MX Sports & Electric Motorcycles

TXDirt
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TXDirt 3/29/2018 4:20pm
3/29/2018 4:20pm
Zaugg wrote:
So let me get this straight...you guys are pissed because AMA and MX Sports are doing their due dilgence to make sure electric bikes fit correctly...
So let me get this straight...you guys are pissed because AMA and MX Sports are doing their due dilgence to make sure electric bikes fit correctly into a class.

While I understand the lack of trust for the AMA and MX Sports at times, I can't understand why anyone would object to researching this futher to make sure the bikes are classed appropriately.

Oh wait, we're a shoot first...aim second society.



Are you at all familiar about the politics and conflicts of interest between MXSports/AMA/OEMs ???

Just by your post I will say no.
Bressler11
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Bressler11 3/29/2018 4:53pm
3/29/2018 4:53pm
We finally have a solid American Motorcycle Manufacturer and Coombs says no, even to the open class?
Dropbear
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Dropbear 3/29/2018 4:55pm
3/29/2018 4:55pm
Honda could bring out a competitive e-bike tomorrow with the work Mugen has done. I haven’t heard anything. Conflict of interests.
R.EX
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R.EX 3/29/2018 5:02pm
3/29/2018 5:02pm
I know there were already a handful of people who were already planning on going to LL with an Alta, I can just imagine how bummed they are.

The Shop

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RACERX69
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RACERX69 3/29/2018 5:43pm
3/29/2018 5:43pm Edited Date/Time 3/29/2018 5:45pm
Ease up fellas, Honda and MX Sports have got this!! I'm sure whatever they decide will be equitable for all!!

NOT!!!!
es337
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es337 3/29/2018 5:50pm
3/29/2018 5:50pm
Something to think about. Honda is an engine company first. They make their cars and motorcycles to sell their engines. Its not a surprise that honda is one of the later oems to embrace a hybrid car for that reason.
Phillip_Lamb
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Phillip_Lamb 3/29/2018 6:00pm
3/29/2018 6:00pm
Brad460 wrote:
Change is frightening..progress is scary.

We wonder why the sport is not growing..this slow adoption of technology isn't helpful to our future.
or....before you suddenly adapt a new technology wholesale you do some due diligence. No reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I think this is a fair move. this shouldve been done with four strokes.
kzizok
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kzizok 3/29/2018 6:17pm
3/29/2018 6:17pm Edited Date/Time 3/29/2018 6:21pm
Meh. Important to get this thing right, especially at a time where motorsports are receding at an alarming rate. Get it wrong, like last time, and the sport may never recover. I think electric is the future but having a future is the most important thing at this time.

Remember, what doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is called? It appears someone may be trying something different for a different result.

Edit: pretty much said the same thing as Lamb^^^^
Brad460
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Brad460 3/29/2018 6:38pm
3/29/2018 6:38pm Edited Date/Time 3/29/2018 6:40pm
Brad460 wrote:
Change is frightening..progress is scary.

We wonder why the sport is not growing..this slow adoption of technology isn't helpful to our future.
Phillip_Lamb wrote:
or....before you suddenly adapt a new technology wholesale you do some due diligence. No reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater. I think this...
or....before you suddenly adapt a new technology wholesale you do some due diligence. No reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I think this is a fair move. this shouldve been done with four strokes.
I think msp332 sums it up well (from his post above):

“2009: All-electric 24-hr motocross race is held with Zero Motorcycles.
2011: Redshift is unveiled.
2016: Redshift in production, available to public. No homologation in 2016.
2018: MX Sports, “Electric motorcycles bring a new and unknown technology…
No timeline given for allowing any electric-powered motorcycles to compete.”


How much more time is needed? If they were responsible at managing the sport of motocross they would have started this “due diligence” a couple years ago..
racin mason
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racin mason 3/29/2018 6:52pm
3/29/2018 6:52pm
I say let them race this year!Most of the top talent is already committed to the big 5.Lets see how the ALTA stacks up against the current crop of machinery ,then adjust the rules accordingly,or add an electric only class.
Tim507
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Tim507 3/29/2018 6:55pm
3/29/2018 6:55pm
Stretch67 wrote:
Really dumb and short sighted IMO. I understand the A and B classes but the Vet and open classes. From Release: "Until further information is known...
Really dumb and short sighted IMO.

I understand the A and B classes but the Vet and open classes.


From Release:

"Until further information is known on the performance comparison between combustion and electric motorcycles, it would be pre-mature to allow these machines to compete at the national level."

You don't gain a further information by excluding. Let them race and then next year you can change something if need be.

To me this has the big OEM's putting a stop to it.

CONTROLEvil
CG118
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CG118 3/29/2018 7:31pm
3/29/2018 7:31pm
This smells.
Are the vet classes open or NOT?

Serious question. Is there a min or max engine size in the vet classes at LL?
Pdub
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Pdub 3/29/2018 8:03pm
3/29/2018 8:03pm
It's one race. Chill.
TJMX947
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TJMX947 3/29/2018 8:09pm
3/29/2018 8:09pm
IMO They should just add an Electric Open class to each Regional and invite those riders to the Ranch. Its not like there are thousands of Alta owners dying to go to Loretta's. At that point they could make some comparisons and gather data.
Ozzy
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Ozzy 3/29/2018 8:51pm
3/29/2018 8:51pm
Electric & Electric.
4stk & 4stk.
2stk & 2stk.
Anything but the above is a Royal Cluster Fuck!!
History in our Lil Sport has already stamped this to be so.
#CommonSense
DavetheVintageGuy 3/29/2018 8:53pm
3/29/2018 8:53pm
My 2013 KTM 450 puts out approximately 58 horses. It's legal for any Vet class. A 2001 Honda CR500 can potentially put out 70+ when massaged by a good tuner. It's legal for any Vet class.

Who's going to say that the Alta (which Alta says is aimed at the 250 4 stroke) is going to exceed the power put out by a CR500? And it weighs 260 lbs. Tell me again what needs to be researched for these classes.

It's not like the kids are buying a 14K electric bike, what classes are they most likely to end up in? What better way to evaluate them than to let them run in the Vet classes...

I smell what the Japanese are cooking and it's methed upSick
Zaugg
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Zaugg 3/29/2018 8:59pm
3/29/2018 8:59pm
TXDirt wrote:
Are you at all familiar about the politics and conflicts of interest between MXSports/AMA/OEMs ???

Just by your post I will say no.
You must be able to read minds. I lost that ability at birth...haha

Read my post again...especially the part where I mentioned the lack of trust for MX Sports and the AMA.

If I'm Alta, I'd want my bike to race in a class where it's competitive to make it look competitive and a viable racing option. Not in a class, at the national level, where it looks like a poor choice.





wfo4ever
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wfo4ever 3/29/2018 9:04pm
3/29/2018 9:04pm
Money and Greed as usual control motocross. Great way to grow the future of the sport, no electric bikes allowed. That is not common sense, it is nonsense. Alta should start their own series. Who needs those other jerk offs anyway. They will loose in the long run anyway, not enough new young riders will sink their ship.

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Dropbear
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Dropbear 3/29/2018 11:00pm
3/29/2018 11:00pm
It’s strange but I’m losing interest, and I’m not consciously trying to, in cars and bikes with ICE’s. It’s starting to seem like old technology.
colintrax
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colintrax 3/29/2018 11:34pm
3/29/2018 11:34pm
Brad460 wrote:
I think msp332 sums it up well (from his post above): “2009: All-electric 24-hr motocross race is held with Zero Motorcycles. 2011: Redshift is unveiled. 2016...
I think msp332 sums it up well (from his post above):

“2009: All-electric 24-hr motocross race is held with Zero Motorcycles.
2011: Redshift is unveiled.
2016: Redshift in production, available to public. No homologation in 2016.
2018: MX Sports, “Electric motorcycles bring a new and unknown technology…
No timeline given for allowing any electric-powered motorcycles to compete.”


How much more time is needed? If they were responsible at managing the sport of motocross they would have started this “due diligence” a couple years ago..
Exactly. I've been saying for years the ama needs to set rules for electric bikes BEFORE the bikes showed up. They knew it was coming. Hybrid cars, electric cars, electric RC cars, and so on have been going strong for over a decade now.
Hell my cordless impact is nearly as strong as my air impact.
No reason to not let the Alta race open class and see how it stacks up.
Jaze
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Jaze 3/30/2018 2:36am
3/30/2018 2:36am
This is typical BS in mx sports.
I wasnt suprised that they didnt allow them run in any class and it wont happen in near future. Sad but true.
No wonder why money isnt in mx anymore.
RichardLoots 3/30/2018 2:54am
3/30/2018 2:54am
there are rumours Tonkov is back for a single race @ the russian GP and possibly on a Alta
Whymee 3/30/2018 4:48am
3/30/2018 4:48am
There is absolutely no reason why the Alta should not be allowed in the age classes at LL.

DC & CO. needs to get there heads out of the sand. Or go the way of the Dodo bird...

If it wasn't for an upcoming surgery that will put me out of action for most of the season, I would have a MXR right beside my 18 TC250.


motomike137
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motomike137 3/30/2018 6:06am
3/30/2018 6:06am
Like many have said they should be allowed at least in the vet classes. Also why not add an exhibition class for them. If they take more than a year to rule on this than imho opinion they are stalling because the big 5 are making the call. I am likely going to by one as my next bike.
Bearuno
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Bearuno 3/30/2018 6:29am
3/30/2018 6:29am Edited Date/Time 3/30/2018 6:34am
MX Sports are going to have to face up to E Bikes soon. KTM are dropping their ICE 50s for E minis, so they'll conveniently have it sorted by then......

As for the Alta- the Open / 450 class is what they should be allowed in, in National / International level (and amateur ) events. I bet if Honda turned up with that Electric MXer they showed a while back, it would be 'In Like Flynn'.
gt80rider
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gt80rider 3/30/2018 6:49am
3/30/2018 6:49am
Markee wrote:
"Together with the AMA and OEM’s, MX Sports will work to develop equipment rules and class structure so that these machines can be included in the...
"Together with the AMA and OEM’s, MX Sports will work to develop equipment rules and class structure so that these machines can be included in the program in the future where appropriate."

I'm sure Alta has a warm and fuzzy ready that...

Those guys are about to learn all about kV ratings, pole counts, electrical timing, mechanical timing, cell counts, "C" ratings, lithium cobalt oxide vs lithium iron phosphate, etc.... LOL.

I see the side of the sanctioning body. They want to make accurate rules, they want to make precise rules, fair rules, etc. However, unless there is someone working up in there that legit knows what they are doing in the BL/Li world, they will be absolutely clueless.

RPM68
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RPM68 3/30/2018 6:54am
3/30/2018 6:54am
wonder what the correlation between those complaining about this and also those begging for 2-strokes to be made again?

I for one appreciate them taking their time to make sure this gives the other OEMs an opportunity towards investing in a future without it being such a grey area still. However I think the open classes should be able to still “Run what ya brung.”
Johnny Depp
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Johnny Depp 3/30/2018 6:55am
3/30/2018 6:55am Edited Date/Time 3/30/2018 6:56am
Markee wrote:
"Together with the AMA and OEM’s, MX Sports will work to develop equipment rules and class structure so that these machines can be included in the...
"Together with the AMA and OEM’s, MX Sports will work to develop equipment rules and class structure so that these machines can be included in the program in the future where appropriate."

I'm sure Alta has a warm and fuzzy ready that...

gt80rider wrote:
Those guys are about to learn all about kV ratings, pole counts, electrical timing, mechanical timing, cell counts, "C" ratings, lithium cobalt oxide vs lithium iron...
Those guys are about to learn all about kV ratings, pole counts, electrical timing, mechanical timing, cell counts, "C" ratings, lithium cobalt oxide vs lithium iron phosphate, etc.... LOL.

I see the side of the sanctioning body. They want to make accurate rules, they want to make precise rules, fair rules, etc. However, unless there is someone working up in there that legit knows what they are doing in the BL/Li world, they will be absolutely clueless.

You've got it all wrong. There is no need to know how to build a watch, you just need to know what time it is.

OPEN class.
ML512
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ML512 3/30/2018 6:57am
3/30/2018 6:57am
es337 wrote:
Something to think about. Honda is an engine company first. They make their cars and motorcycles to sell their engines. Its not a surprise that honda...
Something to think about. Honda is an engine company first. They make their cars and motorcycles to sell their engines. Its not a surprise that honda is one of the later oems to embrace a hybrid car for that reason.
Honda’s Insight was the second ever “mass produced” hybrid car, launched in 1999, only about 14 months after the Toyota Prius.
Johnny Ringo
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Johnny Ringo 3/30/2018 6:58am
3/30/2018 6:58am
This board is famous for complaining about how the AMA handled the four strokes and how they were too quick to let them in the same classes as 125s and 250s, yet now we're bitching that taking time to make sure the same thing doesn't happen with electric bikes means MX Sports is killing the sport? ok.

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