Five minutes to go in Moto 1- KTM/Husky holds down 70% of the top 10.

Sierra Ranger
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Sierra Ranger
Edited Date/Time 7/8/2019 12:23am
There's a pattern here...

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MZ193
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MZ193 7/7/2019 1:40am
7/7/2019 1:40am
lol
fullfloater 7/7/2019 2:18am
7/7/2019 2:18am Edited Date/Time 7/7/2019 2:22am
Not in the 250 class though!

No Yamahas in your 450 snip but they sure make up for it in the 250 class.


Motofinne
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Motofinne 7/7/2019 2:27am
7/7/2019 2:27am Edited Date/Time 7/7/2019 1:53pm
fullfloater wrote:
Not in the 250 class though!

No Yamahas in your 450 snip but they sure make up for it in the 250 class.


This is why i don't give that much for these kind of stats.

The fact is that KTM/Husky presence in the 450 class is great. They have so many teams with very good riders so that they will probably always have multiple riders in the top 10. Yamaha (and most other brands) on the other hand have 2 (max) factory supported bikes with good riders on the track. On average KTM will dominate the top 10 just because of the number of high level rides on the track.

Then we look at the 250 class. Yamaha has no injuries to their factory effort and they have an ok support team with 2 riders (Hayes and Hartranft are performing better than many of the Austrian factory riders). KTM on the other hand has both injuries and way lesser riders on their squad. It doesn't say anything about the performance of the bikes in my opinion.
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CPR
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CPR 7/7/2019 2:34am
7/7/2019 2:34am
fullfloater wrote:
Not in the 250 class though!

No Yamahas in your 450 snip but they sure make up for it in the 250 class.


Motofinne wrote:
This is why i don't give that much for these kind of stats. The fact is that KTM/Husky presence in the 450 class is great. They...
This is why i don't give that much for these kind of stats.

The fact is that KTM/Husky presence in the 450 class is great. They have so many teams with very good riders so that they will probably always have multiple riders in the top 10. Yamaha (and most other brands) on the other hand have 2 (max) factory supported bikes with good riders on the track. On average KTM will dominate the top 10 just because of the number of high level rides on the track.

Then we look at the 250 class. Yamaha has no injuries to their factory effort and they have an ok support team with 2 riders (Hayes and Hartranft are performing better than many of the Austrian factory riders). KTM on the other hand has both injuries and way lesser riders on their squad. It doesn't say anything about the performance of the bikes in my opinion.
C'mon finne don't go bringing logic in here!
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Dropbear
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Dropbear 7/7/2019 2:51am
7/7/2019 2:51am
What did I say about a tinpot sport.
Crisp
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Crisp 7/7/2019 4:20am
7/7/2019 4:20am
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

And if Osbourne was there it would be 80%.
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Dtat720
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Dtat720 7/7/2019 5:42am
7/7/2019 5:42am
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

Yes, the pattern is flood the market and skew results.
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SEMAC
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SEMAC 7/7/2019 6:09am
7/7/2019 6:09am
Like Yamaha in 250 class
H4L
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H4L 7/7/2019 6:29am
7/7/2019 6:29am Edited Date/Time 7/7/2019 7:03am
fullfloater wrote:
Not in the 250 class though!

No Yamahas in your 450 snip but they sure make up for it in the 250 class.


Motofinne wrote:
This is why i don't give that much for these kind of stats. The fact is that KTM/Husky presence in the 450 class is great. They...
This is why i don't give that much for these kind of stats.

The fact is that KTM/Husky presence in the 450 class is great. They have so many teams with very good riders so that they will probably always have multiple riders in the top 10. Yamaha (and most other brands) on the other hand have 2 (max) factory supported bikes with good riders on the track. On average KTM will dominate the top 10 just because of the number of high level rides on the track.

Then we look at the 250 class. Yamaha has no injuries to their factory effort and they have an ok support team with 2 riders (Hayes and Hartranft are performing better than many of the Austrian factory riders). KTM on the other hand has both injuries and way lesser riders on their squad. It doesn't say anything about the performance of the bikes in my opinion.
CPR wrote:
C'mon finne don't go bringing logic in here!
Yep. Peick, Seely etc.. are out. Plesinger & Barcia are coming back from injury & are not @ 100%. To many variables in the equation. At that level all the bikes are good including the outdated Zuk..
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kb228
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kb228 7/7/2019 7:23am
7/7/2019 7:23am
You have a jar full of yellow m&ms and only 10 red m&ms, the probability of you pulling out a yellow m&m is high.
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BikeGuy321
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BikeGuy321 7/7/2019 9:46am
7/7/2019 9:46am Edited Date/Time 7/7/2019 9:50am
Weedge has mentioned multiple times that Blake Baggett's bike is very similar to the factory team bikes. Justin Brayton and Fredrik Noren are the only guys I can think of that rode for smaller teams and got factory support from a Japanese brand.

How much money in "trick" parts would it cost to build a Honda/Yamaha/Suzuki that's right on the AMA weight limit? Seems like it'd be much easier on KTM/Husky. Is that why JGR doesn't have backup bikes...?
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Motofinne
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Motofinne 7/7/2019 11:02am
7/7/2019 11:02am Edited Date/Time 7/7/2019 11:04am
BikeGuy321 wrote:
Weedge has mentioned multiple times that Blake Baggett's bike is very similar to the factory team bikes. Justin Brayton and Fredrik Noren are the only guys...
Weedge has mentioned multiple times that Blake Baggett's bike is very similar to the factory team bikes. Justin Brayton and Fredrik Noren are the only guys I can think of that rode for smaller teams and got factory support from a Japanese brand.

How much money in "trick" parts would it cost to build a Honda/Yamaha/Suzuki that's right on the AMA weight limit? Seems like it'd be much easier on KTM/Husky. Is that why JGR doesn't have backup bikes...?
The RMATV KTMs are full factory spec bikes. The only parts that are different to the Red Bull bikes are small things like exhaust, clamps etc. The engine and suspension is the same as the RB bikes.

Someone that knows can correct me but i think Brayton "only" had a factory front caliper and factory suspension on his MCR bike?
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byke
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byke 7/7/2019 11:26am
7/7/2019 11:26am
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

Dtat720 wrote:
Yes, the pattern is flood the market and skew results.
Flooding the market is the result of an action, not an action itself, otherwise all mfr's would "flood the market". What they actually did was make a good bike.
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H4L
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H4L 7/7/2019 11:29am
7/7/2019 11:29am
BikeGuy321 wrote:
Weedge has mentioned multiple times that Blake Baggett's bike is very similar to the factory team bikes. Justin Brayton and Fredrik Noren are the only guys...
Weedge has mentioned multiple times that Blake Baggett's bike is very similar to the factory team bikes. Justin Brayton and Fredrik Noren are the only guys I can think of that rode for smaller teams and got factory support from a Japanese brand.

How much money in "trick" parts would it cost to build a Honda/Yamaha/Suzuki that's right on the AMA weight limit? Seems like it'd be much easier on KTM/Husky. Is that why JGR doesn't have backup bikes...?
Motofinne wrote:
The RMATV KTMs are full factory spec bikes. The only parts that are different to the Red Bull bikes are small things like exhaust, clamps etc...
The RMATV KTMs are full factory spec bikes. The only parts that are different to the Red Bull bikes are small things like exhaust, clamps etc. The engine and suspension is the same as the RB bikes.

Someone that knows can correct me but i think Brayton "only" had a factory front caliper and factory suspension on his MCR bike?
I believe so. Same with Freddie running factory suspension on his privateer Honda. Most of the parts can be obtained by the general public.
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Dirty Points 7/7/2019 11:29am
7/7/2019 11:29am
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

Dtat720 wrote:
Yes, the pattern is flood the market and skew results.
byke wrote:
Flooding the market is the result of an action, not an action itself, otherwise all mfr's would "flood the market". What they actually did was make...
Flooding the market is the result of an action, not an action itself, otherwise all mfr's would "flood the market". What they actually did was make a good bike.
I am sure the bike is good, but Miller is the only guy on orange/white not directly on a KTM factory payroll/bike. But I applaud them for putting forth that level of effort. Would like to see any other manufacturer field that many riders.
Dtat720
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Dtat720 7/7/2019 12:10pm
7/7/2019 12:10pm
Dtat720 wrote:
Yes, the pattern is flood the market and skew results.
byke wrote:
Flooding the market is the result of an action, not an action itself, otherwise all mfr's would "flood the market". What they actually did was make...
Flooding the market is the result of an action, not an action itself, otherwise all mfr's would "flood the market". What they actually did was make a good bike.
Dirty Points wrote:
I am sure the bike is good, but Miller is the only guy on orange/white not directly on a KTM factory payroll/bike. But I applaud them...
I am sure the bike is good, but Miller is the only guy on orange/white not directly on a KTM factory payroll/bike. But I applaud them for putting forth that level of effort. Would like to see any other manufacturer field that many riders.
Thats my point. KTM makes a decent bike, but the fielding is a result of KTM/ Husky working with several other teams to field as many bikes as they can afford. They basically have what, 9 pretty much factory bikes on the gate every week? Yamaha has 2. Then Rock River has 2-3 support bikes. Honda has 2. Kawi has 2. Zook has 2. The rest are privateers. So KTM has 4-5 times as many factory bikes than everyone else. Of course they are going to place more bikes than the competition
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outerlimits
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outerlimits 7/7/2019 1:32pm
7/7/2019 1:32pm
byke wrote:
Flooding the market is the result of an action, not an action itself, otherwise all mfr's would "flood the market". What they actually did was make...
Flooding the market is the result of an action, not an action itself, otherwise all mfr's would "flood the market". What they actually did was make a good bike.
Dirty Points wrote:
I am sure the bike is good, but Miller is the only guy on orange/white not directly on a KTM factory payroll/bike. But I applaud them...
I am sure the bike is good, but Miller is the only guy on orange/white not directly on a KTM factory payroll/bike. But I applaud them for putting forth that level of effort. Would like to see any other manufacturer field that many riders.
Dtat720 wrote:
Thats my point. KTM makes a decent bike, but the fielding is a result of KTM/ Husky working with several other teams to field as many...
Thats my point. KTM makes a decent bike, but the fielding is a result of KTM/ Husky working with several other teams to field as many bikes as they can afford. They basically have what, 9 pretty much factory bikes on the gate every week? Yamaha has 2. Then Rock River has 2-3 support bikes. Honda has 2. Kawi has 2. Zook has 2. The rest are privateers. So KTM has 4-5 times as many factory bikes than everyone else. Of course they are going to place more bikes than the competition
That's basically it in a nutshell. I don't pay too much attention to the sub teams like Rock River etc as they are never in the top 10 anyway. Hon/Kaw/Yam/Suz typically have 2-rider teams. At the moment KTM/Hsq has 8 factory guys and they are all basically top 10 quality, the low man probably being Bloss. Rockymountain/BTO KTM is effectively a factory squad.
BobPA
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BobPA 7/7/2019 1:38pm
7/7/2019 1:38pm
KTM doing well = “They just have a bunch of riders/teams.....bikes are still junk

Suzuki get a single holeshot in the 250’s = They are a fantastic bike, best thing on the track, not outdated at all
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cable
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cable 7/7/2019 7:18pm
7/7/2019 7:18pm
stacking the deck. Roger built great bikes and everyone wants to ride one now? thats going to make it very very hard for another team to win a sx title ever again.
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Eddieg15
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Eddieg15 7/7/2019 8:08pm
7/7/2019 8:08pm
BobPA wrote:
KTM doing well = “They just have a bunch of riders/teams.....bikes are still junk Suzuki get a single holeshot in the 250’s = They are a...
KTM doing well = “They just have a bunch of riders/teams.....bikes are still junk

Suzuki get a single holeshot in the 250’s = They are a fantastic bike, best thing on the track, not outdated at all
Not
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NeedMoto 7/7/2019 8:16pm
7/7/2019 8:16pm
With all those KTM/Husky riders, green on track to a three peat. If you ain't first, your last. (Ricky Bobby)
SEMAC
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SEMAC 7/7/2019 8:26pm
7/7/2019 8:26pm
cable wrote:
stacking the deck. Roger built great bikes and everyone wants to ride one now? thats going to make it very very hard for another team to...
stacking the deck. Roger built great bikes and everyone wants to ride one now? thats going to make it very very hard for another team to win a sx title ever again.
KTM wont win another tittle, stamped, and we are taking mx, why do you bring circus cross, cookie cutter tracks to the conversation
zehn
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zehn 7/7/2019 8:33pm
7/7/2019 8:33pm
cable wrote:
stacking the deck. Roger built great bikes and everyone wants to ride one now? thats going to make it very very hard for another team to...
stacking the deck. Roger built great bikes and everyone wants to ride one now? thats going to make it very very hard for another team to win a sx title ever again.
SEMAC wrote:
KTM wont win another tittle, stamped, and we are taking mx, why do you bring circus cross, cookie cutter tracks to the conversation
lol
TbonesPop 7/7/2019 8:35pm
7/7/2019 8:35pm
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

Crisp wrote:
And if Osbourne was there it would be 80%.
If Osborne were on the list, he would have knocked Bloss off the list, or Miller, or Musquin (all on KTMs). So if Osborne makes that list, he knocks off another KTM which still puts it at 70%. Either way, its still a misleading statistic. There are no Yamahas on the list, but the winner of MXGP race 2 yesterday was on a Yamaha and second place was on a Honda. 4 of the top 5 in the MXGP race were non-KTM/Husky bikes. 3 of the top 5 MXGP race 2 results were on Yamahas. 3 of the top 5 (60%) of the top 5 at Red Bud were non-KTM/Husky bikes. You can make statistics say about anything you want to.
Crisp
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Crisp 7/7/2019 10:46pm
7/7/2019 10:46pm
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

Crisp wrote:
And if Osbourne was there it would be 80%.
TbonesPop wrote:
If Osborne were on the list, he would have knocked Bloss off the list, or Miller, or Musquin (all on KTMs). So if Osborne makes that...
If Osborne were on the list, he would have knocked Bloss off the list, or Miller, or Musquin (all on KTMs). So if Osborne makes that list, he knocks off another KTM which still puts it at 70%. Either way, its still a misleading statistic. There are no Yamahas on the list, but the winner of MXGP race 2 yesterday was on a Yamaha and second place was on a Honda. 4 of the top 5 in the MXGP race were non-KTM/Husky bikes. 3 of the top 5 MXGP race 2 results were on Yamahas. 3 of the top 5 (60%) of the top 5 at Red Bud were non-KTM/Husky bikes. You can make statistics say about anything you want to.
That's true. I shouldn't post without thinking. Silly
Last Braaap
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Last Braaap 7/7/2019 11:18pm
7/7/2019 11:18pm Edited Date/Time 7/7/2019 11:20pm
BobPA wrote:
KTM doing well = “They just have a bunch of riders/teams.....bikes are still junk Suzuki get a single holeshot in the 250’s = They are a...
KTM doing well = “They just have a bunch of riders/teams.....bikes are still junk

Suzuki get a single holeshot in the 250’s = They are a fantastic bike, best thing on the track, not outdated at all
Zook getting holeshots is the best thing since sliced bread.

prove me wrong.
kiwifan
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kiwifan 7/8/2019 12:22am
7/8/2019 12:22am
lol if there were 70% Suzukis in the top ten that would be more of a surprise, so lets not get too excited

Fact is, it is not a KTM or Husky leading the championship, I think thats what really matters...in my humble opinion
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Ingjr1
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Ingjr1 7/8/2019 8:00am
7/8/2019 8:00am
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

Dtat720 wrote:
Yes, the pattern is flood the market and skew results.
You know there's a reason there are so many KTM's. Highest priced bike so it sure isn't the price that brings people to KTM.
Dtat720
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Dtat720 7/8/2019 8:16am
7/8/2019 8:16am
Sierra Ranger wrote:
There's a pattern here... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/07/07/358622/s1200_ktm_70.jpg[/img]
There's a pattern here...

Dtat720 wrote:
Yes, the pattern is flood the market and skew results.
Ingjr1 wrote:
You know there's a reason there are so many KTM's. Highest priced bike so it sure isn't the price that brings people to KTM.
That has exactly zero to do with this thread topic. KTM pays riders to race them. They are paying 4 times as many riders as the other brands. Or to put it another way, they are fielding as many factory bikes as all the other brands combined.
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