Gate malfunction?

FWYT
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FWYT 5/27/2019 8:03am
5/27/2019 8:03am
"Flinch Gate" !!!

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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Mit12
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Mit12 5/27/2019 9:16am
5/27/2019 9:16am
Tell me how a gate flinches? The activation arm on the bottom drops and the gate falls. The only way the gate can flinch is if a rider hits the gate just like we saw in the video.
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DC
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DC 5/27/2019 10:43am
5/27/2019 10:43am Edited Date/Time 5/27/2019 10:44am
I was traveling yesterday and my computer and phone were not syncing. Here is a video I actually shot on my phone of the second 250 moto start. You will see three riders on the left side of the starter's box, spots 4, 6 and 7 to the left, the opposite side as AC, Cooper and Chase to the right of the box, all hit the gate, which was held a tick longer than usual. That caused the "flinch" of the main axle that the gate works on, and the closer you were to them, the more it shook. It was not a gate malfunction--the gate didn't drop--but it was a couple riders going early, hitting the gate and causing a ripple effect and rapid reactions....

https://www.youtube.com/embed/VDPA2MpVgR0

I think the referees made the right call in continuing the race.

DC
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race
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race 5/27/2019 1:23pm
5/27/2019 1:23pm
DC - I think you're just going to have to mandate that all tracks install a new 3 ton, triple steel I-beam reinforced, hydraulic starting gate.

With laser sensors!



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ruy
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ruy 5/27/2019 1:56pm
5/27/2019 1:56pm
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newmann
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newmann 5/27/2019 2:12pm
5/27/2019 2:12pm
race wrote:
DC - I think you're just going to have to mandate that all tracks install a new 3 ton, triple steel I-beam reinforced, hydraulic starting gate...
DC - I think you're just going to have to mandate that all tracks install a new 3 ton, triple steel I-beam reinforced, hydraulic starting gate.

With laser sensors!



And gate activated shock collars for the riders.
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ruy
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ruy 5/27/2019 2:14pm
5/27/2019 2:14pm
You can see that also affect Cairoli, gatergate rules
shiftmx_22 5/27/2019 2:49pm
5/27/2019 2:49pm
m121c wrote:
So if I’m a team member and one of the riders on my team is in the championship I know what I’m doing... going right by...
So if I’m a team member and one of the riders on my team is in the championship I know what I’m doing... going right by my teammates championship rival and absolutely ramming that gate so it throws him off while my teammate knows to wait...... but hey no malfunction...

That slow-mo video only shows one side of the gate, the big mishap was on the right side where it started. In the incomplete replay from the broadcast (just my observation) the gates did not drop equally for those who didn’t jump forward. To be fair, it’s tough to know if a knobbie was in the gate or not from that angle so that could be why.

Regardless if there was no malfunction of the gate, It’s my opinion if someone hits the gate good enough causing a flinch/wobble which propagates outward to other gates, someone’s gate will be higher and drop later/longer. The energy has to go somewhere and it’s all about timing. Even if the variance is slight, it means a lot. In instances like this, the race should be started and the guy who caused the restart is penalized by having to start backwards, old school rules.

It’s over, the race is done. Onward to the next round. I just think it’s a slippery slope saying no malfunction no restart with only rider error. Although a dirty tactic, with money on the line I wouldn’t put it past a team to try to exploit it.
Come on, this isn't rocket appliances we're dealing with here.
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GuyB
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GuyB 5/27/2019 3:18pm
5/27/2019 3:18pm
It's purely speculation on my part, but...

Fox Raceway has a concrete start pad. I believe the gate got moved shortly before the National, so that the riders would be using the mandated dirt start. Given that, I'd guess that it wasn't embedded quite as firmly as at other tracks in the series. I'd further hypothesize that's why when it got hit, it transmitted the movement further in either direction.

Note: I'm not a scientist, but I play one on the internet.
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zehn
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zehn 5/27/2019 3:21pm
5/27/2019 3:21pm
m121c wrote:
So if I’m a team member and one of the riders on my team is in the championship I know what I’m doing... going right by...
So if I’m a team member and one of the riders on my team is in the championship I know what I’m doing... going right by my teammates championship rival and absolutely ramming that gate so it throws him off while my teammate knows to wait...... but hey no malfunction...

That slow-mo video only shows one side of the gate, the big mishap was on the right side where it started. In the incomplete replay from the broadcast (just my observation) the gates did not drop equally for those who didn’t jump forward. To be fair, it’s tough to know if a knobbie was in the gate or not from that angle so that could be why.

Regardless if there was no malfunction of the gate, It’s my opinion if someone hits the gate good enough causing a flinch/wobble which propagates outward to other gates, someone’s gate will be higher and drop later/longer. The energy has to go somewhere and it’s all about timing. Even if the variance is slight, it means a lot. In instances like this, the race should be started and the guy who caused the restart is penalized by having to start backwards, old school rules.

It’s over, the race is done. Onward to the next round. I just think it’s a slippery slope saying no malfunction no restart with only rider error. Although a dirty tactic, with money on the line I wouldn’t put it past a team to try to exploit it.
shiftmx_22 wrote:
Come on, this isn't rocket appliances we're dealing with here.
Worst case Ontario is someone gets stuck in the gate
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ferg722
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ferg722 5/27/2019 3:32pm
5/27/2019 3:32pm
ruy wrote:
You can see that also affect Cairoli, gatergate rules [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/05/27/350549/s1200_287795_MXGP_of_France_St_Jean_d_Angely_7th_Round.jpg[/img]
You can see that also affect Cairoli, gatergate rules
That’s because their gate actually malfunctioned...


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mac3-d
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mac3-d 5/27/2019 4:03pm
5/27/2019 4:03pm
ruy wrote:
You can see that also affect Cairoli, gatergate rules [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/05/27/350549/s1200_287795_MXGP_of_France_St_Jean_d_Angely_7th_Round.jpg[/img]
You can see that also affect Cairoli, gatergate rules
I thought starting blocks were illegal !
I'm I seeing correctly Paulin using them ! He's a giant !
mac3-d
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mac3-d 5/27/2019 4:07pm
5/27/2019 4:07pm
Question about Sexton.
He hits gate , it breaks & falls forward , he rides on & gets holeshot , any penalty ?
He gains an advantage as it turns out ,he doesn't need to pull his bike back & go as the pack leaves him for dead last ?
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skidmarkz
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skidmarkz 5/27/2019 4:44pm
5/27/2019 4:44pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2019 7:36pm
If you look at the helmet cam from Josh Varize’s 125 all-star race, you can see all three visible gates move slightly before it drops (around 0:20 into the vid). Enough to red flag a race? Not in my opinion. Seems to be just a little slop in the gate mechanism.

https://youtu.be/cR0ZqpNIxLk
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plowboy
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plowboy 5/27/2019 4:48pm
5/27/2019 4:48pm
mac3-d wrote:
Question about Sexton. He hits gate , it breaks & falls forward , he rides on & gets holeshot , any penalty ? He gains an...
Question about Sexton.
He hits gate , it breaks & falls forward , he rides on & gets holeshot , any penalty ?
He gains an advantage as it turns out ,he doesn't need to pull his bike back & go as the pack leaves him for dead last ?
Whistling
Texas Built
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Texas Built 5/27/2019 6:58pm
5/27/2019 6:58pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2019 7:00pm
gt80rider wrote:
If u look only at ac's gate, it moved.. Should have been a re start....
We should do Participation Starts now? Keep doing restarts till everyone gets a good start and nobody jumps the start? LOL
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theycallmeebryan 5/27/2019 9:46pm
5/27/2019 9:46pm
skidmarkz wrote:
If you look at the helmet cam from Josh Varize’s 125 all-star race, you can see all three visible gates move slightly before it drops (around...
If you look at the helmet cam from Josh Varize’s 125 all-star race, you can see all three visible gates move slightly before it drops (around 0:20 into the vid). Enough to red flag a race? Not in my opinion. Seems to be just a little slop in the gate mechanism.

https://youtu.be/cR0ZqpNIxLk
Clear as day right there. It flinched for the 125 guys, too. Fortunately non of them took the bait.
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blockhead17 5/27/2019 10:02pm
5/27/2019 10:02pm
Only thing I took away from the GoPro video is these guys reactions are a hell of a lot faster than mine haha
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zippytech
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zippytech 5/28/2019 5:28am
5/28/2019 5:28am
It don't matter if the gate was jumping up and down. till it hits the dirt you cannot go..pretty simple system.
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slipdog
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slipdog 5/28/2019 5:35am
5/28/2019 5:35am
skidmarkz wrote:
If you look at the helmet cam from Josh Varize’s 125 all-star race, you can see all three visible gates move slightly before it drops (around...
If you look at the helmet cam from Josh Varize’s 125 all-star race, you can see all three visible gates move slightly before it drops (around 0:20 into the vid). Enough to red flag a race? Not in my opinion. Seems to be just a little slop in the gate mechanism.

https://youtu.be/cR0ZqpNIxLk
Flinchy, flinchy...
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kNewc
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kNewc 5/28/2019 6:02am
5/28/2019 6:02am Edited Date/Time 5/28/2019 6:44am
devindavisphoto wrote:
I skimmed through the comments, but saw the Gopro video and it definitely flinched. [img]https://i.gyazo.com/2374a517a477b75f71c9637c2128f2e3.gif[/img]
I skimmed through the comments, but saw the Gopro video and it definitely flinched.


Here's another GIF at .25 speed. Pretty tough to see after uploading it to the site I'll need to make this higher quality I guess. Oh well lol
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tprice07
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tprice07 5/28/2019 7:55am
5/28/2019 7:55am
devindavisphoto wrote:
I skimmed through the comments, but saw the Gopro video and it definitely flinched. [img]https://i.gyazo.com/2374a517a477b75f71c9637c2128f2e3.gif[/img]
I skimmed through the comments, but saw the Gopro video and it definitely flinched.

kNewc wrote:
[img]https://i.imgur.com/kUZBcrq.gif[/img] Here's another GIF at .25 speed. Pretty tough to see after uploading it to the site I'll need to make this higher quality I guess...

Here's another GIF at .25 speed. Pretty tough to see after uploading it to the site I'll need to make this higher quality I guess. Oh well lol
Read back through the previous comments. According to DC the gate "flinched" due to a rider on the other side of the dog house hitting the gate.

That said, the 125 races had a slight drop then full drop. I'm not sure if that gate was hit. Either way, the gates haven't been as bad as SX yet.
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JeepnMike
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JeepnMike 5/28/2019 9:56am
5/28/2019 9:56am
ferg722 wrote:
That’s because their gate actually malfunctioned... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/05/27/350569/s1200_EE221C47_8378_4D48_9E11_4BE575C099AA.jpg[/img]
That’s because their gate actually malfunctioned...


I watched that over and over again to try to see what happened. It was bizarre, and captured so well in that photo above, the gates were totally dropping at a different rate. AC222s gate almost looked gummed up it dropped so much slower, but clearly the gates around him had issues too, he just go the worst of it. That really threw his moto for a downward spiralSad
RichieW13
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RichieW13 5/28/2019 11:25am
5/28/2019 11:25am
gt80rider wrote:
If u look only at ac's gate, it moved.. Should have been a re start....
oldblood wrote:
I thought he won?
DC wrote:
Good point, and the funny part... Should we have stopped the first moto because of the first turn pileup? That was likely one rider's fault, not...
Good point, and the funny part...

Should we have stopped the first moto because of the first turn pileup? That was likely one rider's fault, not all four of them that went down. Should we have stopped the second 450 moto at Hangtown because of the rain? No one deserved that, but it happened. Should we have stopped the first 250 moto because Hunter Lawrence's bike let go in front of Jordon Smith, knocking Jordon out? Wasn't Jordon's fault, but he paid the price for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, just like RJ Hampshire in the second moto with Alex Martin...

Racing is a very dynamic thing. Guys jumped before the starting gate actually dropped, and one of them won the race and the overall. Should it not count because he didn't get a great start because someone hit the gate before him?

When there is a real gate malfunction, or a track problem, or a major injury, we will bring out the red flag. This was not such a case and the race went on. The fastest guy won, and he was one of the guys hampered by the situation at the start. We didn't stop it and restart it because there was no malfunction.

I thought it was a really good race, the fastest guys won, and people seemed to really enjoy watching it. On to Thunder Valley.

DC
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You're a brave man for jumping in the weeds here. But I think it's great that you do.
Press516
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Press516 5/28/2019 12:57pm
5/28/2019 12:57pm
I can certainly see why they let it go... But I'm always bothered by something that affects some riders more than others with no fault of their own... Next to the dog house, the gate definitely moves. It doesn't move farther down. The riders we are talking about here also don't see the other side of the gate where it was hit to cause the "flinch". So for them the gate moves and others it doesn't.

Is what it is and can see the arguments on either side. "Flinch Gate".... Seems appropriate.
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FWYT
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FWYT 5/28/2019 1:04pm
5/28/2019 1:04pm
I say screw all this shit . . . make the gate flinch on purpose. Several times. Weed out the riff raff!

Also, fugg the concrete, steel grate or whatever start surface. Instead put down plexiglass and wet it
down. May the one with the best clutch and throttle control get the holeshot.

Better still - bring back the Le Mans start!!
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Hammer 663s
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Hammer 663s 5/28/2019 3:49pm
5/28/2019 3:49pm Edited Date/Time 5/28/2019 3:54pm
RJ Hampshire:

“Second moto the gate flinched so a few of us hit the gate. One hundred percent, that race should have been red flagged. The whole first lap I was expecting a red flag, and I was not happy that it didn’t come out."

Colt Nichols:

"At the start of the second moto, the gate flinched and a bunch of us ran into it and I just started way too far back. "

Huh. WTF do they know anyway? Not like they are pros or something. Oh wait......
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