Health insurance legal questionaire?

10/30/2023 7:31pm

I guess I’m lucky… my insurance has never sent me anything. They’ve paid out a few Million on my policy, which is covered through my union. I have to qualify for benefits, which I’ve done every year, since I got in the union. 
I’ve been hospitalized with major injuries and spent several months in the hospital over the last 40 years of having my health insurance. (Motion Picture Blue Cross/ Blue Shield)

I’m very fortunate to have a $5.00 co-pay per Dr visit and a maximum out of pocket of $3000 a year. I average $500-$1000 a year with anesthesiologist being $150 per event (colonoscopies/ epidurals) (as well as co-pays/ prescriptions) everything else is covered 100%. 
 

Although I have been injured on my motorcycle in the past, it’s that damn MTB that seems to cause the serious crashes. Lol

I'm blown away what my friends have to pay for their medical for their families, I definitely take it for granted, since I’ve always had it…. My contractor friends are paying $2500 a month to get a fraction of the policy ! 

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rdbs505
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Conroe, TX, USA
10/31/2023 12:29am

Thanks to everyone for their experiences/insight, I appreciate it! Said form states that it is required under the plan to furnish this information, otherwise it may result in rejection of claim for benefits. I find this strange as its showing that almost all of the bills have already been paid.

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rdbs505
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10/31/2023 12:32am
PFitzG38 wrote:
Sounds like the intake doctors may have misheard you when you said you crashed on your Mountain Bike. They are def trying to get out of...

Sounds like the intake doctors may have misheard you when you said you crashed on your Mountain Bike. They are def trying to get out of paying. some policies don’t pay if it’s an organized race - practice is ok. Some don’t pay if your on a purpose built track. Some don’t pay if you’re on a MC….period. I’ve never said I was on my motorcycle except if I got carted in on a gurney. As far as all the urgent care X-ray tech and ER nurses in my area know I am very clumsy on my skateboard and mtb. Read your EOB very carefully and you’ll find the exclusion. If you can’t find your EOB ask for it or figure out how to download it

Thanks! Surprisingly, I couldn't find anything under the exclusions section regarding dirtbikes, mountainbikes, or any of the like. It was 130+ pages of legal crap so I suppose it is likely I missed it. 

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rdbs505
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10/31/2023 12:41am
I had the questionnaire after my last crash (practice track), I filled it out, and it has been absolute hell for the last 2 years. Insurance...

I had the questionnaire after my last crash (practice track), I filled it out, and it has been absolute hell for the last 2 years. Insurance wouldn't budge until it was filled out, and they have sent it over and over saying they haven't received it. They've told the hospital they can't do anything until they receive it.

 

Very annoying because for some reason my insurance company to this day thinks it was a street bike accident

Sorry to hear that, what a nightmare. As I'm reading through over 100 pages of legal mumbo jumbo, I'm just thinking what a clown show dealing with all this.

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The Shop

rdbs505
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10/31/2023 12:53am
Falcon wrote:
Listen carefully: the insurance company is not your friend.  They can and will do anything they can to deny your claim. Don't lie, but do not...

Listen carefully: the insurance company is not your friend. 

They can and will do anything they can to deny your claim. Don't lie, but do not give them any more info than is truly necessary: you fell. (True.) While outdoors. (True.) And received scrapes, bruising, broken bones, and/or other injuries. (True.)  

The truth is, they have already calculated your likelihood of getting injured and they charge you insurance premiums for that. You've paid your part, now make them pay theirs. 

Thanks, yep I agree. This is what I was thinking, being honest but just keeping it real vague and hope it gets passed along. Honestly with what I have, I'm surprised they would waste their time it is probably <7K. I'd think that would be crumbs for a insurance company but what do I know.

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oceantrav
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Tarpon Springs, FL, USA
10/31/2023 4:54am

I have Tricare from being in the military for insurance 

 

every-time my kids or I end up injured from a “accident” the insurance sends the form asking where/how the injury occurred. If you don’t fill it out they don’t pay.

 

I always describe how we wrecked a bicycle on the public road. Doubt they would ever go after the track, don’t need to chance it though 

 

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kage173
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10/31/2023 5:14am
Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still...

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still break multiple bones, get a free helicopter ride to the hospital and get operated on with no worries of paying for it or not telling anyone what I've done. I've even shown the doctors and nurses videos of why I'm there before now.

I'm currently driving my van with the bike in the back through Europe and I'm even covered for free for emergency care here too. The only place I need insurance is through West Africa!

Yeah its a free helicopter. Free healthcare. Free lunch.

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ToolMaker
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10/31/2023 6:17am
disbanded wrote:

Esquire here, don't tell em nothing!

I see what you did there.

Don't, nothing, cya

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ToolMaker
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10/31/2023 6:26am

Insurance companies are slime. It really depends on how much they had to pay. Up to a certain #, it's cheaper to pay and move on,  above that they want to see if they can get reimbursed from another insurance company. Land owner? Given the choice, you always ride on public land right? Of course that's after you caught up on home maintenance where you might have fallen off the leaky roof you were fixing. But then they may look to your home owners policy. Unless it was an extended hospital stay, it's probably not worth their time to get in the weeds.

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early
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10/31/2023 6:33am
Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still...

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still break multiple bones, get a free helicopter ride to the hospital and get operated on with no worries of paying for it or not telling anyone what I've done. I've even shown the doctors and nurses videos of why I'm there before now.

I'm currently driving my van with the bike in the back through Europe and I'm even covered for free for emergency care here too. The only place I need insurance is through West Africa!

kage173 wrote:

Yeah its a free helicopter. Free healthcare. Free lunch.

Yeah, it's not like the cost of motorcycle accidents isn't socialized here thru insurance. Once the ACA is repealed insurance companies will be able to deny claims for anything they want. 

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Hammer 663s
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10/31/2023 8:31am Edited Date/Time 10/31/2023 8:35am

I get that form after every injury treated at hospital. I am very aware of the liability public and private track owners can face in these situations. So somehow it seems to usually be a ladder, or a fall while playing with the kids/grandkids that gets me. Once I even went home to change first before heading to the ER. 

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captmoto
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10/31/2023 8:46am

Never had a problem. My plan was considered a Cadillac plan though. 

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drewis
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10/31/2023 10:51am

I’ve had a few bicycle accidents, a few skateboarding accidents, even fallen off some ladders. 
 

I have only had one motorcycle accident (wink wink) and the paramedics had to cut my gear off. 
 

Guess which accident got a questionnaire. 
 

Who, what, why, where, and when?  

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FreshTopEnd
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10/31/2023 10:56am
This just sums up how fucked your medical system is over there. actually one of the private hospitals where I live you get a discount on...

This just sums up how fucked your medical system is over there.

actually one of the private hospitals where I live you get a discount on sporting injuries if it’s club affiliated or you can use the public system for free 

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still...

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still break multiple bones, get a free helicopter ride to the hospital and get operated on with no worries of paying for it or not telling anyone what I've done. I've even shown the doctors and nurses videos of why I'm there before now.

I'm currently driving my van with the bike in the back through Europe and I'm even covered for free for emergency care here too. The only place I need insurance is through West Africa!

Health care is never free; you're paying for it on the front end through taxes in a govt system , not at time of treatment.  Private insurance does the same thing with up-front premiums.  And no one gets free health care at work; your employer pays for it and there is less left for you and your check.

The issue here is can you get insurance.  

And then will the insurance cover you.  That last issue can be an issue in government based health care systems. 

NY Cartoon

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j368
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10/31/2023 2:47pm
This just sums up how fucked your medical system is over there. actually one of the private hospitals where I live you get a discount on...

This just sums up how fucked your medical system is over there.

actually one of the private hospitals where I live you get a discount on sporting injuries if it’s club affiliated or you can use the public system for free 

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still...

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still break multiple bones, get a free helicopter ride to the hospital and get operated on with no worries of paying for it or not telling anyone what I've done. I've even shown the doctors and nurses videos of why I'm there before now.

I'm currently driving my van with the bike in the back through Europe and I'm even covered for free for emergency care here too. The only place I need insurance is through West Africa!

Don’t you guys pay about the equivalent of $9.00 a gallon for gas too, as well as vat on everything too? All those taxes help pay for the free medical care. Seems like everything in the UK is at least double the cost of what it’s worth. Just saying 

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10/31/2023 3:14pm
This just sums up how fucked your medical system is over there. actually one of the private hospitals where I live you get a discount on...

This just sums up how fucked your medical system is over there.

actually one of the private hospitals where I live you get a discount on sporting injuries if it’s club affiliated or you can use the public system for free 

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still...

Pretty shocking really for someone that's never had to worry about stuff like that. Even though the UK health service is being gutted you could still break multiple bones, get a free helicopter ride to the hospital and get operated on with no worries of paying for it or not telling anyone what I've done. I've even shown the doctors and nurses videos of why I'm there before now.

I'm currently driving my van with the bike in the back through Europe and I'm even covered for free for emergency care here too. The only place I need insurance is through West Africa!

j368 wrote:
Don’t you guys pay about the equivalent of $9.00 a gallon for gas too, as well as vat on everything too? All those taxes help pay...

Don’t you guys pay about the equivalent of $9.00 a gallon for gas too, as well as vat on everything too? All those taxes help pay for the free medical care. Seems like everything in the UK is at least double the cost of what it’s worth. Just saying 

Just did a quick calculation and looks like it's around 7 dollars per US gallon over here for fuel. You guys definitely have cheap fuel that I'm jealous of, although our vehicles seem to get far better mpg.

Our taxes do go towards it yeah and I'm the first one to admit that our system in the UK is slowly breaking, but unfortunately that's due to the people that run the country, a common story all over the world. The good thing we have is that for me I've quit work to travel full time and still have access to healthcare despite not actively paying anything for it for the foreseeable future, but yes I did pay the tax on all the money I earned whilst saving.

I looked into moving to the US a few years ago and the cost of living is actually very similar, ultimately it's slightly cheaper in the UK as the cost of groceries is very high in the US, as well as used vehicles compared to what we would pay. Other things like fuel as you mentioned are significantly cheaper in the US. Of course it's difficult to realistically quantify as the cost of living in New York is very different to rural Oklahoma just as London is completely different to rural Wales

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cadedutt
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10/31/2023 10:51pm
I always just claim a solo mountain bike crash unless I arrive at the hospital by ambulance from a track, then I got hurt practicing, but...

I always just claim a solo mountain bike crash unless I arrive at the hospital by ambulance from a track, then I got hurt practicing, but never racing.

i got hurt last summer and was taken to the hospital by ambulance.  I broke a few ribs and spinous processes.  There is nothing they can do for any of that, so I was released in about 3 hours.  Even though they did absolutely nothing but pump me full of 3 types of pain killers that caused me to puke constantly on the drive home, they still billed my insurance company for well over $50k.  I wasn’t going to give them any ammo that might allow them to deny the claim.

I second this. I have always been told, and I have always said it was a MTB crash to avoid this

ns503
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11/1/2023 2:35am

Cats. Cats are the worst.

They can come out of nowhere at any time, trip you up, and take you down. Into even more hurt. Really bad if they do it at the top of some stairs. Or in front of some big rocks.

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NSP139
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11/1/2023 5:46am
I always just claim a solo mountain bike crash unless I arrive at the hospital by ambulance from a track, then I got hurt practicing, but...

I always just claim a solo mountain bike crash unless I arrive at the hospital by ambulance from a track, then I got hurt practicing, but never racing.

i got hurt last summer and was taken to the hospital by ambulance.  I broke a few ribs and spinous processes.  There is nothing they can do for any of that, so I was released in about 3 hours.  Even though they did absolutely nothing but pump me full of 3 types of pain killers that caused me to puke constantly on the drive home, they still billed my insurance company for well over $50k.  I wasn’t going to give them any ammo that might allow them to deny the claim.

cadedutt wrote:

I second this. I have always been told, and I have always said it was a MTB crash to avoid this

My last two surgeries were from mountain bikes and I received letters on both ignored them the insurance company actually called me. Just had to explain that I fell over on a bicycle all by myself LOL

rdbs505
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11/1/2023 5:54am
I always just claim a solo mountain bike crash unless I arrive at the hospital by ambulance from a track, then I got hurt practicing, but...

I always just claim a solo mountain bike crash unless I arrive at the hospital by ambulance from a track, then I got hurt practicing, but never racing.

i got hurt last summer and was taken to the hospital by ambulance.  I broke a few ribs and spinous processes.  There is nothing they can do for any of that, so I was released in about 3 hours.  Even though they did absolutely nothing but pump me full of 3 types of pain killers that caused me to puke constantly on the drive home, they still billed my insurance company for well over $50k.  I wasn’t going to give them any ammo that might allow them to deny the claim.

cadedutt wrote:

I second this. I have always been told, and I have always said it was a MTB crash to avoid this

NSP139 wrote:
My last two surgeries were from mountain bikes and I received letters on both ignored them the insurance company actually called me. Just had to explain...

My last two surgeries were from mountain bikes and I received letters on both ignored them the insurance company actually called me. Just had to explain that I fell over on a bicycle all by myself LOL

Yea the cats outta the bag on that, they know I was riding a "motorbike" .

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eeazye
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11/1/2023 6:25am
cadedutt wrote:

I second this. I have always been told, and I have always said it was a MTB crash to avoid this

NSP139 wrote:
My last two surgeries were from mountain bikes and I received letters on both ignored them the insurance company actually called me. Just had to explain...

My last two surgeries were from mountain bikes and I received letters on both ignored them the insurance company actually called me. Just had to explain that I fell over on a bicycle all by myself LOL

rdbs505 wrote:

Yea the cats outta the bag on that, they know I was riding a "motorbike" .

You sure they didn’t misunderstand when you said you were “motor boating?” 

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captmoto
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11/1/2023 7:49am

I had to have 3-4 stitches in my finger once, cut while DIY repairing a washing machine. I got a letter asking if it was done while working. I checked the box, sent it back in and never heard back from them. If you say you fell off a ladder you will get the same questionnaire, is this accident work related?

 

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KHNC
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11/1/2023 8:22am

My son broke his ankle on my bike back in May. He was riding on a single track trail in the Mountains, therefore, it was a "mountain bike" accident. He got the same form from insurance a few weeks later. Filled it out as a Mountain Bike injury. Also, I have been an agent for 32 years. I agree with the "throw it away" comment as well. Not much they can do about. The health insurance policy doesnt have a motorcycle injury exclusion listed. They will have a tough time not paying if it went to court. 

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731chopper
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11/1/2023 12:06pm

Whoever said this is the greatest threat to the future of our sport hit the nail on the head.
 

Think about how many times you and people you know have been hurt and how much it cost - what the insurance paid. Now think about how much your other healthcare costs like doctor visits and medications that your insurance pays for each year. Now think about what you pay for your insurance. It isn’t sustainable. For the most part diseases, illnesses and freak accidents are unforeseen events that we don’t have much control over. Getting on a motorcycle and choosing to do a very dangerous activity is avoidable so why would anyone want to underwrite that risk? 

FreshTopEnd
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11/1/2023 12:20pm
731chopper wrote:
Whoever said this is the greatest threat to the future of our sport hit the nail on the head.   Think about how many times you...

Whoever said this is the greatest threat to the future of our sport hit the nail on the head.
 

Think about how many times you and people you know have been hurt and how much it cost - what the insurance paid. Now think about how much your other healthcare costs like doctor visits and medications that your insurance pays for each year. Now think about what you pay for your insurance. It isn’t sustainable. For the most part diseases, illnesses and freak accidents are unforeseen events that we don’t have much control over. Getting on a motorcycle and choosing to do a very dangerous activity is avoidable so why would anyone want to underwrite that risk? 

Why it's underwritten may turn on whether you are on a group plan or have an individual plan, and what regulators require of policies.  The exclusions for risky sports/activities more typically attach to life and disability policies.  

That said, there was a member here, Dirt Diggers guy if I recall, that had real issues with the fiduciaries running his union health plan denying coverage on some pretty bad racing injuries.  So, it's good to know what's covered.

zookrider62!
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11/1/2023 12:25pm
731chopper wrote:
Whoever said this is the greatest threat to the future of our sport hit the nail on the head.   Think about how many times you...

Whoever said this is the greatest threat to the future of our sport hit the nail on the head.
 

Think about how many times you and people you know have been hurt and how much it cost - what the insurance paid. Now think about how much your other healthcare costs like doctor visits and medications that your insurance pays for each year. Now think about what you pay for your insurance. It isn’t sustainable. For the most part diseases, illnesses and freak accidents are unforeseen events that we don’t have much control over. Getting on a motorcycle and choosing to do a very dangerous activity is avoidable so why would anyone want to underwrite that risk? 

Is it that much more dangerous than football, hockey, or driving your car?

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Hammer 663s
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11/1/2023 12:57pm Edited Date/Time 11/1/2023 12:59pm
731chopper wrote:
Whoever said this is the greatest threat to the future of our sport hit the nail on the head.   Think about how many times you...

Whoever said this is the greatest threat to the future of our sport hit the nail on the head.
 

Think about how many times you and people you know have been hurt and how much it cost - what the insurance paid. Now think about how much your other healthcare costs like doctor visits and medications that your insurance pays for each year. Now think about what you pay for your insurance. It isn’t sustainable. For the most part diseases, illnesses and freak accidents are unforeseen events that we don’t have much control over. Getting on a motorcycle and choosing to do a very dangerous activity is avoidable so why would anyone want to underwrite that risk? 

Is it that much more dangerous than football, hockey, or driving your car?

Just based on personal experience in 40+ years of riding, I'd have to say yes, it is. Maybe not technically "more dangerous" but the constancy of your exposure to high risk is far more and IMHO there are many outside factors that increase the likelihood of an incident above other sports.

I haven't played hockey, but have done the other 2 at modestly high levels, and I've been hurt more and more badly by moto than the others combined. And it's a very rare race weekend that someone isn't injured at the tracks we frequent. We race a LOT too and I spend almost every weekend at a track somewhere. By injured I mean concussion or broken bone, ER visit stuff. As a parent of a fast kid I know the fear of late day motos on gnarly tracks. We are squishy sacks of meat not designed to impact hard objects with any real force. I know that in seconds a life-altering event can occur. Love/hate this sport.

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731chopper
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11/1/2023 1:20pm

Is it that much more dangerous than football, hockey, or driving your car?

You don't think motocross is astronomically more dangerous than any other stick and ball sport out there? The injuries in motocross can be absolutely catastrophic and I believe if an actuary looked at the injury rate and degree of injuries in this sport, they'd exclude it from coverage. Of course these are just my personal thoughts but I do believe we've gotten as far as we have because we're a small, niche sport most people don't know about so we've flown under the radar.

zookrider62!
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11/1/2023 1:28pm

Is it that much more dangerous than football, hockey, or driving your car?

731chopper wrote:
You don't think motocross is astronomically more dangerous than any other stick and ball sport out there? The injuries in motocross can be absolutely catastrophic and...

You don't think motocross is astronomically more dangerous than any other stick and ball sport out there? The injuries in motocross can be absolutely catastrophic and I believe if an actuary looked at the injury rate and degree of injuries in this sport, they'd exclude it from coverage. Of course these are just my personal thoughts but I do believe we've gotten as far as we have because we're a small, niche sport most people don't know about so we've flown under the radar.

the last part that you wrote is what I meant in my initial post, I did a poor job of explaining. Of course on a single person basis, moto would be more dangerous than football. As a general population, are more people going to the ER for football, or for motocross

truck
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11/1/2023 2:13pm

ER visit and follow up for an ACL or broken bone are peanuts compared to one big get off with liver laceration and dropped lung and a trip or two to the OR and several days in ICU after the helicopter ride from the track. There are very few other activities that expose the body to the kind of velocity and impacts that moto does.

I do tend to believe the fear that people have about moto not being covered or this being some big secret that insurance companies don't know about are very overblown, and I'll tell you why. They still cover street bike injuries and those are more brutal and far far more frequent. Riding on the street is also entirely elective, lot of states don't have helmet laws, and health insurance still pays when drunk uncle Larry can't hold the curve on his Harley and bounces his head off the guardrail and never lives a normal life again. Moto isn't really even a blip on their radar as far as it being worth excluding. The stuff we're talking about in this thread is just about trying to get some other insurance company to chip in. 

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