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It’s almost like you didn’t learn that the “9-5 40 hr a week” came about BECAUSE of organized labor.
Point 4 mentions an existing AMA Pro Riders group.
What is that? Are they active in MX, or just road racing?
I am well versed in it. Guess you never learned that was more than 100 years ago? All the good attributes were incorporated (child labor laws for 1) and the idea of collecting bargaining still exists but times have changed massively and unions long ago outlived their usefulness to the working stiff due to corruption, favoritism, and power hungry "leaders" making obscene salaries who want to influence politics using forced union dues to keep living the high life more than helping average workers. I worked in 2 union shops in different fields myself. There's ZERO need here for a union or collective bargaining or threats of strikes that would completely alienate the fans and riders and kill the sport while doing so. Trying to fix a "problem" that simply doesn't exist.
Tell me you an npc without telling me you an npc.... lol... ya sure... no problem... you work your ass off, risk your life on the daily, for pennies on the dollar... so that people in suits who don't ride, make brinks truck after brinks truck of cold hard cash, off your broken bones and destroyed mind...
Will say you are one well programmed worker bot rd... standing up for your masters like a good slave... lolll
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If we're going to indulge in fantasies based on events and conditions almost 100 years ago, the creation of United Artists might be a better goal.
Damn, you had a pretty awesome amateur career in one of the best eras of MX, IMO!! Thankfully you've came out ok after all the injuries!
Good luck on the new adventure!
Absolute power corrupts. You all know this, and you clearly know corruption exists on both sides of the Labor/Management divide. But claiming unions are automatically corrupt is as asinine as claiming management is always criminally crooked too. Just like our system of governance, there needs to be checks and balances to keep a semblance of social order. That this is being disputed is remarkable.
too funny- are you a comedian? You got me all wrong dude. I retired early at 56 years old and my only master is Father Time. I started riding in the early 1970s and like many of us had dreams of 1 day getting sponsored and racing for a living. Unfortunately, I was in the 99.9% of riders that would never get to that elite level and career. The racers we follow are the .1% that DO get sponsored and race for a living. They make a great living doing what they love and getting paid well doing it. They are also Free Agents that don't need any middleman group representing them when they choose which new contracts to sign or dictate terms of their employment with sponsors. There is no value added for these pro racers forming a union. Your ramblings above don't apply to the .1% I described, and the only entities making bank off the sport the way you think they are is the promoters and media groups. Maybe go boycott them or something if you have to have a bad guy here that keeps you up at night?
I have some questions. Many of the factories/teams are based in CA. In CA we have something called AB5 (thanks (please note sarcasm here) to Lorena Gonzales) that says if an independent contractor is integral to the operation of your business (who can argue that a rider is not integral to a race team) then that rider HAS to be an employee unless they are incorporated and you are contracting with a corporation. That being said, if the riders are corporate entities, and they collectively make demands, would that not be illegal? As corporations are not allowed to collude?
Just talking out my ass here
AB5 addressing use independent contractor status to avoid giving employees benefits/SSI/etc. doesn't seem apt at all to professional athletes.
So who is actually running this 'new organization' and how much of the riders' money are they taking off the top for running it?
“Anonymous”
I don't know who in here doesn't know this, other than the guy posting this crap, but UNIONs DO NOT WORK. They just cost everyone more money and involve more people that have nothing to do with the end goal except to collect money for themselves. Show me a thriving union that "works"...I'll wait. Just like waiting for the first real working model of socialism or communism.
You need to take a history lesson, union are responsible for most all the labor laws from the 1910s.
The iaff and ups has a crazy good union. There's a reason most corporate interests and corporate owned media are anti union.
No it would not be good for the sport but it would be good for the racers
If organized labor goes away, so do most of the things we all take for granted for the working class. The income gap is expanding, let’s not put that in hyper drive.
For those of you concerned about “middle men” taking money away from any riders involved in a collective bargaining agreement, do you also oppose the rider agents that currently represent, negotiate for and take quite a bit of money from every star racer currently?
That they have agents underscores that they are independent contractors.
What objections I have to agents in MX is that many (not all) don't appear to me to be competent, add value, or seem to have a grasp that they have a fiduciary duty of undivided loyalty to advance their client's interests, which includes subordinating their own interests to the interests of their clients.
I don't have conceptual objections to agents, or to a union. As a practical matter, however, I think a riders' union in this sport cohesive across all talent levels is a wild ass pipe dream. People have been talking about this for the last 25 years on boards like this, and before then when boards didn't exist. It hasn't happened - largely because the elite riders don't need it and are not willing or interested in getting sidetracked into it. Sorry for that real world take. If anything I'd say a scab mentality dominates top to bottom - guys are climbing over one another trying to get prime opportunities.
That they have agents also underscores the fact that it would be extremely difficult, if not impossible, for a lone rider to negotiate a decent deal with a corporation.
But to your point about the real world, I largely agree. There’s only a tiny universe of marketable talent at any given time, the audience is also relatively small, and the promoters and organizers intentionally keep the number of events limited to maintain their control. I just think that change is only possible if one is willing to consider changing.
Pit Row
I'm not sure about that with respect to agents. I guess it depends what talent level the rider has in the sport. The more elite a rider is the more leverage he has to attract sponsors and play them off one another for the best deal.
What agents can do, and may help some mid level talent, is connect riders to opportunities and apply some expertise to refining terms. A good agent also allows the rider to focus on rider prep rather than churning deal opportunities. There's an inherent value to having an agent or business manager mind the store while a rider focuses on training, etc. But not everyone who wants in on the entourage is good at that.
Whether the cost of an agent nets a bigger deal seems questionable to me, at least with respect to top talent. An elite rider might do better paying a lawyer by the hour to review contracts. I've definitely seen contracts through agents in this sport that could have benefited from a transactional attorney to avoid grief to the rider. The Berik contracts from the 2000s come to mind.
FTE, I will also agree with you that a good lawyer (or perhaps even business manager) might be able to get as good a deal, or even better deal for a sought-after racer than some of these agents out here. But my point is that the racer benefits from having someone on their side negotiating on their behalf, and the racer will pay for that “middle man” and be glad they did. I’m just kicking the chair out from under the “no middle men” argument against rider representation. An aspiring professional racer would have to be an idiot not to seek professional help with their contracts.
Unions can work, if they are organised and run appropriately. Here in Australia in the 70’s and 80’s many unions went off the rails when they decided to use their influence to start interfering in how companies were run. Couple that with corrupt union leaders and it went downhill fast.
Are you saying riders are entitled to a living from racing dirtbikes?
He’s trying to say he’s 14.” Npc. Bot. “
He should be the BA of this said union.
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