Barcia Running Stock Motor

ML512
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ML512 11/10/2019 8:41am
11/10/2019 8:41am
Timo_2824 wrote:
Only 450 sx win for Andrew Short was on a stock honda engine if I remember correctly.
Denn700 wrote:
And he battled Roczen who almost won on a 350.
Ahh we’ve got our years mixed up, the year before he won Seattle on a leased HRC bike with L&Mc, the near stock bike was the year after.
MotoMan12345
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MotoMan12345 11/10/2019 8:50am
11/10/2019 8:50am
Dirty Points wrote:
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX: Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig". Savatgy...
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX:
Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig".
Savatgy: 2nd running a stock motor with exhaust and suspension bits on the bike we say is too outdated.
Friese: 3rd with an off-the-dealer-floor vanilla Honda.

And then there are all of us Vital goofballs worrying about whether engine mounts, or ti footpegs, or factory editions will make the difference at the local track.
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got 30th overall AT A PRO NATIONAL ON AN ALL STOCK CRF450r. BONE STOCK SUSPENSION!! Just ride the bike!!
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kiwifan
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kiwifan 11/10/2019 11:02am
11/10/2019 11:02am
Not sure how some people think Barcia on a 350 means he will be faster, he will still rev the thing to buggery and therefore still have chassis/suspension issues
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Zycki11
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Zycki11 11/10/2019 11:25am
11/10/2019 11:25am
Boomslang wrote:
Anyone pay any attention to how Roczen rides the nationals? Sounds like he is idling around the track...look, listen and learn.
Zycki11 wrote:
True, but roczen also uses a high HP bike with lots of low torque to do that. Barcia is complete opposite. He is basically saying you...
True, but roczen also uses a high HP bike with lots of low torque to do that. Barcia is complete opposite. He is basically saying you can’t change a zebras stripes. I rev the bike and I set up my bike to be revved. It’s what he knows.
Flatliner wrote:
But who's had supercross success riding a 450 that way? Or 450 nationals?
Both have, I’m not arguing for Barcia. I’m saying they are simply different. Everyone knows that lower rpms allow the bike to settle more through bumps, chop etc. I think the main argument is that Barcia seems to be happier and feel more aggressive doing it this way. If that’s the case and it translates into better results, who are we to say anything. At the end of the day, Barcia has millions of bucks in the bank and is riding his bike for a living.
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Boomslang 11/10/2019 11:36am
11/10/2019 11:36am
450 outdoors we ran our KTM with a Vortex Ignition mapped by Twisted, VP race gas and Rekluse clutch plates.

For 2020 we will be running Vertex pistons. No motor mods. We will be focusing on chassis and suspension - getting the bike better dailed for each events conditions.

We are a top 20 rider and at times were running between 12th - 15th. Our lap times have been good and for 2020 we are targeting 10th - 15th.

The ideal would be to race 250's but with our budget we cannot. The 250 mods and maintenance are too much for us.


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yz133rider
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yz133rider 11/10/2019 11:38am
11/10/2019 11:38am
kiwifan wrote:
Not sure how some people think Barcia on a 350 means he will be faster, he will still rev the thing to buggery and therefore still...
Not sure how some people think Barcia on a 350 means he will be faster, he will still rev the thing to buggery and therefore still have chassis/suspension issues
Because its less interia than a 450 and wont be as much of a factor. same reason revving the snot out of a 250 doesnt cause these handling issues...
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Zaugg
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Zaugg 11/10/2019 11:39am
11/10/2019 11:39am
kiwifan wrote:
Not sure how some people think Barcia on a 350 means he will be faster, he will still rev the thing to buggery and therefore still...
Not sure how some people think Barcia on a 350 means he will be faster, he will still rev the thing to buggery and therefore still have chassis/suspension issues
Keep in mind the KTM SX-F 350 has its power at high revs. The problem with a high revving 450, knocked down to a 350 is all the rotating mass, hence the chassis issues.

Ideally, Yamaha would want to take the 250 platform and go up instead of taking a 450 and going smaller.

I think Barcia would be deadly on a 250 punched out to 350. Not sure about reliability though. haha

Racerman967
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Racerman967 11/10/2019 11:50am
11/10/2019 11:50am
I know a rider who rode the 2018 outdoors in a bone stock KX450( just a pipe) and just missed the top 20 for the season. Qualified top 20 in most races.
kkawboy14
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kkawboy14 11/10/2019 12:08pm
11/10/2019 12:08pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2019 12:09pm
They may be running stock motors.....but they weren’t trying to beat Roczen, Musquin and Tomacs monster motors last night!
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Tarz483
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Tarz483 11/10/2019 12:17pm
11/10/2019 12:17pm
I'm just surprised they haven't thought about this sooner.
Personally I think it would be be a good idea to make stock motors a requirement, it would save a lot of money and level the playing field a bit.
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philG
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philG 11/10/2019 12:32pm
11/10/2019 12:32pm
Dirty Points wrote:
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX: Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig". Savatgy...
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX:
Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig".
Savatgy: 2nd running a stock motor with exhaust and suspension bits on the bike we say is too outdated.
Friese: 3rd with an off-the-dealer-floor vanilla Honda.

And then there are all of us Vital goofballs worrying about whether engine mounts, or ti footpegs, or factory editions will make the difference at the local track.
philG wrote:
But this is what makes good riders great, the abilty to make a bike work. Anyone who knows anything knows that it isnt all about horsepower...
But this is what makes good riders great, the abilty to make a bike work. Anyone who knows anything knows that it isnt all about horsepower, once you get up to bigger bikes, which is all about getting what you have , to the ground. I have done eniugh development over the years to know that usable power is what its all about, because that transmits to repeatable lap time, and in our case, tyre life. Pourcel was always one for leaving the motor alone, and using what it had, the trouble with factory teams is that because they can change everything, they feel they have to..
Barcia needs to sort his shit out and fast, because Yamaha need results, AP has been a disappointment, i expected more based on his 250 form , injury hasnt helped , but i think they are both up at the end of 2020.
TeamGreen wrote:
Their damn Brits: telling it like it is and forcing my agreement. :laugh: Tho, I'd add this...I'm not as harsh on my "7" judgements. I'm of...
Their damn Brits: telling it like it is and forcing my agreement. Laughing

Tho, I'd add this...I'm not as harsh on my "7" judgements. I'm of the mindset that he's still got time to get the 450 results he wants.
I still rate AP , i thought he would get on the 450 and fly. but he has not even looked like he might as yet.

Barcia just needs to stop revving the crap out of the bike, imagine him being interviewed after he retires. and being asked ' did it never occur to you to actually read the science behind why revving the shit out of everything doesnt work' .

Over a season, i bet Roczen's piston does half the distance. It would be funny but this guy is supposed to be a pro, how hard is it to short shift .if i was the team manager i would be rev limiting the bike to 6000 RPM and telling he need to learn how to ride it or give up.

But getting back to the point, there are guys who can handle that bit extra, they are the guys that can win, but most of those guys want a bike that isnt trying to kill them for 30+2
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Black Diesel Bomber 11/10/2019 1:21pm
11/10/2019 1:21pm
philG wrote:
But this is what makes good riders great, the abilty to make a bike work. Anyone who knows anything knows that it isnt all about horsepower...
But this is what makes good riders great, the abilty to make a bike work. Anyone who knows anything knows that it isnt all about horsepower, once you get up to bigger bikes, which is all about getting what you have , to the ground. I have done eniugh development over the years to know that usable power is what its all about, because that transmits to repeatable lap time, and in our case, tyre life. Pourcel was always one for leaving the motor alone, and using what it had, the trouble with factory teams is that because they can change everything, they feel they have to..
Barcia needs to sort his shit out and fast, because Yamaha need results, AP has been a disappointment, i expected more based on his 250 form , injury hasnt helped , but i think they are both up at the end of 2020.
TeamGreen wrote:
Their damn Brits: telling it like it is and forcing my agreement. :laugh: Tho, I'd add this...I'm not as harsh on my "7" judgements. I'm of...
Their damn Brits: telling it like it is and forcing my agreement. Laughing

Tho, I'd add this...I'm not as harsh on my "7" judgements. I'm of the mindset that he's still got time to get the 450 results he wants.
philG wrote:
I still rate AP , i thought he would get on the 450 and fly. but he has not even looked like he might as yet...
I still rate AP , i thought he would get on the 450 and fly. but he has not even looked like he might as yet.

Barcia just needs to stop revving the crap out of the bike, imagine him being interviewed after he retires. and being asked ' did it never occur to you to actually read the science behind why revving the shit out of everything doesnt work' .

Over a season, i bet Roczen's piston does half the distance. It would be funny but this guy is supposed to be a pro, how hard is it to short shift .if i was the team manager i would be rev limiting the bike to 6000 RPM and telling he need to learn how to ride it or give up.

But getting back to the point, there are guys who can handle that bit extra, they are the guys that can win, but most of those guys want a bike that isnt trying to kill them for 30+2
Based on his interview it sounds like there has been some tension with the team because he's been asking to reduce HP so he can ride on the rev limiter but the team didn't agree. Barcia said they are starting over with settings now with a stock motor so he can rev the piss out of the bike to suit his riding style.

What I basically heard him say in my words is "I ride one way and only one way - which is revving the piss out of the bike. The traditional 450 style of riding (high HP/torque) hasn't been working out for me, so we are changing to a stock motor so I can ride on the rev limiter"
mb60
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mb60 11/10/2019 1:43pm
11/10/2019 1:43pm
I love it when a factory pro rider says stock. Lol
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Helda
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Helda 11/10/2019 2:23pm
11/10/2019 2:23pm
mb60 wrote:
I love it when a factory pro rider says stock. Lol
Yeah lol you bet your ass it's not an out of the box stock engine
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Underground 11/10/2019 2:39pm
11/10/2019 2:39pm
TeamGreen wrote:
Their damn Brits: telling it like it is and forcing my agreement. :laugh: Tho, I'd add this...I'm not as harsh on my "7" judgements. I'm of...
Their damn Brits: telling it like it is and forcing my agreement. Laughing

Tho, I'd add this...I'm not as harsh on my "7" judgements. I'm of the mindset that he's still got time to get the 450 results he wants.
philG wrote:
I still rate AP , i thought he would get on the 450 and fly. but he has not even looked like he might as yet...
I still rate AP , i thought he would get on the 450 and fly. but he has not even looked like he might as yet.

Barcia just needs to stop revving the crap out of the bike, imagine him being interviewed after he retires. and being asked ' did it never occur to you to actually read the science behind why revving the shit out of everything doesnt work' .

Over a season, i bet Roczen's piston does half the distance. It would be funny but this guy is supposed to be a pro, how hard is it to short shift .if i was the team manager i would be rev limiting the bike to 6000 RPM and telling he need to learn how to ride it or give up.

But getting back to the point, there are guys who can handle that bit extra, they are the guys that can win, but most of those guys want a bike that isnt trying to kill them for 30+2
Black Diesel Bomber wrote:
Based on his interview it sounds like there has been some tension with the team because he's been asking to reduce HP so he can ride...
Based on his interview it sounds like there has been some tension with the team because he's been asking to reduce HP so he can ride on the rev limiter but the team didn't agree. Barcia said they are starting over with settings now with a stock motor so he can rev the piss out of the bike to suit his riding style.

What I basically heard him say in my words is "I ride one way and only one way - which is revving the piss out of the bike. The traditional 450 style of riding (high HP/torque) hasn't been working out for me, so we are changing to a stock motor so I can ride on the rev limiter"
A few riders have said that about the team. Reed was one of the most famous for it but based on his rep, it wasn't taken as fact by most. Ferris another with his choice of forks. That team may have gotten the shake up it needed. McCarthy may get Fisher'd otherwise.

As for why Star bikes work so well, I'd say that a lot of that has to do with Wil Hahn who is a very good test rider and I'd bet he still does a lot of the R&D and setting up for the other riders.
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jeffro503
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jeffro503 11/10/2019 2:43pm
11/10/2019 2:43pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2019 2:44pm
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected.

Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class ) , in longer moto's ( I seem to get killed on the starts ) , but after 10 mins I start reeling guys in , and by the 15 - 20 min mark I almost feel as if I have an unfair advantage.

You can take this quote by myself as serious , or a joke , it's up to you : " Why do you need 60HP , when you only use 30 of it? " And mean while I'm riding something 30 - 50lbs lighter then you are. Do the math.

Being a vet rider , I found out a few years ago in longer moto's , the bigger , heavier , over powered bikes were what was killing me. I'll take getting creamed off the start , to only real you in later.

Point being........Maybe Justin just decided that an easier to ride , less HP type motor would help him conserve some energy?
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snackfedbear
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snackfedbear 11/10/2019 3:06pm
11/10/2019 3:06pm
jeffro503 wrote:
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected. Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class )...
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected.

Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class ) , in longer moto's ( I seem to get killed on the starts ) , but after 10 mins I start reeling guys in , and by the 15 - 20 min mark I almost feel as if I have an unfair advantage.

You can take this quote by myself as serious , or a joke , it's up to you : " Why do you need 60HP , when you only use 30 of it? " And mean while I'm riding something 30 - 50lbs lighter then you are. Do the math.

Being a vet rider , I found out a few years ago in longer moto's , the bigger , heavier , over powered bikes were what was killing me. I'll take getting creamed off the start , to only real you in later.

Point being........Maybe Justin just decided that an easier to ride , less HP type motor would help him conserve some energy?
This logic works in your case but I think starts are a bit more important in professional supercross racing.
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Underground 11/10/2019 3:34pm
11/10/2019 3:34pm
snackfedbear wrote:
This logic works in your case but I think starts are a bit more important in professional supercross racing.
Mike Larocco just took his shirt off
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jeffro503
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jeffro503 11/10/2019 3:48pm
11/10/2019 3:48pm
jeffro503 wrote:
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected. Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class )...
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected.

Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class ) , in longer moto's ( I seem to get killed on the starts ) , but after 10 mins I start reeling guys in , and by the 15 - 20 min mark I almost feel as if I have an unfair advantage.

You can take this quote by myself as serious , or a joke , it's up to you : " Why do you need 60HP , when you only use 30 of it? " And mean while I'm riding something 30 - 50lbs lighter then you are. Do the math.

Being a vet rider , I found out a few years ago in longer moto's , the bigger , heavier , over powered bikes were what was killing me. I'll take getting creamed off the start , to only real you in later.

Point being........Maybe Justin just decided that an easier to ride , less HP type motor would help him conserve some energy?
snackfedbear wrote:
This logic works in your case but I think starts are a bit more important in professional supercross racing.
You're totally right. I was just giving an example of what helped me out personally , and maybe it's kind of the same line of thinking that Justin is on? There are plenty of guy's on here that could probably say the same thing , as in going down to something less powerful , helped them. And I know professional SX is way different from what I do , but those races are still long enough where an over powered bike could get you into serious trouble. FWIW......Justin is not the first SX rider in which I've heard he actually de-tuned his motor a bit , to make it more rideable.
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Johnny Ringo
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Johnny Ringo 11/10/2019 3:50pm
11/10/2019 3:50pm
jeffro503 wrote:
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected. Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class )...
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected.

Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class ) , in longer moto's ( I seem to get killed on the starts ) , but after 10 mins I start reeling guys in , and by the 15 - 20 min mark I almost feel as if I have an unfair advantage.

You can take this quote by myself as serious , or a joke , it's up to you : " Why do you need 60HP , when you only use 30 of it? " And mean while I'm riding something 30 - 50lbs lighter then you are. Do the math.

Being a vet rider , I found out a few years ago in longer moto's , the bigger , heavier , over powered bikes were what was killing me. I'll take getting creamed off the start , to only real you in later.

Point being........Maybe Justin just decided that an easier to ride , less HP type motor would help him conserve some energy?
Did you just compare yourself to Justin Barcia?
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Crush
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Crush 11/10/2019 4:21pm
11/10/2019 4:21pm
jeffro503 wrote:
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected. Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class )...
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected.

Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class ) , in longer moto's ( I seem to get killed on the starts ) , but after 10 mins I start reeling guys in , and by the 15 - 20 min mark I almost feel as if I have an unfair advantage.

You can take this quote by myself as serious , or a joke , it's up to you : " Why do you need 60HP , when you only use 30 of it? " And mean while I'm riding something 30 - 50lbs lighter then you are. Do the math.

Being a vet rider , I found out a few years ago in longer moto's , the bigger , heavier , over powered bikes were what was killing me. I'll take getting creamed off the start , to only real you in later.

Point being........Maybe Justin just decided that an easier to ride , less HP type motor would help him conserve some energy?
snackfedbear wrote:
This logic works in your case but I think starts are a bit more important in professional supercross racing.
On the other hand, Barcia, who was always a great starter for years... hasn't been for years.
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omalley
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omalley 11/10/2019 4:47pm
11/10/2019 4:47pm
Dirty Points wrote:
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX: Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig". Savatgy...
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX:
Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig".
Savatgy: 2nd running a stock motor with exhaust and suspension bits on the bike we say is too outdated.
Friese: 3rd with an off-the-dealer-floor vanilla Honda.

And then there are all of us Vital goofballs worrying about whether engine mounts, or ti footpegs, or factory editions will make the difference at the local track.
MotoMan12345 wrote:
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got...
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got 30th overall AT A PRO NATIONAL ON AN ALL STOCK CRF450r. BONE STOCK SUSPENSION!! Just ride the bike!!
Poor comparison. A pro can adapt to a pretty shitty bike because their confidence borders on arrogance. Most of us “old fucks” get easily spooked by a bike that kicks, twitches, or does other weird shit. I agree that we don’t need footpegs, shifters, pipes, cams etc...but I disagree on suspension.
In some cases (like mine) a remap is also needed to fix running issues-not because we “need” it for performance.
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MotoMan12345 11/10/2019 5:55pm
11/10/2019 5:55pm
Dirty Points wrote:
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX: Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig". Savatgy...
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX:
Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig".
Savatgy: 2nd running a stock motor with exhaust and suspension bits on the bike we say is too outdated.
Friese: 3rd with an off-the-dealer-floor vanilla Honda.

And then there are all of us Vital goofballs worrying about whether engine mounts, or ti footpegs, or factory editions will make the difference at the local track.
MotoMan12345 wrote:
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got...
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got 30th overall AT A PRO NATIONAL ON AN ALL STOCK CRF450r. BONE STOCK SUSPENSION!! Just ride the bike!!
omalley wrote:
Poor comparison. A pro can adapt to a pretty shitty bike because their confidence borders on arrogance. Most of us “old fucks” get easily spooked by...
Poor comparison. A pro can adapt to a pretty shitty bike because their confidence borders on arrogance. Most of us “old fucks” get easily spooked by a bike that kicks, twitches, or does other weird shit. I agree that we don’t need footpegs, shifters, pipes, cams etc...but I disagree on suspension.
In some cases (like mine) a remap is also needed to fix running issues-not because we “need” it for performance.
And some of these old guys aren’t going fast enough to notice things but still spend hours adjusting crap
And throwing more cash into the bike.
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Dirty Points 11/10/2019 6:11pm
11/10/2019 6:11pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2019 6:21pm
Dirty Points wrote:
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX: Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig". Savatgy...
So to encapsulate the results for Paris SX:
Barcia: 1st with he says a stock motor and chassis on what we call the "blue pig".
Savatgy: 2nd running a stock motor with exhaust and suspension bits on the bike we say is too outdated.
Friese: 3rd with an off-the-dealer-floor vanilla Honda.

And then there are all of us Vital goofballs worrying about whether engine mounts, or ti footpegs, or factory editions will make the difference at the local track.
MotoMan12345 wrote:
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got...
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got 30th overall AT A PRO NATIONAL ON AN ALL STOCK CRF450r. BONE STOCK SUSPENSION!! Just ride the bike!!
omalley wrote:
Poor comparison. A pro can adapt to a pretty shitty bike because their confidence borders on arrogance. Most of us “old fucks” get easily spooked by...
Poor comparison. A pro can adapt to a pretty shitty bike because their confidence borders on arrogance. Most of us “old fucks” get easily spooked by a bike that kicks, twitches, or does other weird shit. I agree that we don’t need footpegs, shifters, pipes, cams etc...but I disagree on suspension.
In some cases (like mine) a remap is also needed to fix running issues-not because we “need” it for performance.
Or maybe -- and just hear me out, here -- we can be big, whiny babys and the bikes are pretty damn good.
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Kawi15
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Kawi15 11/10/2019 6:31pm
11/10/2019 6:31pm
I could be wrong and I accept the corrections if I am, but right now I am of the conviction that a 250 can start just as well as a 450 can on the modern day SX track setups with the one exception being Daytona. I am not convinced that the extra HP/Torque makes that much difference, since most surfaces seem to be more hard packed and slippery.
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Zycki11
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Zycki11 11/10/2019 6:32pm
11/10/2019 6:32pm
MotoMan12345 wrote:
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got...
HAHAH so true man. I see so many old fucks talking about “set up” it’s crazy. These bike are so damn good stock. My buddy got 30th overall AT A PRO NATIONAL ON AN ALL STOCK CRF450r. BONE STOCK SUSPENSION!! Just ride the bike!!
omalley wrote:
Poor comparison. A pro can adapt to a pretty shitty bike because their confidence borders on arrogance. Most of us “old fucks” get easily spooked by...
Poor comparison. A pro can adapt to a pretty shitty bike because their confidence borders on arrogance. Most of us “old fucks” get easily spooked by a bike that kicks, twitches, or does other weird shit. I agree that we don’t need footpegs, shifters, pipes, cams etc...but I disagree on suspension.
In some cases (like mine) a remap is also needed to fix running issues-not because we “need” it for performance.
Dirty Points wrote:
Or maybe -- and just hear me out, here -- we can be big, whiny babys and the bikes are pretty damn good.
Ohhh come on. When I went riding today it was super choppy. I am blaming my getting tired on my Enzo. Not my technique or lack of fitness. I’m going out and buying a new bike with A kit now.
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Chance1216
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Chance1216 11/10/2019 6:42pm
11/10/2019 6:42pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2019 6:44pm
jeffro503 wrote:
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected. Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class )...
I know I'll get flamed for this , but it's ok , it's expected.

Being a vet rider on a 125 ( expert class ) , in longer moto's ( I seem to get killed on the starts ) , but after 10 mins I start reeling guys in , and by the 15 - 20 min mark I almost feel as if I have an unfair advantage.

You can take this quote by myself as serious , or a joke , it's up to you : " Why do you need 60HP , when you only use 30 of it? " And mean while I'm riding something 30 - 50lbs lighter then you are. Do the math.

Being a vet rider , I found out a few years ago in longer moto's , the bigger , heavier , over powered bikes were what was killing me. I'll take getting creamed off the start , to only real you in later.

Point being........Maybe Justin just decided that an easier to ride , less HP type motor would help him conserve some energy?
snackfedbear wrote:
This logic works in your case but I think starts are a bit more important in professional supercross racing.
jeffro503 wrote:
You're totally right. I was just giving an example of what helped me out personally , and maybe it's kind of the same line of thinking...
You're totally right. I was just giving an example of what helped me out personally , and maybe it's kind of the same line of thinking that Justin is on? There are plenty of guy's on here that could probably say the same thing , as in going down to something less powerful , helped them. And I know professional SX is way different from what I do , but those races are still long enough where an over powered bike could get you into serious trouble. FWIW......Justin is not the first SX rider in which I've heard he actually de-tuned his motor a bit , to make it more rideable.
Detuning has been going on for quite some time. Suddenly, I feel old but back in the day the old two stroke 500s were being detuned more and more each year for factory riders. Making them easier to ride. Larrocco was one I can remember.
Dirty Points 11/10/2019 6:46pm
11/10/2019 6:46pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2019 6:59pm
snackfedbear wrote:
This logic works in your case but I think starts are a bit more important in professional supercross racing.
jeffro503 wrote:
You're totally right. I was just giving an example of what helped me out personally , and maybe it's kind of the same line of thinking...
You're totally right. I was just giving an example of what helped me out personally , and maybe it's kind of the same line of thinking that Justin is on? There are plenty of guy's on here that could probably say the same thing , as in going down to something less powerful , helped them. And I know professional SX is way different from what I do , but those races are still long enough where an over powered bike could get you into serious trouble. FWIW......Justin is not the first SX rider in which I've heard he actually de-tuned his motor a bit , to make it more rideable.
Chance1216 wrote:
Detuning has been going on for quite some time. Suddenly, I feel old but back in the day the old two stroke 500s were being detuned...
Detuning has been going on for quite some time. Suddenly, I feel old but back in the day the old two stroke 500s were being detuned more and more each year for factory riders. Making them easier to ride. Larrocco was one I can remember.
But Barcia's bike wasn't de-tuned. That would be factory-team bike-build magic, just in a different way. What happened was he just went out on the same damn motor the engineers decided was good to put on the showroom floor-- and it was perfectly fine to win on.
Chance1216
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Chance1216 11/10/2019 7:09pm
11/10/2019 7:09pm
Isn't stepping down from a full factory motor to a stocker in a sense detuning?
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Dirty Points 11/10/2019 7:15pm
11/10/2019 7:15pm Edited Date/Time 11/10/2019 7:53pm
Chance1216 wrote:
Isn't stepping down from a full factory motor to a stocker in a sense detuning?
No. It's just not tuning at all.

You say "Full factory motor" as if that is an inherently extant thing, which it is not. It is something they build to meet the requirements of a rider/team.

Of course there are examples like the"big-bang" movement in MotoGP sacrificing raw horsepower for rideability, but that's still a factory build. The reason he went stock is because he felt that the stock motor is as good or better for his needs as a "full factory motor".
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