Chad Watts On Two Strokes

Vonripper450
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Vonripper450 6/6/2014 11:17am
6/6/2014 11:17am Edited Date/Time 6/6/2014 12:02pm
CamP wrote:
You don't understand simple physics if you think a 60' jump related crash results in the same force as a 90' jump related crash. Physical training...
You don't understand simple physics if you think a 60' jump related crash results in the same force as a 90' jump related crash. Physical training and riding gear isn't going to reduce the forces applied to the body when crashing on a 90'+ jump.

Force = Mass x Acceleration
Vonripper450 wrote:
Wow, you hit harder when going faster, really? Sarcasm off Apparently you didn't get my point about conditioning and safety equipment. They are better today so...
Wow, you hit harder when going faster, really? Sarcasm off
Apparently you didn't get my point about conditioning and safety equipment. They are better today so riders can take a bigger hit then they could years ago. I remember years ago watching James Stewart racing with Ricky and he took such a huge tumble I felt an average Joe would have died. But, thanks to conditioning and top end safety equipment he bounced up and got back on the bike an finished the race.
Matt Fisher wrote:
Better safety equipment? Maybe my eyes deceive me, but young Zach's jersey, gloves and pants don't appear to protect him any better than the stuff I...
Better safety equipment?

Maybe my eyes deceive me, but young Zach's jersey, gloves and pants don't appear to protect him any better than the stuff I have in a box somewhere in my garage marked "12-6-91 motocross gear".

Better boots; yeah a little bit. Better helmet and knee braces; certainly. Neck brace- highly questionable.

Safety equipment has certainly lagged behind bike development, as has track safety. To be fair, it's like that in all forms of racing. Look no further than the history of Formula One for a prime example.
People sure cherry pick what they want to hear. There was also a part about conditioning. Also, you said it yourself, the equipment Bell chose to use is better than equipment was 15 years ago.

Man do I feel silly for wasting morning.
Oh, and not sure if I am a pigeon or a moron.
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crazyrooster125 6/6/2014 11:19am
6/6/2014 11:19am
I've got the answer make tracks for 2-strokes and race the 2-strokes on them and as far as the coolness of racing yes a 2-stroke takes more skill to ride, but you can do more with them than a 4-bitch' that's why the tracks have become f-stroke style, less turns, less berms and wimpy whoops... I don't think the racing is better in the 4-bitch era, yes it might have a higher top speed but it's at the expense of track obsticules and riders skill. So did we move forward on that one???

As far as watching 2-stroke vs 4-stroke mx, mx is about going thru the gears over irregular terrain on a closed race course and 2-strokes do it the best, that is once you get some skills...


I think each bike(125, 250 2-strokes or 250, 450 4-strokes) deserves its own class as well as each type of stroke ( 2-stroke or 4-stroke) deserves its own tracks....


Chad Watts Thank you for saying the truth... I hope more industry insiders and pro riders would speak up for 2-strokes, but more importantly ride 2-strokes and support 2-stroke racing... It's up to us riders to save 2-stroke mx....

One more thing I wish all us riders could when the times are right stand together to fight for our sport and it doesn't matter if your on a 2-stroke or a 4-stroke I bet you love riding it and that's what ultimately bonds us together... Crazy Rooster125
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Overdrive 6/6/2014 11:28am
6/6/2014 11:28am
JBlain619 wrote:
^^^ Absolutely correct. The skill that it takes to ride a 2 stroke big bike fast is lost on todays generation. They have all become throttle...
^^^ Absolutely correct. The skill that it takes to ride a 2 stroke big bike fast is lost on todays generation. They have all become throttle jockeys.
BobPA wrote:
The art has been lost because it is no longer needed. Times have changed bro. Nothing you can do about it
The art has not been lost, Mitch made AC run a 125 for a year before he got on the 250f. Most all of the pro's know how to ride a two stroke extremely fast.

But thats not what we are talking about, the new riders and amatuers don't because they don't have to..... No you just twist the throttle, where as on a two stroke you had to think about getting the power to the ground through proper throttle and clutch technique, not to mention pre loading the suspension.

Watts brought this subject up because we just had another amateur rider pass away.

bro
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hvaughn88 6/6/2014 12:17pm
6/6/2014 12:17pm
Vonripper, that picture is awesome and absolutely spot-on

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brimx153
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brimx153 6/6/2014 12:19pm
6/6/2014 12:19pm
two words NECK BRACES , I know it will start a war , but I blame them for so many deaths , this is my opinion , don't care what anyone one else thinks , but must deaths in mx are head injurys , and a lot more forces are put on the head when a neck brace is worn , I also think the tracks are a lot to blame , what jumps I have to jump , now to be compeditive compered to 10 yrs ago , is mad , doubles everywhere , if at an amature level if all the jumps were table tops , it stops soooooo many injurys , but no one will do that , even tho you jump the same distance , just if u get it wrong you have a chance at saving it
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Tiki 6/6/2014 12:20pm
6/6/2014 12:20pm
Look, This argument has been here since 2006 if not before. I would like to think all the valid points actually make it to those who matter. The truth is, They don't. I am in agreement with many of you and Mr. Watts but as long as things go the way they are: AMA, MX Sports etc. The places to race are going to hold races for the bikes that are made. When we start having races strictly for trail bikes with less suspension, people are going to go hog wild on bikes because they can.

In my opinion, four strokes started the style of riding that has increased the speed. That said, it carried over to two strokes. So regardless of how much suspension (and it has decreased. in the 80's we had 13 inches.) Style of power delivery: electric, four stroke or two stroke, it is what it is.

Lot of valid points though. Remember the argument that Four strokes wouldn't be able to go through whoops as well?
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seth505 6/6/2014 12:30pm
6/6/2014 12:30pm
FlaNard wrote:
4-strokes have brought NOTHING to the sport other than the ability for squids to ride over their heads easier. That's it. The local tracks are empty...
4-strokes have brought NOTHING to the sport other than the ability for squids to ride over their heads easier. That's it. The local tracks are empty. But as some of the four stroke guys on here say, who cares if they cant afford it? Its a rich mans sport now...Angry
Vonripper450 wrote:
Maybe we could get the government involved because the danger 4 strokes pose and we could get them outlawed like those pesky 3-wheelers. I think that's...
Maybe we could get the government involved because the danger 4 strokes pose and we could get them outlawed like those pesky 3-wheelers. I think that's what some are advocating here right?
No, no not at all.
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mxb2 6/6/2014 12:32pm
6/6/2014 12:32pm
crazyrooster125 wrote:
I've got the answer make tracks for 2-strokes and race the 2-strokes on them and as far as the coolness of racing yes a 2-stroke takes...
I've got the answer make tracks for 2-strokes and race the 2-strokes on them and as far as the coolness of racing yes a 2-stroke takes more skill to ride, but you can do more with them than a 4-bitch' that's why the tracks have become f-stroke style, less turns, less berms and wimpy whoops... I don't think the racing is better in the 4-bitch era, yes it might have a higher top speed but it's at the expense of track obsticules and riders skill. So did we move forward on that one???

As far as watching 2-stroke vs 4-stroke mx, mx is about going thru the gears over irregular terrain on a closed race course and 2-strokes do it the best, that is once you get some skills...


I think each bike(125, 250 2-strokes or 250, 450 4-strokes) deserves its own class as well as each type of stroke ( 2-stroke or 4-stroke) deserves its own tracks....


Chad Watts Thank you for saying the truth... I hope more industry insiders and pro riders would speak up for 2-strokes, but more importantly ride 2-strokes and support 2-stroke racing... It's up to us riders to save 2-stroke mx....

One more thing I wish all us riders could when the times are right stand together to fight for our sport and it doesn't matter if your on a 2-stroke or a 4-stroke I bet you love riding it and that's what ultimately bonds us together... Crazy Rooster125
Is watts still in the industry?
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hvaughn88 6/6/2014 12:35pm
6/6/2014 12:35pm
brimx153 wrote:
two words NECK BRACES , I know it will start a war , but I blame them for so many deaths , this is my opinion...
two words NECK BRACES , I know it will start a war , but I blame them for so many deaths , this is my opinion , don't care what anyone one else thinks , but must deaths in mx are head injurys , and a lot more forces are put on the head when a neck brace is worn , I also think the tracks are a lot to blame , what jumps I have to jump , now to be compeditive compered to 10 yrs ago , is mad , doubles everywhere , if at an amature level if all the jumps were table tops , it stops soooooo many injurys , but no one will do that , even tho you jump the same distance , just if u get it wrong you have a chance at saving it
that's more than two words
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neverwas 6/6/2014 12:38pm
6/6/2014 12:38pm
JBlain619 wrote:
Just got off the phone with some folks that are at the regional at Muddy Creek and some at Red Bud. They've made both tracks a...
Just got off the phone with some folks that are at the regional at Muddy Creek and some at Red Bud. They've made both tracks a freeway and this is an issue. The tracks have become too fast and not technical at all.(thus my throttle jockey comment) When you have amateurs in 5th gear wide open, theres bound to be carnage. Track owners have to make their tracks more technical. I'm not talking more jumps. I'm talking off cambers, switchbacks, deep ruts etc.
I agree,track being slowed down and with off cambers and switch backs etc.It takes more skill to do those obstacles.
I know that most like the big jumps,it's spectacular but a track with less "flow" and difficult obstacles produces better racing and in my opinion less injuries,But I am a old guy that used to race on old school natural terrain tracks.
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Lightning78 6/6/2014 1:17pm
6/6/2014 1:17pm
Darryl916 wrote:
I'll simply add my experience to the mix. I started racing mx after the 2-strokes had gone. I currently ride/race a 2012 CRF450 decently fast for...
I'll simply add my experience to the mix.

I started racing mx after the 2-strokes had gone. I currently ride/race a 2012 CRF450 decently fast for a regular +30 dude (mid pack 30+ B, podium 30+ C, top 10 Open C). About 2 months ago I purchased a bone stock mint 07 CR250R to add to my collection. Although I haven't spent a ton of time on it yet, as of now I can't ride that thing for shit! So hard to be smooth and carry momentum. Power is extremely touchy with a much shorter and more racey burst. I'd say that thing will probably hurt me sooner than than my 450. The 4 strokes are heavier and faster but are so smooth, predictable, and confidence inspiring. The 2 stroke feels like a 50HP mountain bike with an attitude problem. I'm not sure if I'm riding it or it's riding me half the time. I'm not sure how that would make the sport safer.... Maybe it would scare the shit out of, and run away everyone but the extremely talented, stupid, or hard core riders.

My 450 in the right hands could win an A class moto and still be ridden around the yard by my basically skilled quad riding girlfriend. Where as my CR250R at first crack of the throttle would probably put her thru the neighbors fence before she knew what happened and that bike would not win anything serious in any hands. Feel free to dispute me. I think I paint a descent picture. They are both fun and server their own purpose. I simple feel that if you are non-biased you have to admit the 4 strokes are leaps and bounds ahead of the old 2 strokes. No mixing gas. None of the constant jetting issues. None of the air leaks and runaway throttles. Power valve cleaning/sticking. Worn out reeds. Top ends cheaper but way more often. A 4 stroke is gas and go for a long time. Keep it and the air filter clean, oil changed and you're golden.

Hence the REASON you are backing it down and not riding the CR250 like your 450....THATS the point everyone is trying to get across. You have to be smooth and carry momentum or you will not be going fast beyond you ability ride a dirtbike correctly and well. The racey burst means you wont be jamming the throttle as much until you learn how to control the bike. If you were able to go fast on that cr you'd be extremely skilled, most of the time a 2 stroke will spit you off or slide out LONG BEFORE youre able to hit full tilt boogie and youll end up with road rash or an injured limb at worst 99% of the time...think about what you said and you see what im talking about. The whole idea of MX is to be smooth and carry momentum to go fast and you have to know what youre doing to keep that power in the sweet spot on a 2 stroke whereas a 4 stroke, just about any throttle position youre in the power and its a huge difference.

Im not at all bashing your skills but your counter argument jut proved what everyone else is saying in this thread "I feel more comfortable" therefore you go faster....you cant account for riders that dont have the skills which threr are a lot of that "feel comfortable" and twist the throttle faster than their talent allows them to go.

A 2 stroke will only allow you to go as fast as your talent and skill will and that is the point everyone is trying to make here.

Funny in this thread for once 90% are seeing things the same way which was quite opposite a few years back so yes I think the rapid ride in deaths and serious injuries are catching peoples attention and they are seeing a common denominator, which is whht Watts was pointing out.
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shuggs 6/6/2014 1:32pm
6/6/2014 1:32pm
Just to put my bit in.
Had a CRF250 for 6 years and loved it, first bike in over 25+ years and to me it was the ideal bike to start learning on again. BUT I agree it did make things easier to try, last year changed to 2t (200sx) and this thing is the nuts!!!

But would I be as good on 2t if I did not have the practice on 4t - dont think so, I know we are talking about 2 different types of riding but I appreciate both - for those coming up IMO it would need to go 125 2t so that they can learn more about engine control before thinking about going 4t, even on a 250f the power is there as soon as you twist right hand and for KIDS that is seriously scary IMO (even though I let my son go 85 to 250f).
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peelout 6/6/2014 2:15pm
6/6/2014 2:15pm
shuggs wrote:
Just to put my bit in. Had a CRF250 for 6 years and loved it, first bike in over 25+ years and to me it was...
Just to put my bit in.
Had a CRF250 for 6 years and loved it, first bike in over 25+ years and to me it was the ideal bike to start learning on again. BUT I agree it did make things easier to try, last year changed to 2t (200sx) and this thing is the nuts!!!

But would I be as good on 2t if I did not have the practice on 4t - dont think so, I know we are talking about 2 different types of riding but I appreciate both - for those coming up IMO it would need to go 125 2t so that they can learn more about engine control before thinking about going 4t, even on a 250f the power is there as soon as you twist right hand and for KIDS that is seriously scary IMO (even though I let my son go 85 to 250f).
i was fortunate to grow up racing 80's, 125's, 250's, before the 4-stroke (bowel) movement. i remember getting off my 80 and the 125 had a ton of power but it was never too much. i raced my dad's '95 CR250 a couple times and that thing was crazy fast.

i honestly can't imagine if i had raced 80's then had to jump onto a 250F... such a crazy gap there.
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Ing 6/6/2014 2:46pm
6/6/2014 2:46pm
JBlain619 wrote:
Just got off the phone with some folks that are at the regional at Muddy Creek and some at Red Bud. They've made both tracks a...
Just got off the phone with some folks that are at the regional at Muddy Creek and some at Red Bud. They've made both tracks a freeway and this is an issue. The tracks have become too fast and not technical at all.(thus my throttle jockey comment) When you have amateurs in 5th gear wide open, theres bound to be carnage. Track owners have to make their tracks more technical. I'm not talking more jumps. I'm talking off cambers, switchbacks, deep ruts etc.
neverwas wrote:
I agree,track being slowed down and with off cambers and switch backs etc.It takes more skill to do those obstacles. I know that most like the...
I agree,track being slowed down and with off cambers and switch backs etc.It takes more skill to do those obstacles.
I know that most like the big jumps,it's spectacular but a track with less "flow" and difficult obstacles produces better racing and in my opinion less injuries,But I am a old guy that used to race on old school natural terrain tracks.
Both spot on posts. I concur completely. Old school myself and that includes 500cc 2-strokes at the age of 15.
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Bret 6/6/2014 2:55pm
6/6/2014 2:55pm
I think that if the four-stroke movement never happened we would still be in the same situation. My guess is that two-stroke technology would have progressed and we would probably have easy to ride, big horsepower machines today. Every sport progresses and in MX & SX that translates into bigger jumps and higher speeds. Things will level off eventually because the limits of physics and physiology will eventually be reached. I am not sure if the sport is actually broken or just suffering from some growing pains right now but ultimately it is up the the rider to decide how fast to go and what protective gear to wear. If the rider decides that the risk has become too great then it is time to choose an alternate career path. However, being one of those crusty old farts, I do think the tracks have become to jumpy and dangerous. I do think that the racing can be exciting and fun to watch with a tamed down track. I think two or more riders battling for position is much more exciting than watching 40 guys jump the same big jumps lap after lap.
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vanillaice782 6/6/2014 3:03pm
6/6/2014 3:03pm
brimx153 wrote:
two words NECK BRACES , I know it will start a war , but I blame them for so many deaths , this is my opinion...
two words NECK BRACES , I know it will start a war , but I blame them for so many deaths , this is my opinion , don't care what anyone one else thinks , but must deaths in mx are head injurys , and a lot more forces are put on the head when a neck brace is worn , I also think the tracks are a lot to blame , what jumps I have to jump , now to be compeditive compered to 10 yrs ago , is mad , doubles everywhere , if at an amature level if all the jumps were table tops , it stops soooooo many injurys , but no one will do that , even tho you jump the same distance , just if u get it wrong you have a chance at saving it
Sometimes people get pregnant when they use rubbers. You can't blame the rubbers though.
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hvaughn88 6/6/2014 3:06pm
6/6/2014 3:06pm
vanillaice782 wrote:
Sometimes people get pregnant when they use rubbers. You can't blame the rubbers though.


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Torco1 6/6/2014 3:50pm
6/6/2014 3:50pm
Whatever happened to being responsible for your own actions? Oh no, a 13 year old kid wadded himself up on a 450, lets blame the bike, the manufacture, the industry, the track........lets blame everyone and everything except for the stupid kid that wasn't ready to ride that bike and his dumbass parents for buying it for him.

Oh look, another kid went and shot up his school killing 50 people. Lets blame the gun, the gun maker, the ammo and everyone else except for the crazy ass kid that has been given off hints his entire life that he's a nutcase.

Our kids are getting fatter and fatter, lets only serve nasty ass food in the cafeteria now that just gets thrown away. Heaven forbid we sit fat-ass Johnny down for a little chat to tell him to quite eating every goddamn thing in site.

God I hate people.........rant over.

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mxb2
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mxb2 6/6/2014 3:56pm
6/6/2014 3:56pm
Torco1 wrote:
Whatever happened to being responsible for your own actions? Oh no, a 13 year old kid wadded himself up on a 450, lets blame the bike...
Whatever happened to being responsible for your own actions? Oh no, a 13 year old kid wadded himself up on a 450, lets blame the bike, the manufacture, the industry, the track........lets blame everyone and everything except for the stupid kid that wasn't ready to ride that bike and his dumbass parents for buying it for him.

Oh look, another kid went and shot up his school killing 50 people. Lets blame the gun, the gun maker, the ammo and everyone else except for the crazy ass kid that has been given off hints his entire life that he's a nutcase.

Our kids are getting fatter and fatter, lets only serve nasty ass food in the cafeteria now that just gets thrown away. Heaven forbid we sit fat-ass Johnny down for a little chat to tell him to quite eating every goddamn thing in site.

God I hate people.........rant over.
Hope nick wey doesnt read your post, haha
Socket946
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Socket946 6/6/2014 6:24pm
6/6/2014 6:24pm
Torco1 wrote:
Whatever happened to being responsible for your own actions? Oh no, a 13 year old kid wadded himself up on a 450, lets blame the bike...
Whatever happened to being responsible for your own actions? Oh no, a 13 year old kid wadded himself up on a 450, lets blame the bike, the manufacture, the industry, the track........lets blame everyone and everything except for the stupid kid that wasn't ready to ride that bike and his dumbass parents for buying it for him.

Oh look, another kid went and shot up his school killing 50 people. Lets blame the gun, the gun maker, the ammo and everyone else except for the crazy ass kid that has been given off hints his entire life that he's a nutcase.

Our kids are getting fatter and fatter, lets only serve nasty ass food in the cafeteria now that just gets thrown away. Heaven forbid we sit fat-ass Johnny down for a little chat to tell him to quite eating every goddamn thing in site.

God I hate people.........rant over.
Yep.

Personal accountability went away years ago. Funny enough, the same moment the bleeding heart libs really took hold..

Now it's all about saving you from yourself.
Hank_Thrill
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Hank_Thrill 6/6/2014 7:16pm
6/6/2014 7:16pm Edited Date/Time 6/6/2014 7:17pm
Reducing the suspension travel on these extremely powerful machines would only make the handling worse for when these guys are pushing the limits. Whoever came up with that idea has been around too much leaded gas lol.
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Jack mehoff 6/6/2014 7:54pm
6/6/2014 7:54pm
Torco1 wrote:
Whatever happened to being responsible for your own actions? Oh no, a 13 year old kid wadded himself up on a 450, lets blame the bike...
Whatever happened to being responsible for your own actions? Oh no, a 13 year old kid wadded himself up on a 450, lets blame the bike, the manufacture, the industry, the track........lets blame everyone and everything except for the stupid kid that wasn't ready to ride that bike and his dumbass parents for buying it for him.

Oh look, another kid went and shot up his school killing 50 people. Lets blame the gun, the gun maker, the ammo and everyone else except for the crazy ass kid that has been given off hints his entire life that he's a nutcase.

Our kids are getting fatter and fatter, lets only serve nasty ass food in the cafeteria now that just gets thrown away. Heaven forbid we sit fat-ass Johnny down for a little chat to tell him to quite eating every goddamn thing in site.

God I hate people.........rant over.
Torco you have been around the sport , let's take young dumb and full off cum ,parents walk into the dealership there kid wants to race over here we have a 85 looks like jr will out grow that quick , what's a step up we want him to grow into it 6 k big nut in the budget , here mam we have a 250 f , granted they parents never rode a bike before , the guy selling it to them don't give a shit he wants his taste off the sale , out the door Johnny goes , gets home rides it through the field no problem , take him to the track and all the sudden , Johnny jumping everything he's got no respect for the bike , 125 scenario takes the bike to the same field starts it up gets going power band kicks in , next thing u know he panics grabs a hand full off throttle his eyes get big and he is in a100 yard dash chest hanging over the rear fender feet dragging like 2 boat anchors untill he haves enough sense to let go off the bars , do you think old mom and pa will be taking him to the track soon ? No as soon as dear old mom gets some color back in her face and dad stops laughing his ass off they are going to tell him he needs to work on his skills before they take him any where , do you think mom and pa would off bought him that 250 f if there was a rm 125 on the sales floor , I would be not 250 sounds much bigger then 125 and even dumb parents can figure that out ,
Jack mehoff
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Jack mehoff 6/6/2014 8:04pm
6/6/2014 8:04pm
Darryl916 wrote:
I'll simply add my experience to the mix. I started racing mx after the 2-strokes had gone. I currently ride/race a 2012 CRF450 decently fast for...
I'll simply add my experience to the mix.

I started racing mx after the 2-strokes had gone. I currently ride/race a 2012 CRF450 decently fast for a regular +30 dude (mid pack 30+ B, podium 30+ C, top 10 Open C). About 2 months ago I purchased a bone stock mint 07 CR250R to add to my collection. Although I haven't spent a ton of time on it yet, as of now I can't ride that thing for shit! So hard to be smooth and carry momentum. Power is extremely touchy with a much shorter and more racey burst. I'd say that thing will probably hurt me sooner than than my 450. The 4 strokes are heavier and faster but are so smooth, predictable, and confidence inspiring. The 2 stroke feels like a 50HP mountain bike with an attitude problem. I'm not sure if I'm riding it or it's riding me half the time. I'm not sure how that would make the sport safer.... Maybe it would scare the shit out of, and run away everyone but the extremely talented, stupid, or hard core riders.

My 450 in the right hands could win an A class moto and still be ridden around the yard by my basically skilled quad riding girlfriend. Where as my CR250R at first crack of the throttle would probably put her thru the neighbors fence before she knew what happened and that bike would not win anything serious in any hands. Feel free to dispute me. I think I paint a descent picture. They are both fun and server their own purpose. I simple feel that if you are non-biased you have to admit the 4 strokes are leaps and bounds ahead of the old 2 strokes. No mixing gas. None of the constant jetting issues. None of the air leaks and runaway throttles. Power valve cleaning/sticking. Worn out reeds. Top ends cheaper but way more often. A 4 stroke is gas and go for a long time. Keep it and the air filter clean, oil changed and you're golden.

Got a tip for you , if you can learn how to ride that thing fast you will go from mid pack to winning Motos in no time
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bobby397 6/6/2014 9:13pm
6/6/2014 9:13pm
Damn





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newmann 6/6/2014 9:45pm
6/6/2014 9:45pm
Damn those are pretty. Even that 4 turd.
WhiteKnuckleV2.1 6/7/2014 2:11am
6/7/2014 2:11am
Two stroke, four stroke, whatever. I was just reading the front page test of the KTM 350 with some mods, and I was really jazzed about it. I wish there were more two strokes, but I'm glad we have so many different choices in bikes these days. I came to motocross in an era where you could line up with Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki, Penton, Sachs, Rickman/Zundapp/Montessa/BSA, BSA itself, Husky, CZ, Greeves, Bultaco, Montessa, Ossa, CanAm, Maico...you name it. We had choices that were really different, not just the same basic bike with different plastic like we had in the pre-four stroke days. So it's all good. And now that four strokes are so well developed, it really does make sense to race two strokes and four strokes in equal displacement classes - if four strokes would have never had an advantage under the rules, we'd never have gotten to that place. I think four strokes were the result of bad rules that were bad for the sport, but something good came out of it anyway - options. So now I'd be stoked if the sport's power elite would just capitalize on that happy accident. Can you imagine lining up with 300 two strokes, 350 four strokes, 450 two and four strokes, all with their own characteristics and all with their own pluses and minuses? It'd be like looking on one side and seeing a Montessa and looking on the other side and seeing a Husky.
Rovalova
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AU
Rovalova 6/7/2014 3:28am
6/7/2014 3:28am
peelout wrote:
i was fortunate to grow up racing 80's, 125's, 250's, before the 4-stroke (bowel) movement. i remember getting off my 80 and the 125 had a...
i was fortunate to grow up racing 80's, 125's, 250's, before the 4-stroke (bowel) movement. i remember getting off my 80 and the 125 had a ton of power but it was never too much. i raced my dad's '95 CR250 a couple times and that thing was crazy fast.

i honestly can't imagine if i had raced 80's then had to jump onto a 250F... such a crazy gap there.
Have to agree on that last sentence by peelout. That gap is way too big.....interesting how so many people have noticed that little johnny is faster on a fourstroke and can clear stuff that he couldnt before... no real harm in that, except when things go squirly and he hasnt developed the skills to rectify the problem - the ability to ride faster than genuine skill allows. I remember a few years ago Pit Brier being quite vocal on this and he made some very good points, when guys like him talk I think people need to hear them out. He is/was a big believer of 125 2smoke feeder class, to develop better skills for riders.Also the tracks have changed to suit the new bikes wider more flowing corners = greater speed= greater gaps, any one that rides a two smoke would know its hard to use the fourstroke lines they just dont work and the tracks are now designed to fit them.
hillbilly
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Afton, TN, USA
hillbilly 6/7/2014 6:19am
6/7/2014 6:19am
When the new EPA regs get passed I don't see how a track is going to survive anyways so don't fret,riders will not be getting hurt to much longer.

And the new regs will get passed. Guess that is why the EPA has a SWAT team now,to arrest cows shitting in the creek.
rpoint116
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870
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6/25/2008
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Tempe, AZ, USA
rpoint116 6/7/2014 8:46am
6/7/2014 8:46am
newmann wrote:
Damn those are pretty. Even that 4 turd.
You said 4 turd... That's hilarious!

Wouldn't 2-strokes be more profitable short & long term to the OEM's?
Anthony Siracuse 6/7/2014 11:14am
6/7/2014 11:14am
I feel the fact that people are getting hurt has almost no correlation to the fact that people ride 4 strokes. I think it's just the fact that motocross has gained mich more popularity since the 90's and you do the math more riders = more injuries.

Post a reply to: Chad Watts On Two Strokes