Suzuki RM 125 AF coming out?

SmokinJoe439
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SmokinJoe439 4/4/2019 12:55pm
4/4/2019 12:55pm
The 19 150sx i rode this past weekend didn't make more power than my 06 yz144. Very disappointed after all the hype over the new ktm's.
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Bruce372
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Bruce372 4/4/2019 1:37pm
4/4/2019 1:37pm
ATKpilot99 wrote:
What would be the advantage over having the engine in the steel chassis that it was designed for other than looking modern ? Plus it's the...
What would be the advantage over having the engine in the steel chassis that it was designed for other than looking modern ? Plus it's the same 125 engine which will likely be down on power compared the the KTM/Husky ? If they really care about having a 125 for amateurs they should use the money they're saving not racing GPs for a new 125 . Wink
Bruce372 wrote:
Exactly, you take the heaviest bike in the class, and then you bolt in an engine from 2005 and expect the bike to keep up with...
Exactly, you take the heaviest bike in the class, and then you bolt in an engine from 2005 and expect the bike to keep up with a modern ktm125.

People have gone mad, there had been a new rm125 coming out every year since they stopped making them 12 years ago
oldblood wrote:
Is the yz125 motor much different than the 05 model? What makes the RMZS heavy, the chassis or the motors, asking sincerely.
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe.

It would be interesting to see if a rm125 af is lighter than a regular 2005 rm125 with steel frame. I doubt it, and I doubt it would handle better either....

Additionally, it's a real long shot to where either bike comes close to a sx125.

FWIW I own a 2004 rm144 and a 2018 tc125, I've never ridden a bike that runs as clean and crisp as the TC. Our rm144 is fast, very fast but not as rideable. The rm144 ergos are good, no different feeling than my rmz450 really
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zehn
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zehn 4/4/2019 1:59pm
4/4/2019 1:59pm
cablecable wrote:
can you idiots not read of course its in an rmz chassis its going to be a kit motor. and its a great idea, its a...
can you idiots not read of course its in an rmz chassis its going to be a kit motor. and its a great idea, its a lot easier and cost effective to build and ship motors than whole bikes.
So I buy a RMZ250, then have to buy a kit 125 motor? Lol, sounds really cost effective.

I'd rather just buy a 125SX/TC125 that's undeniably a better bike than whatever Suzuki comes up with
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Brent
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Brent 4/4/2019 2:07pm
4/4/2019 2:07pm
Bruce372 wrote:
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe. It would be interesting to see if a rm125...
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe.

It would be interesting to see if a rm125 af is lighter than a regular 2005 rm125 with steel frame. I doubt it, and I doubt it would handle better either....

Additionally, it's a real long shot to where either bike comes close to a sx125.

FWIW I own a 2004 rm144 and a 2018 tc125, I've never ridden a bike that runs as clean and crisp as the TC. Our rm144 is fast, very fast but not as rideable. The rm144 ergos are good, no different feeling than my rmz450 really
Wait- didn’t you race that RM at REM back in 2004, and didn’t you have trouble getting that bike to the top of that super steep hill they used to have?

I remember waiting on the gate watching a guy on a 125 Suzuki try to get to the top, everybody was cheering when He made it?

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Shawn142
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Shawn142 4/4/2019 2:14pm
4/4/2019 2:14pm
racingfortheson wrote:
How could this even work? The bike wouldn't be homologated. So by the rules, it wouldn't be able to ride in 125 class.
mattyhamz2 wrote:
x2. Been wondering the same thing since it was originally talked about.
-MAVERICK- wrote:
I'm fairly certain the homologation rule only applies to Pro racing. Amateur racing has different rules.
The only type of bike you can't ride at the amateur level of AMA is electric. I'm sure the rules are a bit fuzzy for the limited class even though it is a production frame and engine, but it would qualify for mod for sure.
Bruce372
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Bruce372 4/4/2019 2:25pm
4/4/2019 2:25pm
Bruce372 wrote:
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe. It would be interesting to see if a rm125...
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe.

It would be interesting to see if a rm125 af is lighter than a regular 2005 rm125 with steel frame. I doubt it, and I doubt it would handle better either....

Additionally, it's a real long shot to where either bike comes close to a sx125.

FWIW I own a 2004 rm144 and a 2018 tc125, I've never ridden a bike that runs as clean and crisp as the TC. Our rm144 is fast, very fast but not as rideable. The rm144 ergos are good, no different feeling than my rmz450 really
Brent wrote:
Wait- didn’t you race that RM at REM back in 2004, and didn’t you have trouble getting that bike to the top of that super steep...
Wait- didn’t you race that RM at REM back in 2004, and didn’t you have trouble getting that bike to the top of that super steep hill they used to have?

I remember waiting on the gate watching a guy on a 125 Suzuki try to get to the top, everybody was cheering when He made it?
Oh boy.....Laughing
Rooster
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Rooster 4/4/2019 2:44pm
4/4/2019 2:44pm
zehn wrote:
So I buy a RMZ250, then have to buy a kit 125 motor? Lol, sounds really cost effective. I'd rather just buy a 125SX/TC125 that's undeniably...
So I buy a RMZ250, then have to buy a kit 125 motor? Lol, sounds really cost effective.

I'd rather just buy a 125SX/TC125 that's undeniably a better bike than whatever Suzuki comes up with
Kart racers have been using separate engine and chassis kits forever. There's no reason why it can't work for motocross too.
rongi#401
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rongi#401 4/4/2019 2:49pm
4/4/2019 2:49pm
Let’s get an email for who we should write

Dear mr Suzuki, if you make a new rm 125 and 250 I will buy one of each
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scottydogmx 4/4/2019 3:53pm
4/4/2019 3:53pm
I've got a chubby on looking at those pics!
KHI Guy
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KHI Guy 4/4/2019 4:18pm
4/4/2019 4:18pm
Falcon wrote:
Not a prototype. Like ML said, the in-house guys here in America converted this bike from an RM-Z250 using an old RM125 engine. This is not...
Not a prototype. Like ML said, the in-house guys here in America converted this bike from an RM-Z250 using an old RM125 engine. This is not an SMC Japan project and right now nobody should speculate about an actual RM125 going into production.

I sure hope the interest this machine generates makes a few people in Japan perk up, however... I sure want one.


All of the race teams/engineers/R&D guys have pet projects like this going on from time to time. There has been some pretty cool stuff that materialized, starting from "Here, hold my beer" moments. Grinning
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oldblood
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oldblood 4/4/2019 4:19pm
4/4/2019 4:19pm
Bruce372 wrote:
Exactly, you take the heaviest bike in the class, and then you bolt in an engine from 2005 and expect the bike to keep up with...
Exactly, you take the heaviest bike in the class, and then you bolt in an engine from 2005 and expect the bike to keep up with a modern ktm125.

People have gone mad, there had been a new rm125 coming out every year since they stopped making them 12 years ago
oldblood wrote:
Is the yz125 motor much different than the 05 model? What makes the RMZS heavy, the chassis or the motors, asking sincerely.
Bruce372 wrote:
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe. It would be interesting to see if a rm125...
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe.

It would be interesting to see if a rm125 af is lighter than a regular 2005 rm125 with steel frame. I doubt it, and I doubt it would handle better either....

Additionally, it's a real long shot to where either bike comes close to a sx125.

FWIW I own a 2004 rm144 and a 2018 tc125, I've never ridden a bike that runs as clean and crisp as the TC. Our rm144 is fast, very fast but not as rideable. The rm144 ergos are good, no different feeling than my rmz450 really
'chassis'= frame, tires, suspension, chain, handle bars, etc, the only thing really different (possibly) is the frame. I think the weight would be okay. I'd be getting the motor spiffy from a motor guy anyway.
Bruce372
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Bruce372 4/4/2019 4:52pm
4/4/2019 4:52pm
oldblood wrote:
Is the yz125 motor much different than the 05 model? What makes the RMZS heavy, the chassis or the motors, asking sincerely.
Bruce372 wrote:
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe. It would be interesting to see if a rm125...
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe.

It would be interesting to see if a rm125 af is lighter than a regular 2005 rm125 with steel frame. I doubt it, and I doubt it would handle better either....

Additionally, it's a real long shot to where either bike comes close to a sx125.

FWIW I own a 2004 rm144 and a 2018 tc125, I've never ridden a bike that runs as clean and crisp as the TC. Our rm144 is fast, very fast but not as rideable. The rm144 ergos are good, no different feeling than my rmz450 really
oldblood wrote:
'chassis'= frame, tires, suspension, chain, handle bars, etc, the only thing really different (possibly) is the frame. I think the weight would be okay. I'd be...
'chassis'= frame, tires, suspension, chain, handle bars, etc, the only thing really different (possibly) is the frame. I think the weight would be okay. I'd be getting the motor spiffy from a motor guy anyway.
I've got both bikes and the thumper is way over built for a 125 engine.
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oldblood
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oldblood 4/4/2019 5:06pm
4/4/2019 5:06pm
Bruce372 wrote:
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe. It would be interesting to see if a rm125...
I would imagine the rmz250 is heaviest in class because of the chassis and engine plus pipe.

It would be interesting to see if a rm125 af is lighter than a regular 2005 rm125 with steel frame. I doubt it, and I doubt it would handle better either....

Additionally, it's a real long shot to where either bike comes close to a sx125.

FWIW I own a 2004 rm144 and a 2018 tc125, I've never ridden a bike that runs as clean and crisp as the TC. Our rm144 is fast, very fast but not as rideable. The rm144 ergos are good, no different feeling than my rmz450 really
oldblood wrote:
'chassis'= frame, tires, suspension, chain, handle bars, etc, the only thing really different (possibly) is the frame. I think the weight would be okay. I'd be...
'chassis'= frame, tires, suspension, chain, handle bars, etc, the only thing really different (possibly) is the frame. I think the weight would be okay. I'd be getting the motor spiffy from a motor guy anyway.
Bruce372 wrote:
I've got both bikes and the thumper is way over built for a 125 engine.
Thankfully, you are re-enforcing my post on a previous thread, that the 'big three'(out of the original big 4), could simply resume production of their most recent 125s with updated suspension, bng, and contingency.
Falcon
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Falcon 4/4/2019 5:14pm
4/4/2019 5:14pm
Brent wrote:
..the thing I don't get is, Suzuki bike sales are way down, right? They also know that if they did start producing an RM 125 again...
..the thing I don't get is, Suzuki bike sales are way down, right?

They also know that if they did start producing an RM 125 again, they would sell out very bike they make, right?

So, what keeps Suzuki from producing a 125 MX bike? Is Japanese corporate culture so fucked up that the marketing people in the USA don't dare tell upper management that there is a market for this bike?

It's not that the marketing people in the USA don't dare tell the execs in Japan; it's the following:

1) Japan hasn't agreed yet
2) USA isn't convinced, themselves
3) Nobody knows how many RM-Z250s they wouldn't sell if they brought this bike to market
4) It costs a lot to fire up a production line to make a different model, even if you didn't have to spend new R&D money; that investment had better pay off big time. Do you want to be the guy who signs on the dotted line and approves this model?
5) Your idea and mine about what constitutes "a successful number" of sales may be very different from SMC's.


I'm sure there are additional reasons I'm not even considering. Still, it makes sense to have an interim bike that bridges the gap from an 85 to a 250F. That's what the technical guys are looking at here.

As for me, I'd buy a new 125 the minute they go on sale if it ever arrives.
Bruce372
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Bruce372 4/4/2019 5:14pm
4/4/2019 5:14pm
oldblood wrote:
'chassis'= frame, tires, suspension, chain, handle bars, etc, the only thing really different (possibly) is the frame. I think the weight would be okay. I'd be...
'chassis'= frame, tires, suspension, chain, handle bars, etc, the only thing really different (possibly) is the frame. I think the weight would be okay. I'd be getting the motor spiffy from a motor guy anyway.
Bruce372 wrote:
I've got both bikes and the thumper is way over built for a 125 engine.
oldblood wrote:
Thankfully, you are re-enforcing my post on a previous thread, that the 'big three'(out of the original big 4), could simply resume production of their most...
Thankfully, you are re-enforcing my post on a previous thread, that the 'big three'(out of the original big 4), could simply resume production of their most recent 125s with updated suspension, bng, and contingency.
All the Japanese 125s seem really good in theory, looking through the rose tinted glasses of nostalgia... then you get on the tc125 and all bets are off! Lol

I know an expert level rider in UK and the 2019 sx150 with a couple of hours on the dyno and it's a lot.of bike.
Bret
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Bret 4/4/2019 5:28pm
4/4/2019 5:28pm
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Why is it so hard for them to realize there is a market out there for a production version of this? I'd put a deposit down...
Why is it so hard for them to realize there is a market out there for a production version of this?

I'd put a deposit down tomorrow at my local dealer for one.
roninho wrote:
Don't know about the USA, but over here at every club, amateur or pro event >25% of the bikes are 125cc. It's not that they don't...
Don't know about the USA, but over here at every club, amateur or pro event >25% of the bikes are 125cc. It's not that they don't realize there is a demand, they just don't want to serve this market.
I think they have a pretty good idea what the demand is. I also think they have a really good idea how sustainable the demand is or isn't. Let's just pretend that they did offer the kit. Who would be authorized to perform the installation? Who is going to be on the hook if the resulting vehicle results in some sort of injury caused by the installation? I doubt that Suzuki wants to deal with the possible liability. Just my opinion.
b.mohler
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b.mohler 4/4/2019 6:15pm
4/4/2019 6:15pm
I haven't yet seen it discussed on here but Suzuki Japan went through some big organizational changes April 1st that include the separation and restuctering of the motorcycle division from the rest of Suzuki. The new facility that was built in Hamamatsu, Japan is where they are operating out of. The current president is very much wanting to grow the motorcycle side of the house and I've heard rumors that the new chief engineer that has been placed in charge of the off-road division has some prior experience with electric motorcycles.... Hopefully some more cool shit will start to appear in the future!!

https://www.globalsuzuki.com/globalnews/2019/0329.html
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Jeff_Crutcher 4/4/2019 6:57pm
4/4/2019 6:57pm
Am I the only one to notice the shroud says RMZ..? It’s a kit. Not a new bike.
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bd
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bd 4/4/2019 9:19pm
4/4/2019 9:19pm
Zook should dive into the 2 stroke market. The 125 and 250 models would sell like hot cakes.
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JMX82
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JMX82 4/4/2019 9:36pm
4/4/2019 9:36pm
I don't see the point of this bike. Finnish rider Emil Weckman tried to ride RM125 AF buildt by Italian team in EMX125 class couple years ago. Bike was too heavy and under powered against KTM's, Husky's and Yamaha's. Eventually the team folded up and Emil ended up racing with KTM's with much better results.

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Bruce372
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Bruce372 4/4/2019 9:42pm
4/4/2019 9:42pm
JMX82 wrote:
I don't see the point of this bike. Finnish rider Emil Weckman tried to ride RM125 AF buildt by Italian team in EMX125 class couple years...
I don't see the point of this bike. Finnish rider Emil Weckman tried to ride RM125 AF buildt by Italian team in EMX125 class couple years ago. Bike was too heavy and under powered against KTM's, Husky's and Yamaha's. Eventually the team folded up and Emil ended up racing with KTM's with much better results.

Ouch.
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Rotaholic
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Rotaholic 4/4/2019 11:37pm
4/4/2019 11:37pm
I don't want to race a rm125, I just want to own one cause I like them, over weight and underpowered doesn't bother me, I have a 450 race bike for that fix. I would buy one today ?
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roninho
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roninho 4/5/2019 1:15am
4/5/2019 1:15am
The current ktm's and Huskies make 40 hp stock, a suzuki probably 32-33?

If i'm Suzuki i'm simply restoring the old production lines and start a one make (youth?) serie for suzuki 125's, and offer the bikes new for $1000 less, and limit the after market add ons. Basically what Rotax Max did in karting.

Lower costs to buy a bike, lower costs maintenance wise and level playing field performance wise.

Should be a way to make money on for suzuki and its dealers, and also important: build brand loyalty with the younger racers.
VetMX.com
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VetMX.com 4/6/2019 9:09am
4/6/2019 9:09am
I would be more likely to buy a steel framed version with new suspension. I love my 2005 and rode 2 thirty minute motos yesterday on it.

The brakes and the way it turns...amazing.


KTM150 VS. RM125

Skip to 3:00.
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oldblood
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oldblood 12/15/2019 6:24pm
12/15/2019 6:24pm
So, what the Hell happened?
dpingree101
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dpingree101 12/15/2019 8:46pm
12/15/2019 8:46pm
Yep years ago they built these bike and took them to LL to display. They had petitions there to see how many signatures they could get in support of it to take back to Japan. As you can imagine, people loved it. When I talked to Chris Wheeler about it, he said Japan just won’t move on it, despite calls from Stefan Everts when he was managing the Suzuki team in Europe. A Ray raved this bike at a two stroke race, as did another rider. It’s been floating around. Fingers crossed they do pull the trigger, but not holding my breath.
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oldblood
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oldblood 12/15/2019 8:59pm
12/15/2019 8:59pm
I feel like I know what is wrong with mx. I don't know if I can articulate it. But I'll try,
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oldblood
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oldblood 12/15/2019 9:17pm
12/15/2019 9:17pm Edited Date/Time 12/16/2019 5:25am
I'm trying to get the kids to bed, and I have to work at 7, 2 hours away. So I'll keep it short.
I would suggest everyone watch 'On any Sunday ', especially the opening sequence. It promoted motorcycling as everyone's activity. Of course it presented pro's as the elete. But still obtainable.
The sport has evolved into it's own extinction.
I remember local races with multiple divisions, where now there are 5 on the gate. Something has been lost. The involvement of the average guy has deminished. Of course there are many reasons for this. But I believe that the 125 class is a way to keep many involved that otherwise would bail.
Watch On any Sunday and think about it.
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Deja New
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Deja New 12/15/2019 10:36pm
12/15/2019 10:36pm
isn't that the same movie they said Yamaha should stick to making pianos? Watched on any sunday until the VHS broke, loved it and you're right.
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Drop-Bear
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Drop-Bear 12/16/2019 12:49pm
12/16/2019 12:49pm
SmokinJoe439 wrote:
I approve now please build it!! RM 144 please!!!
Older model, but close enough


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