How does this sport make sense?

willie838
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I was just watching the moto Nation series on YouTube. (Troy is a God and deserves a statue made of his likeness)

Season 2 covers the season that jmart was going for his 3rd consecutive 250mx title. Field contained Webb, mcelrath, Adam cianciarulo, savatgy, forkner (rookie season).

Season 2 episode 5 highlighted J Martin. This season, he left the Farm because Ricky brought in Savatgy and his new trainer....

Martin made a really stunning statement in this episode though, regarding the cost of training out of the farm..... "I was tapped out. I was living paycheck to paycheck and something had to change."

This made me really question...

What is the economic viability of this sport? Picturing an amateur career leading to the pros.

If you look at top flight amateur prospects, parents are looking at least a 500k debt in the face, but if they make pro then you'd at least figure that they "made it.".....

But no JMart continued digging to train at the farm under the tutelage of the GOAT, Johnny O, Jeannie Carmichael... Plus had to pay trainers and practice mechanics.... To the extent that he, as a 2x reigning defending national champion was living paycheck to paycheck....

I just really don't understand the economic viability of this sport. It makes sense for the top 2-3 450 and probably top 6 250 riders....... So approx 10 riders the system works for, of the hundreds of pros, and tens of thousands of amateurs that matriculate down into those slots.

The rate of attrition is so high, multiplied by the chance of ruin, I would think that all parents should steer their children towards almost any other sport, for the financial health of the family and future financial well being of their child.


/////////

It just seems so different from when my old man brought home a busted up 80 he got for 400 that I putted around on a few few years, then grabbed a solid newer kx80 for 1500...

I don't want this to devolve into a 4 stroke debate/boot party but at the end of the day I'd say that the 4 stroke is the elephant in the room as far as culprits to cost inefficiency.

Anyway, just wondering what people thought about this?
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Sierra Ranger
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3/26/2019 3:34pm
There is so much focus on the amateur side, that when these guys get in the pros, there is no money and they often fail. For some reason a kid at Loretta's gets much more focus than a guy in his second year in the pros. It is kind of backward.
But in the several decades around the sport, people have complained about cost. I remember MXA flipping out when bikes starting hitting $2k retail.
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3/26/2019 3:35pm Edited Date/Time 3/26/2019 3:36pm
A 250 Champion?

Aren't most second division (Non premiere-class/league) athletes in most sports living paycheck to paycheck, champion or not?
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2
3/26/2019 3:40pm
A 250 Champion?

Aren't most second division (Non premiere-class/league) athletes in most sports living paycheck to paycheck, champion or not?
Makes me wonder if drivers in the Xfinity series in nascar make a decent living or not.
Braaaphole
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3/26/2019 3:40pm
The structure of the sport is very flawed, but the racers do it for the passion and love not the money.
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The Shop

3/26/2019 3:46pm Edited Date/Time 3/26/2019 3:49pm
A 250 Champion?

Aren't most second division (Non premiere-class/league) athletes in most sports living paycheck to paycheck, champion or not?
Makes me wonder if drivers in the Xfinity series in nascar make a decent living or not.
They may do well (I don't know), but if they do, it is more the exception than the rule for Div 2 pro athletes.
sumdood
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3/26/2019 3:53pm
How does this sport make sense ? Well for starters............









uuummmm.....








nevermind I got nuthin







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3/26/2019 3:55pm
How does it make sense?

Easy...
















Cuz chicks dig it, bro! Don't need any other reason than that.
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Tarz483
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3/26/2019 4:13pm Edited Date/Time 3/26/2019 4:22pm
Im thinking that cant be right, if he is living paycheck to paycheck my guess would be that he had most of his $$
Invested somewhere and therefore living, paycheck to paycheck,
that
Or he was Paying A real lot to train at The Carmichael farm
But i still have a hard time thinking he was actually real low on $$ he had already had factory contracts gear contracts etc at that point that just dont add up.

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Titan1
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3/26/2019 4:17pm
Because its fun?

Oh, you meant at the pro level? In that case, I have no idea....
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aeffertz
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3/26/2019 5:49pm
How does J Mart paying certain trainers a lot of money have anything to do with 2 stroke vs. 4 stroke?
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rjg
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3/26/2019 5:51pm Edited Date/Time 3/26/2019 5:53pm
It's not just this sport. Deep pockets are required in all sports to go far. I would say "generally speaking" that the higher the initial cost it is to play, the greater $ required. Obviously there are exceptions depending on enthusiasm and talent oh and stupidity (my self included).
zehn
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3/26/2019 6:06pm
aeffertz wrote:
How does J Mart paying certain trainers a lot of money have anything to do with 2 stroke vs. 4 stroke?
Because this is Vital
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sumdood
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3/26/2019 6:22pm
mattyhamz2 wrote:
How does it make sense?

Easy...
















Cuz chicks dig it, bro! Don't need any other reason than that.
They dig it until you stop making money cause of it anyway ??
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3/26/2019 6:37pm Edited Date/Time 3/26/2019 6:38pm
The only sense I can make of this sport is that it taught me to introduce my kids to golf and tennis. I’ll gladly dedicate the time for Those sports if they’re into it ! Return on investment seems much better. Physically and monetary.
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3/26/2019 6:54pm
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to much cash and risk way too many life altering injuries.

I have a 12 year old - if he wanted to race motocross even on the amateur level - forget professionally- we would have had to have started much younger and he’d be on a 125 now - I’d be minimum $10k into it not counting travel expenses, race fees, schools, and everything else.

But he won’t ever race. He is currently 5’11” 190lbs, can kick slide quickly and is known as a stud left tackle in Texas. He will come off the line and FUCK you up. He gets the best cleats, cutter gloves, decent helmet (Riddel Revolution) and shoulder pads each year plus registration fees. Comparatively, I’ve maybe spent $3k on this sport.

Do I want my son to ride motocross and do what I did? Hell yes but there’s just no sense in it - #1 he is way too big - #2 it’s always been an elite sport that won’t do shit monetarily for those outside the top 15. It sucked before but really got fucked four ways from Sunday when the 125 class went to four strokes. That is what killed this sport - the 250f for 250 fuck you. $15k to compete with a 13k rpm grenade. no thanks
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carmfarm
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3/26/2019 10:03pm
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to...
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to much cash and risk way too many life altering injuries.

I have a 12 year old - if he wanted to race motocross even on the amateur level - forget professionally- we would have had to have started much younger and he’d be on a 125 now - I’d be minimum $10k into it not counting travel expenses, race fees, schools, and everything else.

But he won’t ever race. He is currently 5’11” 190lbs, can kick slide quickly and is known as a stud left tackle in Texas. He will come off the line and FUCK you up. He gets the best cleats, cutter gloves, decent helmet (Riddel Revolution) and shoulder pads each year plus registration fees. Comparatively, I’ve maybe spent $3k on this sport.

Do I want my son to ride motocross and do what I did? Hell yes but there’s just no sense in it - #1 he is way too big - #2 it’s always been an elite sport that won’t do shit monetarily for those outside the top 15. It sucked before but really got fucked four ways from Sunday when the 125 class went to four strokes. That is what killed this sport - the 250f for 250 fuck you. $15k to compete with a 13k rpm grenade. no thanks
Exactly correct
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milliebays
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3/26/2019 11:19pm
Makes about as much sense as what baseball players get paid.
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Indy mxer
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3/27/2019 4:20am Edited Date/Time 3/27/2019 4:24am
A lot of things in life we spend money on don't make sense. It's about having fun and living life to the fullest.

I've got a mountain bike and a Kawi SxS besides 2 mx bikes. Used to have a Harley and a jet ski. None of these make sense. For me they don't have to. It's about spending my hard earned money the way I want.

I think those parents feel the same way. When my boys were growing up we went to races together and I'm glad we did. We only did local stuff but the memories are priceless. Our kids are all grown now and have families. Have fun with them while you can. They grow up too fast.
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Preston412
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3/27/2019 6:28am
Because it will put the human body and mind through a rigorous test until it breaks. Fear is our limit that gets pushed out and replaced by every accomplishment, got to love MX and SX
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Airick
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3/27/2019 6:45am
It makes sense to do for fun, to whatever degree you can afford, just don't try to keep up with the Jones, it takes the fun away.

The pro league is just a giant commercial, still fun to watch though.
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3/27/2019 6:49am
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to...
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to much cash and risk way too many life altering injuries.

I have a 12 year old - if he wanted to race motocross even on the amateur level - forget professionally- we would have had to have started much younger and he’d be on a 125 now - I’d be minimum $10k into it not counting travel expenses, race fees, schools, and everything else.

But he won’t ever race. He is currently 5’11” 190lbs, can kick slide quickly and is known as a stud left tackle in Texas. He will come off the line and FUCK you up. He gets the best cleats, cutter gloves, decent helmet (Riddel Revolution) and shoulder pads each year plus registration fees. Comparatively, I’ve maybe spent $3k on this sport.

Do I want my son to ride motocross and do what I did? Hell yes but there’s just no sense in it - #1 he is way too big - #2 it’s always been an elite sport that won’t do shit monetarily for those outside the top 15. It sucked before but really got fucked four ways from Sunday when the 125 class went to four strokes. That is what killed this sport - the 250f for 250 fuck you. $15k to compete with a 13k rpm grenade. no thanks
So everything is about "making it" and getting paid?
Pro level, that is probably not happening either way, in any sport.
Why would you have had to start much younger and be on a 125 at 12yo? For racing amateurs, why is it not enough to just race or ride.
Compete on your own terms, at your own pace.
It's mindsets like yours that tear on the sport.
"Little Johnny's too big, lets play football instead", sure that might be accurate, He's probably not the next RC, but if everyone thinks like you, then we can all pack it in right away.
Where's the love for the sport?
The feeling of learning something new, like railing that turn, thats priceless, even if you're not winning, and even if you're riding a 4yo (or 14) bike.
This sport is living because people do it out of love, not to get paid.
IF my kids want to race, they'll race. If they go pro? Who TF cares? They're kids, let them have fun, and not figure life out at 12yo.
I just hope i never have to choose the sport for them, using bullshit reasons like "you're too big".
Where's the love, man?
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mxb2
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3/27/2019 6:51am
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to...
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to much cash and risk way too many life altering injuries.

I have a 12 year old - if he wanted to race motocross even on the amateur level - forget professionally- we would have had to have started much younger and he’d be on a 125 now - I’d be minimum $10k into it not counting travel expenses, race fees, schools, and everything else.

But he won’t ever race. He is currently 5’11” 190lbs, can kick slide quickly and is known as a stud left tackle in Texas. He will come off the line and FUCK you up. He gets the best cleats, cutter gloves, decent helmet (Riddel Revolution) and shoulder pads each year plus registration fees. Comparatively, I’ve maybe spent $3k on this sport.

Do I want my son to ride motocross and do what I did? Hell yes but there’s just no sense in it - #1 he is way too big - #2 it’s always been an elite sport that won’t do shit monetarily for those outside the top 15. It sucked before but really got fucked four ways from Sunday when the 125 class went to four strokes. That is what killed this sport - the 250f for 250 fuck you. $15k to compete with a 13k rpm grenade. no thanks
Bowers is 6 3. 205lbs..
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mx317
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3/27/2019 6:58am
I can tell you what this sport did for me. I was on the road to no good when I started racing. When I started racing I wanted to do well which required me to take better care of myself and quit doing the things that could have led to my demise. It taught me that hard work and that self discipline pays off. I had some talent, but not enough to make a living at the pro level (even though I tried). I still race and don't worry about falling into the party scene anymore at my age, but it still helps keep me much more fit than I would be if I didn't race. So to answer your question, it makes sense to me.
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3/27/2019 7:03am
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to...
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to much cash and risk way too many life altering injuries.

I have a 12 year old - if he wanted to race motocross even on the amateur level - forget professionally- we would have had to have started much younger and he’d be on a 125 now - I’d be minimum $10k into it not counting travel expenses, race fees, schools, and everything else.

But he won’t ever race. He is currently 5’11” 190lbs, can kick slide quickly and is known as a stud left tackle in Texas. He will come off the line and FUCK you up. He gets the best cleats, cutter gloves, decent helmet (Riddel Revolution) and shoulder pads each year plus registration fees. Comparatively, I’ve maybe spent $3k on this sport.

Do I want my son to ride motocross and do what I did? Hell yes but there’s just no sense in it - #1 he is way too big - #2 it’s always been an elite sport that won’t do shit monetarily for those outside the top 15. It sucked before but really got fucked four ways from Sunday when the 125 class went to four strokes. That is what killed this sport - the 250f for 250 fuck you. $15k to compete with a 13k rpm grenade. no thanks
mxb2 wrote:
Bowers is 6 3. 205lbs..
David Knight and Ken de Dycker, also decent sized guys.
drt410
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3/27/2019 7:32am Edited Date/Time 3/27/2019 7:35am
To be fair JMart living paycheck to paycheck also says nothing about the sport. Anyone can live paycheck to paycheck if theyre bad with their finances. He won those championships on his rookie deal too which set him up for when he signed to Honda, but the timing is what it is. He also wasnt a top prospect coming to 250s so he was going to sign for less, luckily he won though to get bonuses and sign a big next contract. Theres lots of factors.

Im not saying its perfect, but I am saying one persons contract situation says next to nothing about a sport overall. Also he could have been making a lot of money, but spending a lot at Carmichaels, so by leaving now he keeps more. Theres not enough info here.

He is making more money than the vast majority of people doing something that we all love though. He is making a lot of money, but even if he was making normal money would u want to make normal money at a shmuck job or racing..
mxb2
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3/27/2019 8:05am
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to...
Motocross in my opinion is NOTHING like other sports - sports that my boys can participate and head for the pro level without spending way to much cash and risk way too many life altering injuries.

I have a 12 year old - if he wanted to race motocross even on the amateur level - forget professionally- we would have had to have started much younger and he’d be on a 125 now - I’d be minimum $10k into it not counting travel expenses, race fees, schools, and everything else.

But he won’t ever race. He is currently 5’11” 190lbs, can kick slide quickly and is known as a stud left tackle in Texas. He will come off the line and FUCK you up. He gets the best cleats, cutter gloves, decent helmet (Riddel Revolution) and shoulder pads each year plus registration fees. Comparatively, I’ve maybe spent $3k on this sport.

Do I want my son to ride motocross and do what I did? Hell yes but there’s just no sense in it - #1 he is way too big - #2 it’s always been an elite sport that won’t do shit monetarily for those outside the top 15. It sucked before but really got fucked four ways from Sunday when the 125 class went to four strokes. That is what killed this sport - the 250f for 250 fuck you. $15k to compete with a 13k rpm grenade. no thanks
mxb2 wrote:
Bowers is 6 3. 205lbs..
David Knight and Ken de Dycker, also decent sized guys.
Exactly. Kdub, milsaps, peick. Blose, herlings. Etc.
3/27/2019 8:15am Edited Date/Time 3/27/2019 8:15am
This sport isn't a PROFESSIONAL sport.

It's just a really hard activity that's incredibly fun we call a sport.

MX Sports, Feld, and every promoter before them is killing it.
The riders are getting killed.

And the OEMS - for the love of it - subsidize it.

There are ways to make money - and in Feld's eye they provide a rider a platform to make money - but the reality is the platform is rickity, barely stable, and not very visible.

I don't have any answer - but when a 1 off event (US open/monster cup) can pay like it does, then surely each SX could pay the same

All that Fly money that came in for SX and MX - is straight to Feld and MX sports. Be nice if every series sponsor who came on board - a percentage of the deal went into the pot for payout. And if we had a rider collective - we could make that happen.

All sx riders HAVE TO HAVE monster on their bike on the number plate (it's super tiny). But - none reap any of the gains of that. Makes no sense....




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cody41
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3/27/2019 8:35am
mx317 wrote:
I can tell you what this sport did for me. I was on the road to no good when I started racing. When I started racing...
I can tell you what this sport did for me. I was on the road to no good when I started racing. When I started racing I wanted to do well which required me to take better care of myself and quit doing the things that could have led to my demise. It taught me that hard work and that self discipline pays off. I had some talent, but not enough to make a living at the pro level (even though I tried). I still race and don't worry about falling into the party scene anymore at my age, but it still helps keep me much more fit than I would be if I didn't race. So to answer your question, it makes sense to me.
X2 for me
Marty1028
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3/27/2019 10:10am
It makes sense because....

well maybe not, i was homeschooled trying to go pro so i cant figure it outBlink Blink
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Tarz483
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3/27/2019 10:21am
1. Big Seperation between someone doing it totally as a hobby and someone wanting to make it a career,
2. even if someone is trying to make it a career its a long shot and takes full commitment from the rider and his parents. And if all the right ingredients aren't there especially these days than it dont make sense.

Buuut then again, how much fun are the guys in 18th to 22nd place or even right on the edge of making the main having?
Those memories are priceless and they make a lot of connections with people they may work with in the future in some way .
There are a lot if angles.

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