Swap and Adrian from Ride Engineering on pulp

ktmdan
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2/25/2021 11:42am
Dude's a hack and gives a bad name for engineers "mechanics and technicians don't have a college degree" Bro you have a bs in engineering, hop...
Dude's a hack and gives a bad name for engineers "mechanics and technicians don't have a college degree"

Bro you have a bs in engineering, hop off your high horse

Forget to mention the stress concentrations that your holes in the frame introduced?

Edit: I am a ME to be clear
I feel the exact same way. I'm an ME and it boils my blood to hear my coworker engineers talk down on our technicians. It's usually the engineers that aren't worth a sh!t that do that...

I believe that in order to have a business with the word 'engineering' in it you must have a PE license. I could be wrong on that. But I understand that back in the day it was much easier to get a PE than it is now.
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Moto Nomad
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2/25/2021 12:03pm
Moto Nomad wrote:
[Edit- apparently I got this slightly wrong- see post on next page with Wheaties box] Remember when Maeda tried to out some "squid" at a local...
[Edit- apparently I got this slightly wrong- see post on next page with Wheaties box]

Remember when Maeda tried to out some "squid" at a local track by posting his photo (because he didn't have numbers or his gear wasn't cool or he somehow or other didn't fit the SoCal cool guy image). Doing that to a random moto guy was dickish enough, then it turned out it was Damon Bradshaw and he had to publicly apologize. As if it would have been okay to use his pulpit to publicly shame some random rider.
stremme12 wrote:
You sure that's the story? It was a picture of Bradshaw on a cereal box with Canard and Short. Donn had no idea who number 45...
You sure that's the story?

It was a picture of Bradshaw on a cereal box with Canard and Short. Donn had no idea who number 45 was and made fun of it. Turns out it ended up being Bradshaw.


Here is the quote he wrote.

Our Take: We absolutely loved the Wheaties box, but the thing that killed it for us was the schmoe on the number 45 bike. We mean, Trey Canard? BAM! Andrew Short? BAM! Schmoe with stick-on numbers and beginner form? Guess two out of three ain’t bad. This one was so close to winning, too.



All I saw was Donn's apology- could have sworn it was a dude at a local track. Maybe I had it a bit wrong- apologies.
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2/25/2021 12:19pm
Dude's a hack and gives a bad name for engineers "mechanics and technicians don't have a college degree" Bro you have a bs in engineering, hop...
Dude's a hack and gives a bad name for engineers "mechanics and technicians don't have a college degree"

Bro you have a bs in engineering, hop off your high horse

Forget to mention the stress concentrations that your holes in the frame introduced?

Edit: I am a ME to be clear
ktmdan wrote:
I feel the exact same way. I'm an ME and it boils my blood to hear my coworker engineers talk down on our technicians. It's usually...
I feel the exact same way. I'm an ME and it boils my blood to hear my coworker engineers talk down on our technicians. It's usually the engineers that aren't worth a sh!t that do that...

I believe that in order to have a business with the word 'engineering' in it you must have a PE license. I could be wrong on that. But I understand that back in the day it was much easier to get a PE than it is now.
I thought Don was sounding pretty decent until he shat on anyone that was not an engineer, I have engineers reporting to me who are like apprentices because of their lack of real world exposure to the machines they are working on. But they do know that the best place to go when they need technical assistance is the tradesmen working on them who have the experience.

The smartest and most technically correct person I have ever worked with left school at 12yo, he just loved what he did and read about, focused and studied the equipment he worked with, he was like an oracle, no degree needed. Degrees are overrated, they do open doors that would not otherwise be opened, but the individual that loves what he does and is focused and will to do what it takes to learn (research) about what he is working on will be the most knowledgeable. Degree/trade aside. No one becomes great by just turning up and doing the basics of any job everyday.
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Snapper
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2/25/2021 12:38pm
Moto Nomad wrote:
[Edit- apparently I got this slightly wrong- see post on next page with Wheaties box] Remember when Maeda tried to out some "squid" at a local...
[Edit- apparently I got this slightly wrong- see post on next page with Wheaties box]

Remember when Maeda tried to out some "squid" at a local track by posting his photo (because he didn't have numbers or his gear wasn't cool or he somehow or other didn't fit the SoCal cool guy image). Doing that to a random moto guy was dickish enough, then it turned out it was Damon Bradshaw and he had to publicly apologize. As if it would have been okay to use his pulpit to publicly shame some random rider.
No way, is that true?
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The Shop

fourfourone
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2/25/2021 1:12pm
This thread keeps getting better and better... Never realized Don was such an ass clown.
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LungButter
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2/25/2021 1:15pm
Snapper wrote:
No way, is that true?
Not exactly, look at the posts about 3-5 above yours.
Anton_514
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2/25/2021 1:16pm Edited Date/Time 2/25/2021 1:39pm
Moto Nomad wrote:
[Edit- apparently I got this slightly wrong- see post on next page with Wheaties box] Remember when Maeda tried to out some "squid" at a local...
[Edit- apparently I got this slightly wrong- see post on next page with Wheaties box]

Remember when Maeda tried to out some "squid" at a local track by posting his photo (because he didn't have numbers or his gear wasn't cool or he somehow or other didn't fit the SoCal cool guy image). Doing that to a random moto guy was dickish enough, then it turned out it was Damon Bradshaw and he had to publicly apologize. As if it would have been okay to use his pulpit to publicly shame some random rider.
stremme12 wrote:
You sure that's the story? It was a picture of Bradshaw on a cereal box with Canard and Short. Donn had no idea who number 45...
You sure that's the story?

It was a picture of Bradshaw on a cereal box with Canard and Short. Donn had no idea who number 45 was and made fun of it. Turns out it ended up being Bradshaw.


Here is the quote he wrote.

Our Take: We absolutely loved the Wheaties box, but the thing that killed it for us was the schmoe on the number 45 bike. We mean, Trey Canard? BAM! Andrew Short? BAM! Schmoe with stick-on numbers and beginner form? Guess two out of three ain’t bad. This one was so close to winning, too.



For more context that no one will pay attention to: Donn didn't write that (someone else on staff did but he didn't stop it, so yes a mistake), and although FLY stopped advertising with TWMX as a result, we got them back by working together and they are one of the key supporters to SML.

EDIT: This was part of the 2012 TWMX Buyers Guide. Every gear brand was given a blank page in the magazine and free to do whatever they wanted to highlight their gear for the next year. They didn't know it was Bradshaw; Damon was just sort of coming back into the mix after some time away. There were some upset people at FLY and they let it be known, so after a few years of the situation calming down and getting to know the people at the brand by seeing them at the races, I started to mend that relationship.

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LungButter
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2/25/2021 1:34pm
Anton_514 wrote:
For more context that no one will pay attention to: Donn didn't write that (someone else on staff did but he didn't stop it, so yes...
For more context that no one will pay attention to: Donn didn't write that (someone else on staff did but he didn't stop it, so yes a mistake), and although FLY stopped advertising with TWMX as a result, we got them back by working together and they are one of the key supporters to SML.

EDIT: This was part of the 2012 TWMX Buyers Guide. Every gear brand was given a blank page in the magazine and free to do whatever they wanted to highlight their gear for the next year. They didn't know it was Bradshaw; Damon was just sort of coming back into the mix after some time away. There were some upset people at FLY and they let it be known, so after a few years of the situation calming down and getting to know the people at the brand by seeing them at the races, I started to mend that relationship.

To be fair, there is absolutely zero way to tell that is Bradshaw....hate to say it but he doesn't have the relevance anymore that the # 45 is immediately going to make most people think of him.


Don't get me wrong if Donn had done what the post here said he had, I'd want to burn him to the ground, come to find out it wasn't even close really. Hell, I might even have loaded up my bike and went to Cali for a riding trip just to blow past ol' Swap with my flannel shirt and headlight on! Tongue
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ACBraap
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2/25/2021 2:52pm
Isn't this the same guy that got McGrath in trouble by posting pictures of him in new gear or on a new brand before it was supposed to be released, in violation of the terms of the photoshoot?
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2/25/2021 3:11pm
Dude's a hack and gives a bad name for engineers "mechanics and technicians don't have a college degree" Bro you have a bs in engineering, hop...
Dude's a hack and gives a bad name for engineers "mechanics and technicians don't have a college degree"

Bro you have a bs in engineering, hop off your high horse

Forget to mention the stress concentrations that your holes in the frame introduced?

Edit: I am a ME to be clear
Panic_Rev wrote:
"I am a ME to be clear"

Are you telling us which pronoun to use when addressing you?
yak651 wrote:
LaughingLaughing
Any of you down voters care to elaborate?
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Anton_514
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2/25/2021 3:13pm
ACBraap wrote:
Isn't this the same guy that got McGrath in trouble by posting pictures of him in new gear or on a new brand before it was...
Isn't this the same guy that got McGrath in trouble by posting pictures of him in new gear or on a new brand before it was supposed to be released, in violation of the terms of the photoshoot?
Another story that's gotten more complicated over time.

Whole story explained at 36-minute mark.

http://pulpmx.com/podcast/guest-donn-maeda-2/

MC was one of the first to support SML and our offices are above his truck race shop in Elsinore.
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Crossup
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2/25/2021 5:24pm Edited Date/Time 2/25/2021 5:26pm
Boy that was hard to listen to. To me it sounded like was Adrian tried to push another product into a review with Don by drilling and bolting on the steering damper (saying he was trying to improve the ride after changing the triple clamps to Don's spec). What balls. He drills holes into the frame of a factory loaner bike that Don was responsible for. I would have been pissed. He should have apologized immediately if Don thought that was over the top.

And Don made it personal and did not take the high road. He capped off the review saying, "The liability associated with such a product is horrific"? That is a hit job on a business, and personal. Product liability is a serious charge. Where is your data to back that comment up? This and all of the other things said, the harassment, the childish giggling, he seems like a general dick.

Ride Engineering's product seems a lot more durable and may last longer than the product Swapmoto puts out.


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2/25/2021 5:58pm
I thought Don was sounding pretty decent until he shat on anyone that was not an engineer, I have engineers reporting to me who are like...
I thought Don was sounding pretty decent until he shat on anyone that was not an engineer, I have engineers reporting to me who are like apprentices because of their lack of real world exposure to the machines they are working on. But they do know that the best place to go when they need technical assistance is the tradesmen working on them who have the experience.

The smartest and most technically correct person I have ever worked with left school at 12yo, he just loved what he did and read about, focused and studied the equipment he worked with, he was like an oracle, no degree needed. Degrees are overrated, they do open doors that would not otherwise be opened, but the individual that loves what he does and is focused and will to do what it takes to learn (research) about what he is working on will be the most knowledgeable. Degree/trade aside. No one becomes great by just turning up and doing the basics of any job everyday.
I think that was Adrian who was shitting on non-Engineers. Go listen again. He known for doing that...and Don has specifically called him out in the past for doing so.
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2/25/2021 6:16pm
I thought Don was sounding pretty decent until he shat on anyone that was not an engineer, I have engineers reporting to me who are like...
I thought Don was sounding pretty decent until he shat on anyone that was not an engineer, I have engineers reporting to me who are like apprentices because of their lack of real world exposure to the machines they are working on. But they do know that the best place to go when they need technical assistance is the tradesmen working on them who have the experience.

The smartest and most technically correct person I have ever worked with left school at 12yo, he just loved what he did and read about, focused and studied the equipment he worked with, he was like an oracle, no degree needed. Degrees are overrated, they do open doors that would not otherwise be opened, but the individual that loves what he does and is focused and will to do what it takes to learn (research) about what he is working on will be the most knowledgeable. Degree/trade aside. No one becomes great by just turning up and doing the basics of any job everyday.
I think that was Adrian who was shitting on non-Engineers. Go listen again. He known for doing that...and Don has specifically called him out in the...
I think that was Adrian who was shitting on non-Engineers. Go listen again. He known for doing that...and Don has specifically called him out in the past for doing so.
You are right......my mistake
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Vet57
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2/26/2021 4:37am
When's Jody on?
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yak651
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2/26/2021 8:45am
Swap was kinda funny on that segment, Adrian seems like an ass that thinks he can do no wrong. I get being pissed if you feel the guy was trying to sabotage your business, but self reflect a little...and say you're sorry, it's not that difficult.
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fourfourone
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2/26/2021 10:22am Edited Date/Time 2/26/2021 11:50am
yak651 wrote:
Swap was kinda funny on that segment, Adrian seems like an ass that thinks he can do no wrong. I get being pissed if you feel...
Swap was kinda funny on that segment, Adrian seems like an ass that thinks he can do no wrong. I get being pissed if you feel the guy was trying to sabotage your business, but self reflect a little...and say you're sorry, it's not that difficult.
Damn I thought Don sounded like an arrogant fuck. He was basically making fun of the situation and laughing.
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Moto_Geek
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2/26/2021 11:01am Edited Date/Time 2/26/2021 11:02am
UPDATE: Maxima Prize Pack came in the mail today! Thanks PulpMX and Maxima!


I truly am a supporter of Maxima products. Eating my words now about PulpMX prize team.. Smile
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soggy
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2/26/2021 11:02am
Neither of them came out looking good in this and it would have been so easy to do
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yak651
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2/26/2021 11:24am
yak651 wrote:
Swap was kinda funny on that segment, Adrian seems like an ass that thinks he can do no wrong. I get being pissed if you feel...
Swap was kinda funny on that segment, Adrian seems like an ass that thinks he can do no wrong. I get being pissed if you feel the guy was trying to sabotage your business, but self reflect a little...and say you're sorry, it's not that difficult.
Damn I thought Don sounded like an arrogant fuck. He was basically making fun of the situation and laughing.
Would agree, although having no vested interest I did chuckle a little at a couple of his comments. Saying that, I wouldn't have been laughing if I was Adrian. Wondering if he knew Steve's plan was to have Swap on? I feel he thought he was going on to tell his side of his story and really wasn't prepared to hear/talk with Swap.
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garasaki
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2/26/2021 12:23pm Edited Date/Time 2/26/2021 12:23pm
LungButter wrote:
To be fair, there is absolutely zero way to tell that is Bradshaw....hate to say it but he doesn't have the relevance anymore that the #...
To be fair, there is absolutely zero way to tell that is Bradshaw....hate to say it but he doesn't have the relevance anymore that the # 45 is immediately going to make most people think of him.


Don't get me wrong if Donn had done what the post here said he had, I'd want to burn him to the ground, come to find out it wasn't even close really. Hell, I might even have loaded up my bike and went to Cali for a riding trip just to blow past ol' Swap with my flannel shirt and headlight on! Tongue
You mean you don't associate Damon Bradshaw with KTM's??

I also have an engineering degree and found Adrian's comments regarding technicians and mechanics to be very distasteful. I can also say that I have no business determining if it's safe to drill into a frame just because I have a degree.

I don't fully know Adrian's background, but I can imagine that there are very few people in existence who could possibly be familiar enough with the stress analysis of a specific motorcycle frame to know where it would be safe to drill holes. Maybe he does possess that knowledge - someone said he worked at Yamaha. But you can be sure that the Yamaha is the only organization that would be in a position to assume any sort of liability for making that determination publicly, and it's safe to assume that Yamaha's lawyers would blow a gasket if they did so.

The poster who talked about the INFP personality type (which is bang on - I'm INFP myself) had it right - it's pretty clear Adrian has a REAL issue actually saying the words "I was wrong about that". If you listen carefully, he fails to take several opportunities to admit wrong-doing and bury this. It's not over in his mind.

If Ride Engineering ever wants to be (more) successful, I'd think they might want to create a marketing department and keep Adrian away from microphones from now on.
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Moto Nomad
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2/26/2021 12:36pm
Anton_514 wrote:
For more context that no one will pay attention to: Donn didn't write that (someone else on staff did but he didn't stop it, so yes...
For more context that no one will pay attention to: Donn didn't write that (someone else on staff did but he didn't stop it, so yes a mistake), and although FLY stopped advertising with TWMX as a result, we got them back by working together and they are one of the key supporters to SML.

EDIT: This was part of the 2012 TWMX Buyers Guide. Every gear brand was given a blank page in the magazine and free to do whatever they wanted to highlight their gear for the next year. They didn't know it was Bradshaw; Damon was just sort of coming back into the mix after some time away. There were some upset people at FLY and they let it be known, so after a few years of the situation calming down and getting to know the people at the brand by seeing them at the races, I started to mend that relationship.

LungButter wrote:
To be fair, there is absolutely zero way to tell that is Bradshaw....hate to say it but he doesn't have the relevance anymore that the #...
To be fair, there is absolutely zero way to tell that is Bradshaw....hate to say it but he doesn't have the relevance anymore that the # 45 is immediately going to make most people think of him.


Don't get me wrong if Donn had done what the post here said he had, I'd want to burn him to the ground, come to find out it wasn't even close really. Hell, I might even have loaded up my bike and went to Cali for a riding trip just to blow past ol' Swap with my flannel shirt and headlight on! Tongue
I feel bad about mischaracterizing this- sorry to Donn Maeda. I just remembered it wrong, or misunderstood his apology. At least I could edit the post.
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Anton_514
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2/26/2021 1:20pm
Moto Nomad wrote:
I feel bad about mischaracterizing this- sorry to Donn Maeda. I just remembered it wrong, or misunderstood his apology. At least I could edit the post.
As one of the guys taking fire for this thing recently, I truly appreciate that you came back and acknowledged a misunderstanding. For real, thanks.

I know Donn isn't everyone's favorite. I've hated him a time or 10 myself. But outside of family, no one has done more for me or my wife, and it sucks to see some of the things that get said about him and us, especially considering what he does to help MX as a whole. There is always much more to the story than what people see from social media or a product report or a message board. Again, I haven't always agreed with every single action or act or word that's been said, but who sees eye to eye with their boss all of the time?

As for Adrian, I don't support some of the hell he's gotten for this over the years or the last week. He's a nice enough guy, shit happens, and it was made worse over time. I hope Ride continues to be successful and that he sells some parts from this whole thing.

Monday night was a mutual meeting from all three sides (Matthes-Adrian-Donn) where one person asked to come on and the other was approved to call in and discuss. No one was ambushed or hung out in the open without consent.
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Monk
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2/26/2021 4:01pm Edited Date/Time 2/26/2021 4:11pm
I just listened to this tonight, and it was painful and awkward. Out of the gate, I am an Engineer, by education, and vocation. I worked...
I just listened to this tonight, and it was painful and awkward.

Out of the gate, I am an Engineer, by education, and vocation. I worked directly as an Engineer in industry (engineered rotating machinery) for 6 years, before moving into technical sales in the same technical world, which I have now done for 12 years. I still work with Engineer's every day. They are who I sell to at a high level. So I have to understand people, personalities, and specifically the personality traits of Engineers. I would estimate that 65%+ of people who work as Engineers are actually INTP or "Engineer" personality types. So you really can stereotype most Engineers. Once you understand the personality type, Engineer's are the easiest sell there is....

To do this, it is helpful to have the Engineering personality type yourself (INTP - https://irritatedntp.tumblr.com/post/92357629826/intp-the-engineer) and learn to recognize the shortcomings of it through self awareness/maturity. Engineering personality types are "idea" people most of all, and they tend to get caught up in their own technical creativity and the endless search for better solutions. The biggest potential character flaw in INTPs is that they equate their self worth, their identity, get their ego tied up in "having the right answer". This can be an incredibly damaging flaw, especially in organizations with other personality types.

Adrian embodies many of the worst aspects of the Engineering/INTP personality. It is so transparent. He just can not acknowledge being wrong, because his whole identity and self worth is tied up in "being right". His dismissal of others who are "not educated" is nauseating, and representative of him viewing his ideas as superior. A solution is a solution. If an Engineer determined a solution through a rigorous understanding of physical and mathematical principles, then power to him. But if a talented mechanic, through experience, feel, and the simple work of trial and error comes up with the same answer, is it any less valid or valuable because of the path he took? NO! A solution is a solution.

But Engineers (the personality type) can be easy to deal with once you realize that their inability to admit being wrong is simply a fundamental personality trait. They literally can not help it. It is how they are wired. Admitting they are wrong is like the end of the universe to them. This is where, for someone in Don's position, having"people knowledge", can save a lot of grief and conflict once the understand that Adrian is not trying to be a flaming asshole. He just stumbled upon a core personality conflict for that person. Again it is a fundamental personality trait that relates to a need to have the solution and "be right".

The sad thing is, when Engineers are wrong, everyone else involved usually knows it. But INTP personality types have such poor perception of other people that they do not know that everyone knows this. And some just keep on digging the hole deeper and making themselves look more pathetic by refusing to own being wrong. Owning it when you are wrong is a great ability, both life and career enhancing.

BEING RIGHT IS NOT ALWAYS THAT IMPORTANT!
Funny, my wife is a Geotechnical Engineering, specializing in rock slopes in mining... Your explanation sums up exactly what she is. In the 10yrs I've been married to her, I think she has said "sorry" once, and I could see it was painful for her to say... Lol

In a recent memory we had a problem with our dishwasher. Her answer is to call a professional, where mine is 'let me look at it'. Her response is to instantly dismiss my claim that I am likely to not only find the problem, but to fix it (turned out to be a leaking o-ring). It is unfathomable for someone like me to do this kind of work, simply cause I don't specialize in dishwashers.

She cannot simply connect that I can tear down a 4t motor with my eyes closed, own a operate a successful landscaping business, do my own accounting, billing, quoting, multiple motor repairs on my heavy equipment, make repairs to plows, sanders, lawn mowers and such—but a dishwasher is far out of my wheelhouse...

But I still love her.
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deluxeman
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2/27/2021 1:33pm
It was painful and rather a feeble attempt to Oprahize Pulp. Neither guy seemed to give two shits about reconciling the issue. I highly doubt this intervention did anything to patch up the relationship. Adrian felt he was doing Don a solid, Don seems to enjoy being a jerk. Both were wrong and neither can admit it.

Sometimes Pulp gets it right but I just don’t thing this was one of those times.

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