Helicopter/Aerial View of Red Bud on the Broadcast

Jerkolantern
Profile picture for user Jerkolantern
Posts
508
Joined
5/18/2016
Location
New Richland, MN, USA
Jerkolantern 7/7/2019 8:09pm
7/7/2019 8:09pm
Chopper footage = bitchin. Drone can't do what a chopper can because of weight limits, and the fact there's a brain running the camera from above that can see everything, not some dude standing in one corner of the track
1
Dirty Points 7/7/2019 8:59pm
7/7/2019 8:59pm
aeffertz wrote:
I loved it. When you can have the riders on screen for a longer period of time, without having to cut to multiple cameras, it really...
I loved it. When you can have the riders on screen for a longer period of time, without having to cut to multiple cameras, it really helps give the viewer a reference of the speed and amount of ground these guys are actually covering. Reminds me of the Isle of Man TT race footage. Plus you get to see a much better view of how rutted some parts of the track are from being higher up!

I agree with the drone idea! Cheaper than a helicopter and possibly better angles too!
Sully wrote:
I liked that it gave us an idea of the distance between the different positions. Sometimes with the head-on shots, it looks like they're a lot...
I liked that it gave us an idea of the distance between the different positions. Sometimes with the head-on shots, it looks like they're a lot closer than they actually are.

The drone idea is good, but like Joe said, do they have the capability to broadcast an HD quality live shot (or even a live shot at all)?
Yes, even many mid range consumer models have livestream capability. And You can use the live stream to steer the drone with a VR headset
1
HusqFan3
Profile picture for user HusqFan3
Posts
719
Joined
4/30/2018
Location
Sammamish, WA, USA
HusqFan3 7/7/2019 9:26pm
7/7/2019 9:26pm
evansteinberg wrote:
I like the idea of it, but I think it was poorly executed. Most of the time they were too zoomed out.
Agreed. Overhead angle? Great. Birdseye view? Not so much... I get it was a helicopter so not fair to expect the same shots you get in football with the camera that runs along 4 opposed wires allowing them complete control but still, the camera has a zoom function for a reason...
Braz
Profile picture for user Braz
Posts
139
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
USA
Fantasy
317th
Braz 7/7/2019 10:06pm
7/7/2019 10:06pm
colintrax wrote:
Does that $10k figure include fuel? If so that's way cheaper than I wouldve guessed.
zehn wrote:
I would have guess double or triple that, and then you have to think about transportation costs etc.
It is a Robinson R44 which is a non-turbine powered heli, so a lot less expensive to operate. When I was flying them 10 years ago, the rental rate including fuel was $440/hr whereas a Jet Ranger, EC-130 or MD500 would be $1000-$1500/hr.
1

The Shop

See All »
KBOLTZ
Profile picture for user KBOLTZ
Posts
381
Joined
4/24/2016
Location
Tarzana, CA, USA
KBOLTZ 7/8/2019 12:32am
7/8/2019 12:32am
Could you imagine if a drone failure impacted a race result???!!! As long as drones bug out and crash there’s no way in hell. I’d love the view but too much at risk.
To The Chopper 7/8/2019 1:43am
7/8/2019 1:43am Edited Date/Time 7/8/2019 1:46am
CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:
A helicopter with camera stabilization, broadcast quality camera, pilot, permits and camera operator... don’t forget it’s live feed being sent wireless. Around $10,000 for a few...
A helicopter with camera stabilization, broadcast quality camera, pilot, permits and camera operator... don’t forget it’s live feed being sent wireless. Around $10,000 for a few hours, at least.

Drone with Red Camera + 2 operators wouldn’t be much less and I’m not sure of the live feed capabilities because of the weight. Another negitive of the drone is that it’s hard to use a zoom lens like they had and keep it ultra smooth.




They were using an R44, I can assure you it was nothing like $10K if they were smart about it at all.

The photos you posted of the other helicopters are Eurocopter/Airbus Astar's, much different price point and way overkill for what MX Sports needs to cover a track. The R44 is fine, and inexpensive compared.

Also, drones are still very limited in capabilities fro applications like these, plus, you'd never use a drone over a live sporting event for safety reasons. We're not there yet.
2
OT
Profile picture for user OT
Posts
649
Joined
11/17/2016
Location
SE, GB
Fantasy
1977th
OT 7/8/2019 2:17am
7/8/2019 2:17am
I mean... the sound of the propellers kind of gave it away...
1
Bearuno
Profile picture for user Bearuno
Posts
5677
Joined
6/28/2014
Location
AU
Bearuno 7/8/2019 4:38am
7/8/2019 4:38am
KBOLTZ wrote:
Could you imagine if a drone failure impacted a race result???!!! As long as drones bug out and crash there’s no way in hell. I’d love...
Could you imagine if a drone failure impacted a race result???!!! As long as drones bug out and crash there’s no way in hell. I’d love the view but too much at risk.
A couple of seasons ago, The GPs had some Drone Camera broadcasting. It was pretty good, high quality footage, but, it disappeared.

I have no idea why. Possible liability issues, if it crashed into the crowd, or the racers, I guess.

I worked through Saturday night, with the National on my 'puter, but got engrossed in the work I was doing, so only saw a little bit of the racing. I think I heard that Lucas Oil had 'donated' the Helicopter (and, it might be back for the final round?). So, no cost to MX Sports, one would think.
Sully
Profile picture for user Sully
Posts
9617
Joined
8/24/2006
Location
JP
Sully 7/8/2019 4:59am
7/8/2019 4:59am Edited Date/Time 7/8/2019 5:59am
OT wrote:
I mean... the sound of the propellers kind of gave it away...
The multiple mentions by Weege and GL, mixed with the footage of the Lucas Oil helo flying around the track were pretty telling as well.
2
Guetterman 7/8/2019 5:12am
7/8/2019 5:12am
Loved it but I’d do away with the helicopter audio next time.
kNewc
Profile picture for user kNewc
Posts
1169
Joined
3/17/2017
Location
USA
kNewc 7/8/2019 5:51am
7/8/2019 5:51am
I liked that in the "Commercial Breaks" on NBC Sports Gold they switched to the heli-cam a few times. That is way better than seeing the side of the track!
1
aeffertz
Profile picture for user aeffertz
Posts
12822
Joined
7/16/2015
Location
La Crosse, WI, USA
aeffertz 7/8/2019 6:51am
7/8/2019 6:51am
kNewc wrote:
I liked that in the "Commercial Breaks" on NBC Sports Gold they switched to the heli-cam a few times. That is way better than seeing the...
I liked that in the "Commercial Breaks" on NBC Sports Gold they switched to the heli-cam a few times. That is way better than seeing the side of the track!
Yes! That was awesome. It’s like the $80 rides you can get at the track but for free!
FreshTopEnd
Profile picture for user FreshTopEnd
Posts
13361
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Sacramento, CA, USA
FreshTopEnd 7/8/2019 9:58am
7/8/2019 9:58am
Only criticism was that the camera was zoomed too far out most of the time.
Mit12
Profile picture for user Mit12
Posts
2230
Joined
6/23/2014
Location
Lake Havasu City, AZ, USA
Mit12 7/8/2019 10:02am
7/8/2019 10:02am
It would be awesome if it was zoomed in closer. The way it was this time the riders were way to far away.
yz133rider
Profile picture for user yz133rider
Posts
5027
Joined
8/1/2013
Location
Avondale, PA, USA
yz133rider 7/8/2019 10:03am
7/8/2019 10:03am
I thought it sucked. Oh look a great battle and lets go to the chopper cam where they look like ants and cant see at all the details in their riding or whos who etc.

1
Jasper125
Profile picture for user Jasper125
Posts
174
Joined
9/20/2013
Location
NL
Jasper125 7/8/2019 10:10am
7/8/2019 10:10am
I thought it was great yes you lose perspective of elevation but you gain a great view on lines and ruts you really cant see that on the normal ground view. Like the battle Tomac and Webb had 1st moto that was awesome to see from the helicopter view!
Rooster
Profile picture for user Rooster
Posts
4432
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Edmonton, CA
Rooster 7/8/2019 1:34pm
7/8/2019 1:34pm
Loved the footage! Especially off the start.

I didn't mind it being zoomed out as it really helped to show the variety of different lines that riders take in the first few corners before they settle into the regular lines.

I certainly wouldn't want to watch the entire race from that angle, but it added a new perspective that I didn't even realize was missing until I saw it. It would be awesome to be able to show how a rider sets up a pass from above if they were able to use it for replays.
3

Pit Row

See All »
Kennyfreemoney 7/8/2019 1:41pm
7/8/2019 1:41pm
To The Chopper wrote:
They were using an R44, I can assure you it was nothing like $10K if they were smart about it at all. The photos you posted...
They were using an R44, I can assure you it was nothing like $10K if they were smart about it at all.

The photos you posted of the other helicopters are Eurocopter/Airbus Astar's, much different price point and way overkill for what MX Sports needs to cover a track. The R44 is fine, and inexpensive compared.

Also, drones are still very limited in capabilities fro applications like these, plus, you'd never use a drone over a live sporting event for safety reasons. We're not there yet.
My buddy flies a Robinson R44. He said the cost to fly is about $600/ Hr. Thats fuel and maintenance. It does take into account the 2000 hour overhaul that is required for Helicopters. he generally charges $1200/hr when he's hired to fly.

$1200/hr for pilot and chopper, $100/hr for each camera operator. Probably 3 of them minimum, maybe even a few more on the ground to make sure the stream is coming through properly. Add an extra $500/hr cost for the camera/gimbal system on the helicopter.

I think $2500/hr is probably close. 4 hours of flight time for the races = $10,000
bigk218
Profile picture for user bigk218
Posts
1465
Joined
1/2/2018
Location
Summerville, SC, USA
bigk218 7/8/2019 2:38pm
7/8/2019 2:38pm
bigk218 wrote:
I can’t imagine the cost of running that helicopter all day.
motomad724 wrote:
Weege mentioned in his show they were charging $40 for helicopter rides around the track. Helps offset between motos (during even?)
https://racerxonline.com/2019/07/07/weeges-walkie-talkie-redbud
That’s interesting. Good call on that update
dkg
Profile picture for user dkg
Posts
1889
Joined
9/12/2010
Location
Rancho Cucamonga, CA, USA
dkg 7/8/2019 2:53pm
7/8/2019 2:53pm
The Helicopter video was excellent. Really added to the broadcast.
1
PTECH
Profile picture for user PTECH
Posts
469
Joined
11/28/2011
Location
Phoenix, AZ, USA
PTECH 7/8/2019 7:09pm
7/8/2019 7:09pm
I thought it was awesome.
ayearinmx
Profile picture for user ayearinmx
Posts
2760
Joined
3/5/2007
Location
GB
ayearinmx 7/8/2019 8:54pm
7/8/2019 8:54pm
they've been using a drone in MXGPs this year... gets some cool viewpoints and I'm a fan, except as others have mentioned when it's a bit too zoomed out
chippo
Profile picture for user chippo
Posts
49
Joined
6/30/2019
Location
AU
chippo 7/9/2019 2:01am
7/9/2019 2:01am
It was a great addition the broadcast it offered a good view of the line selections, depth and speed. Only criticism I have is about the amount of zoom used which isn't major but it could have been a bit closer I believe, hopefully next time they zoom in a tad more.
TeamFlannel
Profile picture for user TeamFlannel
Posts
304
Joined
9/23/2018
Location
Ellsworth, IL, USA
TeamFlannel 7/9/2019 8:29am
7/9/2019 8:29am
I thought it was the crappiest Red Bud coverage I'd seen in years. Heli footage was too zoomed out, looked like an ant farm. Did I blink and miss first Moto highlights and results? Attendance figures anyone? Place looked pretty empty. I'm trying not to compare MXON, as that was off the charts, but eyeing our favorite viewing area on tv revealed lots of open grass.
1
mark_swart
Profile picture for user mark_swart
Posts
2527
Joined
11/2/2011
Location
Chapin, SC, USA
mark_swart 7/9/2019 9:23am
7/9/2019 9:23am
The coolest part of the aerial perspective was seeing the sides of the bikes when the riders scrubbed / whipped over jumps. I noticed that with Tomac once, you could see the whole side of his bike. Pretty rad!
CarlinoJoeVideo
Profile picture for user CarlinoJoeVideo
Posts
7516
Joined
11/30/2013
Location
Portland/Los Angeles, CA, USA
CarlinoJoeVideo 7/9/2019 12:03pm
7/9/2019 12:03pm
CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:
A helicopter with camera stabilization, broadcast quality camera, pilot, permits and camera operator... don’t forget it’s live feed being sent wireless. Around $10,000 for a few...
A helicopter with camera stabilization, broadcast quality camera, pilot, permits and camera operator... don’t forget it’s live feed being sent wireless. Around $10,000 for a few hours, at least.

Drone with Red Camera + 2 operators wouldn’t be much less and I’m not sure of the live feed capabilities because of the weight. Another negitive of the drone is that it’s hard to use a zoom lens like they had and keep it ultra smooth.




colintrax wrote:
Does that $10k figure include fuel? If so that's way cheaper than I wouldve guessed.
Give or take. But it’s not like they are off the ground for 8 hours. You can rent a heli for $1500-$2000 per hour of fly time. That’s counted the second you lift off and timer stops the second you land.
CarlinoJoeVideo
Profile picture for user CarlinoJoeVideo
Posts
7516
Joined
11/30/2013
Location
Portland/Los Angeles, CA, USA
CarlinoJoeVideo 7/9/2019 12:10pm
7/9/2019 12:10pm
CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:
A helicopter with camera stabilization, broadcast quality camera, pilot, permits and camera operator... don’t forget it’s live feed being sent wireless. Around $10,000 for a few...
A helicopter with camera stabilization, broadcast quality camera, pilot, permits and camera operator... don’t forget it’s live feed being sent wireless. Around $10,000 for a few hours, at least.

Drone with Red Camera + 2 operators wouldn’t be much less and I’m not sure of the live feed capabilities because of the weight. Another negitive of the drone is that it’s hard to use a zoom lens like they had and keep it ultra smooth.




aeffertz wrote:
But you would have to add up the cost of multiple uses of the heli vs a camera/quadcopter, no? A RED 4K camera outfitted with goodies...
But you would have to add up the cost of multiple uses of the heli vs a camera/quadcopter, no? A RED 4K camera outfitted with goodies is like $15,000 I think? So it would pay for itself quickly but yeah, you're not going to get those massive zooms. Luckily you can get pretty up close with a quadcopter/drone where you wouldn't need that massive zoom lens.

And yes Sully, RED cameras are capable of 4K live streaming.
A new Red Camera alone is $15k-20k at the low end. You also need lens, live transmission equipment and drone. I’d ballpark minimum of $30,000 and closer to $50k to do it right and to get something even close to that look we saw.

Yes eventually it evens out. But what everyone keeps forgetting is that it’s almost impossible to get a 200mm or 300mm zoom lens stable on a drone.

I’ve worked with both and heli/cineflex gyroscope just can do things drones can’t. I’d do helicopter in this situation every time.
CarlinoJoeVideo
Profile picture for user CarlinoJoeVideo
Posts
7516
Joined
11/30/2013
Location
Portland/Los Angeles, CA, USA
CarlinoJoeVideo 7/9/2019 12:14pm
7/9/2019 12:14pm
To The Chopper wrote:
They were using an R44, I can assure you it was nothing like $10K if they were smart about it at all. The photos you posted...
They were using an R44, I can assure you it was nothing like $10K if they were smart about it at all.

The photos you posted of the other helicopters are Eurocopter/Airbus Astar's, much different price point and way overkill for what MX Sports needs to cover a track. The R44 is fine, and inexpensive compared.

Also, drones are still very limited in capabilities fro applications like these, plus, you'd never use a drone over a live sporting event for safety reasons. We're not there yet.
Kennyfreemoney wrote:
My buddy flies a Robinson R44. He said the cost to fly is about $600/ Hr. Thats fuel and maintenance. It does take into account the...
My buddy flies a Robinson R44. He said the cost to fly is about $600/ Hr. Thats fuel and maintenance. It does take into account the 2000 hour overhaul that is required for Helicopters. he generally charges $1200/hr when he's hired to fly.

$1200/hr for pilot and chopper, $100/hr for each camera operator. Probably 3 of them minimum, maybe even a few more on the ground to make sure the stream is coming through properly. Add an extra $500/hr cost for the camera/gimbal system on the helicopter.

I think $2500/hr is probably close. 4 hours of flight time for the races = $10,000
You need to factor in the stabilization system, camera equipment and operator cost about $5,000-$7,500 per day. That’s why I’m in the $10,000 range.

Post a reply to: Helicopter/Aerial View of Red Bud on the Broadcast