2016 450 Dynos

theycallmeebryan
Edited Date/Time 11/2/2015 8:32pm
http://www.vitalmx.com/stories/non-public/22

Insane that the 450SXF is producing 58hp stock! Check out the KXF's meaty torque curve, though.





|
BobPA
Profile picture for user BobPA
Posts
8332
Joined
10/31/2013
Location
USA
BobPA 10/28/2015 9:35am
10/28/2015 9:35am
The Yamaha looks pretty good on paper...

The Honda drops off like a boss after 8k
gt80rider
Profile picture for user gt80rider
Posts
7132
Joined
4/19/2008
Location
Boulder, CO, USA
gt80rider 10/28/2015 9:40am
10/28/2015 9:40am
That Honda has one funky ass curve, why would they map it like that on purpose? Wtf?
c0ncEpT
Profile picture for user c0ncEpT
Posts
1317
Joined
5/13/2015
Location
Harrison Twp., MI, USA
c0ncEpT 10/28/2015 9:45am
10/28/2015 9:45am
The Yamaha looks real strong. Comes on a touch sooner than the KTM and is FLAT from 8K-10K.
Tom_Ryan
Profile picture for user Tom_Ryan
Posts
105
Joined
7/1/2015
Location
Philadelphia, PA, USA
Tom_Ryan 10/28/2015 10:50am
10/28/2015 10:50am
What happened to the husky having 63 hp lol

The Shop

See All »
ML512
Profile picture for user ML512
Posts
16991
Joined
12/28/2008
Location
Wildomar, CA, USA
Fantasy
1301st
ML512 10/28/2015 10:51am
10/28/2015 10:51am
Tom_Ryan wrote:
What happened to the husky having 63 hp lol
Different dynos produce different numbers. However, all these numbers were produced on Race Tech's dyno, on the same day, within two or three hours of each other total.
mx621
Profile picture for user mx621
Posts
310
Joined
12/8/2014
Location
USA
mx621 10/28/2015 4:28pm
10/28/2015 4:28pm
i wonder what makes the Honda fall so hard at 8k.. the tune (more so timing) , cam, head design? anyone actually know the real answer, not just a BS guess..
BobPA
Profile picture for user BobPA
Posts
8332
Joined
10/31/2013
Location
USA
BobPA 10/28/2015 4:31pm
10/28/2015 4:31pm
I wish the KTM graph was scaled the same as the others..makes it impossible to overlap and compare them
thorns
Profile picture for user thorns
Posts
723
Joined
4/25/2013
Location
NZ
thorns 10/28/2015 4:40pm
10/28/2015 4:40pm
BobPA wrote:
I wish the KTM graph was scaled the same as the others..makes it impossible to overlap and compare them
Heres the horsepower overlay from the main article.


moto0852
Profile picture for user moto0852
Posts
943
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Draper, UT, USA
moto0852 10/28/2015 4:45pm
10/28/2015 4:45pm
Who was just talking about the amazing single overhead cam-dual exhaust, 60 h.p. fire breathing Honda?
nytsmaC
Profile picture for user nytsmaC
Posts
5946
Joined
8/10/2009
Location
Frig Off, CA
nytsmaC 10/28/2015 4:47pm
10/28/2015 4:47pm
Dual exhaust. Sweet!
zehn
Profile picture for user zehn
Posts
7888
Joined
1/15/2013
Location
Anchorage, AK, USA
zehn 10/28/2015 5:31pm
10/28/2015 5:31pm Edited Date/Time 10/28/2015 5:32pm
moto0852 wrote:
Who was just talking about the amazing single overhead cam-dual exhaust, 60 h.p. fire breathing Honda?
Gotta wait for next year bro. Dual cam is the rumor right?
yak651
Profile picture for user yak651
Posts
8805
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Appleton, WI, USA
Fantasy
1358th
yak651 10/28/2015 5:32pm
10/28/2015 5:32pm
moto0852 wrote:
Who was just talking about the amazing single overhead cam-dual exhaust, 60 h.p. fire breathing Honda?
Most likely that Kiwi guy, loves everything Honda, hates everything KTM
zehn
Profile picture for user zehn
Posts
7888
Joined
1/15/2013
Location
Anchorage, AK, USA
zehn 10/28/2015 5:36pm
10/28/2015 5:36pm
Based on the Shootout, I'd definitely get the Yammer if I were in the market for a new bike.
kiwifan
Profile picture for user kiwifan
Posts
9799
Joined
10/31/2009
Location
USA
kiwifan 10/28/2015 6:30pm
10/28/2015 6:30pm Edited Date/Time 10/28/2015 6:32pm
moto0852 wrote:
Who was just talking about the amazing single overhead cam-dual exhaust, 60 h.p. fire breathing Honda?
yak651 wrote:
Most likely that Kiwi guy, loves everything Honda, hates everything KTM
Get a life dude, hating people who like Hondas seems to be a pet hate here

I actually ride a 2016 KXF450 dude, I would love to ride near you and throw some roost in your face.

I did post a article about the 2017 Honda rumour .... I guess that's a big no no here eh?
nascarnate326
Profile picture for user nascarnate326
Posts
3008
Joined
11/3/2014
Location
Charlotte, MI, USA
nascarnate326 10/28/2015 7:51pm
10/28/2015 7:51pm
Going to be real interesting next year with a new CRF and hopefully a new RMZ.

endurox
Profile picture for user endurox
Posts
2098
Joined
3/22/2014
Location
Garden City, ID, USA
endurox 10/28/2015 8:46pm
10/28/2015 8:46pm
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they will add is probably up to the corporate lawyers. The Husky dyno run numbers don't seem right. Maybe the Husky had the mud setting during the dyno test. We will see more tests in the following months.
keith101
Profile picture for user keith101
Posts
256
Joined
9/2/2015
Location
AU
keith101 10/28/2015 9:44pm
10/28/2015 9:44pm
nytsmaC wrote:
Dual exhaust. Sweet!
3rd place=GAMECHANGER.

Awesome!

That was just too easy.
tek14
Profile picture for user tek14
Posts
4934
Joined
1/26/2014
Location
Vantaa, FI
tek14 10/28/2015 10:52pm
10/28/2015 10:52pm
endurox wrote:
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they...
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they will add is probably up to the corporate lawyers. The Husky dyno run numbers don't seem right. Maybe the Husky had the mud setting during the dyno test. We will see more tests in the following months.
Why would Husky make more power than KTM as they are same? Overlay they seems pretty much same.

Pit Row

See All »
yak651
Profile picture for user yak651
Posts
8805
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Appleton, WI, USA
Fantasy
1358th
yak651 10/29/2015 5:37am
10/29/2015 5:37am
moto0852 wrote:
Who was just talking about the amazing single overhead cam-dual exhaust, 60 h.p. fire breathing Honda?
yak651 wrote:
Most likely that Kiwi guy, loves everything Honda, hates everything KTM
kiwifan wrote:
Get a life dude, hating people who like Hondas seems to be a pet hate here I actually ride a 2016 KXF450 dude, I would love...
Get a life dude, hating people who like Hondas seems to be a pet hate here

I actually ride a 2016 KXF450 dude, I would love to ride near you and throw some roost in your face.

I did post a article about the 2017 Honda rumour .... I guess that's a big no no here eh?
Ha, ha, sounds good. Next time your up north let me know, we have some nice sand tracks that make for some great roost throwing!
Samuel
Profile picture for user Samuel
Posts
388
Joined
6/30/2014
Location
Independence, OR, USA
Samuel 10/29/2015 6:26am
10/29/2015 6:26am
It's interesting to see those dyno charts. It is very common for people to talk about how much power the Yamaha has and that you need great throttle control in turns and tight sections. That would mostly be problematic in the lower rpm range. All bikes look very similar up to 7000. I guess the dyno doesn't always paint the perfect picture. Nothing quite like seat time for knowing a bike.
moto0852
Profile picture for user moto0852
Posts
943
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Draper, UT, USA
moto0852 10/29/2015 6:41am
10/29/2015 6:41am
endurox wrote:
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they...
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they will add is probably up to the corporate lawyers. The Husky dyno run numbers don't seem right. Maybe the Husky had the mud setting during the dyno test. We will see more tests in the following months.
You think the Honda is underpowered because of lawyers? I really doubt they will be able to find 10 hp to get the engine competitive next year regardless of lawyers.
Reefer Sutherland 10/29/2015 7:13am
10/29/2015 7:13am
Honda rumor?

There's 3-4 pics of it on this forum right now, and people are too stupid to know they're looking at a dual cam head.
gpracer36
Profile picture for user gpracer36
Posts
419
Joined
12/8/2011
Location
El Cajon, CA, USA
gpracer36 10/29/2015 7:45am
10/29/2015 7:45am
Reefer Sutherland wrote:
Honda rumor?

There's 3-4 pics of it on this forum right now, and people are too stupid to know they're looking at a dual cam head.
duel cam and 60hp, not a rumor. HRC is serious about returning to the top. Time will tell but don't be surprised.
moto0852
Profile picture for user moto0852
Posts
943
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Draper, UT, USA
moto0852 10/29/2015 9:18am
10/29/2015 9:18am
Reefer Sutherland wrote:
Honda rumor?

There's 3-4 pics of it on this forum right now, and people are too stupid to know they're looking at a dual cam head.
gpracer36 wrote:
duel cam and 60hp, not a rumor. HRC is serious about returning to the top. Time will tell but don't be surprised.
I would be willing to lay down a little bet with a willing taker that they will not find 10 h.p. next year. That's a pretty big jump. Could happen but I'll bet against it.
ML512
Profile picture for user ML512
Posts
16991
Joined
12/28/2008
Location
Wildomar, CA, USA
Fantasy
1301st
ML512 10/29/2015 9:43am
10/29/2015 9:43am
moto0852 wrote:
I would be willing to lay down a little bet with a willing taker that they will not find 10 h.p. next year. That's a pretty...
I would be willing to lay down a little bet with a willing taker that they will not find 10 h.p. next year. That's a pretty big jump. Could happen but I'll bet against it.
Their claim of 60 may not be based off our runs saying the stocker makes 50... For instance, their dyno may produce 52 or 53 on the 2016 model.
moto0852
Profile picture for user moto0852
Posts
943
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Draper, UT, USA
moto0852 10/29/2015 9:49am
10/29/2015 9:49am Edited Date/Time 10/29/2015 9:49am
moto0852 wrote:
I would be willing to lay down a little bet with a willing taker that they will not find 10 h.p. next year. That's a pretty...
I would be willing to lay down a little bet with a willing taker that they will not find 10 h.p. next year. That's a pretty big jump. Could happen but I'll bet against it.
ML512 wrote:
Their claim of 60 may not be based off our runs saying the stocker makes 50... For instance, their dyno may produce 52 or 53 on...
Their claim of 60 may not be based off our runs saying the stocker makes 50... For instance, their dyno may produce 52 or 53 on the 2016 model.
Whatever the starting base is. All things being equal they need to find 10 h.p.

That's tough to do.
Reefer Sutherland 10/29/2015 10:07am
10/29/2015 10:07am
endurox wrote:
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they...
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they will add is probably up to the corporate lawyers. The Husky dyno run numbers don't seem right. Maybe the Husky had the mud setting during the dyno test. We will see more tests in the following months.
moto0852 wrote:
You think the Honda is underpowered because of lawyers? I really doubt they will be able to find 10 hp to get the engine competitive next...
You think the Honda is underpowered because of lawyers? I really doubt they will be able to find 10 hp to get the engine competitive next year regardless of lawyers.
Funny you say that, but they are. It's a liability issue. Japan's business laws dictate some pretty strange things. For example... There was a time period where one carburetor company was infinitely better than the other carburetor company, and yet one or more of the manufacturers willingly installed the shittier of the two. Leaves you scratching your head, but it's anti-Monopoly law in effect.

I don't know the specifics of the liability, the sales numbers, and Honda's conservative approach to bikes lately, but that is the culprit, and they're interrelated. When you sell more bikes than anyone, the chance of lawsuit increases.

and another thing.. there used to be an old adage, back when there was a much larger gap in the performance of the production machines, that "it's easier to make a slow bike fast than it is to make a poor handling bike handle well" It's much easier to put an exhaust, a cam, and a re-map on a Honda than it is to shave 10lbs off another brand and make it turn as well. Then, when you get done dumping your money into those parts, you still have less resale value than a Honda.

These arguments go both ways and there is no clear cut "right" answer. The only certainty is that a lot of the people engaging in these arguments probably don't even own the bikes.
moto0852
Profile picture for user moto0852
Posts
943
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Draper, UT, USA
moto0852 10/29/2015 10:16am
10/29/2015 10:16am
endurox wrote:
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they...
17 Honda will be vastly improved, starting with 20 century e start and maybe 21st century tbw. Easy to add more HP. but how much they will add is probably up to the corporate lawyers. The Husky dyno run numbers don't seem right. Maybe the Husky had the mud setting during the dyno test. We will see more tests in the following months.
moto0852 wrote:
You think the Honda is underpowered because of lawyers? I really doubt they will be able to find 10 hp to get the engine competitive next...
You think the Honda is underpowered because of lawyers? I really doubt they will be able to find 10 hp to get the engine competitive next year regardless of lawyers.
Reefer Sutherland wrote:
Funny you say that, but they are. It's a liability issue. Japan's business laws dictate some pretty strange things. For example... There was a time period...
Funny you say that, but they are. It's a liability issue. Japan's business laws dictate some pretty strange things. For example... There was a time period where one carburetor company was infinitely better than the other carburetor company, and yet one or more of the manufacturers willingly installed the shittier of the two. Leaves you scratching your head, but it's anti-Monopoly law in effect.

I don't know the specifics of the liability, the sales numbers, and Honda's conservative approach to bikes lately, but that is the culprit, and they're interrelated. When you sell more bikes than anyone, the chance of lawsuit increases.

and another thing.. there used to be an old adage, back when there was a much larger gap in the performance of the production machines, that "it's easier to make a slow bike fast than it is to make a poor handling bike handle well" It's much easier to put an exhaust, a cam, and a re-map on a Honda than it is to shave 10lbs off another brand and make it turn as well. Then, when you get done dumping your money into those parts, you still have less resale value than a Honda.

These arguments go both ways and there is no clear cut "right" answer. The only certainty is that a lot of the people engaging in these arguments probably don't even own the bikes.
If that's true I would say Honda should look to hire away some of Yamahas lawyers. H.P. seems to be a non issue for them.
dcg141
Profile picture for user dcg141
Posts
2317
Joined
11/30/2009
Location
USA
dcg141 10/29/2015 11:22am
10/29/2015 11:22am Edited Date/Time 10/30/2015 6:36am
kiwifan wrote:
Get a life dude, hating people who like Hondas seems to be a pet hate here I actually ride a 2016 KXF450 dude, I would love...
Get a life dude, hating people who like Hondas seems to be a pet hate here

I actually ride a 2016 KXF450 dude, I would love to ride near you and throw some roost in your face.

I did post a article about the 2017 Honda rumour .... I guess that's a big no no here eh?
When do you graduate from Jr High?
kibby
Profile picture for user kibby
Posts
84
Joined
1/9/2012
Location
El Cerrito, CA, USA
kibby 10/29/2015 9:12pm
10/29/2015 9:12pm Edited Date/Time 10/29/2015 9:13pm
I don't see it listed , but it should probably be taken into consideration that these are dyno sweeps performed at 100% throttle.Unless using some type of servo,a little human inconsistency can creep in and alter the initial rpm readings as the throttle is rolled on.Same gearing on all bikes?Dyno tire?Tire pressure?Drive chain condition?chain lubed etc.Most teams' data from most riders would indicate that 100% throttle is only used for about 10-15% of a lap.
SX maybe 10 out of 50 seconds a lap , MX maybe 20 out of 110 seconds a lap.
Most time is spent in the 10-66% throttle positions, it's not drag racing...
While these offer a good overview of the general performance at all openings the graphs MIGHT look more similar at 33/50/66% TPS etc.Also still an unknown is how well each bike responds between the throttle positions(Response!)This would give some explanation (apart from MX/SX being 70+% rider!) why a so-called under powered bike can still be highly competitive in the right hands,Tomac,Canard? I just wouldn't live and die by the Dyno....that's all.

Post a reply to: 2016 450 Dynos