This topic keeps coming back around,
The incident between Freise and Tomac at the weekend shows why.
Gypsy obviously took a lot of heat by saying the privateers shouldn’t be in professional sports and whilst I agree, I think there is some discrepancy over the definition,
They say on the broadcast Clubmx are a privateer team - I don’t agree, they’re just not a factory team.
In my mind, if you’re getting paid to ride by a team and it is your full time job and you don’t require another job to sustain your racing efforts, nor are you working on your own race machinery or hauling your own bikes to races, you are not a privateer. You are a paid professional racer worthy of at least the opportunity to ride at the highest level subject to qualification, same goes for the teams if you pay a salary to all your riders you are not a privateer team, you’re just not a factory team.
If you are personally driving your bikes to the races yourself, working on your own race bikes and or paying for it out of your own pocket and either funding it with personally acquired sponsors or a second job you are a ‘privateer’
This is where i feel the sport mixes up the sentiment around ‘privateers’
Paid professionals should race on tv, others should find another top tier series for their skill set like arenacross where they may make better money, get more exposure, lift other series up and maybe make a bigger name for themselves.
I know I’m going to get some heat here, but that’s my 2 cents, in line with nearly ALL other professional sports
Just introduce the 107% rule. Unfortunately moto isn't a very deep sport talent-wise and there aren't 20 guys who are good enough to actually be on the gate in SX. A lot of them should be in Arenacross
Are there really still privateers out there. Maybe we can change the term to "non factory supported".
In 1984, Mike Beier finished third in the 125 nationals behind only Jeff Ward and Johnny O'Mara.
Dude drove himself around the country in Clark W. Griswald's family truckster and took showers in the La Brea tar pits. Now, THAT was a privateer.
Are you still considered a professional if you’re paying to be on that team?
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Why do the factory boys get whatever they want? How about making them race showroom-stock bikes? They'll still be faster, but it'll be a hell of a lot more fun to watch.
Many "Professional" racers are paying or bringing money to be on the team. This isnt unique to Motocross. NASCAR, Off Road, F1.
Be interesting if everyone in the main had to swap bikes randomly for a moto .
That's even better. 😀
I am sick of reading about it. Lappers are a part of racing.
Want main events or Nationals with ten guys in each moto? Keep letting a few pampered millionaires bitch and cry. You are already not paying them, now you are letting the top 1-3 riders disrespect them and want them gone.
Makes me sick
did we REALLY need another new thread on the same topic with 4 pages of discussion already?
Where Are The Privateers? - Moto-Related - Motocross Forums / Message Boards - Vital MX
Can you name any other motorsport where lapping guys 3+ times is just considered part of it?
With 50 second lap times?
Enjoy your ten rider pro motos..
Short track racing in just about every form of motorsports has the situation you're describing every time
Gypsy Jase having the most epic meltdown crash out on Instagram over the past 24 hours...
Well at the Thai GP last weekend no one got lapped. Sure the laps are 30 seconds longer but the race is also 40 minutes long. In percentage terms the field is way closer. If anyone was getting lapped multiple times everyone would say they should be in Moto2. And that's assuming they were even getting off the racing line when getting lapped, which a lot of privateers don't do in Supercross
Well put. The whole thing of calling riders on large non-factory teams like Club MX etc 'privateers' is ridiculous. If you look at the 450 class there are essentially no 'privateers' if you use this definition. Harlan, Freddie etc are usually on some sort of non-factory team complete with a semi. Maybe that should be the definition? If you're showing up to races in a large well equipped semi you're not a privateer.
Finally, if you go with these new definitions it's hard to see who Gyp Boy means when he says privateer? Presumably non-factory?
Just casually posting a picture in this thread. Let me introduce you to Jan Pancar. True privateer, battling with two time World Champion Romain Febvre, finishing 3rd in race 1 of the MXGP of Czech Republic
Each manufacturer should have 2 teams; Tier 1 and Tier 2. Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha, Kawasaki, KTM, Husqvarna, Ducati, Triumph = 16 riders.
Tier 1 and Tier 2 should have different support levels and access to parts perhaps, but for example HRC Honda & QuadLock Honda.
Every rider paid fairly, under a semi with mechanics etc.
This should be the format for premier class. Lites class is for the younger / privateers to earn a spot on a Tier 2 team the following year.
Pit Row
I think he just missed getting lapped at the end - Can't recall exactly which Moto that I noticed him when the leader got the flag.
And NO, I'm Not slagging him - the bloke's a Star in my mind. With the pace that the front runners - well, near all out there - were going, it's heck of a thing to remain on the same lap.
Fantastic Track, Fantastic racing.
It's always a Revelation to see the Speed and Grind of Outdoors, after the Timing and the Precision of SX!
You mean last weekend at Australia? Yeah well I agree with you, that's the thing with the 'solution' some people have. With the level these guys have, it's impossible to not get lapped if you have some misfortune. Simon Langefelder got lapped during the MX2 qualifying race on saturday and unlapped himself in the process.
In the end of the day, there are 10-15 riders in the 450 class during the summer that do not belong on the same track as Jett Lawrence and Eli Tomac. I get that some of you are traditionalists are value the old school thinking of anyone with a "pro" license can line up and try to qualify and race an outdoor national. But the fact is that the thresholds to getting a pro license to be on the same gate as these elite riders is not up to a modern standard.
Thus there should absolutely be some kind of rule updates regarding how much slower you can be similar to the 107% rule.
problem is getting rid of riders is the exact opposite of growing the sport, Kids/families see less opportunity then less kids will be trying, and snowball to less riders overall, bike sales etc....the fact that SX has 18 races and pays the most etc...that is the carrot for futures racers....talk about making SX for the rich and the top 3 elite riders is probably not the best idea.
so the thought privateers ruin the racing, lets talk about that scrub Kenny, can't even jump a triple, and taking out AP in the process, talk about a brake check, worse than cross jumping, and go back a few years to Jett, cross jumping and essentialy ruining Forkners career, point is the elite make plenty of their own mistakes that screw other riders too,
yep most here will pick and choose their own narrative...
Must have over 50k instagram followers to be able to sign up for the race.
Straw man argument mean anything to you?
F1
Their races are also 90 minutes long…
IMO the blue flags don't cut it, yes they should pay attention but it's an outdated system
If you watch some of the races they are off the side of the lane waving the blue flag and a racer with tunnel vision however fast or slow they are going may not register it right away. In ear communication to let lappers know the leaders are approaching would be much more immediate, could also help with the red light fiasco.
Putting a triple crown at a track with 47 second lap times was not helping either but I digress.
Make the tracks longer, around 2:30 lap times, make the track wider for more passing, ........probably have to do them outside though. Hell, might even be able to race with 40 riders on the gate. 2 moto "Double Crowns" every weekend.
We can call it Outdoor Supercross.
Y'all crack me up 🤣
Factory teams have several million dollar budgets to spend each year to hire the cream of the crop in both riders and professional personnel allowing them to perform at a much higher level of performance equipment going a couple seconds a lap faster. Star Racing is the factory Yamaha team not a B team.
B teams scrape up a little more money from wherever they can but they still pretty much paid privateers on better bikes.
Pro Circuit and Club MX are truly impressive with enough funds to pay riders and personnel and build some really great built in house bikes.
Privateers are on a lower level of equipment keeping them from achieving the couple seconds a lap faster lap times.
Many factory and B Teams have now started working with the future top racers coming up through the ranks while they are still amateur so they are already under their tent.
In the 1990’s Mitch Payton was the 1st to start seeing and bringing in talented riders to America from other countries that helped raise the bar.
If the 250 class did what it's actually supposed to do this wouldn't be a problem. The 250 class is full of guys who are better than the bottom half of the 450 class. The ones that aren't within their first few years really should move up and the privateers of today could be battling in the "lesser" class. Now how we go about enforcing that, I don't know, because it shouldn't be an age thing and the current pointing out thing doesn't seem to be working.
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