2019 Chinese 2 stroke bikes???

GODZILLA
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GODZILLA 9/11/2018 4:11pm
9/11/2018 4:11pm
dimetime wrote:
A-fucking-men. Y'all go ahead and huck one of those communist chinese POS over SX triples or Laroccos Leap all ya want, l won't stop you but...
A-fucking-men. Y'all go ahead and huck one of those communist chinese POS over SX triples or Laroccos Leap all ya want, l won't stop you but you'd be foolish to do so. These are the same people that sold poisonous toothpaste and drywall that got people sick but yeah, they're legit.

Shit we've had a rash of frame breaks with KTMs and Yamahas and those come from companies that can be successfully sued. Good luck getting recompense from Communist China when you cheap ass chinese POS breaks in half on the second small jump you clear.
What a stupid load of crap.
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SmokinJoe439
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SmokinJoe439 9/11/2018 4:39pm
9/11/2018 4:39pm
These have been out for awhile now Google search tse 250 and read the 200 plus page post on advrider a couple guys have been thrashing them on there. So far they've really been liking them.
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ACBraap
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ACBraap 9/11/2018 4:47pm
9/11/2018 4:47pm
JD167 wrote:
It would be interesting to demo one of those haha
At $30 a lap, no way!
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jeffro503
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jeffro503 9/11/2018 5:01pm
9/11/2018 5:01pm Edited Date/Time 9/11/2018 5:01pm
JD167 wrote:
I would much rather piss and moan about jap/euro bike prices than pay chinese prices and wind up with a blown up bike you cant get...
I would much rather piss and moan about jap/euro bike prices than pay chinese prices and wind up with a blown up bike you cant get parts for.
jeffro503 wrote:
If you have been in this sport for a few decade's , you'll remember going back about 45 year's , and almost everyone laughed at how...
If you have been in this sport for a few decade's , you'll remember going back about 45 year's , and almost everyone laughed at how the Japanese would never make a good dirt bike. And right about that time , they took fire and engulfed this sport so fast , nobody saw it coming. I know it's the " normal " thing to do , is to laugh at the Chinese bikes .....but honestly , I wouldn't be so quick to do that in this day and age.

In fact.....if we could fast forward to about 5 - 10 year's from now , I don't think many people will be laughing at their bike's , if they are serious about making them. With that being said , we will all have to sit back and see how thing's develop.
Dirty Points wrote:
Going back 45 years would be 1973. Elsinores were already crushing Euro offerings, Yamaha introduced the Monoshock that year, and DeCoster was World Champion aboard Suzuki
You can go back 50 - 55 years , it doesn't matter really. My point was that the Japanese bikes were laughed at , at one point in time. When I tried following the sport for the first time ( About 1978 ) the Japanese bike's had already taken over. The generation before that , they were considered a joke , and look what happened.
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Spurdo
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Spurdo 9/11/2018 5:03pm
9/11/2018 5:03pm
I see broken KTM frames, and cracking Yamaha welds on this forum every week, yet have never seen one of these bikes with similar issues. The criticism doesn't seem founded.....
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-MAVERICK-
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-MAVERICK- 9/11/2018 5:14pm
9/11/2018 5:14pm
Spurdo wrote:
I see broken KTM frames, and cracking Yamaha welds on this forum every week, yet have never seen one of these bikes with similar issues. The...
I see broken KTM frames, and cracking Yamaha welds on this forum every week, yet have never seen one of these bikes with similar issues. The criticism doesn't seem founded.....
How many people actually purchase those Chinese bikes? A lot less. Not hard to see why you don't see any posts about them having broken frames, cracked welds, etc.

Anyone that's serious about riding is not riding a Chinese made bike.
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outerlimits
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outerlimits 9/11/2018 5:15pm
9/11/2018 5:15pm
It's not a race bike and was never intended to be. It's based on the 90's version of the Yamaha Lanza 230 engine (close relative of the WR200 engine). It's nearly a direct copy in fact, being that they bought the tooling from Yamaha. Power valve is electronically servo activated as was the Yamaha, which to me is a plus compared to the complicated mechanical ones used today. There is like two parts to it. 6 speed, oil injected, electric start, counter balanced.......it was never intended to compete on a motocross track. It has a frame dimensionally the same as a 16-18 Husky frame and so accepts Husky seats, bodywork, and tanks. There are lots of owner reports on these bikes as well as the 4-strokes on Thumpertalk and Advrider, they are the real deal. Current KTM/Husky owners are saying the suspension is better than what came on their bikes in 2016, but I understand that isn't saying much.

Bottom line is it's another option and that's never a bad thing.
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Dirty Points 9/11/2018 5:30pm
9/11/2018 5:30pm Edited Date/Time 9/11/2018 7:49pm
jeffro503 wrote:
You can go back 50 - 55 years , it doesn't matter really. My point was that the Japanese bikes were laughed at , at one...
You can go back 50 - 55 years , it doesn't matter really. My point was that the Japanese bikes were laughed at , at one point in time. When I tried following the sport for the first time ( About 1978 ) the Japanese bike's had already taken over. The generation before that , they were considered a joke , and look what happened.
It matters because that narrative is simply not true.

The first Nifty-Thrifty Honda fifty hit American shores for the model year 1962. By 1965, they were dominating motorcycle Grand Prix racing. The 24-valve six cylinder DOHC Honda RC166 was already the most technologically advanced motorcycle anybody anywhere on the planet had ever built.

In 1968, a scant 6 years after the first American Honda, the CB750 was hitting the shelves, a big bike that from an engineering-standpoint put all motorcycles then available to shame. The same year, the Yamaha DT1 was clearly the best dual sport motorcycle ever. It was only a matter of time before true competition dirt bikes were on the way. If by this point, somebody wasn't taking Japanese motorcycles seriously, they were clearly out of touch.

There is no analogue here with the Chinese manufacturers, who, to date, have been in the global market for over 30 years, and still haven't built anything but cheap knockoffs of old Japanese designs.

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plowboy
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plowboy 9/11/2018 5:35pm
9/11/2018 5:35pm
Paging ML...need a Vital test to settle this.
mwr
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mwr 9/11/2018 5:38pm
9/11/2018 5:38pm Edited Date/Time 9/11/2018 5:40pm
Spurdo wrote:
I see broken KTM frames, and cracking Yamaha welds on this forum every week, yet have never seen one of these bikes with similar issues. The...
I see broken KTM frames, and cracking Yamaha welds on this forum every week, yet have never seen one of these bikes with similar issues. The criticism doesn't seem founded.....
And you know what? You can then contact KTM or Yamaha and they might do something about it, or at least have replacement parts, and someone will stock those parts too.

But by all means anyone is welcome to buy the mystery bike whose engine is a Yamaha copy, whose brakes are Brembo copies, whose importer is God Knows Who, and do it so they can save maybe a grand & change over buying an '18 RMZ. Good luck to ya.
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early
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early 9/11/2018 5:59pm
9/11/2018 5:59pm
The Chinese and Japanese have different philosophies in business. The Japanese weren't exploiting a cheap labor market and super lax environmental and social policies, they were trying to be the best in the world.

This bike is probably pretty good performance wise for a trail bike, but like others have said, it doesn't really make sense to take a chance on purchasing one for the price they want for it.
rutsmash
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rutsmash 9/11/2018 7:06pm
9/11/2018 7:06pm
If China want to seriously get in the competitive MX business, they can do it easily and wouldn't take them long to catch up. They steal every technology of interest, particularly from the US, to catch up and become a dominant power. I wouldn't be surprised if they have cyber-intruded KTM and Yamaha (and all others for that matter) and could duplicate any bike out there. But it may be that its not in the government's current five year plan however so the government is not pushing their cyber actors to go after it (not yet). If they ever do, you can guarantee they will attempt to build a competitive model and undercut the market to force everyone else out and then control the market. That's what they do in every industry they want to dominate.
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scooter5002
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scooter5002 9/11/2018 7:19pm
9/11/2018 7:19pm
JD167 wrote:
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable...
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable componets for $7500?
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just those who lean more towards casual play riding. Yamaha at $7500 or Hop Sing Ring Ding for $5500? $2000 is huge, to someone who thinks they want a bike to ride, while following Junior on the Chinese PW 50.
yak651
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yak651 9/11/2018 7:39pm
9/11/2018 7:39pm
plowboy wrote:
Paging ML...need a Vital test to settle this.
Pffff....he probably couldn't even bottom the suspension....speaking of suspension did that A-kit test ever get done? Maybe put a set on this Smile
Dirty Points 9/11/2018 7:45pm
9/11/2018 7:45pm Edited Date/Time 9/11/2018 7:47pm
JD167 wrote:
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable...
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable componets for $7500?
scooter5002 wrote:
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just...
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just those who lean more towards casual play riding. Yamaha at $7500 or Hop Sing Ring Ding for $5500? $2000 is huge, to someone who thinks they want a bike to ride, while following Junior on the Chinese PW 50.
But, it's not cheap. It's way overpriced.

The SSR (Asiawing) SR250 is $3700 street price.
Mace-x
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Mace-x 9/11/2018 7:46pm
9/11/2018 7:46pm


$3990 msrp

they dont look bad at all...
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jbrownmxr
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jbrownmxr 9/11/2018 8:00pm
9/11/2018 8:00pm
jeffro503 wrote:
You can go back 50 - 55 years , it doesn't matter really. My point was that the Japanese bikes were laughed at , at one...
You can go back 50 - 55 years , it doesn't matter really. My point was that the Japanese bikes were laughed at , at one point in time. When I tried following the sport for the first time ( About 1978 ) the Japanese bike's had already taken over. The generation before that , they were considered a joke , and look what happened.
Dirty Points wrote:
It matters because that narrative is simply not true. The first Nifty-Thrifty Honda fifty hit American shores for the model year 1962. By 1965, they were...
It matters because that narrative is simply not true.

The first Nifty-Thrifty Honda fifty hit American shores for the model year 1962. By 1965, they were dominating motorcycle Grand Prix racing. The 24-valve six cylinder DOHC Honda RC166 was already the most technologically advanced motorcycle anybody anywhere on the planet had ever built.

In 1968, a scant 6 years after the first American Honda, the CB750 was hitting the shelves, a big bike that from an engineering-standpoint put all motorcycles then available to shame. The same year, the Yamaha DT1 was clearly the best dual sport motorcycle ever. It was only a matter of time before true competition dirt bikes were on the way. If by this point, somebody wasn't taking Japanese motorcycles seriously, they were clearly out of touch.

There is no analogue here with the Chinese manufacturers, who, to date, have been in the global market for over 30 years, and still haven't built anything but cheap knockoffs of old Japanese designs.

The Japanese had a long history of making small displacement motors and motorcycles prior to dominating the market.

The Chinese have shown no great innovative spirit outside the introduction of gun powder and General Tso’s chicken.

I don’t think they have it in them to innovate. They can make cheap shit all day long though.
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JD167
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JD167 9/11/2018 8:05pm
9/11/2018 8:05pm
JD167 wrote:
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable...
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable componets for $7500?
scooter5002 wrote:
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just...
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just those who lean more towards casual play riding. Yamaha at $7500 or Hop Sing Ring Ding for $5500? $2000 is huge, to someone who thinks they want a bike to ride, while following Junior on the Chinese PW 50.
Dirty Points wrote:
But, it's not cheap. It's way overpriced.

The SSR (Asiawing) SR250 is $3700 street price.
You can get a 2018 RMZ250 right now for $5399, there is no valid argument for buying one of these.
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TymeMoto
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TymeMoto 9/11/2018 10:00pm
9/11/2018 10:00pm
JD167 wrote:
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable...
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable componets for $7500?
Exactly.

Plus what happens when you need parts for this Chinese bike??
.kyle
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.kyle 9/12/2018 12:57am
9/12/2018 12:57am
A chinese bike?...erm....no thanks.
GODZILLA
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GODZILLA 9/12/2018 1:31am
9/12/2018 1:31am Edited Date/Time 9/12/2018 1:38am
JD167 wrote:
You can get a 2018 RMZ250 right now for $5399, there is no valid argument for buying one of these.
Apples and oranges...
These seem mucher closer to a 200 WR or a KDX 200, which were great woods bikes that some truly miss...
And from what I saw, they're pretty well built.

The funny thing is that most of you who say "Chinese products are crap" are actually typing this on a computer or a smartphone that comes straight from China...
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Jrewing
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Jrewing 9/12/2018 2:45am
9/12/2018 2:45am
logan_140 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/09/11/286658/s1200_87DE5A97_2D20_4D27_9FEC_80B8B8E54354.jpg[/img] Interesting?

Interesting?
Haha Jeff your famous!!!
nascarnate326
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nascarnate326 9/12/2018 2:52am
9/12/2018 2:52am
JD167 wrote:
You can get a 2018 RMZ250 right now for $5399, there is no valid argument for buying one of these.
GODZILLA wrote:
Apples and oranges... These seem mucher closer to a 200 WR or a KDX 200, which were great woods bikes that some truly miss... And from...
Apples and oranges...
These seem mucher closer to a 200 WR or a KDX 200, which were great woods bikes that some truly miss...
And from what I saw, they're pretty well built.

The funny thing is that most of you who say "Chinese products are crap" are actually typing this on a computer or a smartphone that comes straight from China...
There is a big difference between an American engineered product produced in China and a China engineered(stolen) product produced in China.
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JMX82
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JMX82 9/12/2018 3:26am
9/12/2018 3:26am
plowboy wrote:
Paging ML...need a Vital test to settle this.
And Pingree to race one ....
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scooter5002
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scooter5002 9/12/2018 6:07am
9/12/2018 6:07am
JD167 wrote:
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable...
Even if it isn't a complete turd who is really gonna spend $5,500 for this when you can get a yz250 with legit and easily replaceable componets for $7500?
scooter5002 wrote:
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just...
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just those who lean more towards casual play riding. Yamaha at $7500 or Hop Sing Ring Ding for $5500? $2000 is huge, to someone who thinks they want a bike to ride, while following Junior on the Chinese PW 50.
Dirty Points wrote:
But, it's not cheap. It's way overpriced.

The SSR (Asiawing) SR250 is $3700 street price.
True enough, but, the Chinese bike is $2000 cheaper. That’s what some people will look at.
Dirty Points 9/12/2018 6:12am
9/12/2018 6:12am Edited Date/Time 9/12/2018 6:20am
JD167 wrote:
You can get a 2018 RMZ250 right now for $5399, there is no valid argument for buying one of these.
GODZILLA wrote:
Apples and oranges... These seem mucher closer to a 200 WR or a KDX 200, which were great woods bikes that some truly miss... And from...
Apples and oranges...
These seem mucher closer to a 200 WR or a KDX 200, which were great woods bikes that some truly miss...
And from what I saw, they're pretty well built.

The funny thing is that most of you who say "Chinese products are crap" are actually typing this on a computer or a smartphone that comes straight from China...
nascarnate326 wrote:
There is a big difference between an American engineered product produced in China and a China engineered(stolen) product produced in China.
This.

I wouldn't be entirely surprised if there was a Chinese-built actual YZ in the not-too-distant future. And I would not hesitate to buy that.

Just as I wouldn't hesitate to purchase a Chinese-built actual CRF50.
Dirty Points 9/12/2018 6:15am
9/12/2018 6:15am Edited Date/Time 9/12/2018 6:17am
scooter5002 wrote:
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just...
People will buy these, for the same reason they buy any other cheap crap, which is price alone. Not people in the know about bikes, just those who lean more towards casual play riding. Yamaha at $7500 or Hop Sing Ring Ding for $5500? $2000 is huge, to someone who thinks they want a bike to ride, while following Junior on the Chinese PW 50.
Dirty Points wrote:
But, it's not cheap. It's way overpriced.

The SSR (Asiawing) SR250 is $3700 street price.
scooter5002 wrote:
True enough, but, the Chinese bike is $2000 cheaper. That’s what some people will look at.
But following that logic, if they are purely a price-driven shopper, why wouldn't they buy the bikes that are $2000 cheaper than $2000 cheaper?
scooter5002
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scooter5002 9/12/2018 8:35am
9/12/2018 8:35am
Dirty Points wrote:
But, it's not cheap. It's way overpriced.

The SSR (Asiawing) SR250 is $3700 street price.
scooter5002 wrote:
True enough, but, the Chinese bike is $2000 cheaper. That’s what some people will look at.
Dirty Points wrote:
But following that logic, if they are purely a price-driven shopper, why wouldn't they buy the bikes that are $2000 cheaper than $2000 cheaper?
Not saying they wouldn’t. However, if they’ve only seen a bike at $5500, not the $3500 model, they’ll buy it, instead of the Japanese model.
Doddy
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Doddy 9/12/2018 8:50am
9/12/2018 8:50am
GODZILLA wrote:
Apples and oranges... These seem mucher closer to a 200 WR or a KDX 200, which were great woods bikes that some truly miss... And from...
Apples and oranges...
These seem mucher closer to a 200 WR or a KDX 200, which were great woods bikes that some truly miss...
And from what I saw, they're pretty well built.

The funny thing is that most of you who say "Chinese products are crap" are actually typing this on a computer or a smartphone that comes straight from China...
nascarnate326 wrote:
There is a big difference between an American engineered product produced in China and a China engineered(stolen) product produced in China.
Dirty Points wrote:
This. I wouldn't be entirely surprised if there was a Chinese-built [i]actual[/i] YZ in the not-too-distant future. And I would not hesitate to buy that. Just...
This.

I wouldn't be entirely surprised if there was a Chinese-built actual YZ in the not-too-distant future. And I would not hesitate to buy that.

Just as I wouldn't hesitate to purchase a Chinese-built actual CRF50.
A Chinese made CRF50 is the same price(if not more) than a PW50.....almost bought one too, until I saw that lovely little made in China sticker. I am not going to support that practice.
Dirty Points 9/12/2018 8:56am
9/12/2018 8:56am Edited Date/Time 9/12/2018 8:57am
nascarnate326 wrote:
There is a big difference between an American engineered product produced in China and a China engineered(stolen) product produced in China.
Dirty Points wrote:
This. I wouldn't be entirely surprised if there was a Chinese-built [i]actual[/i] YZ in the not-too-distant future. And I would not hesitate to buy that. Just...
This.

I wouldn't be entirely surprised if there was a Chinese-built actual YZ in the not-too-distant future. And I would not hesitate to buy that.

Just as I wouldn't hesitate to purchase a Chinese-built actual CRF50.
Doddy wrote:
A Chinese made CRF50 is the same price(if not more) than a PW50.....almost bought one too, until I saw that lovely little made in China sticker...
A Chinese made CRF50 is the same price(if not more) than a PW50.....almost bought one too, until I saw that lovely little made in China sticker. I am not going to support that practice.
If a CRF50 is the same price as a PW50, then it is a lot cheaper.

It is a whole lot more motorcycle. In terms of build, it compares more closely with a (no longer produced) PW80

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