in compliance, and then comply. If you do this, then they will have to go back to the complainer and tell them to pound sand if you are in compliance.

Then on the sly try to find out who snitched or complained. then go throw a burning bag of dogshit up against their front doorEvil Woohoo
11
mikec265
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mikec265 8/9/2019 6:05pm
8/9/2019 6:05pm
Just got done riding (and crashing)... I am putting a silt fence up on the south side where the dirt will run. A friend of mine who dealt with DEP a lot while working on pipelines came over and showed me where to put it up. Probably about 4 or 5 acres got worked. I was going to let mother nature grow grass for me, but I better buy some cheap seed. Do I need to keep silt fence up forever, or just long enough to get off of thier radar?
mikec265
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mikec265 8/9/2019 6:08pm
8/9/2019 6:08pm
Anyhow I hope my friend who knows more about this stuff is right. He basically said to just put a proper silt fence up, and there shouldn't be anything to worry about. A few of you guys backed up his statement, so I feel a lot better about it now.
1
Hammer 663s
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Hammer 663s 8/9/2019 6:19pm
8/9/2019 6:19pm
This happened to me in CA. There were local rules about how much you could cut in (5') and how much you could build up (10'). The big deal is erosion control. Get some straw wattles (Home Depot) and stake them in at collection pools. Make sure you don't generate dust. Noise control is always an issue too.

I got supremely lucky - my inspector's brother used to ride with Malcolm Smith back in the day. We shot the shit for over an hour, watched my 7 year old turn some laps, and then he signed off on it. I was within the rules so that helped. I heard after I moved that they came back again, but not my problem at that point.

Good luck.

Mike
Rupert X
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Rupert X 8/9/2019 6:23pm
8/9/2019 6:23pm
I’m a rebel, Dottie.
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PRM31
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PRM31 8/9/2019 6:27pm
8/9/2019 6:27pm
Keep voting people into office that want the government to be more involved and this is what you get. Elections have consequences.
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419250f
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419250f 8/9/2019 6:49pm
8/9/2019 6:49pm
TeamGreen wrote:
1. No matter what.. “family use only”...as in the people that “live here”...that’s who’s riding there. 2. What’s “permitted” or allowed for the type of zoning...
1. No matter what.. “family use only”...as in the people that “live here”...that’s who’s riding there.
2. What’s “permitted” or allowed for the type of zoning you have...needs to be known.
3. Very quietly and carefully try to find out “who” snitched ya out!

Years ago...we found out it was a neighbor...we bought the land on the other side of said neighbor (near Merced, Ca out on hi-way 140) & built a really nice chicken coop complete with rooster and guard dogs...right up against the PL. Then...I put a pig pen on that side of the property, too. Me and my Hawaiian-Portuguese gram’pa...We were MEAN! We added goats in the summer, too.

Snitches get Stitches!
Beat me to it, roosters, pigs and chainsaws.
They'll wish you had a track again.
Good luck.
1
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kage173
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kage173 8/9/2019 6:49pm
8/9/2019 6:49pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2019 6:51pm
mikec265
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mikec265 8/9/2019 6:49pm
8/9/2019 6:49pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2019 6:51pm
My neighbors mostly seem pretty cool. Of the 7 closest houses, 6 of them have guns, side x sides, atvs, and or tractors. There's one city couple that no one really knows well. On top of that, one of them has a track back in and mostly out of sight. We cleared the prickers and brush for them. That track gas been there for almost 20 years, but hard to see from the road. There's a ton of bicyclist that use my road which is part of a yearly triathlon, or it could have been some old anti-fun twat. The DEP guy said it was anonymous, but he couldn't give me a name if he had one.

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