Barcia

Huckster
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Huckster 2/9/2020 12:20pm
2/9/2020 12:20pm
slipdog wrote:
I've never been a Barcia fan, at all. I saw nothing wrong with the way he raced Tomac for position.
StartedTooLate wrote:
You don't get it then. Stupid and wrong are not the same thing. If you are a contender for a title, you can do neither. There...
You don't get it then. Stupid and wrong are not the same thing. If you are a contender for a title, you can do neither. There was indeed nothing "wrong" with what Barcia did...but it was stupid. He cost HIMSELF 3-4 seconds of traffic position because his ego got bruised. Wrong? No. Stupid? Yes. This is why Barcia will NEVER get close to a title.
Hey man just wondering if you feel the same about what AC did to Coop when he was trying to get around him?
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KHI Guy
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KHI Guy 2/9/2020 12:42pm
2/9/2020 12:42pm
westeast wrote:
If it's the last lap or two, sure, race Tomac like Barcia did. It wasn't though. Barcia should have accepted the pass and tried to latch...
If it's the last lap or two, sure, race Tomac like Barcia did. It wasn't though. Barcia should have accepted the pass and tried to latch on. Barcia is lucky Roczen didn't get by.
Rushton597 wrote:
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what...
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what you're saying is everyone should just let Tomac or whoever is behind them by?
That's what a lot of people in this thread seem to think. Huh
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Black Diesel Bomber 2/9/2020 1:05pm
2/9/2020 1:05pm
Black Diesel Bomber wrote:
For everyone not understanding why a lot of us think what Barcia did was stupid (not wrong) please see Cooper Webb’s podium interview: “I got to...
For everyone not understanding why a lot of us think what Barcia did was stupid (not wrong) please see Cooper Webb’s podium interview:


“I got to the lead early and then Adam made a good, aggressive move to the inside. I just kind of let him go. I knew the track was going to be hard to pass. I knew it was going to be a long Main. I tried to make a pass earlier, but we played a little cat and mouse which kind of allowed Blake to catch up and I didn’t want to do that”

Race Winner: Cooper Webb

If Webb would have instead pulled a Barcia and continued to play cat and mouse, who knows where both him and AC would have finished.

And how many other race winner interviews have you heard the winner say “I just settled in behind him”?

aeffertz wrote:
I don’t think it’s a fair comparison. Webb was faster then AC and was being held up, searching for a spot to make the pass and...
I don’t think it’s a fair comparison. Webb was faster then AC and was being held up, searching for a spot to make the pass and being patient.

Tomac was faster then Barcia and was being held up and forced passes instantly, which allowed Barcia to rebuttal instantly.

I haven’t seen a single comment complaining about AC “racing backwards” and he was brake checking and holding up Webb in numerous spots, taking his line away. Barcia was racing, simple as that. People start to involve their feelings towards a certain rider and change their narrative because they’re angry.
I don't think Barcia did anything wrong, but I think he did something stupid as in taking a potential podium opportunity off the table for himself. In my opinion Barcia short changed himself and here's why...

Like other's have pointed out Barcia only finished two seconds behind Tomac and he actually had a faster lap time than Tomac. With that said, Barcia had the speed to stay on Tomac's rear wheel and "settle in" for several laps until Tomac catches up to Baggett in 3rd. Once Tomac get's behind Baggett, Barcia's 2 sectond gap disappears and he's now on both of their rear wheels. Then Barcia has the opportunity to go all Bam Bam on both of them toward the end of the race and possibly finish in 3rd...

I like what Barcia does because it makes things exciting, but I think his timing was off. Follow Tomac until he gets slowed up behind Baggett and then pull your cat/mouse Bam Bam shit on both of them in the final laps and laugh all the way to the podium.

I believe Barcia's mentality might be different in that if he races hard like he did with Tomac his competitor might go down or lose several seconds, and then Barcia is granted his finishing position ahead of the downed rider.
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mxjon454
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mxjon454 2/9/2020 1:18pm
2/9/2020 1:18pm
It seems like Barcia would rather go backwards trying to keep a rider behind him and lose touch with the guys in front of him. He had to have lost 3-5 seconds on Baggett trying to keep Tomac behind him.
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kiwifan
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kiwifan 2/9/2020 1:36pm
2/9/2020 1:36pm
crowe176 wrote:
That’s probably how Roczen felt lol
kiwifan wrote:
This actually might be very true, it was clear to me Roczen was not going to risk Barcia...oh well, always next week!
ATKpilot99 wrote:
Why do people always think Roczen just settles for a position when he doesn't win ? He simply didn't have it last night. If he did...
Why do people always think Roczen just settles for a position when he doesn't win ? He simply didn't have it last night. If he did he passes Barcia. I watched the race today and I honestly don't see what the big deal is. It's not like Barcia put anyone on the ground. Once Tomac passed him the gaps between Tomac , Barcia, and Roczen stayed in the 2 second range. Barcia rode well.
you have your opinion I have mine, one of us might be right but we will never know
TbonesPop
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TbonesPop 2/9/2020 1:55pm
2/9/2020 1:55pm
TbonesPop wrote:
You're missing a key point. Cat and mouse and the end of a race, [b]especially for the win[/b] is perfectly fine. Doing that to hold 5th...
You're missing a key point. Cat and mouse and the end of a race, especially for the win is perfectly fine. Doing that to hold 5th place in the middle of the race, and thus slowing down letting the riders behind you catch up is stupid race craft.

Re-read what Cooper said and think it through. Some riders play Chess and others play checkers.....
aeffertz wrote:
I disagree that you’re only allowed to battle for your position if you are in first place. Doesn’t matter where you are, you’re trying to finished...
I disagree that you’re only allowed to battle for your position if you are in first place. Doesn’t matter where you are, you’re trying to finished in the best spot possible.

What I’m saying is, by your logic, the blame is on Tomac not Barcia. The scenarios are very similar.

Webb was faster than AC but was being held up by AC.
Tomac was faster than Barcia, but was being held up by Barcia. Webb played it smarter than Tomac since both AC and Barcia were fending their positions.

Webb said he made a pass on AC and AC made an aggressive pass back for the lead. This is exactly what Barcia did to Tomac, albeit not for the lead. Webb says he then tried to make a pass again but realized it was causing them to do a cat and mouse scenario, allowing Blake to catch up. So instead of forcing the pass again, he settles in behind AC and waited for a better time to make the pass.

Instead of Tomac just letting him go and wait for a better time to pass like Webb did, he forced a pass again and again, which caused the cat and mouse scenario because Barcia was close enough to retaliate the pass. Tomac was being impatient and making passes that weren’t able to stick.
Football teams don't run a prevent defense in the 3rd quarter when up by a TD. I'm a Barcia fan. I also like Eli and Ken. Shoot, there isn't a rider I don't like. The whole cat and mouse thing (blocking, brake checking, etc) slowed the two of them down instead of moving forward to gain positions on the leaders. When its the middle of the race and a rider is road grading a faster rider from coming through the pack on a hard to pass layout, I wouldn't consider that "battling". If a racer is "battling", lets see the lap times get faster and gain on the leaders. And that's coming from a Barcia fan. Race forward son! He's shown he has the speed this year. It's not it was 3 years ago. I think he would have been better served and had a better finish had he tucked in under Eli and learned from his lines, where he was making up time on the track - and raced forward.
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TbonesPop
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TbonesPop 2/9/2020 1:58pm
2/9/2020 1:58pm
westeast wrote:
If it's the last lap or two, sure, race Tomac like Barcia did. It wasn't though. Barcia should have accepted the pass and tried to latch...
If it's the last lap or two, sure, race Tomac like Barcia did. It wasn't though. Barcia should have accepted the pass and tried to latch on. Barcia is lucky Roczen didn't get by.
Rushton597 wrote:
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what...
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what you're saying is everyone should just let Tomac or whoever is behind them by?
KHI Guy wrote:
That's what a lot of people in this thread seem to think. Huh
I think several folks in this thread have a difficult time with reading and comprehension.
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KHI Guy
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KHI Guy 2/9/2020 2:22pm
2/9/2020 2:22pm
Rushton597 wrote:
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what...
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what you're saying is everyone should just let Tomac or whoever is behind them by?
KHI Guy wrote:
That's what a lot of people in this thread seem to think. Huh
TbonesPop wrote:
I think several folks in this thread have a difficult time with reading and comprehension.
This is vitalmx, it goes without saying...
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Tarz483
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Tarz483 2/9/2020 2:29pm
2/9/2020 2:29pm
Rushton597 wrote:
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what...
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what you're saying is everyone should just let Tomac or whoever is behind them by?
KHI Guy wrote:
That's what a lot of people in this thread seem to think. Huh
TbonesPop wrote:
I think several folks in this thread have a difficult time with reading and comprehension.
Ding ding ding Winner!
gregyou
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gregyou 2/9/2020 2:56pm
2/9/2020 2:56pm
Did you read what they were talking back? I don’t have the link but Barcia Approached Eli and said you didn’t have to run it in so deep and Eli replied by saying I could’ve hit you harder
motomike137
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motomike137 2/9/2020 3:08pm
2/9/2020 3:08pm
I'm a Barcia fan but Justin should have tucked in behind Eli for a couple of laps right after Eli stood him up before that jump. His shenanigans after that did the real damage.
Goon126
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Goon126 2/9/2020 3:18pm
2/9/2020 3:18pm
ET3 has always been good about making clean passes. I bet he told Barcia something like “pull that shit again and see what happens”
mulletman
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mulletman 2/9/2020 3:40pm
2/9/2020 3:40pm
It’s easy to sort the mouth breathers on here by what their definition of “racing” is. I like to pretend that Mx/Sx fans may have some class, but in reality it’s mainly of bunch men who wanna see a combo of monster jam and UFC instead of an actual race.

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madmaxperformance 2/9/2020 3:44pm
2/9/2020 3:44pm
Goon126 wrote:
ET3 has always been good about making clean passes. I bet he told Barcia something like “pull that shit again and see what happens”
Probably not. Who knows. Barcia might have been apologizing, who knows. Or Tomac and Barcia were just talking about the fun of the race.

Seems many feel that they were arguing. They didn’t look all that mad. Meh, who knows.

Awesome race either way.
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C.Worthy
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C.Worthy 2/9/2020 3:55pm
2/9/2020 3:55pm
Goon126 wrote:
ET3 has always been good about making clean passes. I bet he told Barcia something like “pull that shit again and see what happens”
madmaxperformance wrote:
Probably not. Who knows. Barcia might have been apologizing, who knows. Or Tomac and Barcia were just talking about the fun of the race. Seems many...
Probably not. Who knows. Barcia might have been apologizing, who knows. Or Tomac and Barcia were just talking about the fun of the race.

Seems many feel that they were arguing. They didn’t look all that mad. Meh, who knows.

Awesome race either way.
Barcia talked about it on the post race pulp interviews with Steve. Talks about it at the 6:50 mark, Barcia told Tomac "You drove in on me pretty hard, that was kind of aggressive" and Tomac told him something like "I could've hit you harder" Didn't seem like a big deal the way Barcia was talking about it. Water under the bridge

San diego SX Post Race Interview Pulp
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Crush
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Crush 2/9/2020 4:13pm
2/9/2020 4:13pm
If your pass cost you both time, it's probably not the best attempt. Worse, if your pass attempt is just that, and costs you time, and the other guy gets away, then it was definitely not the smartest way.

This is where Barcia almost always operates. And it's retarded, because he's good enough to be better, to make smarter choices. He actually rode well at the end, but he cost himself a shot by brainfarting straight away. It's like when AC passed him and he dived to the inside – it wasn't there bro. Lucky AC made a mistake, this week Eli didn't.

Just needs to make better choices. Pro since 09 and two lites titles and fuck-all wins for a mega talent whilst his direct competition has multiple majors. You can argue he's racing for a position, and what if it works etc, but honestly, it usually doesn't, and it always causes him shit with other riders.... Seriously, the list of riders he hasn't had an issue with would be shorter than those he has.
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Radical
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Radical 2/9/2020 5:53pm
2/9/2020 5:53pm
In a race, never give away anything. If someone wants to pass you, they have to earn it.
I'm not talking about weaving back and forth across the track or being an obstacle. I'm talking about racing hard, and not "accepting" any passes or pecking order.

When I line up (in the old dude beginner class), I'm racing for the win.
If someone passes me, I'm determined to pass them back, then whoever's in front of them.

I found the Barcia/Tomac battle legit. Same with AC/Webb. AC got passed, then took it back.

I want to see all out battles, all through the pack, start to finish.
Isn't that what it's all about?

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kkawboy14
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kkawboy14 2/9/2020 6:04pm
2/9/2020 6:04pm Edited Date/Time 2/9/2020 6:05pm
westeast wrote:
If it's the last lap or two, sure, race Tomac like Barcia did. It wasn't though. Barcia should have accepted the pass and tried to latch...
If it's the last lap or two, sure, race Tomac like Barcia did. It wasn't though. Barcia should have accepted the pass and tried to latch on. Barcia is lucky Roczen didn't get by.
Rushton597 wrote:
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what...
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what you're saying is everyone should just let Tomac or whoever is behind them by?
KHI Guy wrote:
That's what a lot of people in this thread seem to think. Huh
I didn’t read that!

I think people think that racing sideways is dumb, no matter who is doing it. But it worked for holding Roczen back.
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8k4x6f
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8k4x6f 2/9/2020 6:25pm
2/9/2020 6:25pm
Dont be so critical, anyone have passion or care for there job to do it 100%? Thats what #51 did. It didnt get to him that #3 was faster, caught him, or he was losing the podium guys pace. He was doing and holding #51 pace, obviously not making fellow racers want to hire him, but Eli wont be hiring him,nor will factory Kawasaki because of this San Diego main event. Hats off to someone willing to send it and make all us FELD fans pumped up and talking about the race benind 1st place.
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Rhody
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Rhody 2/9/2020 7:13pm
2/9/2020 7:13pm
As far as I can tell you win by taking the least time to complete the race. So why would you waste time battling for a position early? You never get back the time that you wasted. The guy in 3rd might get arm pump and the leaders may crash each other, but you can't capitalize because you played games and pissed away a bunch of time. I can understand it from Friese, but not a guy with win potential like Barcia.
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westeast
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westeast 2/9/2020 8:44pm
2/9/2020 8:44pm Edited Date/Time 2/9/2020 8:45pm
Rushton597 wrote:
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what...
So Barcia should have let the pass happen and lose the position in hopes of gaining it back once Tomac makes another pass? So basically what you're saying is everyone should just let Tomac or whoever is behind them by?
KHI Guy wrote:
That's what a lot of people in this thread seem to think. Huh
kkawboy14 wrote:
I didn’t read that!

I think people think that racing sideways is dumb, no matter who is doing it. But it worked for holding Roczen back.
I guess it all depends on if you think Barcia had the speed to maybe finish better than he did. He and Tomac looked fast last night. I think Barcia would have been better served trying to follow Tomac, learn where he was faster and maybe catch Bagget, Webb and AC or even pass Tomac back. There was a lot of time left in the race. Instead he made some desperate moves that slowed both him and Tomac down making it more difficult to move up positions. I don't think Barcia did anything wrong racing etiquette wise, but it didn't seem smart to me.
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Mit12
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Mit12 2/10/2020 5:42am
2/10/2020 5:42am
Mit12 wrote:
Dumb Dumb is back! What an idiot!
2WheelsForTheMasses wrote:
You guys are a bunch of cry babies....I dont like Barcia at all but he did nothing wrong. This is motorcycle racing. Last time I checked...
You guys are a bunch of cry babies....I dont like Barcia at all but he did nothing wrong. This is motorcycle racing. Last time I checked he gets paid to win. Not to roll around the track letting anyone roll right bye. He rode great and kept Roczen behind him.
He should be racing foreword, blocking and ramming trying to keep a position at the mid way point of the race is desperation. The first two races this season Barcia was great and after he started getting beat and struggling he returned to Dumb Dumb.
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Rushton597 2/10/2020 5:57am
2/10/2020 5:57am
KHI Guy wrote:
That's what a lot of people in this thread seem to think. Huh
kkawboy14 wrote:
I didn’t read that!

I think people think that racing sideways is dumb, no matter who is doing it. But it worked for holding Roczen back.
westeast wrote:
I guess it all depends on if you think Barcia had the speed to maybe finish better than he did. He and Tomac looked fast last...
I guess it all depends on if you think Barcia had the speed to maybe finish better than he did. He and Tomac looked fast last night. I think Barcia would have been better served trying to follow Tomac, learn where he was faster and maybe catch Bagget, Webb and AC or even pass Tomac back. There was a lot of time left in the race. Instead he made some desperate moves that slowed both him and Tomac down making it more difficult to move up positions. I don't think Barcia did anything wrong racing etiquette wise, but it didn't seem smart to me.
That's reasonable. I do understand that sometimes the fastest way around the track can be latching on to the back wheel of the rider that passed you. It gives you some time to learn the fast lines and what not. But there are all kinds of ways to race the track. Personally I like seeing more than one style of racing out there. Either way it was a good race.
hamncheeze
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hamncheeze 2/10/2020 8:43am
2/10/2020 8:43am
Let's add a little data to the arguments:

https://results.amasupercross.com/xml/SX/events/S2030/S1F1RID.pdf

Looking at Barcia, Tomac, Roczen they all lost 2-3 seconds to the leaders on lap 12 when all the stupidity was going on. Was this a deal breaker moment for them to catch the leaders? Well it was obvious KR was not going to get there. I still think Tomac and Barcia had a chance had they not monkeyed about.
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seth505
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seth505 2/10/2020 10:27am
2/10/2020 10:27am
hamncheeze wrote:
Let's add a little data to the arguments: https://results.amasupercross.com/xml/SX/events/S2030/S1F1RID.pdf Looking at Barcia, Tomac, Roczen they all lost 2-3 seconds to the leaders on lap 12 when...
Let's add a little data to the arguments:

https://results.amasupercross.com/xml/SX/events/S2030/S1F1RID.pdf

Looking at Barcia, Tomac, Roczen they all lost 2-3 seconds to the leaders on lap 12 when all the stupidity was going on. Was this a deal breaker moment for them to catch the leaders? Well it was obvious KR was not going to get there. I still think Tomac and Barcia had a chance had they not monkeyed about.
I made a thread with factual numbers but no one likes facts. Barcia had a faster lap than Tomac and Roczen had a faster lap than both of them believe it or not.
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Skylebones 2/10/2020 10:31am
2/10/2020 10:31am

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crowe176
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crowe176 2/10/2020 11:41am
2/10/2020 11:41am
hamncheeze wrote:
Let's add a little data to the arguments: https://results.amasupercross.com/xml/SX/events/S2030/S1F1RID.pdf Looking at Barcia, Tomac, Roczen they all lost 2-3 seconds to the leaders on lap 12 when...
Let's add a little data to the arguments:

https://results.amasupercross.com/xml/SX/events/S2030/S1F1RID.pdf

Looking at Barcia, Tomac, Roczen they all lost 2-3 seconds to the leaders on lap 12 when all the stupidity was going on. Was this a deal breaker moment for them to catch the leaders? Well it was obvious KR was not going to get there. I still think Tomac and Barcia had a chance had they not monkeyed about.
seth505 wrote:
I made a thread with factual numbers but no one likes facts. Barcia had a faster lap than Tomac and Roczen had a faster lap than...
I made a thread with factual numbers but no one likes facts. Barcia had a faster lap than Tomac and Roczen had a faster lap than both of them believe it or not.
Yea, but It's easier to blame Barcia for the lack of SX championships in that trio.
RonJon
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RonJon 2/10/2020 11:44am
2/10/2020 11:44am
crowe176 wrote:
Yea, but It's easier to blame Barcia for the lack of SX championships in that trio.
I'd blame inconstancy.
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Fonzarelli
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Fonzarelli 2/10/2020 11:45am
2/10/2020 11:45am
I think the folks implying that Roczen stayed behind Barcia because he "didn't want none"are dimwits. I think Roczen is one of the best passers in MX history and you don't accomplish what he has by being afraid of anyone.
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