Deegan's off-track acceleration is already covered in other threads, along with the crazy inconsistent penalty from the usual suspects. I was really surprised during the live call that neither Weege, Stew, JT, nor anybody else dared mentioned what they all clearly saw. Does anyone else think that the broadcast crew must have been told not to call those things out? They have always done so in the past, so I doubt it was simple oversight. IMO, it is entirely relevant to the race and it's weird to not mention it.
For good measure on how bad/inconsistent these penalties are, here is Mike Pelletier on Jett's penalty at Washougal, which immediately preceded Unadilla. Listen to his words and picture Deegan wide open as he wheelies up the hill. What changed from the last round to this one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zkbG6-2inA
Deegan clip?
The difference is simple and doesn't take a rocket scientist or conspiracy theorist to see.
Deegan bike kicked to the left. Got it straight but the momentum moved him right, when he hit the next big bump roller while he was in the air from that his momentum carried him further right. He went just outside the stakes. He was still on the race track just outside the markers. He wasnt off the track or in a water truck atv media lane which is on the other side of the banners. He accelerated up hill what a foot or so to the right of the stakes. That line was not faster considering he went outside at the top and tok the same line he would have taken had he not been bounced of the track. Its not like when he was cutting around them at I forget what track a few rounds ago.
As far as jetts penalty. I dont agree woth it but its as apples to to oranges as you can get. Jett went litterally completely off the track in the official infield, water truck, atv, media lanes. Accelerated around the outside of the track and behind the berm. You couldnt be further off the track then jett was.
This is a nothing burger. But im sure the hens here will cluck about it for the next few days doing their best impressions of The View.
"He was still on the race track just outside the markers..."
Genuinely curious, how far outside the marker do you need to be in order to be considered OFF the race track?
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It's a new hairstyle for the bedbugs.
Look who is a major sponsor of #38's team and the series as a whole. Also, #38's team is a sponsor of some of the ancillary MX/SX media programs. The program announcers called out #38's repeated course-cutting at Thunder Valley and it was widely discussed in the MX media afterwards. The AMA announced mid-event that there would be a major penalty assessed. I'm guessing two major #38 sponsors did not like that result and that kind of publicity.
Don't forget, the rider has a history, going back to 50cc racing.
The AMA's treatment of this issue (and the rules in general) makes a mockery of the professionalism the series tries to project. A one position, in-race penalty for Jett at Washougal; but a slap on the wrist, announced well after the event, for a virtually identical #38 infraction at Unadilla. (And that's leaving aside the obviously intentional and repeated take-out moves on Jo Shimoda at last year's SMX finale).
It's a joke, frankly.
See ML512's thread on "license point" penalties... I'm no lawyer (😉) but, is it possible that the apparent change in penalty assessment is due to a need to appear to not be manipulating results, now that gambling on races is allowed? Will ALL penalties during races just be license points now?
The race track is determined by the markers. By definition, if you're outside of them whether by an inch or a mile, you're off the race track
It's simple, so simple even a caveman can understand.
Theres going off track by going just over the markers which happens at every single national ive been to since they came out and most of the time isnt intentionally.
Just outside of those markers are still part of the track its just not part of the track your supposed to be on, i know duh. In situations like these 2 with haiden he was still on the race course/race track just out of bounds I guess is a good way to put it. The time he was cutting the corner was a well deserved penalty, this one wasnt. One you can easily see or argue with that lil swap it wasnt his intentions, not only that but taking the line the way he did wasnt an advantage over the previous and future laps he took the normal line.
Look he goes through the banners and does this or is completely off the race track in the water truck, atv media lanes like jett was apple to apples and everyone upset about this is right and I would agree to.
It would have taken him nearly zero effort to veer back inside the markers, but years of cheating to the smoothest line are not easy to overcome.
Now this I have some agreement with. I was very critical of the special treatment mxsports gave him and monster during his Loretta lynn years. No ones allowed to do any of this stuff after the races you'll be kicked out. Haiden and monster proceed to do just that and its a ok. I get it but I dont agree with it. Why cant red bull have one of their guys do it to for the media and marketing.
Yes but theres being off the marked track and being off the race course is my point. Haiden was still on the race course and should be a judgment call which im fine with the one made.
Then theres being off of the race course not just outside the track markers like jett was which I still wasnt a fan of the penalty but I can atleast understand their point like matthes and keefer debated.
makes little difference if the obfuscate the penalty to being basically meaningless and harmless to the rider.
Get some fresh air, boys.
this will help you understand as its clear you have not read the rules....
https://www.americanflattrack.com/assets/view/28864/2026-AMAP-MX-Rulebook-FINAL-V1.pdf
When I read this...
I heard it in Steve McQueen's voice. 🤣
Why are y'all melting down still about this? The rule literally says that if a rider doesn’t gain an advantage, the outcome is license points (not a position or time penalty).
And it’s completely reasonable to say Deegan didn’t gain an advantage: he likely got kicked sideways, got air, lost traction, wheeled, looked back, all while going uphill, and re‑entered while likely giving up a bike length or more than he had in the previous corner.
People clowning the poster above for saying “he’s still on the racetrack, just outside the markers” are just showing they don’t understand how to apply the track cut unfair advantage rule. People who can’t think in the grey always flatten everything into a bad black‑and‑white take or worse a conspiracy.
Race Direction evaluates the track and race context, not a binary “off track = penalty,” and the rule’s “properly re‑entering the course without gaining an advantage” and “accelerated in an unsafe manner” language is inherently location‑dependent. So yes, there’s a distinction to between being a little off the track and being way off it when applying the rule, because what counts as “unsafe” or “properly re‑entering” likely changes entirely based on the location of where that acceleration happens.
If you can’t grasp the difference between being few feet outside the markers and accelerating while going uphill with no advantage compared to accelerating off the track on the outside of a berm near a track worker, you’re just being obtuse.
Saying “outside the markers means off the track, period” sounds authoritative, but it isn’t the rule; it ignores the rule’s nuance, ignores the actual context, and mostly just broadcasts a level of critical‑thinking deficiency one shouldn’t be advertising, even anonymously.
So not letting off the gas = not gaining an advantage…got it 🙄
Pit Row
Not letting off the gas by itself does not equal gaining an advantage, but that would require nuance which you just advertised you can't handle.
I hear clint... through clenched teeth....
The deegan haters are just as bad as the bedbugs. Lol
Watch a Downhill World Cup mtb race. If you go outside of the course markers you must re-enter the track at the same point you left it or you will be DQ’d. Pretty brutal rule considering your race is essentially over with all the time lost climbing back up the hill to re-enter, but it keeps the field highly focused on track limits. The consistency at which the UCI enforces the rule is key, which is exactly what the AMA has a systemic problem with.
Dude.... If you spin any harder you're gonna loop out.
The majority of these guys have never seen the rule book and by some of the responses I would venture to guess that their reading comprehension would make reading and understanding the rules very difficult for them…
Let’s see, heading off the track so let off gas to stay within track markers, slows you down. Head off the track and keep it pinned for another 100 yards outside the markers, doesn’t slow you down. I know it takes some common sense, which is very difficult to obtain these days, but not slowing down > slowing down = gaining an advantage
You go to the same school as Deegan? Not slowing down isn’t the advantage the advantage is whether the rider ends up with a "net benefit" in time, momentum, distance, or position compared to the proper racing line on the track. You can stay on the gas and still lose time, and you can slow down and still gain time. The rule cares about outcome, not strictly the action. “Not slowing down” is an action. “Gaining an advantage” is an outcome.
A rider can stay on the gas and still lose time, cover more distance, lose momentum, or re‑enter the track at a worse angle than if they had remained on the proper racing line on the track. In those situations, the net effect of the off‑track excursion is negative, which means no advantage was gained regardless of the fact that the rider “didn’t slow down.” If the same action can produce different outcomes, then the action cannot logically equal the outcome. Nice try though making shit up!
Fair assumption and you might be onto something in the precedent getting set here. But the wagering lines have been so bad since the beginning of Supercross this year that it is not worth even playing anymore. I placed wagers on winners and podiums when it was introduced and if you knew the sport you could do well. Then Underdog came around and it was more of a fantasy style game that I did really well with for 2 years. This year they made all of the lines/placements so impossible that you can’t get ahead anymore. They’ll list 10 guys that have to finish better than 5th to score. Even with that they heavily counter any rider that has a shot of hitting the mark to where it literally doesn’t add any value to your team.
I know the majority of Vital members despise any wagering on the sport. They should rejoice that it is dying and will likely be gone in the next year or two…if not sooner.
This thread has an HOA meeting vibe.
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