Making the switch.. 450 to 125

FGR01
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Fantasy
7/30/2014 2:11pm
That bike runs great with the stock pipe. No real need to replace it for a beginner/novice rider. Just keep the silencer clean and carbon free with fresh packing.

There is a couple good threads on Thumpertalk in the Yamaha 2-stroke forum on the shift stopper issue with lots of pics to show you what the original and replacement part look like and what the original looks like when it comes apart (outer bearing race and balls gone leaving just the inner race).
rosebud441
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Bellingham, WA US
7/30/2014 2:28pm
Its the Ethanol in today's pump gas that is a problem for 2 strokes.. I have 2 125's and each one gets a 50/50 mix pump and race gas. and trust me i can feel and hear the difference.

If you can find Non-Ethanol pump gas you should be fine.. If not beware.
rmartin517
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Dickinson, TX US
7/30/2014 3:07pm
I actually did the same thing. I started riding again after 10 years. Im now 31 and weigh about 185 as well 6'0. I started out with 250fs sold them bought a 450 sold it and now Im back on 125s as thats what I always rode. Im actually on 2 02 cr 125s but modified and one big bore. I have so much fun on them but, they were both small projects. 1 of them needes new shift forks and a few tranny gear as I was getting false neutral and the oher well it was a total project. Still haveing less the 4500.00 in two bikes. As far as your YZ I would start looking for the newwer SSS suspension. Open the cases check all your gears and shift forks. You will really enjoy the bike once you get it dialed.
JM485
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7/30/2014 3:42pm
I just started riding my 125 again to help me with my corner speed, and I'm glad I put a new top end on and pulled it out of the garage!Woohoo Mine is an 04 cr (which is very slow), but it is super light and allows me to throw it around and lean over in corners easier. I also feel like I'm able to ride with a lot more confidence since I can control the bike more easily, as well as carry a LOT more speed through corners.

Funny you guys talk about running or not running pump gas. When I rode it before I never had and issues with detonation, but now that the track I ride has changed, there is one spot where I can hear it crackle just a bit before a large table top. I'm thinking I will mix about one gallon of race gas (100 octane) with every two gallons of pump (91) this weekend.

The Shop

4stroke4DWIN
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7/30/2014 4:38pm
JA946 wrote:
Also, 1 last thing. Don't run pump gas - the 125's don't like it.
Lol, not true. I run pump gas in mine all the time with out a hitch.
bd
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7/30/2014 5:44pm
I would not run pump gas in a YZ125 and YZ250. I run race gas in mine - at a min, run 50 pump/50 race gas.
bd
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7/30/2014 5:46pm
JM485 wrote:
I just started riding my 125 again to help me with my corner speed, and I'm glad I put a new top end on and pulled...
I just started riding my 125 again to help me with my corner speed, and I'm glad I put a new top end on and pulled it out of the garage!Woohoo Mine is an 04 cr (which is very slow), but it is super light and allows me to throw it around and lean over in corners easier. I also feel like I'm able to ride with a lot more confidence since I can control the bike more easily, as well as carry a LOT more speed through corners.

Funny you guys talk about running or not running pump gas. When I rode it before I never had and issues with detonation, but now that the track I ride has changed, there is one spot where I can hear it crackle just a bit before a large table top. I'm thinking I will mix about one gallon of race gas (100 octane) with every two gallons of pump (91) this weekend.
Took me some work to get the 2004 CR125 up to speed - I installed a 2005-2007 air boot, PC Pipe, PC Shorty, and VForce. The bike took some work to jet, once it was jetted correctly it was a lot faster.
bd
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7/30/2014 5:48pm
rosebud441 wrote:
Its the Ethanol in today's pump gas that is a problem for 2 strokes.. I have 2 125's and each one gets a 50/50 mix pump...
Its the Ethanol in today's pump gas that is a problem for 2 strokes.. I have 2 125's and each one gets a 50/50 mix pump and race gas. and trust me i can feel and hear the difference.

If you can find Non-Ethanol pump gas you should be fine.. If not beware.
Ethanol and additives are harming bikes. I think the YZ's manuals recommend at least 97 octane (do not quote me on it). Those bikes ping and blow up with shitty gas.
BAMX
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7/30/2014 5:56pm
JA946 wrote:
Also, 1 last thing. Don't run pump gas - the 125's don't like it.
Lol, not true. I run pump gas in mine all the time with out a hitch.
It depends on the bike. My RM eats pistons on anything less than 50/50 mix.
7/30/2014 6:37pm
Hazem, I just put about 5 grand into an 05 yz 125. Best money I've ever spent. Thing is the funnest thing on 2 wheels. Also...
Hazem, I just put about 5 grand into an 05 yz 125. Best money I've ever spent. Thing is the funnest thing on 2 wheels. Also I'm from Kansas City, and there aren't too many 125''s around. we should ride!
HazemG wrote:
Let's get it! Nice to know you're local. You do the work yourself? Wouldn't mind hooking you up for a little help getting mine dialed in...
Let's get it! Nice to know you're local. You do the work yourself? Wouldn't mind hooking you up for a little help getting mine dialed in. Although I'm setting my budget a little (or a lot) lower than yours!!
I sent the motor on my bike to eric gorr, here's the thread on all what I've done.. I'll help ya out with anything I can. This is my 2nd 05 and up yz 125. http://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Race-Shop,42/Another-yz-125-build-my-05,1…
Xracer
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7/30/2014 6:54pm
Funny...I did the same thing. Kid down the street had a low-time, bone-stock 04' YZ125 in his garage that he didn't ride for several years while he was discovering himself or whatever. When he finally came back go earth, he managed to get the bike started but a combination of old gas, oil pooled in the bottom of the carb and plugged jets made it run like a smokin, misfiring, bogging mess. His sole attempt at repair was to put a new plug in. When it ran just as bad, he came to the conclusion that the engine was "blown". Lacking the knowledge or funds to rebuild it, he let it sit for 2 more years. I would periodically offer him 1k for it and he always declined, until one day he stopped by and asked if I was still interested. I told him that the passage of time takes a toll and that I'd only give him 800. He took it. I went through he carb, spooned on fresh tires and replaced the plastic and graphics, as my sole intention was to flip it. It sounded so good that I decided I just had to spin a few laps (I hadn't ridden a 125 in 20 years) and took it and my 07' CRF450 to open ride day at a loamy-to-hard pack track. I took the 125 out first and was surprised at how hard it pulled on top....and how totally flaccid it was everywhere else. But once I got the hang of it and accepted that being at such high rpm all the time wasn't hurting it a bit, I started having a blast. I felt indestructible and almost crash-proof. It was so easy to change lines and correct from mistakes. Once I started going faster, the softness of the suspension became the limiting factor (I'm 175 in gear), but I was hooked. The 450 never came off the trailer that day. As soon as I got home, I ordered heavier springs from Race Tech and a better set of bars, as it still had the straight but weak stockers. With the heavier springs, I felt like I was going faster than I could on my 450, for longer. I was moto-reborn at a time when accumulated injuries were causing me to consider buying something with a headlight, kickstand, electric start, and becoming a trail rider. I was in love.

Then it happened....I went to a sand track. Suddenly what was "enough" power was waaaayy not enough, and the absence of torque that could be negated with a quick clutch hand and locked right twist wasn't so easy to overcome. My buds on 450s yelled out insults to my manhood as they roosted on by like I was on an a y-zinger. I was miserable. The next weekend we had muddy conditions, and I was miserable again. The honeymoon was over. The bike was going onto Craigslist ASAP. I was done with it. The next weekend I took it to the hard-loamy track to get re-aquainted with my 450 and to meet a potential buyer of the 125 (who never showed). The first time out on the 450 in a while was a pucker-fest. I was quickly reminded that they have a lot of inertia, they numb your arms quickly, you don't ride them like a 125, and the act of turning actually took some thought and planning. By the 3rd lap I was bored and decided to consciously measure how often I had the bike's throttle really, really pinned. The answer was "hardly ever...only on the long straights, and never in corners". Well this isn't much fun. The 125 was sitting at my truck, gleaming in a coat of moto-shine and freshly polished spokes, but I decided to get it dirty one last time....and fell in love again.

The moral of the story is, we all need and should have 125's, but not as your only bike. They suck in sand and mud, but are an absolute hero riot in loam or hard pack. Fortunately they're pretty cheap and a 10-year old one is fine. Parts are plentiful and cheap. Go get one before they're gone.
Mr Bean
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7/30/2014 7:35pm
bd wrote:
Ethanol and additives are harming bikes. I think the YZ's manuals recommend at least 97 octane (do not quote me on it). Those bikes ping and...
Ethanol and additives are harming bikes. I think the YZ's manuals recommend at least 97 octane (do not quote me on it). Those bikes ping and blow up with shitty gas.
My 2006 YZ125V manual specifies a minimum of 95 RON (research octane number).

However, it's important to know what that means.

Most pump fuel sold in the US uses the (R+M)/2 method. That's RON + MON divided by two (or the average of the two octane ratings).

MON (motor octane number) tends to run around 8-10 points lower than RON. Therefore a fuel rated at 93 octane using the (R+M)/2 method should be sufficient.

FWIW, I've been using 93 octane, ethanol-free pump gas in my stock YZ125 the entire time I've owned it (since 2007) and it has never missed a beat.

I also have a friend that was using 87 octane ethanol-free and melted the piston and flaked the nikasil. She thought it was more important to avoid the alcohol than to get the octane. Obviously not.
7/30/2014 7:46pm
I have this same bike. Mine had zero low end when i bought it too.

Check the power valve linkage. Mine was broken. You can buy a new one for over $100 or have a buddy weld/braze it for cheap.

With your weight, you may want to add a tooth or 2 to the rear sprocket.

( I didn't read everyone's posts above, so sorry if this is a repeat)
bish153
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Frisco, TX US
7/30/2014 7:54pm
Steel frame.
I'm confused as to why you made your steel frame comment?
To the op, have fun and enjoy. I do hope that you are not under the impression that making the switch to 125 is gonna make you a faster rider, in the long run it will make you a better rider. However there is going to be a learning curve in how to properly ride a 2 stroke, especially coming off a 450. Imho everyone should learn on a two stroke. Proper maintenance on a 2 stroke goes along way. As noted I would get the bike working properly, but would not worry to much about spending a lot on suspension at first. Just set the sag and change the oil and seals. (something that can be done very cheap and extreme easy)
JM485
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7/30/2014 8:00pm
JM485 wrote:
I just started riding my 125 again to help me with my corner speed, and I'm glad I put a new top end on and pulled...
I just started riding my 125 again to help me with my corner speed, and I'm glad I put a new top end on and pulled it out of the garage!Woohoo Mine is an 04 cr (which is very slow), but it is super light and allows me to throw it around and lean over in corners easier. I also feel like I'm able to ride with a lot more confidence since I can control the bike more easily, as well as carry a LOT more speed through corners.

Funny you guys talk about running or not running pump gas. When I rode it before I never had and issues with detonation, but now that the track I ride has changed, there is one spot where I can hear it crackle just a bit before a large table top. I'm thinking I will mix about one gallon of race gas (100 octane) with every two gallons of pump (91) this weekend.
bd wrote:
Took me some work to get the 2004 CR125 up to speed - I installed a 2005-2007 air boot, PC Pipe, PC Shorty, and VForce. The...
Took me some work to get the 2004 CR125 up to speed - I installed a 2005-2007 air boot, PC Pipe, PC Shorty, and VForce. The bike took some work to jet, once it was jetted correctly it was a lot faster.
I have an FMF pipe and silencer on it, as well as a v-force reed cage, and when I rebuilt it the last time I smoothed out the exhaust and intake ports. It's better than it was, but I think the jetting is very rich, since it bogs off idle just sitting on the stand. Honestly though, I am fine with the rich jetting just as added protection from a lean seize. I need to look into the newer intake boot though, I have heard a lot about them working well on the older bikes. Thanks for the info!
7/30/2014 10:14pm
JM485 wrote:
I just started riding my 125 again to help me with my corner speed, and I'm glad I put a new top end on and pulled...
I just started riding my 125 again to help me with my corner speed, and I'm glad I put a new top end on and pulled it out of the garage!Woohoo Mine is an 04 cr (which is very slow), but it is super light and allows me to throw it around and lean over in corners easier. I also feel like I'm able to ride with a lot more confidence since I can control the bike more easily, as well as carry a LOT more speed through corners.

Funny you guys talk about running or not running pump gas. When I rode it before I never had and issues with detonation, but now that the track I ride has changed, there is one spot where I can hear it crackle just a bit before a large table top. I'm thinking I will mix about one gallon of race gas (100 octane) with every two gallons of pump (91) this weekend.
Av Gas / 100LL works great instead of race fuel. Not much more $ than the 91 octane swill at the pump, but light years better. No alcohol helps keep it 2 stroke friendly and if you store it in a metal container, it'll stay fresh for months. I run it in a plethora of bikes (and even the lawnmower).
usp4u
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7/31/2014 7:01am
I dumped my 450 for a 150SX and don't regret it a bit. Riding is fun again.
Tumblin
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7/31/2014 9:39am
I'm also 6' 1" and 180# ride the boy's 05 with revalved but w/stock springs. but it works well as I have air limits Tongue Procircuit w/Shorty and 50/50 race fuel make for FUN FUN FUN! However after hammering out laps or ripping some single track, it's damn near as much fun to hop back on the 450 and have that amazing control with all of that potential/controlled power.
Most of my competitive years were on open bikes and there really is no replacement for displacement.
malachi177
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7/31/2014 9:01pm
JA946 wrote:
Also, 1 last thing. Don't run pump gas - the 125's don't like it.
Lol, not true. I run pump gas in mine all the time with out a hitch.
Yep...Chevron 94 works just fine.
Cancerman
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7/31/2014 11:55pm
I also sold my CRF 450 and bought a ex team practice bike of Davi Millsaps. It was sold out of the MTF facility some years ago. The cool thing is it's totally loaded with all the PC parts, pipe, etc. Since the motor was dead, I replated the cyl, new everything. Even with a stock head, it does not like 93 oct pump gas at all. I don't want to grenade it, so I use 3:1 race gas, 110 to 115 oct. I have tried the 100LL also, but it runs cooler (burn) and I can feel a lossof power. Being a pilot, the 100LL is easy, but be careful what you tell them. Some airports are weird about that. I had to re-spring mine, as Davi , (or the last kid to race it) was under 150 lbs, and I'm 190, so it bottomed front and rear riding thru the pits. Get a PDF file manual for your bike, so you can learn how to fix it and set it up for you. I'm using .44 fork springs and 5.1 shock spring. It's worth the investment. Just do it over a couple of months, it won't hurt so much. Wink My RM is the one in my avitar.Cool I'm just finishing a 87 CR500 to race vintage with. Best of both worlds. Right now I'm faster on the 125 unless there is alot of hills and or long straights / sand.Whistling EnjoyTongue
Vanilla
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8/1/2014 2:59am
If i where in your situation i would never spend that money on a new plastic kit.

You are planning on keeping this bike for a while, why take any chances? Parts are pretty cheap and working on a 125 is pretty easy.
I know your budget is not really big but if i was you i would look into something like this.
HazemG
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8/1/2014 11:29am
Vanilla wrote:
If i where in your situation i would never spend that money on a new plastic kit. You are planning on keeping this bike for a...
If i where in your situation i would never spend that money on a new plastic kit.

You are planning on keeping this bike for a while, why take any chances? Parts are pretty cheap and working on a 125 is pretty easy.
I know your budget is not really big but if i was you i would look into something like this.
Good point, but I want to make this bike aesthetically pleasing as well. My '10 450 looks and feels modern, and I hope to somewhat achieve that with this bike build..

I will look into a top/bottom end kit but most likely at the end of the season as I won't get much seat time before that anyway. I'll probably put 15 hours on it tops and then rebuild the top/bottom end. Thanks for the link. Might as well do that and know that I have a fresh solid motor!!

I think I'm going to start by replacing the shift stopper, changing drain bolt washer, servicing (read: freshening up oils/seals) the suspension, then plastics and graphics (most likely 180 decals). Anyone have other graphics suggestions? Turnaround time is important to me, as last time I tried to go through Bryar (180 decals) he was too busy to really respond to me. I know he races (would be cool to support a privateer) and his work is stellar so I definitely want to use him if possible.
endurox
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8/1/2014 7:03pm
Turn the YZ into a 167 and blast by those 250f's
Cancerman
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8/1/2014 11:34pm
Vanilla wrote:
If i where in your situation i would never spend that money on a new plastic kit. You are planning on keeping this bike for a...
If i where in your situation i would never spend that money on a new plastic kit.

You are planning on keeping this bike for a while, why take any chances? Parts are pretty cheap and working on a 125 is pretty easy.
I know your budget is not really big but if i was you i would look into something like this.
HazemG wrote:
Good point, but I want to make this bike aesthetically pleasing as well. My '10 450 looks and feels modern, and I hope to somewhat achieve...
Good point, but I want to make this bike aesthetically pleasing as well. My '10 450 looks and feels modern, and I hope to somewhat achieve that with this bike build..

I will look into a top/bottom end kit but most likely at the end of the season as I won't get much seat time before that anyway. I'll probably put 15 hours on it tops and then rebuild the top/bottom end. Thanks for the link. Might as well do that and know that I have a fresh solid motor!!

I think I'm going to start by replacing the shift stopper, changing drain bolt washer, servicing (read: freshening up oils/seals) the suspension, then plastics and graphics (most likely 180 decals). Anyone have other graphics suggestions? Turnaround time is important to me, as last time I tried to go through Bryar (180 decals) he was too busy to really respond to me. I know he races (would be cool to support a privateer) and his work is stellar so I definitely want to use him if possible.
If I had it to do over on my RM, I would send the motor to Eric Gore for a 144 kit. He does it for $500, including cyl replate, porting for your choice of power and compression, you can solve some of the power issues when doing this. You can add a bunch of midrange without really losing top end, it makes it much easier to ride, especially for us old guysWink
HazemG
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8/2/2014 9:09am
I want to keep the reliability and I hear that boring it out can mess with that. I honestly am not too concerned with power at this point, or else I wouldn't have bought a 125 haha.

I can't decide where to begin!! Any tips on cleaning the motor to get some of they Oklahoma red clay off??
Cygnus
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8/2/2014 9:18am
HazemG wrote:
I want to keep the reliability and I hear that boring it out can mess with that. I honestly am not too concerned with power at...
I want to keep the reliability and I hear that boring it out can mess with that. I honestly am not too concerned with power at this point, or else I wouldn't have bought a 125 haha.

I can't decide where to begin!! Any tips on cleaning the motor to get some of they Oklahoma red clay off??
Soda blasting or eagle one etching mag cleaner. Either one will make it look new.
BobPA
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8/2/2014 10:24am
How can you guys say that riding a 450 makes moto not fun? Do you even ride bros?

As for the OP, 180 lbs on a stock 125 you are really gonna have to learn momentum. It will certainly make you a better rider, but you will struggle for a few rides.
Mr Bean
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8/2/2014 10:27am
HazemG wrote:
I want to keep the reliability and I hear that boring it out can mess with that. I honestly am not too concerned with power at...
I want to keep the reliability and I hear that boring it out can mess with that. I honestly am not too concerned with power at this point, or else I wouldn't have bought a 125 haha.

I can't decide where to begin!! Any tips on cleaning the motor to get some of they Oklahoma red clay off??
This stuff works great but use with caution -



It's removed some of the nastiest SE clay stains from engine cases for me. I pour a small amount into a container and use several different type brushes to apply it to the surfaces I want it on (and keep it off the ones I don't want it on).

HazemG
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8/2/2014 10:34am
I think they mean riding a 125 can make us all feel more like our favorite riders and less like some joes. Torque is fun but on some level being able to just hold a 125 WFO has a certain fun factor that a 450 can't provide (unless you're bubba, Kenny or your favorite pro).

Mr Bean (lmao btw) I'll give that a shot. I downloaded a manual and hopefully will be tearing her down to the frame in the next week or two.

Anyone interested in me starting a build thread with photos?
Pryda
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8/2/2014 11:02am Edited Date/Time 8/2/2014 11:04am
I dident make as dramatic change, but I went from RMZ250 - YZ125 this year, and I have to say, I completly agree with everything said. They are really really fun and I regret that I dident start earlier.

Many told me that it was going to be slow and this and that, but as we know, MX is full of guys who have big mouths, atleast on the interwebs. YZ125 is perfectly fine, even with my 200lbs & 6.4

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