These bike shootouts are in need of change. Yes, we all know it's all subjective, but that's not my complaint. My complaint and idea for change is these shootouts should ride and test the bikes in real world terms. These shootouts pick these bikes apart and mention things like "we don't like the tires it comes with, or the bar bend is too low, the grips are uncomfortable" etc. In my opinion all this is useless info as most of those items are immediately changed when we buy a new bike, or changed soon after we buy it, so don't even bother mentioning it. To me, these companies that do the shootouts should get a stock bike and then have an allowance for parts/upgrades. Set a limit, say $1500 for each bike on anything they think the bikes needs. That way these bikes can be tested in a condition where most of us ride them. Allow them to do a re-valve, add an ECU, change bars, linkage or whatever. As long as they stay under the pre determined budget, let them set the bikes up so they are more in line with what we ride.
Isn't this pretty much what MXA does (though maybe not that extensive)? Or at least they used to - they seem to be coming out with shootouts quicker lately. They used to be much later than everyone else so they had more time to race the bikes and offer the kind of helpful advice you mention.
I say no shootouts.
These are two wheelers.
Only Jousting.
Winner take all.
I would like to see two rounds. First round is just all stock with only allowing adjustments like clickers and bar position, etc. whatever adjustments you can make with what comes stock on the bike.
The second round is how good can you make the bike for the specific rider. Granted you may have to reduce the number of test riders out of practicality, but this would include all the standard mods people would do like springing for weight, prefered grips and bar bends, etc. maybe set a budget. A lot of people might find out they can buy a Suzuki and spend the same money they would modding another bike and be pretty close to what they need.
The bikes are so close on the track sometimes to comes down to little things. I wish they would test at more than 1 track but I will take what I can get. Personal taste seems to account for more than the performance delta of the bikes.
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I think you just take it too seriously. The point of shootouts is not actually to determine which bike is the best, as you said, that’s a subjective opinion. The point is to market all of them for the manufacturers.
I think ecu and exhaust are taking it a bit far. It would be interesting to see if the Suzuki, Kawi, and Honda 250s move up with a revalve. But that is still probably $1k more. They almost all have mx33 tires so I don’t see that being an issue although when they throw maxxis tires on for the test…
That's the point of shootouts though, reviewing and ranking based off of the bike off the showroom floor...
Yes, that would be cool if they did a modified shootout using a small allowance per bike and see if the results change...
Problem with shoots they are just first impressions, i like the long term reviews much better, get a better idea about the performence and reliability
Keefer has done something similar to this. Idk shoot outs are dumb unless you y one of the lucky few that is riding all the bikes. Unless you know you ride very similar to one of the test riders it’s hard to put any weight on any of the opinions.
Then read/watch MXA shootouts...
Maybe change bars and tires, I wouldn't say engine mods are needed in the test.
Keefer just presented his thoughts about shootouts earlier this week, including those on baselineing tires:
https://www.keeferinctesting.com/27522-2/
MXA seem to be the only people who actually criticize a bike. Any bike.
Any comparison or “shootout” where the bikes are not actually weighed is bogus.
Been saying it for years. I want to see a modded 2006 vs a stock 2023
MXA thoroughly test bikes for extended periods in real racing events with various levels of riders (pros, int, etc) They've been doing that for decades. I trust their opinions over anyone elses...especially because they're not holding punches. Everyone else is too scared to be honest for fear of losing access to bikes and advert $$$$$.
The OEMs listen to MXA...that should tell you something.
Shootouts are kind of a joke anyway....you're testing a bike in an "as delivered" state. Who the hell leaves their bike stock?
Anyone else wonder why MXA hasn't been given a Varg to flog the shit out of like they do for all bikes yet? LOL.
A stock 2023 bike properly set up is much better than a factory 2006 bike so yeah
It would be cool to see though
A factory 06 Honda 450 would be dam hard to beat.
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A few of the media guys are clearly biased towards certain bikes: they shouldn’t do the shootouts. I wouldn’t be able to do them as I’m biased towards Kawi.
I'd rather see hot chicks with the bikes when the bikes are parked. That'd be a nice change. Don, and Keefer aren't pretty enough to be posing with the bikes. Who's got that pretty picture of ML?
The track and the track prep Swap moto's shootout was on was comical.
How can you confidently say which bike corners the best when there’s not a single rut on the entire track and every corner is rock hard and dry as hell. I haven’t seen a track that hard and dry since the 90’s.
Tim.ferry said his stock.2015 kawy 450 was better than his 2007 mxon bike.
Did the OP’s bike come last again?
Well, you're in luck with that.
You'll see that , in a 23 /24 YZ250 vs 23 / 24 KTM / KTHusky / KTGG 250 2 stroke test!
I wouldnt like lap times
And which they would buy
Not really
😂 gold, but true.
It would be cool, but probably not that good of a match?
But if you went a ten year difference; say super modded 2012/13 bike (setup to suit the test rider) vs 2022/23 stocko, that could be interesting.
The frame geometry on my 22 Kawi is based off the 06 Honda, they were damn good bikes.
The 06 would weigh less than all the new bikes.
Quick solution: You test and rate all the bikes but not the Kawi.
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