Opinion on future e-bike racing

10/6/2023 1:51pm
You just have a portable battery bank.  Charge at home or Solar etc.  Pretty simple solution besides generators running.    Also, orange extension cord can work...

You just have a portable battery bank. 
Charge at home or Solar etc. 

Pretty simple solution besides generators running. 
 

Also, orange extension cord can work to. 🙃

There is a powertool company that has a DC fast charge setup for Professional lawn care equipment that has a system like that. And it can charge way faster than an outlet.  Its a sister company to Cat power tools. And it charges  the tool batteries in minutes. I've posted about it on here before.  There is a Youtube channel that has been documenting their use of the first generation of those tools without showing any branding or saying what brand the tools were until recently. They just came out th the faster charging setup last year or so. 

I think that those setups will cost more all at once than a generator and gassing it up. But it could charge much faster so it might be worth it for that alone. For the people who want it.

 

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10/6/2023 2:08pm

Sounds less noisy than tracks are now.

If we'd been on electric motocross bikes all along, think how many tracks would still be open that were closed due to noise.

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ando
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10/6/2023 2:12pm

50-100 bikes at a race meet or track day that make over 100dB running around on the track or just revving/warming up in the pit areas and you are worried about generators that barely make 60dB and are probably twice as efficient with fuel use and therefore heat/fume generation?

 

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CrashMaster01
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10/6/2023 2:23pm

The manufacturer’s can try but if the core of the sport don’t give in and buy these electric bikes than the manufacturer’s will be forced to stop making them. I for one never want to see electric bikes take over. How boring the sport would become…

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The Shop

ando
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10/6/2023 2:26pm
crt32 wrote:
I can't have a serious discussion with someone who thinks battery prices are going down or solar panels at a track are the answer. Or thinking...

I can't have a serious discussion with someone who thinks battery prices are going down or solar panels at a track are the answer. Or thinking a company like FMF can just transition to software. 

 

devotid wrote:
This.^ Its so tiring... Its always the same story too. People that have never ran a business or even a book club are going to tell...

This.^ Its so tiring...

Its always the same story too. People that have never ran a business or even a book club are going to tell 30 year business owners how to "adapt or die". 

"Just change from everything you have ever known... its super easy and its something you can just "write off right?""

I own an Talaria Sting MX4 and it AMAZING... but it is by no means the answer for rural outdoor moto racing.

Well the change is coming whether anyone likes it or not.  It will change the landscape of aftermarket component and service providers.

Tyres, wheels, suspension, handle bars, controls, chains, sprockets, plastics plus rider protection and apparel will continue largely unchanged.  Engine, clutch/transmission and exhaust manufacturers will have to adapt or die; that’s just a reality.  Some will adapt, some will disappear and other new ones will emerge in their place.

However this change is not sudden and unforeseen.  Plenty of time to plan for it.

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ando
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10/6/2023 2:29pm
The manufacturer’s can try but if the core of the sport don’t give in and buy these electric bikes than the manufacturer’s will be forced to...

The manufacturer’s can try but if the core of the sport don’t give in and buy these electric bikes than the manufacturer’s will be forced to stop making them. I for one never want to see electric bikes take over. How boring the sport would become…

Those people won’t be the core of the sport anymore.  

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TeamGreen
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10/6/2023 2:34pm
You just have a portable battery bank.  Charge at home or Solar etc.  Pretty simple solution besides generators running.    Also, orange extension cord can work...

You just have a portable battery bank. 
Charge at home or Solar etc. 

Pretty simple solution besides generators running. 
 

Also, orange extension cord can work to. 🙃

Wait a second? Charging a battery from…A BATTERY!
What is this dark-web-trickery you are discussing? 

Laughing

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10/6/2023 2:35pm Edited Date/Time 10/6/2023 3:37pm
The manufacturer’s can try but if the core of the sport don’t give in and buy these electric bikes than the manufacturer’s will be forced to...

The manufacturer’s can try but if the core of the sport don’t give in and buy these electric bikes than the manufacturer’s will be forced to stop making them. I for one never want to see electric bikes take over. How boring the sport would become…

As soon as they start winning races on a local or even national level, then they will start selling. Wink and everyone will think they need one to win. 

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10/6/2023 2:55pm
You just have a portable battery bank.  Charge at home or Solar etc.  Pretty simple solution besides generators running.    Also, orange extension cord can work...

You just have a portable battery bank. 
Charge at home or Solar etc. 

Pretty simple solution besides generators running. 
 

Also, orange extension cord can work to. 🙃

TeamGreen wrote:
Wait a second? Charging a battery from…A BATTERY! What is this dark-web-trickery you are discussing? 

Wait a second? Charging a battery from…A BATTERY!
What is this dark-web-trickery you are discussing? 

Laughing

Obviously you charge the charging battery at home via grid or solar.

But this is what I was talking about This company and CAT power tools  are connected.

They charge from 0 to 100% in 8 minutes and do not need to cool between cycles. and get 3000 charge cycles  even charging at such a high speed.   

https://www.kress.com/en-us/8-minute-fastest-battery-charge/

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10/6/2023 2:59pm

Here is my EV bike honest prediction:

They'll get traction for popularity because they're new and still virtually non-existent.

They'll grow fast right away because they're now "available".

Regular weekend warriors will lose interest because there's no engine sound. All that's left is the annoying sounds of your suspension, chain slapping, and tires hitting the ground.

It will never gain enough popularity to make a thriving Pro-level class championship.

The cost of that $13K EV-MX bike already makes other bikes seem cheap. And people can barely afford the bikes at $8-10K..

Charging won't progress or be fast enough to make sense on race day.

The EV racing will only reach local level racing, unless FIM says "we can host the first MXGP MXE championship". Does it 2 year with terrible reviews / feedback, and leaves EV's entirely.

My timeline prediction for rise and fall of EV-MX: 4 years.

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Dave v3.0
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10/6/2023 3:18pm
Nairb#70 wrote:

Is that Gatorback in the O.P.'s original post?

Yes, what's left of it since the elevator was bulldozed and layout beyond the pit changed.Unsure

Dave v3.0
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10/6/2023 3:21pm

Sounds less noisy than tracks are now.

If we'd been on electric motocross bikes all along, think how many tracks would still be open that were closed due to noise.

None. 

They would have been closed due to dust, erosion, rider injury, traffic congestion, undesirable people, etc.

The NIMBYs are Fun Police.  They always find a way.

And they won't slow down when every bike is electric...

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Magoofan
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10/6/2023 3:22pm

I know I can't wait for the sound of clacking chains and  Wrrrr....wrrrr....wrrrr of the motor.       The excitement will be uncontainable.

 

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Magoofan
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10/6/2023 3:27pm

Sounds less noisy than tracks are now.

If we'd been on electric motocross bikes all along, think how many tracks would still be open that were closed due to noise.

Dave v3.0 wrote:
None.  They would have been closed due to dust, erosion, rider injury, traffic congestion, undesirable people, etc. The NIMBYs are Fun Police.  They always find a...

None. 

They would have been closed due to dust, erosion, rider injury, traffic congestion, undesirable people, etc.

The NIMBYs are Fun Police.  They always find a way.

And they won't slow down when every bike is electric...

Yup.  It's not just the noise.  We're "damaging" the delicate environment...lol.

Delusional thinking that it's going to get friendlier with the enviro whackos...

 

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AH387
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10/6/2023 4:00pm
I would argue that there will be a bigger number of aftermarket companies that pop up or come from other sectors.  If a lot of EMX...

I would argue that there will be a bigger number of aftermarket companies that pop up or come from other sectors.  If a lot of EMX bikes are being bought.   Most people would love to have an MX bike with all the trick cool parts on them. People with Dirtbikes are used to working on them. There will be less that is needed to do to EMX bikes between rides. So people will buy stuff to change the looks or performance in different ways. Look at all the crap You can buy for a cell phone. Or tool boxes.Or just about anything. If there are large numbers of anything being sold, there will be many companies making stuff to customize that item. 

 

No engine mods, no clutch and no pipes.    Mapping would be the similar thing for an EMX bike at the start. But motor mods could still be a thing, and as more is learned about how electric and MX mix, there will be more areas for custom stuff.  Perhaps moto builders will shift towards building high performance batteries.    

EMX bikes will still have many parts that are similar to gas bikes.  

And lets not forget that UFO started to make fresh runs of plastic for bikes back into the 80's. Vintco , and company that makes OEM style parts for older bikes was started. there will still be a demand for gas bikes and parts no matter how much better the EMX bikes are. People still enjoy driving Horse and buggies, 1800's cars and motorcycles, etc. That demand may decrease. or might increase if the doom and gloom of electric is true.  

I just don't see that. Sure there will still be parts and customization but not to the same degree. If a Stark can go from 10hp to 80hp and all various different maps and engine brake etc, you have more than you ever had right at your finger tips. And that is super cool, don't get me wrong. But thinking of the brands that I have used on my personal bike just to get a hp or 2 here or there or to slightly change how it runs. I think the industry will take a bit of a hit there. Not saying it will collapse but it could hurt it. 

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JM485
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10/6/2023 4:01pm
You just have a portable battery bank.  Charge at home or Solar etc.  Pretty simple solution besides generators running.    Also, orange extension cord can work...

You just have a portable battery bank. 
Charge at home or Solar etc. 

Pretty simple solution besides generators running. 
 

Also, orange extension cord can work to. 🙃

This.

 

That’s my plan, battery bank in the van with a solar panel to charge them for free during the week, it’s more up front cost but it will amortize over the years.

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10/6/2023 4:32pm

Sounds less noisy than tracks are now.

If we'd been on electric motocross bikes all along, think how many tracks would still be open that were closed due to noise.

There is not one track in the state where I live that has been closed due to noise in my life time. We have more tracks now then ever before. Land cost, zoning, dust and traffic control will get one shut down or prevent one from opening. Any tracks that were effected from noise would have been sold off for development by now anyway. 

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yzr250r
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10/6/2023 4:43pm

A dirt bike has to have a clutch to be able to do the proper technique to be faster! 

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early
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10/6/2023 5:34pm

81qjg4.jpg?VersionId=Futtfql6FDTitO274v7y5KKUKZJR

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10/6/2023 5:48pm
I would argue that there will be a bigger number of aftermarket companies that pop up or come from other sectors.  If a lot of EMX...

I would argue that there will be a bigger number of aftermarket companies that pop up or come from other sectors.  If a lot of EMX bikes are being bought.   Most people would love to have an MX bike with all the trick cool parts on them. People with Dirtbikes are used to working on them. There will be less that is needed to do to EMX bikes between rides. So people will buy stuff to change the looks or performance in different ways. Look at all the crap You can buy for a cell phone. Or tool boxes.Or just about anything. If there are large numbers of anything being sold, there will be many companies making stuff to customize that item. 

 

No engine mods, no clutch and no pipes.    Mapping would be the similar thing for an EMX bike at the start. But motor mods could still be a thing, and as more is learned about how electric and MX mix, there will be more areas for custom stuff.  Perhaps moto builders will shift towards building high performance batteries.    

EMX bikes will still have many parts that are similar to gas bikes.  

And lets not forget that UFO started to make fresh runs of plastic for bikes back into the 80's. Vintco , and company that makes OEM style parts for older bikes was started. there will still be a demand for gas bikes and parts no matter how much better the EMX bikes are. People still enjoy driving Horse and buggies, 1800's cars and motorcycles, etc. That demand may decrease. or might increase if the doom and gloom of electric is true.  

AH387 wrote:
I just don't see that. Sure there will still be parts and customization but not to the same degree. If a Stark can go from 10hp...

I just don't see that. Sure there will still be parts and customization but not to the same degree. If a Stark can go from 10hp to 80hp and all various different maps and engine brake etc, you have more than you ever had right at your finger tips. And that is super cool, don't get me wrong. But thinking of the brands that I have used on my personal bike just to get a hp or 2 here or there or to slightly change how it runs. I think the industry will take a bit of a hit there. Not saying it will collapse but it could hurt it. 

Yes it will be different, but look at electric RC cars. there is still a million things you can buy to help finetune and make them faster and handle better.

450's already make more power than most people can really use. And yet the aftermarket still is surviving. Controlling the power to even finer degrees and tools and parts to do that .  I bet that  most aftermarket pipes are for weight loss and looks. Things that will still be needed on electric bikes. 

Look at what FMF and PC have grown into. They used to be just pipe companies and now they both have a wider range of products. 

 

IF electric MX bikes start to sell in higher numbers than what gas bikes currently sell, I bet that it would be like the MTB and UTV market is right now with new to the industry brands starting to offer parts and acc. If the market stays a similar size to what it is now, with a shift from gas to electric , then I bet it stays similar to how it is now as far as brands offering aftermarket items.  

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10/6/2023 5:53pm
GrapeApe wrote:
This is the point in the e-bike thread that some ol' boy posts that picture of a strip mine and cries "isn't anybody thinking about the...

This is the point in the e-bike thread that some ol' boy posts that picture of a strip mine and cries "isn't anybody thinking about the environment?" Go ahead, get it out of the way.

 

Who cares about the environment, this is a dirt bike forum, our nobbies cause erosion!

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10/6/2023 5:57pm
HonDawg17 wrote:
Here is my EV bike honest prediction: They'll get traction for popularity because they're new and still virtually non-existent. They'll grow fast right away because they're...

Here is my EV bike honest prediction:

They'll get traction for popularity because they're new and still virtually non-existent.

They'll grow fast right away because they're now "available".

Regular weekend warriors will lose interest because there's no engine sound. All that's left is the annoying sounds of your suspension, chain slapping, and tires hitting the ground.

It will never gain enough popularity to make a thriving Pro-level class championship.

The cost of that $13K EV-MX bike already makes other bikes seem cheap. And people can barely afford the bikes at $8-10K..

Charging won't progress or be fast enough to make sense on race day.

The EV racing will only reach local level racing, unless FIM says "we can host the first MXGP MXE championship". Does it 2 year with terrible reviews / feedback, and leaves EV's entirely.

My timeline prediction for rise and fall of EV-MX: 4 years.

"It will never gain enough popularity to make a thriving Pro-level class championship."

If Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki, Suzuki, KTM have electric motocross bikes to sell, they will advertise them by racing AMA Supercross and AMA Motocross.

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10/6/2023 5:58pm
yzr250r wrote:

A dirt bike has to have a clutch to be able to do the proper technique to be faster! 

Not with electric, the "proper technique" will evolve.

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yota
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10/6/2023 6:01pm

I've been to gncc's and other large offroad races and the generator fumes and noise at night jammed between the motorhomes and campers is awful.  add a bunch more charging bikes.  wonderful.

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Zycki11
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10/7/2023 6:40am

Sounds less noisy than tracks are now.

If we'd been on electric motocross bikes all along, think how many tracks would still be open that were closed due to noise.

Ok let’s try it the other way. If we had electric bikes all along, guess how many people wouldn’t be in the sport? You can’t erase history and rewrite your own script that suits your narrative. 
 

The truth about electric is that it will make our sport boring. Look no further than the E series in Indy. While some “tuners” may pop up, what most don’t realize is that it is limited outside of the normal hard parts and “programming”. 

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Zycki11
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10/7/2023 6:46am

Hey kids, look how exciting that bike that sounds like a bee is going around and around. I can’t tell how hard he is on the throttle because the chain is just as loud but look at him go. How exciting! I’m out when electric tries it’s hand. No longer hearing and feeling the excitement. I like to compare it to listening to music through your phone or through surround sound. 

 

Food for thought. Those dirt bikes are so noisy, we may as well start making all guitars acoustic because electric is damaging the environment by tapping the grids and also noise pollution. 

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mark_swart
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10/7/2023 7:41am Edited Date/Time 10/7/2023 7:42am
Itchy858 wrote:
When everyone has to race e-bikes in the near future, how are you going to feel about coming off a nice quiet e race, exhausted, hot...

When everyone has to race e-bikes in the near future, how are you going to feel about coming off a nice quiet e race, exhausted, hot, maybe frustrated about your finish or sore from a crash, to sit in your chair and try to relax before your next moto only to have the sound off hundreds of Fuel powered generators charging bikes and breathing the exhaust of them all crammed together Everywhere around you. Quiet track/race, extremely noisy hard to breathe pits. IMG 8616

What’s your thoughts?

True story - I was at a race last weekend at Nxt LVL 101 and the yahoo next to me was running a generator all day to power a stupid shop fan. On a beautiful 72 degree day with a light breeze. And to make it even better, the pits were wide open but he had to park right next to me and do this.

Generator noise has been here a long time, I don’t think e-bikes will make it any worse.

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Andrew314
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10/7/2023 7:43am

The climate change death cult are the most genocidal maniacs we’ve ever encountered. The death count will make Hitler, Mao, and Stalin look like child’s play. They will kill billions to “save the planet”. This whole move to electric will be the death of everything we love. 

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crt32
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10/7/2023 7:59am
Andrew314 wrote:
The climate change death cult are the most genocidal maniacs we’ve ever encountered. The death count will make Hitler, Mao, and Stalin look like child’s play...

The climate change death cult are the most genocidal maniacs we’ve ever encountered. The death count will make Hitler, Mao, and Stalin look like child’s play. They will kill billions to “save the planet”. This whole move to electric will be the death of everything we love. 

Electric is easier to control aka shut down. I wish people would see that. 

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davis224
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Fantasy
10/7/2023 8:14am Edited Date/Time 10/7/2023 8:16am
Andrew314 wrote:
The climate change death cult are the most genocidal maniacs we’ve ever encountered. The death count will make Hitler, Mao, and Stalin look like child’s play...

The climate change death cult are the most genocidal maniacs we’ve ever encountered. The death count will make Hitler, Mao, and Stalin look like child’s play. They will kill billions to “save the planet”. This whole move to electric will be the death of everything we love. 

crt32 wrote:

Electric is easier to control aka shut down. I wish people would see that. 

I see the argument for that, but few people also consider the fact that you can build your own generator and have electricity off grid. I can't refine crude oil into gasoline off grid. You're completely dependent on multiple governments for gas.

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