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To the original question, YES.
I am considering buying one for myself and one for my 17 year old. Especially after seeing the data of Barcia’s crash, and then the slow motion clip of Forkners crash with deployment in the RMatv review video.
I am very interested in buying one, but two things that are holding me back. 1. I'm hesitant to ditch my neck brace. I broke my neck many years ago (before neck braces came out), and I've been religious about wearing my neck brace ever since. I'm a big believer in the braces ability to limit range of motion to help prevent neck injuries, and it doesn't restrict me to the point that it hinders my riding or prevent me from tucking my head if need be in a crash. I honestly don't even notice it when I'm riding. I'm not sure the tech-air would offer the same neck protection as a neck brace. 2. The heat. I have an A4 chest protector currently, and in Florida that thing is already pretty hot as it is. I'm not sure I can deal with something much hotter, but maybe it's not as bad as I think. Interested to hear other people's opinions.
You are insufferable! Good golly, you must be super fun to be around at a party. No one has said "f*ck concussions" or implied that head injuries are not serious. We are simply saying that this technology likely saved some serious internal injuries. None of us know that for certain, but because of the DATA and the use of our own eyeballs, we can infer that Barcia could have easily had life-altering injuries. Did you read the post from the guy who had a high-speed crash with bleeding around the heart and other internal injuries?? THAT is what this type of technology is designed to mitigate. not head injuries. But it feels like I'm talking to a petulant child, so I'm sure this will fall on deaf ears.
Did you break your neck by it bending too far forward or back or by compressing it by landing on your head?
That tech air has to be hot as shit you have a decently large chest protector with basically a rubber bag inside of it blocking all airflow so thats sort of comes with the territory no real way around that.
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Take it from someone who is paralyzed. Had the technology been around when I was riding, I more than likely would not be in a wheelchair. I probably would not have bruised my sternum, broken ribs, punctured a lung and collapsed the other either.
I burst my T5-T6 vertebrae, but my spinal cord is still intact. The force of the impact I sustained was enough to cause just enough damage to leave me a paraplegic.
How this would have helped. Easy. The airbag would have significantly reduced the amount of force transferred to my body, therefore protecting vital organs.
I was wearing a full roost deflector at the time. It protected me from getting scrapes, but they are not designed to reduce the force of an impact. Sure, it'll take some of the brunt out of getting hit by rocks, dirt, and things like that, but that's about it.
I'm not saying it will save everyone who crashes from receiving body damage or catastrophic injuries as each crash and force of impact is different, but yes, it can absolutely save people from organ damage and paralysis.
There are other members on here who are paralyzed. Maybe they'll chime in on whether or not this would have helped them.
If you can't see how this technology is a significant step towards improving the safety of riders, I can't help you.
My 2¢.
Shit Mav, I’ve been on this forum for years and never knew that about ya. Thank you for your input and thoughts on it. Makes my decision to purchase two of them even more important. Really struggled to spend the money right now but no regrets.
There is an opening in the middle of the chest to allow some air through. I haven't ridden with it in hot conditions so I can't really say, but I do think it will be warm. I'm ok with that, I'll just live with it.
Well would you rather ride with the "warmer" chest protector with an airbag, or possibly get paralyzed?
Relax, I was just saying its got to be hotter than a normal chest protector.
Saying wear this or get paralyzed is ridiculous, I would say this would reduce your chances of being paralyzed by less than a few percent, that doesn't mean its a bad product there is just some things that cant be fully protected.
Like I mentioned, it's not going to save everyone, but IMO, it's one of those things where it's better to wear it and not need it, than need it and not have it.
It's common sense. If you were in a head on collision driving down the road, would you rather have an air bag deploy or have your head and chest smash directly into the steering wheel and windshield? The answer should be an obvious one.
Considering Barcia broke a wing off one of his vertebrae whilst wearing the airbag. Perhaps he could have shattered his spine or severed his spinal cord without the system absorbing the impact?
I am sincerely sorry to hear about your circumstance.
There is positively no way to retroactively go back and claim that a piece of safety equipment would’ve prevented a particular injury from happening especially one as complex as a spinal cord injury.
Justin Barcia did not walk away from this crash without suffering a serious injury. He suffered a serious concussion. There is absolutely no way that Alpinestars can claim that their vest saved him from anything.
They immediately ran an ad claiming he did not suffer a serious injury. He suffered a serious goddamn injury.
To assert that the air vest prevented Justin Barcia from becoming paralyzed is just plain fucking ridiculous.
If these things really prevented paralysis, every single professional motocross racer on the planet would be wearing one. But they aren’t.
In an attempt to try and change the direction of the thread a little...
Does anyone use one of these. They claim to be "the first".
https://srg.shotracegear.com/en
They have Coldenhoff and Philippaerts list as riders.
Point on the doll where Alpinestars hurt you?
I'd be curious as to what protective pieces you ride with (if you ride) as you could literally use that argument against any piece of protection. Barcia himself has credited his lack of injuries thanks to Tech-Air MX. That's not Alpinestars saying that. That's the dude himself who has probably had multiple conversations with doctors over the last few weeks in regards to what he was wearing during his crash. I would take that as an expert testimonial.
congratulations. You have succeeded in me leaving this discussion. Wont click on it again. good job
It is up to a 95% reduction in force of impact.
I agree its a great product but come on, "up to 95% reduction in impact" is the most generic open ended statistic you could put out there.
What I'm arguing is everyone seems to think this kept Barcia from being paralyzed but unlikely thats the case, I don't know the exact stats but the overwhelming majority of spinal cord injuries in our sport are from compression like landing on your head or feet with crazy force.
I think its great and can prevent a ton of different injuries but people need to have a bit more realistic expectations of what's possible by simply an airbag on your torso, its like saying a good pair of boots will keep you form breaking your femur.
“What I'm arguing is everyone seems to think this kept Barcia from being paralyzed”
Nobody outright thinks this. You’re twisting the data and what people are saying to fit your negative narrative because you personally don’t see the value in the Tech-Air technology. It’s fine not to see the value in it, airbags have been a slow climb for adoption all of the last 20+ years, you’re not alone. The growth shows that you’ll likely come around at some point, and if you don’t, you might wish you did.
Pit Row
"There is absolutely no way that Alpinestars can claim that their vest saved him from anything. He suffered a serious goddamn injury."
Yes, and here's why.
The concussion he sustained is not related to the Tech-Air vest. The helmet and the airbag are two separate pieces of safety equipment designed to protect different parts of the body from different injuries. Sustaining a concussion does not invalidate the performance of the Tech-Air vest.
Alpinestars’ claim is not that Justin suffered no injuries, but that based on the measured impact data, the forces transmitted to his body were significantly reduced. That directly correlates with a reduced risk of rib fractures, lung injury, organ damage, etc. Their claim is not pulled out of nowhere. It's supported by the measured G-force reduction, known injury threshold for thoracic trauma, CE certification and lab validation, and real world crash telemetry.
Reducing force reduces the risk and severity of injury.
Less Force = Less Tissue Load = Lower Likelihood of Severe Damage
If your standard for safety equipment is that it must eliminate all injuries or guarantee specific outcomes, then no protective gear in would qualify, including helmets. That standard simply isn’t how injury mitigation works.
No one is saying this vest guarantees prevention of paralysis or death, and Alpinestars is certainly not going to say, claim, or advertise that. What they are saying and what the data shows is that it significantly reduces impact forces to vital areas of the body.
Technology evolves. That’s why we no longer wear leather helmets. Modern helmets don’t prevent all concussions, but no rational person would argue they aren’t vastly superior at reducing injury risk.
This airbag system is no different.
Just like I’d rather be in a vehicle with front and side airbags than one without them, I’d rather crash my dirt bike wearing a system proven to reduce impact forces than not.
Just block him and go on with your reading and contributing. Problem solved!
AMetts,
I broke my neck by casing a landing extremely hard and my head snapping forward in a hyperflexion manner. This was back in 2000. I'm confident if neck braces existed back then and I had been wearing one it would have prevented my injury. Thank God I made a full recovery and am still able to ride today. I don't take it for granted though, and when I got back into riding 15 years ago I have not ridden without a neck brace. So I'm very hesitant to change that habit now.
nrosso391,
to answer your question yes I would rather ride in something that makes me way hotter if it decreased my risk of paralysis. I don't doubt the technology of the air bag, My only struggle is, would I be sacrificing neck protection for better protection in other areas. If I was sure that the tech-air offered just as much neck protection as my neck brace I would buy one today.
Did anyone bother to question these numbers?
For example, can anyone explain why 27.6 Gs is supposed to be a meaningful metric in this context?
Did anyone bother to notice the duration of peak G forces?
NASA has done extensive research on G force tolerances and 27.6 is barely approaching the injury threshold, especially when you take into consideration the duration of G forces applied, which in Justin Barcia crash, was measured in milliseconds.
Nothing about these numbers screams, “Justin Barcia walked away without a serious injury”
… especially since he did in fact get carted away with a serious injury to his head.
For fucks sake, let it go man lol.
"Why dont they just make the whole plane out of the black box?" - Some corny 80's comic
I dont even need to click on the thread when a back and forth like this starts. I see it at the top of the page and just know, yeah its still going in there
My new chest protector/ineffective airbag rig showed up today. Ordered Sunday from mxboot.com. Process through their site was smooth as could be.
Initial opening of the box, looks sweet. Immediately pulled it out just for a test fit. Pulling it from the box, i definitely felt the weight. Im 6' 190 and went with a Large. Everything i read said to choose your shirt size and if youre in between, go with the size down, so that's what i did. I didn't measure anything. Seems to fit very well and once I put it on, i honestly couldnt even "feel" the weight difference in that form. Overall, pretty comfortable chest protector even if its as worthless at Jeremy says. Goal is to never have it inflate in the first place and just let it be my roost guard. Lol
Should I wear boots when I ride or go barefoot? The boots are pretty hot and I can't find any real data on their effectiveness. I know lots of people wear them but I'm worried about people thinking I'm just a sheep. Please help me, I'm in real turmoil over this.
Why are people so determined to shit on progress?
This is far an an away a massive safety improvement using a technology proven to increase safety and crash outcomes in cars, street bikes, rally bike racing and now supercross.
Like in the Dakar and in MotoGP this should be compulsory in any professional supercross race.
Anyone arguing against it can only argue semantics and whether or not every injury in every scenario will be absolutely stopped 100%. The answer is ‘it won’t and helmets don’t stop all head injuries but they stop a fuck load and are compulsory, this should be the same’
Well said, I bet eventually they will be mandatory but it will take some years to get there. In MotoGP Dainese and Alpinestars developed the tech since about 2008, then it was made available to competitors so that other riders could keep their sponsorship with another company while wearing Alpinestars or Dainese airbag under their regular suit (modified to fit this).
Airbags became mandatory in MotoGP (and Moto3 and Moto2) in 2018. By that time, Dainese and Alpinestars had a decade of experience with MotoGP riders, other brands had had time to catch up and were well on their way to develop and certify their own tech.
The argument that if it was safer all pro riders would be using it is ludicrous. The tech effectiveness had been well demonstrated by 2018 with drastic reduction in upper body injuries but some top MotoGP riders were still choosing to not use it simply because they favored ultimate performance (did not like the moderate extra bulk and weight) over their own safety. Even after they became mandatory, a world champion had been reportedly faking it by wearing a suit with the airbag light on but without any actual airbag in it just because he didn't have the same feeling with it.
We got ours as well. 100% agree with your take. Crazy how you feel the weight when you pick it up but super comfortable and you don’t notice it at all while it on. We got a medium and a large and honestly there’s not much difference. My son is 6’ 180 and I’m 6’ 185 and we both agreed we could wear either one. The medium was a bit more snug in the shoulder area but I actually kind of liked that. It kind of makes since as our A4 chest protectors were a M/L. Now I just have to learn a bit more about removing the airbag and fiddling with the electronics part yet.
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