New Lectron “Billetron”

pcm_918
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Elgin, MN, USA
Edited Date/Time 11/6/2022 11:50pm
Who is going to be the Guinea pig?

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Hi Side
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12/21/2021 10:16am
I would jump on it in a heartbeat if I had another 2-stroke. I have a Lectron on my 125 and it's the best money I've spent. No more changing brass every time the weather changes. I'm on the prowl for a TC 250 and when I find one I'll likely give the Billetron a try.
1
opyguy
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Boston, MA, USA
12/21/2021 10:56am
go to KTM talk jetting and fuel injection section...guys having problems
3
Bruce372
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12/21/2021 11:39am
Fair play to them for fixing all of the short comings like wrong side choke, imperial screws, needing a new cable and air boot etc etc.

They certainly have a different feel and I can see people liking them for trail riding.
AJ565
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San Antonio, TX, USA
12/21/2021 5:26pm
$600 carb vs $140 in carb parts to properly set up the stock carb seems kinda like a no brainer.
8

The Shop

12/23/2021 10:38am
AJ565 wrote:
$600 carb vs $140 in carb parts to properly set up the stock carb seems kinda like a no brainer.
Most guys don’t want to do the work anymore. One of the most rewarding things in my opinion is starting with a bike that barely runs and turning it into a crisp and clean revving machine with only some pieces of brass, a couple screwdrivers, and a 6mm Smile
8
12/23/2021 10:42am
AJ565 wrote:
$600 carb vs $140 in carb parts to properly set up the stock carb seems kinda like a no brainer.
I have a friend like that anyway. Buys an 04 CR125 that runs way fat. Plays with air/fuel screw for a couple minutes, fouls a couple plugs, swaps carb off a friends YZ250, still runs fat (Wonder why!) and then blows the money on a lectron saying it was the only way to fix how that bike ran.

He didn’t even let me put in my jetting specs for my 06 CR125 that ran like a top, said it would be too much work and wouldn’t fix it anyway.

The Lectron treated him well, but after coughing up that coin he had to run my take off tires the rest of the year.
seth505
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SD, CA, USA
12/23/2021 11:53am
I felt like my 17 250sx pulled harder with stock carb than my buddies '17 tc250 with a Lectron. His also bogged on landings a few times the one time I rode it which my bike never did the 4 years I owned it.
1
AJ565
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12/23/2021 1:10pm
seth505 wrote:
I felt like my 17 250sx pulled harder with stock carb than my buddies '17 tc250 with a Lectron. His also bogged on landings a few...
I felt like my 17 250sx pulled harder with stock carb than my buddies '17 tc250 with a Lectron. His also bogged on landings a few times the one time I rode it which my bike never did the 4 years I owned it.
They do pull way harder. People just think it’s less work to swap a carb then it in to crack open the stock carb and tinker with the black magic on the insides of them.
3
swordfish
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Somewhere, AB, CA
12/23/2021 1:16pm
seth505 wrote:
I felt like my 17 250sx pulled harder with stock carb than my buddies '17 tc250 with a Lectron. His also bogged on landings a few...
I felt like my 17 250sx pulled harder with stock carb than my buddies '17 tc250 with a Lectron. His also bogged on landings a few times the one time I rode it which my bike never did the 4 years I owned it.
AJ565 wrote:
They do pull way harder. People just think it’s less work to swap a carb then it in to crack open the stock carb and tinker...
They do pull way harder. People just think it’s less work to swap a carb then it in to crack open the stock carb and tinker with the black magic on the insides of them.
Too many people afraid of a little brass. So easy to access and tune.
2
Bruce372
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12/23/2021 1:58pm
Sorry guys, I am sure you are proud of your jetting skills, but ktm have caused all these issues.

If a stock bike can't be dialed with plus or minus one or two jets on pilot, main or needle clip, that is a big deal and no wonder people look for alternatives.

End users shouldn't need to change needles, nozzles and start filing slides to get the bike running decent.

And yes, I've tried them all.
4
Bruce372
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12/23/2021 2:02pm
It's a damn shame ktm dropped the keihin after 2016
2
1
Leeham
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Rochester, WA, USA
12/23/2021 2:24pm
On my 17 250 SX, I just bought a Keihin carb only because I was far more familar with it vs the Mikuni. I got that bike going REALLY good. Actually the bike became too much after awhile.
1
b8res
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Location
Lodi, CA, USA
12/23/2021 8:22pm
Nah... not drinking that kool-aid.. jetting is easy if you understand the basics.... My YZ 125, 250 and RM 250 are all jetted really good...

Just can't see dropping the coin to replace another true tested widget.....
3
hylo
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NO
12/23/2021 11:01pm
Bruce372 wrote:
Sorry guys, I am sure you are proud of your jetting skills, but ktm have caused all these issues. If a stock bike can't be dialed...
Sorry guys, I am sure you are proud of your jetting skills, but ktm have caused all these issues.

If a stock bike can't be dialed with plus or minus one or two jets on pilot, main or needle clip, that is a big deal and no wonder people look for alternatives.

End users shouldn't need to change needles, nozzles and start filing slides to get the bike running decent.

And yes, I've tried them all.
Why not? Some end users like to tinker and make the bike they own better. The awesome thing with two strokes is you can tune it with brass for a few bucks as well as tune the powervalve for free. You even get optional springs for the powervalve from KTM. You cant set and forget a carb on a two stroke. Do you set and forget your suspension? Maybe end users shouldnt swap springs or play with air pressure since its ‘advanced’.

If you change a clip on the needle you’re halfway there already.

I thought about buying the new lectron or a smartcarb a few weeks ago, but I like the mikuni as it is now. Buy the jets and slide from AJ’s thread and buy him a few beers instead. Way cheaper and better!
Bruce372
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12/24/2021 3:36am
Bruce372 wrote:
Sorry guys, I am sure you are proud of your jetting skills, but ktm have caused all these issues. If a stock bike can't be dialed...
Sorry guys, I am sure you are proud of your jetting skills, but ktm have caused all these issues.

If a stock bike can't be dialed with plus or minus one or two jets on pilot, main or needle clip, that is a big deal and no wonder people look for alternatives.

End users shouldn't need to change needles, nozzles and start filing slides to get the bike running decent.

And yes, I've tried them all.
hylo wrote:
Why not? Some end users like to tinker and make the bike they own better. The awesome thing with two strokes is you can tune it...
Why not? Some end users like to tinker and make the bike they own better. The awesome thing with two strokes is you can tune it with brass for a few bucks as well as tune the powervalve for free. You even get optional springs for the powervalve from KTM. You cant set and forget a carb on a two stroke. Do you set and forget your suspension? Maybe end users shouldnt swap springs or play with air pressure since its ‘advanced’.

If you change a clip on the needle you’re halfway there already.

I thought about buying the new lectron or a smartcarb a few weeks ago, but I like the mikuni as it is now. Buy the jets and slide from AJ’s thread and buy him a few beers instead. Way cheaper and better!
I dont think you got my point.

Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position.

But having to buy new needles, nozzles, isn't good for anyone in this sport. Buying slides is expensive, cutting them can be dangerous if not done right. Combining all that together is a giant shit sandwich.

No one wants to mess around wirh their carb for a month or two every time they ride their new bike trying to dial it in and not blow it up.

The mikuni is a great carb, but damn have they missed the mark with settings and they've been at it for half a decade.
3
1
hylo
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12/24/2021 4:18am
Bruce372 wrote:
I dont think you got my point. Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position. But having to...
I dont think you got my point.

Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position.

But having to buy new needles, nozzles, isn't good for anyone in this sport. Buying slides is expensive, cutting them can be dangerous if not done right. Combining all that together is a giant shit sandwich.

No one wants to mess around wirh their carb for a month or two every time they ride their new bike trying to dial it in and not blow it up.

The mikuni is a great carb, but damn have they missed the mark with settings and they've been at it for half a decade.
Okay! I get you now, I apologize!

I guess you are right, KTM should have adressed this and released the bike with good jetting. The thing is the tinkerer in me doesnt mind swapping brass and filing slides.

And it seems they didnt try to hit the mark, they just put some specs in there it seems like.

With that said, the best needle for the previous generation of Keihin carburated 250s was a Suzuki needle called NECJ. Haha, theres always someone tinkering and even if its TBI next year someone is probably gonna throw a Keihin in there or do something with it. Grinning
1
Bruce372
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12/24/2021 4:31am
Bruce372 wrote:
I dont think you got my point. Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position. But having to...
I dont think you got my point.

Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position.

But having to buy new needles, nozzles, isn't good for anyone in this sport. Buying slides is expensive, cutting them can be dangerous if not done right. Combining all that together is a giant shit sandwich.

No one wants to mess around wirh their carb for a month or two every time they ride their new bike trying to dial it in and not blow it up.

The mikuni is a great carb, but damn have they missed the mark with settings and they've been at it for half a decade.
hylo wrote:
Okay! I get you now, I apologize! I guess you are right, KTM should have adressed this and released the bike with good jetting. The thing...
Okay! I get you now, I apologize!

I guess you are right, KTM should have adressed this and released the bike with good jetting. The thing is the tinkerer in me doesnt mind swapping brass and filing slides.

And it seems they didnt try to hit the mark, they just put some specs in there it seems like.

With that said, the best needle for the previous generation of Keihin carburated 250s was a Suzuki needle called NECJ. Haha, theres always someone tinkering and even if its TBI next year someone is probably gonna throw a Keihin in there or do something with it. Grinning
My last smokers 2004 rm125 and 2005 rm250 ran really good as supplied with small changes. It's hard to fathom how wrong ktm got it.

One more thing, constantly changing jets etc isn't good for other reasons, when you twist the carb to access, the cable gets distorted and wears prematurely, carb manifold the same and the breathers can get messed up also. Then there is all the fuel you are breathing in and getting on your skin.

Plus, all that time and frustration when it doesn't go right... fair play to the vital gang for short cuts on settings tho.
4
AJ565
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San Antonio, TX, USA
12/24/2021 7:23am
Bruce372 wrote:
Sorry guys, I am sure you are proud of your jetting skills, but ktm have caused all these issues. If a stock bike can't be dialed...
Sorry guys, I am sure you are proud of your jetting skills, but ktm have caused all these issues.

If a stock bike can't be dialed with plus or minus one or two jets on pilot, main or needle clip, that is a big deal and no wonder people look for alternatives.

End users shouldn't need to change needles, nozzles and start filing slides to get the bike running decent.

And yes, I've tried them all.
hylo wrote:
Why not? Some end users like to tinker and make the bike they own better. The awesome thing with two strokes is you can tune it...
Why not? Some end users like to tinker and make the bike they own better. The awesome thing with two strokes is you can tune it with brass for a few bucks as well as tune the powervalve for free. You even get optional springs for the powervalve from KTM. You cant set and forget a carb on a two stroke. Do you set and forget your suspension? Maybe end users shouldnt swap springs or play with air pressure since its ‘advanced’.

If you change a clip on the needle you’re halfway there already.

I thought about buying the new lectron or a smartcarb a few weeks ago, but I like the mikuni as it is now. Buy the jets and slide from AJ’s thread and buy him a few beers instead. Way cheaper and better!
Bruce372 wrote:
I dont think you got my point. Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position. But having to...
I dont think you got my point.

Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position.

But having to buy new needles, nozzles, isn't good for anyone in this sport. Buying slides is expensive, cutting them can be dangerous if not done right. Combining all that together is a giant shit sandwich.

No one wants to mess around wirh their carb for a month or two every time they ride their new bike trying to dial it in and not blow it up.

The mikuni is a great carb, but damn have they missed the mark with settings and they've been at it for half a decade.
You do realize that the parts I’ve listed are all option parts from other OEM’s to adjust their carbs because they weren’t always spot on right? They all have multiple options richer and leaner from what came stock so they could tune as needed. What we’ve done is no different then anyone else has done when 2 stroke carb bikes were the main engine in racing. As a matter of fact pro teams used to jet the bikes different for practice when the tracks were muddy and then rejet them for the mains/motos when things changed. So your argument isn’t all that valid.
Bruce372
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12/24/2021 7:45am
hylo wrote:
Why not? Some end users like to tinker and make the bike they own better. The awesome thing with two strokes is you can tune it...
Why not? Some end users like to tinker and make the bike they own better. The awesome thing with two strokes is you can tune it with brass for a few bucks as well as tune the powervalve for free. You even get optional springs for the powervalve from KTM. You cant set and forget a carb on a two stroke. Do you set and forget your suspension? Maybe end users shouldnt swap springs or play with air pressure since its ‘advanced’.

If you change a clip on the needle you’re halfway there already.

I thought about buying the new lectron or a smartcarb a few weeks ago, but I like the mikuni as it is now. Buy the jets and slide from AJ’s thread and buy him a few beers instead. Way cheaper and better!
Bruce372 wrote:
I dont think you got my point. Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position. But having to...
I dont think you got my point.

Nothing wrong with carbs, and nothing wrong with swapping one or two jets or clip position.

But having to buy new needles, nozzles, isn't good for anyone in this sport. Buying slides is expensive, cutting them can be dangerous if not done right. Combining all that together is a giant shit sandwich.

No one wants to mess around wirh their carb for a month or two every time they ride their new bike trying to dial it in and not blow it up.

The mikuni is a great carb, but damn have they missed the mark with settings and they've been at it for half a decade.
AJ565 wrote:
You do realize that the parts I’ve listed are all option parts from other OEM’s to adjust their carbs because they weren’t always spot on right...
You do realize that the parts I’ve listed are all option parts from other OEM’s to adjust their carbs because they weren’t always spot on right? They all have multiple options richer and leaner from what came stock so they could tune as needed. What we’ve done is no different then anyone else has done when 2 stroke carb bikes were the main engine in racing. As a matter of fact pro teams used to jet the bikes different for practice when the tracks were muddy and then rejet them for the mains/motos when things changed. So your argument isn’t all that valid.
I am not arguing with you dude.

The factory settings are so crap, people are buying new carbs and going riding vs wasting their time messing around swapping parts.

Ive run your settings and they are great, congratulations on helping sell all the parts that the bike should have come with in 2017.
1
1
Bruce372
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12/24/2021 7:48am
Anyway, this is a billectron thread, mikuni has its own thread.

Good job to lectron for fixing all the feedback. Let's hope the new version works great and people can run it and go have fun.
2
digger
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Upstate, NY, USA
12/24/2021 9:29am
If KTM sold cars that were jetted as poorly as their carbed bikes, the cars would never make it off the dealers lot.
3
DynoDan22
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Victorville, CA, USA
12/24/2021 10:45am
Wait until people start riding their '22 YZ125's. I can't believe Yamaha jetted that bike so bad. The good news is it has a Keihin and it can be sorted out pretty quickly (you need a different needle). I can see a bunch of people chucking the Airstryker and trying a smartcarb. Haha
1
stone881
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Fruita, CO, USA
12/24/2021 11:16am
I ran a billet Smartcarb on a 2011 Yz 250 and a 14 Ktm Sx 250. I can say unequivocally that they were the cleanest running 2 strokes I ever owned and I am pretty capable at jetting. The power, as others have noted was smoothed out, but I don't remember losing over rev, and I would say it made both bikes more tractable.

If you are out of the altitude range (mine had the rod for 5000 feet plus) at sea level in my case, they don't run well and you have to change the meter rod. I also had to trim the air boot on both bikes and the adjuster knob on top was hard to actuate.
1
Wiscomx
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West Bend, WI, USA
12/24/2021 7:47pm
The lectrons are decent, when I ran one they had quite a few fit and finish issues, nice to see they finally moved the choke, hopefully corrected a few things, its hard to beat a well tuned kehin.
garasaki
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Mount Vernon, IA, USA
12/26/2021 9:47am
I drank a bunch of beer and bought a Billetron the other day.

I bought a '98 RM125 to turn into a woods bike. Couldn't get the thing to idle.

Mucho internet searching revealed no one else was able to get that year RM125 to idle either (it's a Keihin VM carb, I think it was only on the RM for a single year). I tried the obvious possibilities but the design of the carb simply does not allow it.

It's an interesting experience to ride a 125 that doesn't idle in the woods.

I could have bought a used carb to swap on there instead. That looked to be at least a $200 dollar proposition.

But I've also learned that trying to use products for applications that they weren't originally designed for ends up being a money pit. For instance, trying to use a 96 or 97 RM125 ends up meaning I'd have to replace the airbox with a 96 or 97. Maybe a new filter/cage. Experience tells me I'd end up spending another $200 to make it work.

And I'd end up dropping a bunch of time and frustration into trying to make a different carb work. Plus there are no good starting resources for how to jet a carb from a 2003 YZ125 for a 98 RM125. I also hate dealing with jetting - mosty because of how much a PIA it is to get a carb off the bike to access the jets.

I'm mostly just typing this out to justify my decision to drop $650 bucks for a plug and play solution that is unique to the specific model and year bike I'm using.
4
12/26/2021 12:44pm
garasaki wrote:
I drank a bunch of beer and bought a Billetron the other day. I bought a '98 RM125 to turn into a woods bike. Couldn't get...
I drank a bunch of beer and bought a Billetron the other day.

I bought a '98 RM125 to turn into a woods bike. Couldn't get the thing to idle.

Mucho internet searching revealed no one else was able to get that year RM125 to idle either (it's a Keihin VM carb, I think it was only on the RM for a single year). I tried the obvious possibilities but the design of the carb simply does not allow it.

It's an interesting experience to ride a 125 that doesn't idle in the woods.

I could have bought a used carb to swap on there instead. That looked to be at least a $200 dollar proposition.

But I've also learned that trying to use products for applications that they weren't originally designed for ends up being a money pit. For instance, trying to use a 96 or 97 RM125 ends up meaning I'd have to replace the airbox with a 96 or 97. Maybe a new filter/cage. Experience tells me I'd end up spending another $200 to make it work.

And I'd end up dropping a bunch of time and frustration into trying to make a different carb work. Plus there are no good starting resources for how to jet a carb from a 2003 YZ125 for a 98 RM125. I also hate dealing with jetting - mosty because of how much a PIA it is to get a carb off the bike to access the jets.

I'm mostly just typing this out to justify my decision to drop $650 bucks for a plug and play solution that is unique to the specific model and year bike I'm using.
I'm pretty sure the stock '98 carb was a PWM and they have no idle screw. You may have known this, but the idle is adjusted with the choke knob. Honda had some of the CR's in that era that had no idle screw and used the choke knob to adjust idle as well.
2
garasaki
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Mount Vernon, IA, USA
12/26/2021 7:54pm
garasaki wrote:
I drank a bunch of beer and bought a Billetron the other day. I bought a '98 RM125 to turn into a woods bike. Couldn't get...
I drank a bunch of beer and bought a Billetron the other day.

I bought a '98 RM125 to turn into a woods bike. Couldn't get the thing to idle.

Mucho internet searching revealed no one else was able to get that year RM125 to idle either (it's a Keihin VM carb, I think it was only on the RM for a single year). I tried the obvious possibilities but the design of the carb simply does not allow it.

It's an interesting experience to ride a 125 that doesn't idle in the woods.

I could have bought a used carb to swap on there instead. That looked to be at least a $200 dollar proposition.

But I've also learned that trying to use products for applications that they weren't originally designed for ends up being a money pit. For instance, trying to use a 96 or 97 RM125 ends up meaning I'd have to replace the airbox with a 96 or 97. Maybe a new filter/cage. Experience tells me I'd end up spending another $200 to make it work.

And I'd end up dropping a bunch of time and frustration into trying to make a different carb work. Plus there are no good starting resources for how to jet a carb from a 2003 YZ125 for a 98 RM125. I also hate dealing with jetting - mosty because of how much a PIA it is to get a carb off the bike to access the jets.

I'm mostly just typing this out to justify my decision to drop $650 bucks for a plug and play solution that is unique to the specific model and year bike I'm using.
I'm pretty sure the stock '98 carb was a PWM and they have no idle screw. You may have known this, but the idle is adjusted...
I'm pretty sure the stock '98 carb was a PWM and they have no idle screw. You may have known this, but the idle is adjusted with the choke knob. Honda had some of the CR's in that era that had no idle screw and used the choke knob to adjust idle as well.
Yup that's the one. I appreciate the heads up. I knew about the "adjustable" idle but it has no effect on mine. I took the choke off to be sure the adjustment nut was working correctly. It just does not do enough (or anything) on this carb.
m21racing
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Reno, NV, USA
12/28/2021 1:30pm
garasaki wrote:
I drank a bunch of beer and bought a Billetron the other day. I bought a '98 RM125 to turn into a woods bike. Couldn't get...
I drank a bunch of beer and bought a Billetron the other day.

I bought a '98 RM125 to turn into a woods bike. Couldn't get the thing to idle.

Mucho internet searching revealed no one else was able to get that year RM125 to idle either (it's a Keihin VM carb, I think it was only on the RM for a single year). I tried the obvious possibilities but the design of the carb simply does not allow it.

It's an interesting experience to ride a 125 that doesn't idle in the woods.

I could have bought a used carb to swap on there instead. That looked to be at least a $200 dollar proposition.

But I've also learned that trying to use products for applications that they weren't originally designed for ends up being a money pit. For instance, trying to use a 96 or 97 RM125 ends up meaning I'd have to replace the airbox with a 96 or 97. Maybe a new filter/cage. Experience tells me I'd end up spending another $200 to make it work.

And I'd end up dropping a bunch of time and frustration into trying to make a different carb work. Plus there are no good starting resources for how to jet a carb from a 2003 YZ125 for a 98 RM125. I also hate dealing with jetting - mosty because of how much a PIA it is to get a carb off the bike to access the jets.

I'm mostly just typing this out to justify my decision to drop $650 bucks for a plug and play solution that is unique to the specific model and year bike I'm using.
Nothing wrong with spending the dough on something you enjoy and plan to keep. I've jetted bike for years in high altitude. Nowadays I'd choose a plug n play kit or what you got. Don't need to prove I can do it; I'd rather save time.
3
mwssquad827
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Twin Falls, ID, USA
12/30/2021 4:07pm Edited Date/Time 12/30/2021 4:25pm
Bruce372 wrote:
Anyway, this is a billectron thread, mikuni has its own thread. Good job to lectron for fixing all the feedback. Let's hope the new version works...
Anyway, this is a billectron thread, mikuni has its own thread.

Good job to lectron for fixing all the feedback. Let's hope the new version works great and people can run it and go have fun.
You seem like a salesman for the lectern carb…. $600 for not wanting to jet my bike is crazy in my mind.. not saying the lectron isn’t a nice product but just my 2 cents…
Bruce372
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Location
USA
12/30/2021 6:12pm
Bruce372 wrote:
Anyway, this is a billectron thread, mikuni has its own thread. Good job to lectron for fixing all the feedback. Let's hope the new version works...
Anyway, this is a billectron thread, mikuni has its own thread.

Good job to lectron for fixing all the feedback. Let's hope the new version works great and people can run it and go have fun.
You seem like a salesman for the lectern carb…. $600 for not wanting to jet my bike is crazy in my mind.. not saying the lectron...
You seem like a salesman for the lectern carb…. $600 for not wanting to jet my bike is crazy in my mind.. not saying the lectron isn’t a nice product but just my 2 cents…
Lol, absolutely not. I had one on a bike and sold it. Only thing I was pointing out, they addressed all the practical things I didn't like about it.

My recommendation is mikuni with aj specs, or keihin pwk Stic metering block. Both run great and are up to the job and both give different riding experience.
1

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