Bad news on Alta

theycallmeebryan 10/18/2018 7:37am
10/18/2018 7:37am Edited Date/Time 10/18/2018 7:40am
There's not much to the electric motor. The motor and its drive components are not the things i'm worried about long term. There are so few parts in the system.



I'm most concerned about the battery long term (and i'm talking 5-10 years from now). This battery is rated for 1000 charge cycles, and even after the 1000th charge cycle it will have 80-85% of the battery capacity, at the least. The good news is that one of the owners (Mark911) tore a pack apart and they appear to use common lithium ion cells like a laptop battery. So, in theory, it could be refurbished in the distance future if needed.

I'm also most concerned about parts availability. There really is no aftermarket for this bike so us owners must go straight to alta for replacement parts like brackets, plastics (except front end), and stuff like that.
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theycallmeebryan 10/18/2018 7:43am
10/18/2018 7:43am
How can you say that? The bike is ALREADY competitive in motocross, on their 2nd model run. Can you imagine what 5 more years of development will bring? I'm already racing the bike in vet classes here in southern California and i'm very successful on it so far. I'm already faster on my MXR in stock trim than i was on my KX450 (a bike that was set up for me). Its a fantastic motorcycle. The best motorcross bike i have ridden by far.
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dcg141
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dcg141 10/18/2018 7:49am
10/18/2018 7:49am
Torrot/ GasGas has developed a E Trails bike with a 5 speed and a clutch. I have a feeling the bigger E motorcycle market may go that direction.
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gabrielito
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gabrielito 10/18/2018 7:51am
10/18/2018 7:51am
mxracer816 wrote:
That sucks, hope they get it figured out as they are the future of this sport.
newmann wrote:
Never understood this point of view. Too many people out there unwilling to give up their IC powered motorcycles for an e-bike to be considered the...
Never understood this point of view. Too many people out there unwilling to give up their IC powered motorcycles for an e-bike to be considered the future of the sport. Cool bikes, neat tech, but a bit soulless for a sport that revolves around gear heads. All the idiots ( and there were/ are many)who proclaimed the 2 stroke dead in MX have been forced to face the reality that the sport was floundering in the 4 stroke era. If we aren't willing to give up on the 2 stroke, even less people will be willing to give up gasoline altogether.

I'd still like the option of an Alta to terrorize the neighborhood on. Stealth does have its benefits.
I think there is a huge future for electric bikes and Alta (they will get investment or bought). But your point makes a lot of sense. I think electric bikes and racing will be primarily with people who are coming into the sport not as much those who already ride and race. The main issue is price point right now. If they can get a disposable (5 year) electric bike for a reasonable price then it will take off.
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Bruce372
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Bruce372 10/18/2018 7:53am
10/18/2018 7:53am
It's the cost of doing business in the bay area, burn rates are off the charts. I was site head for a biotech just down the street from alta... to finance our cancer drug into clinical trials, we had to close the entire company to finance the trial.

Tech companies in the bay area close every week.
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GODZILLA
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GODZILLA 10/18/2018 8:08am
10/18/2018 8:08am
Sad news for the owners and employees.
Really can't get myself to say it's a sad news for the sport in any way.
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RCF
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RCF 10/18/2018 8:09am
10/18/2018 8:09am
How could an E Bike only company sustain itself on a bike that doesn't need parts, the major motorcycle companies make a fortune off of selling parts , probably far more money than selling the actual bike.
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KennyT
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KennyT 10/18/2018 8:10am
10/18/2018 8:10am
SCAM124 wrote:
Removed post.
KDXGarage wrote:
Chicken Little. Economy is going better of late.
I think his mind is stuck in the period of 2008-2016. If you aren’t working now you don’t want to work. Not hard to figure out when there is a shortage of skilled labor maybe it’s time to learn a skill.

It must be the price of the product that is hurting the sales. From what I’ve read/heard it certainly isn’t the product that is the problem. Like someone else mentioned, if you could buy direct and lower the price it eliminates the dealer markup. Isn’t that how Tesla sells their cars? Also if they could relocate out of California or at least get to a more affordable region I would think they could cut manufacturing cost. Anyway as much as I like gas powered motorsports this news is sad to hear
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grunkster
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grunkster 10/18/2018 8:13am
10/18/2018 8:13am
what will happen to current bikes at dealers? fire sale?!!!
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MR. X
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MR. X 10/18/2018 8:13am
10/18/2018 8:13am Edited Date/Time 10/18/2018 8:14am
Step 1 : send everyone home
Step 2 : government steps in to help
Step 3 : profit
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endurox
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endurox 10/18/2018 8:22am
10/18/2018 8:22am
dcg141 wrote:
Torrot/ GasGas has developed a E Trails bike with a 5 speed and a clutch. I have a feeling the bigger E motorcycle market may go...
Torrot/ GasGas has developed a E Trails bike with a 5 speed and a clutch. I have a feeling the bigger E motorcycle market may go that direction.
Mecatecno also has an e-trials bike. They are using a Montessa/Honda 5 speed gear box and clutch. Weight is 130 pounds. Very limited production at this point. Alta should move their operations over to Reno or Boise. They can reduce their rent a million bucks a year for starters. Their employees could afford to pay for housing also.
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500guy
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500guy 10/18/2018 8:22am
10/18/2018 8:22am
I just want to know how much money they need to make it another 3-5 years.

I watched the vital video tour of their place and was really impressed, hopefully they will get funding sorted out.
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Derek Harris 10/18/2018 8:39am
10/18/2018 8:39am Edited Date/Time 10/18/2018 8:39am
Muezh wrote:
How does this even happen? Bikes were selling and dealerships kept opening. wow. talk about being shocked. Such a bummer because 2020 was gonna be my...
How does this even happen? Bikes were selling and dealerships kept opening. wow. talk about being shocked. Such a bummer because 2020 was gonna be my year to make the switch.
The stated sales numbers of 1000 units total - isn't nearly enough to pay their bills

A relocation OUT of cali for headquarters would likely cut costs - less race promotion and more production units and dealer sales network promotion would likely have gone farther but then again I don't know - im not successful in this market

And if they DO want to go racing - IMHO they need to line up an energy drink sponsor or billionaire philanthropist to pay that side of the bills.

Assuming they can make 3k a unit profit - And i'd guess that to be possible but dont know - 1000*3k is 3 million gross
That would be half gone in taxes and facility leases - then engineer/design crew salaries, etc...

1.5 million wouldn't go far in their realm

shame - it's the future of the sport (sadly)

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peltier626 10/18/2018 8:40am
10/18/2018 8:40am
Awful news. American progression denied.
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tprice07
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tprice07 10/18/2018 8:40am
10/18/2018 8:40am
Could be good, an OEM like Honda could swoop in and grab it. I assume they’ll have some power in the industry to get them into some more professional racing.

KTM has some electric bikes already so I don’t see why it wouldn’t happen. The major thing hurting motocross right now is the lack of places to ride. I’ve got the money to buy just about any bike I want but no where to ride/race it. If you eliminate the noise that opens up some more areas for me. Just not feasible for one person, they need to be more widely adopted.

Electric is the future, it will happen. I race RC cars and I can assure you electric is superior for so many reasons.
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Moto96
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Moto96 10/18/2018 8:43am
10/18/2018 8:43am Edited Date/Time 10/18/2018 8:44am
Electric is a hard sell to motorsport enthusiasts. Check out the crowd excitement over electric. I get excited just to hear a F1 car start.

https://youtu.be/ywR4AYqPXz4
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NorCal 50+
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NorCal 50+ 10/18/2018 8:58am
10/18/2018 8:58am
I bet you they rebound. The article says: "Now with Alta’s business operations shuttered, the company has effectively ended [its] burn-rate of capital, which allows Alta Motors time to field serious offers of investment and acquisition. This plan could very well payoff, as Alta Motors was in the midst of a stellar year, showing 50% growth quarter-to-quarter in 2018, with roughly 1,000 units sold to customers this year so far, and a backlog of 300 units or so still to work through."

I can't see a company with numbers like that going away- they are making money so somebody will pick them up.
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brocsdad
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brocsdad 10/18/2018 8:59am
10/18/2018 8:59am
Will they still compete at the Red Bull Straight Rhythm this weekend?
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brocster
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brocster 10/18/2018 9:03am
10/18/2018 9:03am
Would be cool as hell if Can Am or Bultaco stepped in but ultimately would be better for Ford, Chevy or Dodge to throw some interest and step off into electric motorcycling
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aroark247
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aroark247 10/18/2018 9:08am
10/18/2018 9:08am
SCAM124 wrote:
Removed post.
You don't know much about what's going on in the country do you? It's hard for even the mainstream hate/media to deny that the economy is thriving.
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willie838
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willie838 10/18/2018 9:20am
10/18/2018 9:20am Edited Date/Time 10/18/2018 9:31am
crf250pilot wrote:
I think they would have been a lot better off making a UTV model for hunting. Bigger market for those right now.
damn is this true?

i guess i'm kind of out of the loop....not a hunter and in ny so whenever i see a utv somewhere i'm like......

yeah...cool Mega-Go Cart.



they're a larger market than dirtbikes? interesting to learn.



--------------------------------------------


also, WHAAAAA it doesn't go brrrraaaap or thump along at 135Db so i can get the entire 5 sq mile area to rally against me to the local police for a quality of life noise violation WHAAAAAAAAAA


SERIOUSLY...... it's like when we were children building mini moto-tracks in the sandbox and making mouth motor noises as the bikes navigated the track.......if only we had real engine noises here.......our lives would be complete!.



-------------

hopefully alta finds a way to carry on. with the amount of reaching and stretching going on in venture capital out in that area, i'm really pretty shocked that they found themselves this hard up at this point.
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byke
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byke 10/18/2018 9:27am
10/18/2018 9:27am
Premix wrote:
Not shocking. Operating in one of the worst states to own a business in, breaking into a market that has deep roots in completely different technology...
Not shocking. Operating in one of the worst states to own a business in, breaking into a market that has deep roots in completely different technology, offering an inferior product to what the market currently produces. What could go wrong?

Looking forward, one of the OEM’s will scoop this up.
Not just one of the worst states, but one of the most expensive areas in one of the most expensive states. They jumped in balls deep trying to build a toyota facility filled with super expensive six figure bay area labor, but without the sales anywhere near enough to support it. They knew it though and hoped sales income would take over before investment money ran out. Also, we've seen this a hundred times with new tech and even if this specific story has an ending, bless 'em for laying down the biggest building block in e-moto by far. Wherever we go from here, a really high bar has been set and we're going to get better bikes because of it.
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mx 219
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mx 219 10/18/2018 9:30am
10/18/2018 9:30am
crf250pilot wrote:
I think they would have been a lot better off making a UTV model for hunting. Bigger market for those right now.
I think this could be true.

They are making utv''s and bikes that are electric for hunting. I enjoy both hunting and mx, and while hunting isn't huge its quite bigger than mx.

The biggest concern would be the costs. If a dirt bike is 11k-ish. What is a utv from Alta going to cost comparing a yamaha 450f vs say the viking. Probably puts an Alta utv at around 15-20k.

Maybe the guys that own Alta should talk with Marcus lemonis. Not sure how the company is not succeeding, unless they just didn't price the bikes right/ just didn't sell enough.
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SCAM124
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SCAM124 10/18/2018 9:35am
10/18/2018 9:35am
SCAM124 wrote:
Removed post.
aroark247 wrote:
You don't know much about what's going on in the country do you? It's hard for even the mainstream hate/media to deny that the economy is...
You don't know much about what's going on in the country do you? It's hard for even the mainstream hate/media to deny that the economy is thriving.
Do you always start out with an insult? Sorry, i guess my feeble mind is limited to the automotive world.
I'll edit my original statement. Carry on.
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RandyS
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RandyS 10/18/2018 9:36am
10/18/2018 9:36am
Hopefully they get it sorted out, my next new bike was going to be electric. Wouldn't it make more sense for someone to build a motor/battery pack kit with mounts for each recent model than trying to sell a complete bike. There are so many 250f rollers around there would be no shortage of donors. The mass placement doesn't vary much between brands does it? A 5 or 6K pack that bolts up to an existing chassis seems like an easier sell than reinventing everything.
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Zoom
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Zoom 10/18/2018 9:36am
10/18/2018 9:36am Edited Date/Time 10/18/2018 9:52am
kb228 wrote:
Had a feeling that was going to happen when harley put their hands on it. Went in, learned the technology, left, let alta go out of...
Had a feeling that was going to happen when harley put their hands on it. Went in, learned the technology, left, let alta go out of business, open their own factory. I called it months ago.
Alta pulled out of the Harley deal about 6 months ago
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motohead (MD) 10/18/2018 9:39am
10/18/2018 9:39am
newmann wrote:
Never understood this point of view. Too many people out there unwilling to give up their IC powered motorcycles for an e-bike to be considered the...
Never understood this point of view. Too many people out there unwilling to give up their IC powered motorcycles for an e-bike to be considered the future of the sport. Cool bikes, neat tech, but a bit soulless for a sport that revolves around gear heads. All the idiots ( and there were/ are many)who proclaimed the 2 stroke dead in MX have been forced to face the reality that the sport was floundering in the 4 stroke era. If we aren't willing to give up on the 2 stroke, even less people will be willing to give up gasoline altogether.

I'd still like the option of an Alta to terrorize the neighborhood on. Stealth does have its benefits.
Fourth_Floor wrote:
Can you give an example of how the sport was/is floundering because of 4-strokes? Please don't say it's because how expensive they are because a brand...
Can you give an example of how the sport was/is floundering because of 4-strokes? Please don't say it's because how expensive they are because a brand new KTM 65SX is $5,000.........Is the average working class dad going to cough up that kind of dough so junior can ride on the nearest track that's an hour away or is he putting the kid in baseball.
brocster wrote:
This^^^ the only kids getting into the sport are offspring of people already in it. $5000 for a 65 is not entry level. We are going...
This^^^ the only kids getting into the sport are offspring of people already in it. $5000 for a 65 is not entry level. We are going to price ourselves right out of a sport. Their are far more Vets (guys that weee kids in the 70’s and 80’s) at anytrack that I have been to recently and when they are gone this sport will be a hell of a lot smaller than it is today.

Also, Altas not being allowed in the current race format also limits exposure of the actual possibility. Either include them or give them their own class and let it develop into it’s own niche. i.e Pro 250, Pro 450 and Pro E all individual and seperate.
But what makes you think that a KTM65 costs that much less to build than a KTM250SX?
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CozMan
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CozMan 10/18/2018 9:39am
10/18/2018 9:39am
as soon as I read this I thought of that documentary they did on that e-car that Ford (I think?) built. Was stupid popular, so much so that they rounded them all up and squashed them and have never talked about them since because they feared that it would destroy their regular car business.

I wonder if a Suzuki would buy them and just destroy all their tech to prolong the inevitable move toward e-bikes? There's a reason KTM isn't using their e-bike tech to build a MX bike, but instead are building a little cruise around town bike. I'm sure the OEMs were clinking beers when they read this article.
byke
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byke 10/18/2018 9:41am
10/18/2018 9:41am
Suzuki doesn't have the margin to buy companies in order to kill the tech, that's a rich company's game.
ga_pike
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ga_pike 10/18/2018 9:41am
10/18/2018 9:41am
RandyS wrote:
Hopefully they get it sorted out, my next new bike was going to be electric. Wouldn't it make more sense for someone to build a motor/battery...
Hopefully they get it sorted out, my next new bike was going to be electric. Wouldn't it make more sense for someone to build a motor/battery pack kit with mounts for each recent model than trying to sell a complete bike. There are so many 250f rollers around there would be no shortage of donors. The mass placement doesn't vary much between brands does it? A 5 or 6K pack that bolts up to an existing chassis seems like an easier sell than reinventing everything.
This isn't a bad idea. Make 1 pack and drive system with adaptability to fit into multiple chassis options. I thin the only downfall would be that the generic chassis wasn't designed for an electric setup, so possibly the ergonomics would be off? Would be pretty cool to revive older bikes from the 80's, 90's and early 2000's with electric motors.

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