Deegan cutting the track in the supermini 1 moto 2 at the mini o's.

EngIceDave
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EngIceDave 12/2/2020 11:55am
12/2/2020 11:55am
Chris O'Neal wrote:
I just watched it over a few times and didn’t realize he came out in the top 3 on the start. After watching it I think...
I just watched it over a few times and didn’t realize he came out in the top 3 on the start. After watching it I think he definitely should of been penalized cause he didn’t really slow down enough and got a good start. If he had slowed up more and got a start like he should of gotten if there was banners there then I could see why they didn’t penalize him.
I’m really surprised they didn’t have banners there lining the start down to the first corner. Almost reminded me of when Chad Reed got that start by going on the grass in muddy Indiana race.
Goes to what I said earlier, he got out of it, but whether he got out of it enough is subjective.

Had he pinned it all the way down and around Gregg of Radmx, the video guy, I'd be all for a penalty.

But he did get out of it and rolled back in.

I believe it is clear it wasn't intentional
It is clear he got out of it
It is clear he didn't pin it through the off track area
He did re-enter at the next safe location
He re-entered the race


Call me crazy, but by the rules, seems he complied
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JBrockman856 12/2/2020 12:02pm
12/2/2020 12:02pm
JBrockman856 wrote:
I'm not voicing an opinion one way or the other but heres his position when he leaves the track vs. when he re-enters. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/12/02/463014/s1200_Leaves_Track.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/12/02/463015/s1200_Enters_Track.jpg[/img]
I'm not voicing an opinion one way or the other but heres his position when he leaves the track vs. when he re-enters.


yak651 wrote:
I'm not voicing an opinion,,,but if you are saying that he came back on the track in 2nd instead of 1st it's a-ok, you should stick...
I'm not voicing an opinion,,,but if you are saying that he came back on the track in 2nd instead of 1st it's a-ok, you should stick to not voicing your opinion...
Did I voice an opinion? Because it appears I posted two objective images that allow for the public to decide based on the AMA rule book.

I appreciate you speaking for me and making your own assumptions based on the images, but personally, I think he should have been penalized - now thats me voicing my opinion.
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Finnish_Flash_62 12/2/2020 12:54pm
12/2/2020 12:54pm
str8line wrote:
It's disheartening to see how many people on here are ok with this.
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old.

He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting worked up about this, especially considering no one on here really knows how this has been handled.
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Average Vitard 12/2/2020 1:11pm
12/2/2020 1:11pm
str8line wrote:
It's disheartening to see how many people on here are ok with this.
Finnish_Flash_62 wrote:
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old. He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting...
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old.

He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting worked up about this, especially considering no one on here really knows how this has been handled.
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why the ama/promoter didn't do anything after it was protested. Things like this make me question the legitimacy of the titles awarded. After seeing how he handled himself on and off the track I think the kid needs some type of discipline. (Not by the ama) But I don't expect that to happen being that "the deegan crew" is threatening people over the video. Its a sad situation either way you look at it and a loss for race fans that expect a fair and even race.
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numbers 12/2/2020 1:20pm
12/2/2020 1:20pm
str8line wrote:
It's disheartening to see how many people on here are ok with this.
Finnish_Flash_62 wrote:
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old. He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting...
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old.

He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting worked up about this, especially considering no one on here really knows how this has been handled.
Average Vitard wrote:
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why...
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why the ama/promoter didn't do anything after it was protested. Things like this make me question the legitimacy of the titles awarded. After seeing how he handled himself on and off the track I think the kid needs some type of discipline. (Not by the ama) But I don't expect that to happen being that "the deegan crew" is threatening people over the video. Its a sad situation either way you look at it and a loss for race fans that expect a fair and even race.
You sure know allot about the kid. Im wondering who was pointing the laser pen at him. The laser pen distracted him and caused the bobble.
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Finnish_Flash_62 12/2/2020 1:21pm
12/2/2020 1:21pm
str8line wrote:
It's disheartening to see how many people on here are ok with this.
Finnish_Flash_62 wrote:
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old. He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting...
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old.

He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting worked up about this, especially considering no one on here really knows how this has been handled.
Average Vitard wrote:
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why...
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why the ama/promoter didn't do anything after it was protested. Things like this make me question the legitimacy of the titles awarded. After seeing how he handled himself on and off the track I think the kid needs some type of discipline. (Not by the ama) But I don't expect that to happen being that "the deegan crew" is threatening people over the video. Its a sad situation either way you look at it and a loss for race fans that expect a fair and even race.
Not blaming you. But most of the ”conversation” in this thread hasn’t been about why the promoter didn’t do anything about it, which again I think they should have done. But that’s not your fault.
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Falcon
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Falcon 12/2/2020 1:27pm
12/2/2020 1:27pm
So, I re-watched the video, and I can easily concur that the kid made some soft of mistake which sent him off track. No problem there. He also didn't accelerate in an unsafe manner, but he sure didn't slow down a lot, either. He also didn't even look over his right shoulder when re-joining the track in front of several guys who were on track.

It's a tough call, but if the track officials knew about it and decided not to penalize him, that's it. It's "at the discretion of AMA officials," after all.
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Tbteam
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Tbteam 12/2/2020 1:30pm
12/2/2020 1:30pm
Tbteam wrote:
Finally watched the video. Two things: 1. He cut the track. 2. He was the fastest guy in the class. In the end, I'd bet the...
Finally watched the video. Two things:

1. He cut the track.

2. He was the fastest guy in the class.

In the end, I'd bet the factories couldn't care less if he won, really. It looks good for a print ad, but showing he's the fastest kid sets him up for a few years from now.
Quoting myself? Yes, please!

Instead of down voting me, can one of the 7 of you tell me where I'm in the wrong?

Thanks.
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Rickyisms 12/2/2020 1:40pm
12/2/2020 1:40pm Edited Date/Time 12/2/2020 1:43pm
On another note, what's up with that kid throwing his hands up at 1:27 after he falls? My dad would've kicked my ass if I pulled some shit like that.

EDIT: Looks like his bars and mounts got ripped off the top clamp? Never seen anything like that, I'd be pissed too.
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DonM
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DonM 12/2/2020 1:41pm
12/2/2020 1:41pm
Finnish_Flash_62 wrote:
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old. He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting...
And just as disheartening to see grown men going after a 13 year old.

He made a mistake absolutely but holy cow some people are getting worked up about this, especially considering no one on here really knows how this has been handled.
Average Vitard wrote:
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why...
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why the ama/promoter didn't do anything after it was protested. Things like this make me question the legitimacy of the titles awarded. After seeing how he handled himself on and off the track I think the kid needs some type of discipline. (Not by the ama) But I don't expect that to happen being that "the deegan crew" is threatening people over the video. Its a sad situation either way you look at it and a loss for race fans that expect a fair and even race.
numbers wrote:
You sure know allot about the kid. Im wondering who was pointing the laser pen at him. The laser pen distracted him and caused the bobble.
Like I said earlier in the thread....I believe this guy isn’t as innocent as he is trying to be...he signed up to post this...Now he has some more info on how Deegan handled himself off the track and he thinks the kid needs some discipline but he doesn’t expect that to happen because the Deegan crew is threatening people....sure is a lot of info for somebody that claims he’s not involved....Lik I said before it just feels a little fishy....amazed how many people are jumping on Deegan for a mistake and not on the AMA but whatever it’s just an amateur race...
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Johnny Ringo
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Johnny Ringo 12/2/2020 1:45pm
12/2/2020 1:45pm
I wonder if there are forums where adults abuse teenagers playing little league?
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numbers
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numbers 12/2/2020 1:53pm
12/2/2020 1:53pm
Johnny Ringo wrote:
I wonder if there are forums where adults abuse teenagers playing little league?
Thats a huge can of worms. My son still plays ball in college and ill tell you ive seen parents protest kids bats in tournaments and it gets ugly. Shaved bats are huge in the younger ages. Once you get to BBCore bats not so much. But a shaved drop 10 0r 13 gets parents fired up.
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TooTallJason
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TooTallJason 12/2/2020 1:54pm
12/2/2020 1:54pm Edited Date/Time 12/2/2020 1:55pm
Johnny Ringo wrote:
I wonder if there are forums where adults abuse teenagers playing little league?
I mean if you run out of the base-path you're out, so hopefully this conversation would be avoided in Little League.

Also go look at twitter or whatever from when Bryce Harper was a teenager. Definitely happens.
Average Vitard 12/2/2020 1:54pm
12/2/2020 1:54pm
Average Vitard wrote:
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why...
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why the ama/promoter didn't do anything after it was protested. Things like this make me question the legitimacy of the titles awarded. After seeing how he handled himself on and off the track I think the kid needs some type of discipline. (Not by the ama) But I don't expect that to happen being that "the deegan crew" is threatening people over the video. Its a sad situation either way you look at it and a loss for race fans that expect a fair and even race.
numbers wrote:
You sure know allot about the kid. Im wondering who was pointing the laser pen at him. The laser pen distracted him and caused the bobble.
DonM wrote:
Like I said earlier in the thread....I believe this guy isn’t as innocent as he is trying to be...he signed up to post this...Now he has...
Like I said earlier in the thread....I believe this guy isn’t as innocent as he is trying to be...he signed up to post this...Now he has some more info on how Deegan handled himself off the track and he thinks the kid needs some discipline but he doesn’t expect that to happen because the Deegan crew is threatening people....sure is a lot of info for somebody that claims he’s not involved....Lik I said before it just feels a little fishy....amazed how many people are jumping on Deegan for a mistake and not on the AMA but whatever it’s just an amateur race...
What am I guilty of besides hurting your feelings?
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fourfourone
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fourfourone 12/2/2020 1:57pm
12/2/2020 1:57pm
Its pretty crazy the amount of speculation here. Only issue I see is if the AMA didn't give out a punishment because of WHO the racer is.
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DonM
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DonM 12/2/2020 1:58pm
12/2/2020 1:58pm
numbers wrote:
You sure know allot about the kid. Im wondering who was pointing the laser pen at him. The laser pen distracted him and caused the bobble.
DonM wrote:
Like I said earlier in the thread....I believe this guy isn’t as innocent as he is trying to be...he signed up to post this...Now he has...
Like I said earlier in the thread....I believe this guy isn’t as innocent as he is trying to be...he signed up to post this...Now he has some more info on how Deegan handled himself off the track and he thinks the kid needs some discipline but he doesn’t expect that to happen because the Deegan crew is threatening people....sure is a lot of info for somebody that claims he’s not involved....Lik I said before it just feels a little fishy....amazed how many people are jumping on Deegan for a mistake and not on the AMA but whatever it’s just an amateur race...
Average Vitard wrote:
What am I guilty of besides hurting your feelings?
You’ve not hurt my feelings...I just don’t believe you’re as disconnected as you claim to be...you’ve done way more than just innocently point something out...
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Yeti831
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Yeti831 12/2/2020 2:03pm
12/2/2020 2:03pm
EngIceDave wrote:
Did you know that at one time the rule was you had to re-enter at the point you left the track? Circle back around to where...
Did you know that at one time the rule was you had to re-enter at the point you left the track?
Circle back around to where you went out.

And at the end of the day, the AMA implementing that rule will be the ONLY way to stop arguments or excuses when this happens.

Because judging by what is now going to be a classic Vital 10 pager, “re-entering at safest point, gaining no advantage, no off track acceleration” is clearly not working.

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Johnny Ringo
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Johnny Ringo 12/2/2020 2:10pm
12/2/2020 2:10pm
Johnny Ringo wrote:
I wonder if there are forums where adults abuse teenagers playing little league?
TooTallJason wrote:
I mean if you run out of the base-path you're out, so hopefully this conversation would be avoided in Little League. Also go look at twitter...
I mean if you run out of the base-path you're out, so hopefully this conversation would be avoided in Little League.

Also go look at twitter or whatever from when Bryce Harper was a teenager. Definitely happens.
Oh so it’s totally normal? Cool, carry on
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FLmxer
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FLmxer 12/2/2020 2:20pm
12/2/2020 2:20pm
Maybe the officials may have seen there was no intent to cheat and decided no penalty but now after seeing the angle where he came around in that turn in second I think he should of slowed way down or recieved some type of penalty subtracted from his time and that's his position. At first i only saw the incident and thought he came out in 8th or further. I grew up with the enter where you left era rule and it worked and you definately were penalized by how long it took to spin around. I think riding up the side of jumps and entering whoops from outside the track should of been and be excluded.
Hopefully its a learning experience now if nothing else.
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peltier626 12/2/2020 2:21pm
12/2/2020 2:21pm
3 more pages to go guys!
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Tracktor
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Tracktor 12/2/2020 2:22pm
12/2/2020 2:22pm
IHe looked to hit something that caused a bobble. That said, he could have hit the brakes & been stuck behind the pack but chose not to. Speculation is certain riders, especially in amateurs, know that most times things like this will be overlooked by promoters/sanctioning bodies because of who they are so take calculated risks like this.

That said, mainly exposes the sad truth of amateur sports - If this was some no name kid who ended up winning the moto after a start like this all of the big names in this class would be burning him at the stake, lol. It is what it is and will always be this way so if you want to chase the "white trash lottery" of Pro MX better get used to it or have deep pockets.

This is about $$ not rulebooks.............
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peltier626 12/2/2020 2:28pm
12/2/2020 2:28pm
Look, there is some obvious celebritism going on with the DEEGANS. We are all familiar with the story and lets just hope for this kids sake that he is not exploited and becomes over saturated as in "BELIEVE THE HYPE" 2.0. Once he hits the pro's he'll get quite the reality check. Either way the Deegans add quite the excitement and story line to this novelty sport/entertainment known as MOTO. 10 pages, we're almost there!
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numbers
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numbers 12/2/2020 2:35pm
12/2/2020 2:35pm
peltier626 wrote:
3 more pages to go guys!
Wait....is he a Free Mason. Explains everything 🤣
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Suicidal_Tendencies 12/2/2020 2:46pm
12/2/2020 2:46pm Edited Date/Time 12/2/2020 3:31pm
dkurtd wrote:
You obviously have been drinking to much Engine Ice, it has clouded your eyesight and judgement.
I think it's fine to disagree and voice your opinion, but I'm not a big fan of bringing someone's business into the discussion.
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RMT
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RMT 12/2/2020 2:47pm
12/2/2020 2:47pm Edited Date/Time 12/2/2020 2:57pm
EngIceDave wrote:
Goes to what I said earlier, he got out of it, but whether he got out of it enough is subjective. Had he pinned it all...
Goes to what I said earlier, he got out of it, but whether he got out of it enough is subjective.

Had he pinned it all the way down and around Gregg of Radmx, the video guy, I'd be all for a penalty.

But he did get out of it and rolled back in.

I believe it is clear it wasn't intentional
It is clear he got out of it
It is clear he didn't pin it through the off track area
He did re-enter at the next safe location
He re-entered the race


Call me crazy, but by the rules, seems he complied
I agree with everything you said except re-enter in the next safe location. If he let off the gas and braked a tiny bit, he could have veered right and went right back on the track. The 5 foot gap in the banners all the way around the first turn which is blocked by a cameraman is probably not the next safest place to enter the track. Problem is it would have resulted in a last place start.

Either way, I don't blame the kid, the rule needs to clear up what "gain an advantage" means. As it is, as long as the kid thinks he was in 3rd when he went off, and it looks like he was, he should be able to re-enter in 3rd.





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WFO
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WFO 12/2/2020 2:53pm
12/2/2020 2:53pm
gt80rider wrote:
Danger Boy is still, wait for it.... still a BOY! He is still learning the ropes of racing.... Now, when you see the big boys doing...
Danger Boy is still, wait for it.... still a BOY! He is still learning the ropes of racing....

Now, when you see the big boys doing it, the guys with 7 digits in their bank accounts, completely different story...
Its called CHEATING.
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EngIceDave
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EngIceDave 12/2/2020 2:56pm
12/2/2020 2:56pm
peltier626 wrote:
3 more pages to go guys!
I'm tryin!
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GrapeApe
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GrapeApe 12/2/2020 3:10pm
12/2/2020 3:10pm Edited Date/Time 12/2/2020 3:11pm
Average Vitard wrote:
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why...
My post wasn't made to go after a 14 year old 15 in a month. My post was made to get to the bottom of why the ama/promoter didn't do anything after it was protested. Things like this make me question the legitimacy of the titles awarded. After seeing how he handled himself on and off the track I think the kid needs some type of discipline. (Not by the ama) But I don't expect that to happen being that "the deegan crew" is threatening people over the video. Its a sad situation either way you look at it and a loss for race fans that expect a fair and even race.
How do you know it was protested, other than citing "allen05050" on instagram? Is that your sole source of information? Who is allen05050 and why is his word gospel?

You make reference to how he handled himself "off the track", please expound. What did he do "off the track" that would lead you to believe he needs "some type of discipline"?

What number was your son/friend in that race?
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numbers
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numbers 12/2/2020 3:23pm
12/2/2020 3:23pm
gt80rider wrote:
Danger Boy is still, wait for it.... still a BOY! He is still learning the ropes of racing.... Now, when you see the big boys doing...
Danger Boy is still, wait for it.... still a BOY! He is still learning the ropes of racing....

Now, when you see the big boys doing it, the guys with 7 digits in their bank accounts, completely different story...
WFO wrote:
Its called CHEATING.
Nobody's talking about him taking Casey out. Any good footage of that 🤣
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