Local MX Racing Turnout

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7/20/2017 7:49 PM

Although just practicing and riding isn't doing half bad its much cheaper, local racing events seem to be declining everywhere. I know this has been stated before in the past but iv'e noticed everyone said its the cost which I know is true. The most expensive thing is the bike, and obviously it is literally the most expensive its way to expensive for what it should be. Maybe in the future in a few years MX manufacturers will focus on affordability. It may not be hitting quite yet but it is true sales are dropping with bike costs rising. I don't care about your little electronic crap and useless ti stuff and electric start. Once it becomes bad enough I assume they will respond and start making bike a bit cheaper will less useless stuff that we don't need as an average rider. Maybe then local races will have more racers? I want to see MX grow not shrink.

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7/20/2017 8:01 PM

I don't know a 14 to 18 year old kid who can afford a repair bill for a blown up 4 stroke.

Used 125s are no longer a dime a dozen.
So basically I don't think as many kids are getting into it.

Nowdays kids are more likely to pay for a cell phone and electronic crap instead of a $100 bike payment.

The norms of todays society and four strokes are killing the entry level.

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7/20/2017 8:19 PM

mikec265 wrote:

I don't know a 14 to 18 year old kid who can afford a repair bill for a blown up 4 stroke.

Used 125s are no longer a dime a dozen.
So basically I don't think as many kids are getting into it.

Nowdays kids are more likely to pay for a cell phone and electronic crap instead of a $100 bike payment.

The norms of todays society and four strokes are killing the entry level.

Yea, it quite sucks and I think younger people would still get into it, but its to expensive unless their parents help. I think someone who has a job and has graduated school is more likely though. Im just curious what will happen to all these big MX manufacturers and what will happen when bike sales really take a hit. Maybe then the rebirth of mx is to come.

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7/20/2017 8:20 PM

If you are saying riders are going to "tracks" to practice, but won't go race because it's too expensive, that is an excuse. In Washington the price difference between practicing and racing is roughly $10 in the gate fee. I think people aren't happy with the lack of seat time and waiting in between motos. I think races should be broken up into half days. Morning session is 50s, 65s, 85s and 125 classes. Afternoon could be 250s, 450s and age groups. I think that may help, or class restructure with less classes, longer motos. It will cost more per entry though.

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Go Hawks!

7/20/2017 8:41 PM

mx510 wrote:

If you are saying riders are going to "tracks" to practice, but won't go race because it's too expensive, that is an excuse. In Washington the price difference between practicing and racing is roughly $10 in the gate fee. I think people aren't happy with the lack of seat time and waiting in between motos. I think races should be broken up into half days. Morning session is 50s, 65s, 85s and 125 classes. Afternoon could be 250s, 450s and age groups. I think that may help, or class restructure with less classes, longer motos. It will cost more per entry though.

Well Washington is odd then. Because everywhere I've ever been it's only $10 for a practice day. Race day is usually $10 gate fee each person, organization membership fee then a $50 Race fee.

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7/20/2017 8:43 PM
Edited Date/Time: 7/20/2017 8:44 PM

agn5009 wrote:

Well Washington is odd then. Because everywhere I've ever been it's only $10 for a practice day. Race day is usually $10 gate fee each person, organization membership fee then a $50 Race fee.

Practice fees in Washington are typically $30 and race fees are typically $30-35, plus $10 gate fee.

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Go Hawks!

7/20/2017 8:45 PM

mx510 wrote:

If you are saying riders are going to "tracks" to practice, but won't go race because it's too expensive, that is an excuse. In Washington the price difference between practicing and racing is roughly $10 in the gate fee. I think people aren't happy with the lack of seat time and waiting in between motos. I think races should be broken up into half days. Morning session is 50s, 65s, 85s and 125 classes. Afternoon could be 250s, 450s and age groups. I think that may help, or class restructure with less classes, longer motos. It will cost more per entry though.

I can practice right now for 30-40 bucks. For an entire weekend of racing its about 270 for the gate fee, class sign up, fuel and other little expenses. Including a new bike and maintenance for racing it gets pretty pricey. They run races really well here. First its practice in the morning and then races and they are quick about getting to each race. Good point though, maybe less useless classes would help. Would allow for more practice time.

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7/20/2017 8:52 PM

m1ke2001 wrote:

I can practice right now for 30-40 bucks. For an entire weekend of racing its about 270 for the gate fee, class sign up, fuel and other little expenses. Including a new bike and maintenance for racing it gets pretty pricey. They run races really well here. First its practice in the morning and then races and they are quick about getting to each race. Good point though, maybe less useless classes would help. Would allow for more practice time.

How many classes are you racing? You don't have the maintenance, fuel etc when you go practicing?

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Go Hawks!

7/20/2017 9:00 PM
Edited Date/Time: 7/20/2017 9:01 PM

Local bike racing is heavily tied to used motocross bikes.

Used 4 strokes == trouble

Hence not many people are getting into the sport. Is anyone surprised?

The only people who have a shot at pro motocross are the "select few" whos parents can afford to pay for them to race.

If you arent "cut from that cloth", you have no chance, regardless of skill.

I mean it shouldnt be a surprise to anyone that amateur motocross is dying

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7/20/2017 9:14 PM

mx510 wrote:

If you are saying riders are going to "tracks" to practice, but won't go race because it's too expensive, that is an excuse. In Washington the price difference between practicing and racing is roughly $10 in the gate fee. I think people aren't happy with the lack of seat time and waiting in between motos. I think races should be broken up into half days. Morning session is 50s, 65s, 85s and 125 classes. Afternoon could be 250s, 450s and age groups. I think that may help, or class restructure with less classes, longer motos. It will cost more per entry though.

m1ke2001 wrote:

I can practice right now for 30-40 bucks. For an entire weekend of racing its about 270 for the gate fee, class sign up, fuel and other little expenses. Including a new bike and maintenance for racing it gets pretty pricey. They run races really well here. First its practice in the morning and then races and they are quick about getting to each race. Good point though, maybe less useless classes would help. Would allow for more practice time.

mx510 wrote:

How many classes are you racing? You don't have the maintenance, fuel etc when you go practicing?

About two. They charge about 40-50 bucks a class I can't remember to well its been a while.

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7/20/2017 9:19 PM

Times have changed. Kids now spend a couple grand on a new smartphone and a gaming console so that they can sit in the comfort of the house and race online while texting their friends and posting to Facebook.

I drive through some of the towns around here on a Friday or Saturday night and they are literally dead. I'm the only car on streets that just 10 years ago would have been jam packed with cars, music and teenagers.

Welcome to the world of smartphones and social media.

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7/20/2017 9:30 PM

It's too hot outside....

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There's something happening here, what it is ain't exactly clear.

7/20/2017 9:46 PM

reded wrote:

Times have changed. Kids now spend a couple grand on a new smartphone and a gaming console so that they can sit in the comfort of the house and race online while texting their friends and posting to Facebook.

I drive through some of the towns around here on a Friday or Saturday night and they are literally dead. I'm the only car on streets that just 10 years ago would have been jam packed with cars, music and teenagers.

Welcome to the world of smartphones and social media.

I see plenty kids outside playing sports. Their are the group who do stay inside but that was kinda a big deal back in 2013 and such. I see plenty of kids on instagram who ride but motocross is not for everyone. My little brother likes to ride occasionally but would never race.

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7/20/2017 10:14 PM

For me, race tracks are 2-3 hours away, or I can drive 30 minutes to Zaca. Race, get up at 4am, drive, practice 5 laps in mud, wait till 9am, race a 10 min moto, then wait till 3pm to ride an 8 minute moto blue groove, and be home by 8pm. OR wake up at 9, ride first 30 minute moto at 10, the second 30 min moto at 11, and the third 30 min moto at 12, and be home by 2pm. If I want to "race" I go on the track w a few fast guys. Don't get me wrong, I raced all through the 80's and 90's, been there done that and get the "race feel", but just can't justify the lack of seat time for an all day event.

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7/20/2017 10:14 PM

Ill play a little devils advocate here. While I agree, four strokes have and had their part in negatively affecting MX because of cost and complexity. However, kids starting out can still do so on PW's, used 50's, used 65's, used 85's, and used superminis. There are good ones out there that are fairly inexpensive. New KTM and Cobras aren't cheap. But they weren't cheap when am nationals had 3-4 divisions of them either, nor were the am nationals (and costs associated with it) themselves. The costs for running an amatuer national in say, 2008, were about the same as today. The local racing costs are a little higher now, but not out of proportion to fairly recent years when participation levels were still pretty high. For that matter, practice is still less expensive than racing, and there aren't a whole lot of mini's at those either.

Are there adjustments within the control of MX that can be made to improve access? Yeah. However, there an overwhelming amount of factors out of control of MX that nothing can be done about.

The real problem is the number of new kids getting in the sport. If kids really wanted to do it, they could get in like they did in the past, with similar costs of expenses and bikes. There used to be a good number of kids coming in on older, less expensive minis but I dont see that happening now. If participation numbers are dwindling only in MX, and not in other motorsports, then it would be much easier to isolate the problem within MX itself. But thats not the case.

So, IMO, even if there was an overnight switch to two strokes only, with an abundance of very cheap and good options, I still dont think we would see much of a resurgence. Adults, and kids especially, are switching their focus of entertainment from active participation to distraction. Just my .02 cents.

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much ty. How to spot a paid forum poster/artificial forum traffic producer (see list of actions/phrases below):

Copius pattern amounts of phrases like “Anyone have”..., “Anybody know?”.... and their variations.

Thoughts?
Any help is appreciated!
Thanks in advance!





7/20/2017 11:56 PM

m1ke2001 wrote:

Although just practicing and riding isn't doing half bad its much cheaper, local racing events seem to be declining everywhere. I know this has been stated before in the past but iv'e noticed everyone said its the cost which I know is true. The most expensive thing is the bike, and obviously it is literally the most expensive its way to expensive for what it should be. Maybe in the future in a few years MX manufacturers will focus on affordability. It may not be hitting quite yet but it is true sales are dropping with bike costs rising. I don't care about your little electronic crap and useless ti stuff and electric start. Once it becomes bad enough I assume they will respond and start making bike a bit cheaper will less useless stuff that we don't need as an average rider. Maybe then local races will have more racers? I want to see MX grow not shrink.

IMHO... I think we have it pretty good up here in Northern California. We have ay least 7-9 differt tracks with multiple promotors all puttting on either practice or small series among 3-5 different tracks. The AMP Triple Crown, LL qualifiers, Mammoth Mountain qualifiers are the big ones.

3 of the local tracks have night races and practice sessions during the week and weekends.
Between the OTHG & OTMX, have support classes, then throw in AMP, REP & Mike Sexton and Garrahan combining races and different locations.. one could race about every weekend. Practice is about unlimited. Based on the turn out, I'd say were doing pretty good up here. Riverfront is holding a Friday night practice for women and kids, if the demand wasn't there, Zeb wouldn't waste his time.

I myself race at least 19-22 weekend a year, not counting practice days.

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7/21/2017 12:33 AM

GNCCs are getting HUGE turnouts.

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7/21/2017 12:49 AM

We race in Idaho and Washington. For 25 you can ride all day for practice. For a race? Shit, your talking 40-50 for my little girl, 10-20 for me depending on the pits, and an extra class is $30..

So just in fees for myself both days and my little girl racing is $160 at a certain track. It's insane. And THAT is on a small 50! I couldn't imagine a big four stroke, hauling an RV etc

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7/21/2017 1:57 AM

Riding offroad is where its at now. Even in Toronto half of the old dedicated hardcore mx clubs are now putting on XC events, Enduros and Sprint Enduros. For small events we get great turnouts.

People also like riding/racing for 2 to 3 hours straight depending on class. I know a few friends that ride motocross and have to be at the track from 9am to 4pm only to get about 4 or 5 10-15 min sessions in. Once all the classes get rotated around.

Offroad events they get double the riding in half the day and most track encorporate MX sections.

Youll always have LL qualies and other Am Nationals but for the joe blow i think GNCC, Sprint Enduros and JDAY are going to take over attendance in the states for sure.

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7/21/2017 2:20 AM

Moto331 wrote:

We race in Idaho and Washington. For 25 you can ride all day for practice. For a race? Shit, your talking 40-50 for my little girl, 10-20 for me depending on the pits, and an extra class is $30..

So just in fees for myself both days and my little girl racing is $160 at a certain track. It's insane. And THAT is on a small 50! I couldn't imagine a big four stroke, hauling an RV etc

It is insane! Right around $500 to race 4 motos! Transponder rental, mount purchase, entry, and gate fees all add up.

That seems crazy to me on top of everything else that's already expensive.

Expensive sport $$$

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If you're not mixing gas, you're not haulin ass.

7/21/2017 3:25 AM

D11 gates were packed in the 90's and had many fast riders. I don't think there even is a D11 anymore, I didn't have to buy one when I raced a couple times a few yrs ago. Most of the tracks are gone.

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7/21/2017 4:54 AM

It's the phones. They are killing everything. F#@$ cell phones!!

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7/21/2017 5:05 AM

reded wrote:

Times have changed. Kids now spend a couple grand on a new smartphone and a gaming console so that they can sit in the comfort of the house and race online while texting their friends and posting to Facebook.

I drive through some of the towns around here on a Friday or Saturday night and they are literally dead. I'm the only car on streets that just 10 years ago would have been jam packed with cars, music and teenagers.

Welcome to the world of smartphones and social media.

Wow that's the same thing I said In my hometown. Took a Friday night bike ride and it was dead.

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7/21/2017 5:07 AM

And I forgot about the video games and the internet. F the games and the net! With the awesomeness of modern bikes and modern tracks if it weren't for phones, games and the net ALOT more people would moto.

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7/21/2017 5:15 AM

reded wrote:

Times have changed. Kids now spend a couple grand on a new smartphone and a gaming console so that they can sit in the comfort of the house and race online while texting their friends and posting to Facebook.

I drive through some of the towns around here on a Friday or Saturday night and they are literally dead. I'm the only car on streets that just 10 years ago would have been jam packed with cars, music and teenagers.

Welcome to the world of smartphones and social media.

dedi684 wrote:

Wow that's the same thing I said In my hometown. Took a Friday night bike ride and it was dead.

I agree. It sucks so bad. It pisses me off. My kids are 11, 13, and 18. They are so different than me and the kids I grew up with. I blame the electronics.

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7/21/2017 6:06 AM

m1ke2001 wrote:

Although just practicing and riding isn't doing half bad its much cheaper, local racing events seem to be declining everywhere. I know this has been stated before in the past but iv'e noticed everyone said its the cost which I know is true. The most expensive thing is the bike, and obviously it is literally the most expensive its way to expensive for what it should be. Maybe in the future in a few years MX manufacturers will focus on affordability. It may not be hitting quite yet but it is true sales are dropping with bike costs rising. I don't care about your little electronic crap and useless ti stuff and electric start. Once it becomes bad enough I assume they will respond and start making bike a bit cheaper will less useless stuff that we don't need as an average rider. Maybe then local races will have more racers? I want to see MX grow not shrink.

b8res wrote:

IMHO... I think we have it pretty good up here in Northern California. We have ay least 7-9 differt tracks with multiple promotors all puttting on either practice or small series among 3-5 different tracks. The AMP Triple Crown, LL qualifiers, Mammoth Mountain qualifiers are the big ones.

3 of the local tracks have night races and practice sessions during the week and weekends.
Between the OTHG & OTMX, have support classes, then throw in AMP, REP & Mike Sexton and Garrahan combining races and different locations.. one could race about every weekend. Practice is about unlimited. Based on the turn out, I'd say were doing pretty good up here. Riverfront is holding a Friday night practice for women and kids, if the demand wasn't there, Zeb wouldn't waste his time.

I myself race at least 19-22 weekend a year, not counting practice days.

We have plenty of tracks and practices just not many racers. I comapared race results from 2007 and their is like between 10 and 20 people difference or more per class.

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7/21/2017 7:20 AM

Practice around here is $30.

A race day is typically $70/day to race 2 classes. $30/class and $10 gate fee.

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Race Bike: 2018 KTM 350SXF

Other Bikes: 1985 CR80R, 1990 CR250R, 1998 PW80, Specialized Fuse Comp 29.

Sold: 2016 YZ250F, 2012 CRF250R

7/21/2017 7:36 AM

FWYT wrote:

GNCCs are getting HUGE turnouts.

More seat time for the money. And a lot of people are catching on to that.

The same conversation came up at a local track the other night when we were practicing. Its not that people don't love moto anymore. Its that so much money gets sunk into very little time on the bike to compete. The JDay format caught on huge in New England and has the potential to do so elsewhere. You can run whatever bike you have without making a bunch of changes to it. Throw a set of handguards on a MX bike or change the clickers around on a woods bike and just go race. Personally, I would love to see one of our 4 "local" woods series switch formats instead of saturate the area even more, but I doubt that will happen.

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7/21/2017 8:53 AM

Rode a D14 Hare Scramble this year....never seen so many people on bikes. 60% of them being KTM but still lots of new bikes in the off moto scene.

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7/21/2017 9:31 AM

Here are some interesting statistics about snowsports. This chart shows that despite a 50% increase in US population between 1978 and 2016 the industry shows significantly less growth. The data shows numbers in the east have been basically flat while numbers in the west have improved (large population increase in the west especially with outdoor enthusiasts). These are relatively disappointing numbers even given that the cost of equipment hasnt risen that much although lift ticket prices have.
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