Maduro capture

1/9/2026 3:37pm

For all of you who don't understand the play and can't see the big picture:

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1424095435732733

byke wrote:
Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do...

Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do something better than you, that it's okay to reduce morality until you find a solution? And that a criminal first place is better than a moral second place? How does this fit with wanting America to be more merit based? 

Do you realize how many verses there are in the bible that surround cheating even in the non-marital sense? As best I can tell, the big picture is ten times worse in every aspect of what it means to be an American, or a Christian, or pretty much anything we hold sacred. The whole "win at any cost" thing is for the Gordon Gekko's out there, which.....holy shit now that I'm saying it, it makes perfect sense. What doesn't make sense, is how the people in this country fell in love with it. 

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a battlefield.  Some of you are just too sheltered to see it, or choose to look the other way.

People like you may not be willing to fight for their freedom or territory, but there's a lot of us who are all for it.

4
1/9/2026 3:53pm

For all of you who don't understand the play and can't see the big picture:

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1424095435732733

T-MAC wrote:

An interesting read below. While we double down on the past, China seems to be full speed ahead into the future.

https://www.energypolicy.columbia.edu/chinas-slowing-oil-demand-growth-…

What do you mean the past?  China will always need oil, and a lot of it.  They are playing the precious metal game, and we countered...

What do you mean the past?  China will always need oil, and a lot of it.  They are playing the precious metal game, and we countered with the oil play.  Very smart of our President to be looking out for you and everyone else on this forum to avoid being owned by China.

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/china-oil-demand-plateau-betwee…

They already own you. 

2
LoudLove
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1/9/2026 3:57pm

For all of you who don't understand the play and can't see the big picture:

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1424095435732733

byke wrote:
Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do...

Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do something better than you, that it's okay to reduce morality until you find a solution? And that a criminal first place is better than a moral second place? How does this fit with wanting America to be more merit based? 

Do you realize how many verses there are in the bible that surround cheating even in the non-marital sense? As best I can tell, the big picture is ten times worse in every aspect of what it means to be an American, or a Christian, or pretty much anything we hold sacred. The whole "win at any cost" thing is for the Gordon Gekko's out there, which.....holy shit now that I'm saying it, it makes perfect sense. What doesn't make sense, is how the people in this country fell in love with it. 

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a...

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a battlefield.  Some of you are just too sheltered to see it, or choose to look the other way.

People like you may not be willing to fight for their freedom or territory, but there's a lot of us who are all for it.

Define “fight”. 

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byke
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1/9/2026 4:06pm Edited Date/Time 1/9/2026 4:07pm

For all of you who don't understand the play and can't see the big picture:

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1424095435732733

byke wrote:
Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do...

Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do something better than you, that it's okay to reduce morality until you find a solution? And that a criminal first place is better than a moral second place? How does this fit with wanting America to be more merit based? 

Do you realize how many verses there are in the bible that surround cheating even in the non-marital sense? As best I can tell, the big picture is ten times worse in every aspect of what it means to be an American, or a Christian, or pretty much anything we hold sacred. The whole "win at any cost" thing is for the Gordon Gekko's out there, which.....holy shit now that I'm saying it, it makes perfect sense. What doesn't make sense, is how the people in this country fell in love with it. 

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a...

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a battlefield.  Some of you are just too sheltered to see it, or choose to look the other way.

People like you may not be willing to fight for their freedom or territory, but there's a lot of us who are all for it.

Maybe we can avoid the "you" stuff since it delegitimizes everything we say, but I'd like to understand what the principle is. I see it as being unwilling to come in second even if it means committing crimes and support for those crimes looks very hug-a-thug to me, but the post above reads more like we have to do whatever is needed to survive, which is a totally valid principle. 

If that's the point, then the next step is validating that's the level of imminent danger that we're in, otherwise I could just walk around stealing food whenever I want and say, "sorry I need it to survive", which is both true in theory but completely untrue in practice since I have plenty of food at home and the means to either grow or purchase more food whenever I want. 

So, are you able to support what's being suggested, which is that our danger level is so severe and so imminent that morality must be scarified in order to survive? 

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The Shop

soggy
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1/9/2026 4:54pm
R66 wrote:
Do you have something against gay people? I don’t. These peoples sexual orientation was not their problem. The problem was they were championing an open border...

Do you have something against gay people? I don’t. These peoples sexual orientation was not their problem. The problem was they were championing an open border, dei programs, allowing our cities to be over run with crime, weakening our military, allowing trannies to influence kids, not knowing what a women is, not knowing what a man is, allowing men in women’s sports,  not tending to domestic issues, etc.   I post this pic because people are quick to forget what a shit show the last administration was. I do not want to go back to those times. Out of curiosity, what do you think was the greatest accomplishment of the biden administration?

you should just stay off the internet. Cause I doubt any of those things you mentioned actually impacted you consistently. 

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R66
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1/10/2026 6:59am
R66 wrote:
Do you have something against gay people? I don’t. These peoples sexual orientation was not their problem. The problem was they were championing an open border...

Do you have something against gay people? I don’t. These peoples sexual orientation was not their problem. The problem was they were championing an open border, dei programs, allowing our cities to be over run with crime, weakening our military, allowing trannies to influence kids, not knowing what a women is, not knowing what a man is, allowing men in women’s sports,  not tending to domestic issues, etc.   I post this pic because people are quick to forget what a shit show the last administration was. I do not want to go back to those times. Out of curiosity, what do you think was the greatest accomplishment of the biden administration?

soggy wrote:

you should just stay off the internet. Cause I doubt any of those things you mentioned actually impacted you consistently. 

Everything I mentioned is true and does impact the direction of our country. Ignoring these things allows them to grow. 

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Kenny Banyan
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1/10/2026 8:12am
R66 wrote:
Do you have something against gay people? I don’t. These peoples sexual orientation was not their problem. The problem was they were championing an open border...

Do you have something against gay people? I don’t. These peoples sexual orientation was not their problem. The problem was they were championing an open border, dei programs, allowing our cities to be over run with crime, weakening our military, allowing trannies to influence kids, not knowing what a women is, not knowing what a man is, allowing men in women’s sports,  not tending to domestic issues, etc.   I post this pic because people are quick to forget what a shit show the last administration was. I do not want to go back to those times. Out of curiosity, what do you think was the greatest accomplishment of the biden administration?

Good post 66….💯👍🏻

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byke
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1/10/2026 4:43pm Edited Date/Time 1/10/2026 4:45pm
plowboy wrote:
Brother man...that meme perfectly illustrates one of, if not the main reason, that Red and Blue can't get on the same page.Just because us Lefties don't...

Brother man...that meme perfectly illustrates one of, if not the main reason, that Red and Blue can't get on the same page.

Just because us Lefties don't agree with how Trump went about this doesn't mean we are "supporting" a dictator.

If we and our allies agree that an evil mother fucker has to go...then jump on it.  But that ain't what the world is seeing/hearing.

ToolMaker wrote:
Brother, if not us, then who? If not now, then when? If not how it was done, then how do you believe it should have been...

Brother, if not us, then who? If not now, then when? If not how it was done, then how do you believe it should have been done?

Do you believe it was

A: a success

B: not a success

It appears so far, that the people of Venezuela appreciate the removal of the illegitimate president.

It appears it was very targeted, not a big military resistance like in Iraq.

TM

TeamGreen wrote:
It appears it was very targeted, not a big military resistance like in Iraq.TMYou are correct: It was an op. Not a war. 💪🏼I’m...

It appears it was very targeted, not a big military resistance like in Iraq.

TM

You are correct: It was an op. Not a war. 💪🏼

I’m thoroughly enjoying the way the usual suspects…the haters…are twisting the point of “return of assets” and running with their…”it’s just about the oil” narrative…it’s like they absolutely ARE NOT interested in the actual history here…ya know?

It’s almost funny…the “ignorable truth”. No recollection of stolen U.S. assets. No interest in knowing the politics of oppression that Maduro has used to murder his opposition…the politics of the oppression of the Venezuelan people…nope. Not interested.

Just…”Hate” for their own President. Why? Because, he’s doing exactly what he said he’d do. And they hate it. He’s not a mumbling vegetable. And they hate it. Shown, for a fact, that the Biden Border was a complete shit show…that any REAL PRESIDENT could…and did…SHUT DOWN. Showed us where Billions were going for Trans-stupidity in countries who’s names many of the haters can’t even spell correctly. Yup. They hate it. 

No worries.

They’re jus’ something to laugh at. Just like their candidates were, last  November. 

 

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/trump-signs-order-protect-venezuelan-oil-revenue-held-us-accounts-2026-01-10/

Trump said ConocoPhillips will get a lot of its money back, but the U.S. would start with a clean slate. "We're not going to look at what people lost in the past because that was their fault," Trump said before asking Lance how much ConocoPhillips lost in Venezuela.

Lance said his company was owed $12 billion.

"Well, good write-off," Trump remarked.

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LoudLove
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1/11/2026 8:58am

Trump admitted this isn’t about regime change; it’s about getting Venezuelan leadership to play ball.  Give US companies access to reserves, get less cozy with our adversaries, and everything will be fine.  Trump lacks faith in the opposition, so as long as the folks replacing Maduro stick to the plan, that’s a more expeditious resolution. Which makes complete sense. 

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T-MAC
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1/11/2026 9:07am

What are the odds this had a big influence on his decision to go after Maduro?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2026/01/05/trump-pushes-conspiracy-that-venezuela-helped-biden-win-after-maduros-capture/

The irony is Trump (and Cambridge Analytica) did very similar shit leading up to his 2016 presidential occupancy.

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T-MAC
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1/11/2026 9:23am
LoudLove wrote:
Trump admitted this isn’t about regime change; it’s about getting Venezuelan leadership to play ball.  Give US companies access to reserves, get less cozy with our...

Trump admitted this isn’t about regime change; it’s about getting Venezuelan leadership to play ball.  Give US companies access to reserves, get less cozy with our adversaries, and everything will be fine.  Trump lacks faith in the opposition, so as long as the folks replacing Maduro stick to the plan, that’s a more expeditious resolution. Which makes complete sense. 

Except US oil companies are not very eager to do this, and are quite clear in their language while delicately trying to appease Trump's fragile ego.

https://www.axios.com/2026/01/09/us-oil-giants-noncommittal-on-venezuela

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LoudLove
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1/11/2026 9:43am
LoudLove wrote:
Trump admitted this isn’t about regime change; it’s about getting Venezuelan leadership to play ball.  Give US companies access to reserves, get less cozy with our...

Trump admitted this isn’t about regime change; it’s about getting Venezuelan leadership to play ball.  Give US companies access to reserves, get less cozy with our adversaries, and everything will be fine.  Trump lacks faith in the opposition, so as long as the folks replacing Maduro stick to the plan, that’s a more expeditious resolution. Which makes complete sense. 

T-MAC wrote:

Except US oil companies are not very eager to do this, and are quite clear in their language while delicately trying to appease Trump's fragile ego.

https://www.axios.com/2026/01/09/us-oil-giants-noncommittal-on-venezuela

Oh, my statement wasn’t a compliment, it was simply outlining Trump’s thought process. Needs to keep it easy to digest; detailed post-kidnapping strategies are for losers!

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Joey Bridges
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1/12/2026 3:30am

The reports surfacing about the use of sonic devices, and a force of seemingly invincible soldiers, are off the chart awesome.

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Spoonguy
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T-MAC wrote:

Neat.

R66 wrote:

Well, it is the truth. 

soggy wrote:

Imagine being 60 years old and making fun of how people look 😂. Most people left that in junior high. 

I don't know, most things I thought were funny as a child I still think are funny. Lighten up, be able to make fun of yourself too, it's just a joke after all.

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soggy
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1/12/2026 7:54am
R66 wrote:

Well, it is the truth. 

soggy wrote:

Imagine being 60 years old and making fun of how people look 😂. Most people left that in junior high. 

Spoonguy wrote:
I don't know, most things I thought were funny as a child I still think are funny. Lighten up, be able to make fun of yourself...

I don't know, most things I thought were funny as a child I still think are funny. Lighten up, be able to make fun of yourself too, it's just a joke after all.

Sure yea like a fart or something will always be funny. Making fun of how people dress or appear is insecure adolescent behavior. 

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R66
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1/12/2026 8:11am

I don’t recall making fun of them  

IMG 2525 8.jpeg?VersionId=QEH
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R66
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IMG 3197 6.jpeg?VersionId=Wyx  HF6r
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cheesehead420
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1/12/2026 8:41am
byke wrote:
Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do...

Looks like AI slop, but does the competition aspect matter? What exactly is the top level principle to support it.....when someone you're competing with may do something better than you, that it's okay to reduce morality until you find a solution? And that a criminal first place is better than a moral second place? How does this fit with wanting America to be more merit based? 

Do you realize how many verses there are in the bible that surround cheating even in the non-marital sense? As best I can tell, the big picture is ten times worse in every aspect of what it means to be an American, or a Christian, or pretty much anything we hold sacred. The whole "win at any cost" thing is for the Gordon Gekko's out there, which.....holy shit now that I'm saying it, it makes perfect sense. What doesn't make sense, is how the people in this country fell in love with it. 

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a...

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a battlefield.  Some of you are just too sheltered to see it, or choose to look the other way.

People like you may not be willing to fight for their freedom or territory, but there's a lot of us who are all for it.

byke wrote:
Maybe we can avoid the "you" stuff since it delegitimizes everything we say, but I'd like to understand what the principle is. I see it as...

Maybe we can avoid the "you" stuff since it delegitimizes everything we say, but I'd like to understand what the principle is. I see it as being unwilling to come in second even if it means committing crimes and support for those crimes looks very hug-a-thug to me, but the post above reads more like we have to do whatever is needed to survive, which is a totally valid principle. 

If that's the point, then the next step is validating that's the level of imminent danger that we're in, otherwise I could just walk around stealing food whenever I want and say, "sorry I need it to survive", which is both true in theory but completely untrue in practice since I have plenty of food at home and the means to either grow or purchase more food whenever I want. 

So, are you able to support what's being suggested, which is that our danger level is so severe and so imminent that morality must be scarified in order to survive? 

What’s at stake is unfettered growth and access to the natural resources that are required for unfettered growth. If GDP can’t grow than we can’t service our debts,  and if we can’t service our debts we lose big time. Its debt based currency in action. 

This is just what modern day war looks like. It’s fought with dimes and dollars. Supply chains and world economies are too dependent on each other for real war. Economic destruction of China equates to economic destruction of America and vice versa. 

China owns billions and billions of dollars worth of American debt and American companies do billions and billions of dollars worth of business with China and need their production capacity. We’re reliant on each other. Yet still we want to dominate each other, but we don’t want to destroy or even destabilize each other past a certain point. It’s an almost maddening dynamic. 

You underestimate the religious aspect to money and the belief that the power it conveys holds sway over all else. 

We truly have no other option but to proceed without moral considerations otherwise we are writing our own death warrant. It’s is or them, kill or be killed. 

Stable state economics is flat out not possible within our current social construct. If you want moral stability and economic sustainability then you need to radicalize. Jesus was an anarchist. 

 The only principle is that the principle must gain, month after month and year after year. The idea that profits must exceed profits from years past is necessitated within the framework of debt based currency. 

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R66
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1/12/2026 8:43am
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cheesehead420
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1/12/2026 9:25am Edited Date/Time 1/12/2026 9:43am
soggy wrote:

Imagine being 60 years old and making fun of how people look 😂. Most people left that in junior high. 

Spoonguy wrote:
I don't know, most things I thought were funny as a child I still think are funny. Lighten up, be able to make fun of yourself...

I don't know, most things I thought were funny as a child I still think are funny. Lighten up, be able to make fun of yourself too, it's just a joke after all.

soggy wrote:

Sure yea like a fart or something will always be funny. Making fun of how people dress or appear is insecure adolescent behavior. 

It’s less about what these people look like and more about the symbolic nature of what they look like represents. 

What they, or those people represent goes beyond disregard for tradition and into a completely degenerate and depraved perversion that is at least somewhat aimed at children. This is totally unacceptable and where the vast majority of the outrage is coming from. It’s a perversion of conformity because what these people are rebelling against is not even approached in their actions. By mutilating their bodies and relying on medical procedures and pharmaceutical drugs to correct their inability to accept themselves for who they are, they serve only to strengthen the very much inhuman system which nurtured their insecurities in the first place. 

The humorous and absurd hypocrisy in all this is the fact that the movement/administration which is spearheading the “resistance” against such degeneracy is actually complicit in protecting an international pedophile ring and the individuals who took part in it. 
Which of course included many individuals from the left. And it is this fact that proves ultimate loyalty is to the State and the institutions of commerce and not political parties. 

*edited for spelling 

R66
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1/12/2026 9:45am

I agree. It is not what they look like, it is what they stand for. 

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R66
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1/12/2026 9:49am
It’s less about what these people look like and more about the symbolic nature of what they look like represents. What they, or those people represent goes...

It’s less about what these people look like and more about the symbolic nature of what they look like represents. 

What they, or those people represent goes beyond disregard for tradition and into a completely degenerate and depraved perversion that is at least somewhat aimed at children. This is totally unacceptable and where the vast majority of the outrage is coming from. It’s a perversion of conformity because what these people are rebelling against is not even approached in their actions. By mutilating their bodies and relying on medical procedures and pharmaceutical drugs to correct their inability to accept themselves for who they are, they serve only to strengthen the very much inhuman system which nurtured their insecurities in the first place. 

The humorous and absurd hypocrisy in all this is the fact that the movement/administration which is spearheading the “resistance” against such degeneracy is actually complicit in protecting an international pedophile ring and the individuals who took part in it. 
Which of course included many individuals from the left. And it is this fact that proves ultimate loyalty is to the State and the institutions of commerce and not political parties. 

*edited for spelling 

The last administration championed the trannies and gays but they did not release the Epstein files either so don’t solely hang that around the neck of the current administration. 

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T-MAC
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1/12/2026 9:50am
R66 wrote:

I agree. It is not what they look like, it is what they stand for. 

Fair enough, but your post above is somewhat contradictory of this claim though. Be consistent brotha!

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byke
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1/12/2026 10:01am
Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a...

Just like the guy in the video said, "they're (you) are missing the point".  I'm not expecting everyone to understand...this is not a playground, it's a battlefield.  Some of you are just too sheltered to see it, or choose to look the other way.

People like you may not be willing to fight for their freedom or territory, but there's a lot of us who are all for it.

byke wrote:
Maybe we can avoid the "you" stuff since it delegitimizes everything we say, but I'd like to understand what the principle is. I see it as...

Maybe we can avoid the "you" stuff since it delegitimizes everything we say, but I'd like to understand what the principle is. I see it as being unwilling to come in second even if it means committing crimes and support for those crimes looks very hug-a-thug to me, but the post above reads more like we have to do whatever is needed to survive, which is a totally valid principle. 

If that's the point, then the next step is validating that's the level of imminent danger that we're in, otherwise I could just walk around stealing food whenever I want and say, "sorry I need it to survive", which is both true in theory but completely untrue in practice since I have plenty of food at home and the means to either grow or purchase more food whenever I want. 

So, are you able to support what's being suggested, which is that our danger level is so severe and so imminent that morality must be scarified in order to survive? 

What’s at stake is unfettered growth and access to the natural resources that are required for unfettered growth. If GDP can’t grow than we can’t service...

What’s at stake is unfettered growth and access to the natural resources that are required for unfettered growth. If GDP can’t grow than we can’t service our debts,  and if we can’t service our debts we lose big time. Its debt based currency in action. 

This is just what modern day war looks like. It’s fought with dimes and dollars. Supply chains and world economies are too dependent on each other for real war. Economic destruction of China equates to economic destruction of America and vice versa. 

China owns billions and billions of dollars worth of American debt and American companies do billions and billions of dollars worth of business with China and need their production capacity. We’re reliant on each other. Yet still we want to dominate each other, but we don’t want to destroy or even destabilize each other past a certain point. It’s an almost maddening dynamic. 

You underestimate the religious aspect to money and the belief that the power it conveys holds sway over all else. 

We truly have no other option but to proceed without moral considerations otherwise we are writing our own death warrant. It’s is or them, kill or be killed. 

Stable state economics is flat out not possible within our current social construct. If you want moral stability and economic sustainability then you need to radicalize. Jesus was an anarchist. 

 The only principle is that the principle must gain, month after month and year after year. The idea that profits must exceed profits from years past is necessitated within the framework of debt based currency. 

I just completely disagree with the foundation of all that, because I think that being a monster is far worse than death. I think it would have been much better for German soldiers to die by their own hand, than to become Nazi's and then be killed. The end result is that they're dead either way, but only one death is honorable and would have been reflected on positively by future generations. It reads like being waaaaaaay too eager to abandon morality, like looking for an excuse and all someone had to do is wave some cash (cash that we'll never see personally) and instill a little fear and poof it's gone. 

Now, to be fair, I think being open to abandoning morality has a very strong 1:1 with comfort, and me feeling far from abandoning morality might come from a position of comfort. Anyone that's desperate, is far more likely to abandon morality. My morality has never truly been tested. I've never had to live under an overpass, I've never been to prison, and I've never been unable to afford food. I'd like to think that I'd hold strong under such pressure, but I can't say for sure and history often says otherwise. 

2
Chance1216
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1/12/2026 10:10am
soggy wrote:

Sure yea like a fart or something will always be funny. Making fun of how people dress or appear is insecure adolescent behavior. 

Just yesterday, I told my daughter’s boyfriend, get rid of that tank top “Powder”. Put a tee shirt on. That shits embarrassing. 

Im pushing 50. Growing up is the worst thing we could do. 
 

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T-MAC
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1/12/2026 10:14am Edited Date/Time 1/12/2026 10:17am

Agreed. Growing up in the societal sense is overrated in a lot of ways.

Growing old is mandatory, up is optional.

EDIT - The world would really blow if we couldn't handle making fun of each other in a healthy way.

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soggy
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1/12/2026 10:34am
soggy wrote:

Sure yea like a fart or something will always be funny. Making fun of how people dress or appear is insecure adolescent behavior. 

Chance1216 wrote:
Just yesterday, I told my daughter’s boyfriend, get rid of that tank top “Powder”. Put a tee shirt on. That shits embarrassing. Im pushing 50. Growing up...

Just yesterday, I told my daughter’s boyfriend, get rid of that tank top “Powder”. Put a tee shirt on. That shits embarrassing. 

Im pushing 50. Growing up is the worst thing we could do. 
 

Little help, I don’t know what tank top ‘powder’ means?

cheesehead420
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1/12/2026 11:07am
byke wrote:
Maybe we can avoid the "you" stuff since it delegitimizes everything we say, but I'd like to understand what the principle is. I see it as...

Maybe we can avoid the "you" stuff since it delegitimizes everything we say, but I'd like to understand what the principle is. I see it as being unwilling to come in second even if it means committing crimes and support for those crimes looks very hug-a-thug to me, but the post above reads more like we have to do whatever is needed to survive, which is a totally valid principle. 

If that's the point, then the next step is validating that's the level of imminent danger that we're in, otherwise I could just walk around stealing food whenever I want and say, "sorry I need it to survive", which is both true in theory but completely untrue in practice since I have plenty of food at home and the means to either grow or purchase more food whenever I want. 

So, are you able to support what's being suggested, which is that our danger level is so severe and so imminent that morality must be scarified in order to survive? 

What’s at stake is unfettered growth and access to the natural resources that are required for unfettered growth. If GDP can’t grow than we can’t service...

What’s at stake is unfettered growth and access to the natural resources that are required for unfettered growth. If GDP can’t grow than we can’t service our debts,  and if we can’t service our debts we lose big time. Its debt based currency in action. 

This is just what modern day war looks like. It’s fought with dimes and dollars. Supply chains and world economies are too dependent on each other for real war. Economic destruction of China equates to economic destruction of America and vice versa. 

China owns billions and billions of dollars worth of American debt and American companies do billions and billions of dollars worth of business with China and need their production capacity. We’re reliant on each other. Yet still we want to dominate each other, but we don’t want to destroy or even destabilize each other past a certain point. It’s an almost maddening dynamic. 

You underestimate the religious aspect to money and the belief that the power it conveys holds sway over all else. 

We truly have no other option but to proceed without moral considerations otherwise we are writing our own death warrant. It’s is or them, kill or be killed. 

Stable state economics is flat out not possible within our current social construct. If you want moral stability and economic sustainability then you need to radicalize. Jesus was an anarchist. 

 The only principle is that the principle must gain, month after month and year after year. The idea that profits must exceed profits from years past is necessitated within the framework of debt based currency. 

byke wrote:
I just completely disagree with the foundation of all that, because I think that being a monster is far worse than death. I think it would...

I just completely disagree with the foundation of all that, because I think that being a monster is far worse than death. I think it would have been much better for German soldiers to die by their own hand, than to become Nazi's and then be killed. The end result is that they're dead either way, but only one death is honorable and would have been reflected on positively by future generations. It reads like being waaaaaaay too eager to abandon morality, like looking for an excuse and all someone had to do is wave some cash (cash that we'll never see personally) and instill a little fear and poof it's gone. 

Now, to be fair, I think being open to abandoning morality has a very strong 1:1 with comfort, and me feeling far from abandoning morality might come from a position of comfort. Anyone that's desperate, is far more likely to abandon morality. My morality has never truly been tested. I've never had to live under an overpass, I've never been to prison, and I've never been unable to afford food. I'd like to think that I'd hold strong under such pressure, but I can't say for sure and history often says otherwise. 

I also completely disagree with the whole philosophical premise, or metaphysical assumptions which underly and define our entire modern world view. It’s completely suicidal and if things aren’t drastically changed on a global level future generations will certainly suffer the consequences of our infantile and selfish actions. 

But the very reluctant pragmatist in me admits that for the most part blackdieselbomber is not wrong. If we don’t dominate China, then China dominates us. And I guess I’d rather have my future circumstances dictated by the devil I know.   Pick your poison.  The old proverb is “Better the devil you know than the devil you don't“.

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