The great Privateer debate

parks387
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3/10/2026 8:10am Edited Date/Time 3/10/2026 8:11am
Paul333 wrote:
I am sick of reading about it. Lappers are a part of racing. Want main events or Nationals with ten guys in each moto? Keep letting a...

I am sick of reading about it. Lappers are a part of racing. 

Want main events or Nationals with ten guys in each moto? Keep letting a few pampered millionaires bitch and cry. You are already not paying them, now you are letting the top 1-3 riders disrespect them and want them gone. 

Makes me sick

Imagine becoming one of the best in the world and then you have this old squid ruin your shot at a win because he’s mentally retarded from drinking garbage water while growing up in southeast Missouri. That would make you sheet your pants 😆 

2
agn5008
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3/10/2026 9:03am
Just introduce the 107% rule. Unfortunately moto isn't a very deep sport talent-wise and there aren't 20 guys who are good enough to actually be on...

Just introduce the 107% rule. Unfortunately moto isn't a very deep sport talent-wise and there aren't 20 guys who are good enough to actually be on the gate in SX. A lot of them should be in Arenacross

There certainly are enough to fill 20 gates talent wise. Unfortunately some of them stay in 250’s (and I understand why, it’s more money. I’m not trying to start that argument) But imagine if guys had to move up after say 3 years of 250 experience. We’d have our current crop of 450 guys plus Antsie, Deegan, Shimoda, Hammaker, Kitchen, McAdoo, Mosiman plus many more. That’s 7 extremely good riders to add to the current 22 man field. 

1
umagumadog
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3/10/2026 9:54am

I know flags are the arch nemesis of the AMA but they do have this thing called a “black flag” don’t they? 

5
3strokemx
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3/10/2026 10:10am
umagumadog wrote:

I know flags are the arch nemesis of the AMA but they do have this thing called a “black flag” don’t they? 

Not anymore, Feld traded it for the Rainbow Flag

8
4

The Shop

bonseff
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3/10/2026 11:05am Edited Date/Time 3/10/2026 11:06am
image 2726.png?VersionId=GtVlnicUNYbUJtekcTqSi J.

 

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1
3/10/2026 11:29am
bonseff wrote:
 
image 2726.png?VersionId=GtVlnicUNYbUJtekcTqSi J.

 

Are fans of the sport really stupid enough to think stock bikes would keep them that much closer and alleviate the lapper issue?

4
1
30minmotos
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3/10/2026 11:31am
bonseff wrote:
 
image 2726.png?VersionId=GtVlnicUNYbUJtekcTqSi J.

 

Rickyisms wrote:

Are fans of the sport really stupid enough to think stock bikes would keep them that much closer and alleviate the lapper issue?

Yes and hopper made a video about it too.

1
kawasa84
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3/10/2026 11:45am
Paul333 wrote:

With 50 second lap times?

Enjoy your ten rider pro motos..

This is why Indy was such an issue. The track only had a couple places for passes. It was one fast line into several corners and lappers were still battling. And breaking down so fast because of sub 50 second lap times is getting ridiculous. Even the lappers have a harder time moving over constantly and into a whole lot shittier part of the track. 

Feld is going to have to come up with designs that can get laps to around 53-55 seconds minimum and find, use dirt that works better at certain moisture levels for indoor stadiums and doesn't break down in 2 laps. 

Feld shares some responsibility in the lapper situation we saw at Indy. They rebuild the track in between and with the dirt they're using and the moisture they're leaving in the dirt, it breaks down too fast, and ruts up the jump faces too deep. They could do better

3
3strokemx
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3/10/2026 12:11pm
Rickyisms wrote:

Are fans of the sport really stupid enough to think stock bikes would keep them that much closer and alleviate the lapper issue?

Yes. We buy stickers and clothing so we can cosplay as a pro racer. 

3/10/2026 12:18pm
Rickyisms wrote:

Are fans of the sport really stupid enough to think stock bikes would keep them that much closer and alleviate the lapper issue?

3strokemx wrote:

Yes. We buy stickers and clothing so we can cosplay as a pro racer. 

I just wear my jersey to the race instead. 

1
The Wolf Man
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3/10/2026 1:27pm
bonseff wrote:
 
image 2726.png?VersionId=GtVlnicUNYbUJtekcTqSi J.

 

Rickyisms wrote:

Are fans of the sport really stupid enough to think stock bikes would keep them that much closer and alleviate the lapper issue?

Yes, many of them are...

1
Tiki
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3/10/2026 6:25pm
3strokemx wrote:

Must have over 50k instagram followers to be able to sign up for the race.

phone-farm-la-gi-01

I got you. 

1
Tiki
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3/10/2026 6:27pm
bonseff wrote:
 
image 2726.png?VersionId=GtVlnicUNYbUJtekcTqSi J.

 

Exactly. Keep it the way it is and shut up.

Cliffy615
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3/11/2026 2:14am Edited Date/Time 3/11/2026 2:17am

To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a mainstream global sport.
Motocross, naturally, is more grassroots, and I don't see a real issue with privateers attempting to qualify and enter. There is way more space on a mx track and the consequences of lappers is far less severe and MX will never be mainstream - it can grow and improve, but SX i beleive is where the level of professionalism on a lot of fronts needs to elevate.

Someone mentioned Jan Pancar, and completely agree, this is great to see and a great story, he also did incredibly well at the nations last year, but this would never happen in SX.
If privateers can enter MX and arenacross but not SX, you will see a lot more privateers raise their level outdoors and if a rider was top 5 in outdoors and winning AX, perhaps they get a shot on a factory team for SX which would've never happened if they continued on their way with LCQ victories or not qualifying for SX

1
lumpy790
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York, SC US
3/11/2026 8:06am
Cliffy615 wrote:
To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a...

To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a mainstream global sport.
Motocross, naturally, is more grassroots, and I don't see a real issue with privateers attempting to qualify and enter. There is way more space on a mx track and the consequences of lappers is far less severe and MX will never be mainstream - it can grow and improve, but SX i beleive is where the level of professionalism on a lot of fronts needs to elevate.

Someone mentioned Jan Pancar, and completely agree, this is great to see and a great story, he also did incredibly well at the nations last year, but this would never happen in SX.
If privateers can enter MX and arenacross but not SX, you will see a lot more privateers raise their level outdoors and if a rider was top 5 in outdoors and winning AX, perhaps they get a shot on a factory team for SX which would've never happened if they continued on their way with LCQ victories or not qualifying for SX

Those riders making mains always have a shot at a fill in ride.

4
Cliffy615
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3/11/2026 8:45am
Cliffy615 wrote:
To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a...

To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a mainstream global sport.
Motocross, naturally, is more grassroots, and I don't see a real issue with privateers attempting to qualify and enter. There is way more space on a mx track and the consequences of lappers is far less severe and MX will never be mainstream - it can grow and improve, but SX i beleive is where the level of professionalism on a lot of fronts needs to elevate.

Someone mentioned Jan Pancar, and completely agree, this is great to see and a great story, he also did incredibly well at the nations last year, but this would never happen in SX.
If privateers can enter MX and arenacross but not SX, you will see a lot more privateers raise their level outdoors and if a rider was top 5 in outdoors and winning AX, perhaps they get a shot on a factory team for SX which would've never happened if they continued on their way with LCQ victories or not qualifying for SX

lumpy790 wrote:

Those riders making mains always have a shot at a fill in ride.

So, would the winner of AX have a shot at a fill in factory ride, I can't remember the last time anyone who barely qualifies got a fill-in ride with a factory team - these factory teams often instead run with 1 or sometimes even both riders out as Beta have this season

1
Johnny Ringo
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3/11/2026 8:59am

How many of you have ever bought a bike or a product because a privateer ran it?

2
2
mxaniac
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Airway Heights, WA US
3/11/2026 9:05am

IF, and I say IF you wanted to limit riders on the gate it needs to be performance based, not team based.

AMA handing out point penalties for egregiously affecting the outcome of a race due to non compliance with the rules is the way too handle it IMO. Yes it's somewhat subjective and thus a slippery slope, but you have to make the outcome of the front positions more important than those in the rear. The guys in the rear may be racing for money too, but to the people funding the sport, they aren't as important as those lapping them.

lumpy790
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3/11/2026 9:06am
Cliffy615 wrote:
To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a...

To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a mainstream global sport.
Motocross, naturally, is more grassroots, and I don't see a real issue with privateers attempting to qualify and enter. There is way more space on a mx track and the consequences of lappers is far less severe and MX will never be mainstream - it can grow and improve, but SX i beleive is where the level of professionalism on a lot of fronts needs to elevate.

Someone mentioned Jan Pancar, and completely agree, this is great to see and a great story, he also did incredibly well at the nations last year, but this would never happen in SX.
If privateers can enter MX and arenacross but not SX, you will see a lot more privateers raise their level outdoors and if a rider was top 5 in outdoors and winning AX, perhaps they get a shot on a factory team for SX which would've never happened if they continued on their way with LCQ victories or not qualifying for SX

lumpy790 wrote:

Those riders making mains always have a shot at a fill in ride.

Cliffy615 wrote:
So, would the winner of AX have a shot at a fill in factory ride, I can't remember the last time anyone who barely qualifies got...

So, would the winner of AX have a shot at a fill in factory ride, I can't remember the last time anyone who barely qualifies got a fill-in ride with a factory team - these factory teams often instead run with 1 or sometimes even both riders out as Beta have this season

Teams have contractual obligations so if the team wants the sponsors $$ they put a butt on the seat.  Guys making the SX mains get a fill in ride just about every year. 

As for AX winners guys like #118 Cheyenne Harmon they have a shot too .

2
vet323
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Lead, SD US
3/11/2026 10:27am
jndmx wrote:
IMO the blue flags don't cut it, yes they should pay attention but it's an outdated systemIf you watch some of the races they are off...

IMO the blue flags don't cut it, yes they should pay attention but it's an outdated system

If you watch some of the races they are off the side of the lane waving the blue flag and a racer with tunnel vision however fast or slow they are going may not register it right away. In ear communication to let lappers know the leaders are approaching would be much more immediate, could also help with the red light fiasco.

Putting a triple crown at a track with 47 second lap times was not helping either but I digress.

That track/those lappers would have been worse with a standard SX main running time.

1
Spoonguy
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3/11/2026 10:34am
lumpy790 wrote:
Y'all crack me up  🤣Factory teams have several million dollar budgets to spend each year to hire the cream of the crop in both riders and...

Y'all crack me up  🤣

Factory teams have several million dollar budgets to spend each year to hire the cream of the crop in both riders and professional personnel allowing them to perform at a much higher level of performance equipment going a couple seconds a lap faster. Star Racing is the factory Yamaha team not a B team.

B teams scrape up a little more money from wherever they can but they still pretty much paid privateers on better bikes. 

Pro Circuit and Club MX are truly impressive with enough funds to pay riders and personnel and build some really great built in house bikes.

Privateers are on a lower level of equipment keeping them from achieving the couple seconds a lap faster lap times.

Many factory and B Teams have now started working with the future top racers coming up through the ranks while they are still amateur so they are already under their tent. 

In the 1990’s Mitch Payton was the 1st to start seeing and bringing in talented riders to America from other countries that helped raise the bar.

 

Mitch brought in Pierre Karsmaker?

1
Spoonguy
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3/11/2026 10:38am

How many of you have ever bought a bike or a product because a privateer ran it?

I bought Surf detergent because they sponsored Jeff Glass.

Johnny Ringo
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3/11/2026 10:41am

How many of you have ever bought a bike or a product because a privateer ran it?

Spoonguy wrote:

I bought Surf detergent because they sponsored Jeff Glass.

Hot take: you would have bought Surf detergent if they sponsored MC instead. 

alphado
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Erie, PA US
3/11/2026 10:54am

How many of you have ever bought a bike or a product because a privateer ran it?

Onlyfans?

5
3/11/2026 10:59am
lumpy790 wrote:
Teams have contractual obligations so if the team wants the sponsors $$ they put a butt on the seat.  Guys making the SX mains get a...

Teams have contractual obligations so if the team wants the sponsors $$ they put a butt on the seat.  Guys making the SX mains get a fill in ride just about every year. 

As for AX winners guys like #118 Cheyenne Harmon they have a shot too .

Who is the last backmarker that a factory team has picked up? Unless my mind is blanking out, the last I can really remember is A-Ray at Factory Yamaha. 

Spoonguy
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3/11/2026 11:51am

How many of you have ever bought a bike or a product because a privateer ran it?

Spoonguy wrote:

I bought Surf detergent because they sponsored Jeff Glass.

Hot take: you would have bought Surf detergent if they sponsored MC instead. 

Certainly, but the only reason I bought Surf was because they sponsored a supercross rider, it happened to be Jeff Glass. I did use 1-800-collect and tried Bud Light because of MC, didn't stick with either very long. But other products, like MucOff, I use because of their involvement.

Camo383
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Stouffville, ON CA
3/11/2026 12:11pm

How many of you have ever bought a bike or a product because a privateer ran it?

Had various privateers recommend Dirt Tricks sprockets in 2017, which turned into one of the best moto purchases I’ve ever made.

Also like looking at privateer teams and some of my privateer buddies bikes for what parts they use and how their bikes are setup. Without access to factory equipment and a limited budget, they lean towards genuinely good products. FWIW, their bikes are a lot closer to what the general public would ride compared to factory bikes.

2
RDnutz
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3/11/2026 12:53pm
Cliffy615 wrote:
To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a...

To add to my initial post, this is talking about Supercross which holds the most prestige and is the sport that can be taken to a mainstream global sport.
Motocross, naturally, is more grassroots, and I don't see a real issue with privateers attempting to qualify and enter. There is way more space on a mx track and the consequences of lappers is far less severe and MX will never be mainstream - it can grow and improve, but SX i beleive is where the level of professionalism on a lot of fronts needs to elevate.

Someone mentioned Jan Pancar, and completely agree, this is great to see and a great story, he also did incredibly well at the nations last year, but this would never happen in SX.
If privateers can enter MX and arenacross but not SX, you will see a lot more privateers raise their level outdoors and if a rider was top 5 in outdoors and winning AX, perhaps they get a shot on a factory team for SX which would've never happened if they continued on their way with LCQ victories or not qualifying for SX

disagree Supercross has the most prestige. It has the most home viewership and promotion and the most consciousness with today's riders because it was what Millennials and Gen Z grew up with along with cell phones and social media where stuff could be pushed on people who otherwise may not have paid any attention to it. Those of use that grew up and raced in the formative years in USA saw the origination of the Super Bowl of Motocross in 1972 and regarded it as a gimmick and ok for a change of pace in the normal outdoor schedule which after regional championships had the most prestige. It is fitting that Feld who owns a circus franchise runs the enterprise as a big 3 ring circus. Us old guys basically referred to it as Jump O Cross and could take it or leave it since we can't relate to it vs. our own growing up loving the sport memories.

1
lumpy790
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3/11/2026 12:57pm Edited Date/Time 3/11/2026 12:58pm
lumpy790 wrote:
Teams have contractual obligations so if the team wants the sponsors $$ they put a butt on the seat.  Guys making the SX mains get a...

Teams have contractual obligations so if the team wants the sponsors $$ they put a butt on the seat.  Guys making the SX mains get a fill in ride just about every year. 

As for AX winners guys like #118 Cheyenne Harmon they have a shot too .

Rickyisms wrote:
Who is the last backmarker that a factory team has picked up? Unless my mind is blanking out, the last I can really remember is A-Ray...

Who is the last backmarker that a factory team has picked up? Unless my mind is blanking out, the last I can really remember is A-Ray at Factory Yamaha. 

Les Smith was the one I immediately remembered 

1
Heavyhitter
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Machias, WA US
3/11/2026 12:57pm

How many of you have ever bought a bike or a product because a privateer ran it?

3dp yz250f airbox lid, I saw it on David Pulleys bike and it looked rad.

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