Deegan and Shimoda Penalized

What about the other 30 guys that jumped it (not wheels on the ground)?

Mike Pelletier only cares about the headlines that grab attention. Jo and Deegan are the main guys, so naturally they’re the ones he cares about. Couldn’t be bothered with the rest. This guy is a joke.

I’m getting really sick of Pelletier enforcing the rules that are clearly not in the spirit of the rule book.

The rule for Jumping the gate is only for people trying to gain an advantage. It was obvious Jett wasn’t intentionally doing that.

The rule for jumping the Red Cross flag is endangering a downed rider. Here the Red Cross flag was used only to signal the end of the race since not every flagger has an actual red flag.

This is getting ridiculous. When the rules break down it kills the “buzz” of the race because the results clearly become a farce. Davies was 22 seconds behind and the infraction happened in a race that didn’t even count.

Not to mention, this guy only penalizes the guys out front, he selectively enforces the rules and doesn’t pay attention to anyone else.

Atleast they didn't get docked a whole lap, this rule seems way more reasonable. 

In a situation where it is a failed attempt to start a race on the first lap, this seems ridiculous. 

I have about had it with Pelletier following the  rulebook as written

Move the red flagger to the side of the track where the riders are headed so they can see it NOT up the side of hill on the opposite side.

Why do you think the mechanics area is on the other side??? Because thats where the riders can see them!

I've raced and flagged at Budds a bunch and would never have seen that flagger hanging out in the shade on the inside of that turn.  It's hard to tell on TV but it's a high speed, off camber turn.  No one is looking inside.  I'm not sure if there was another wog flag that I couldn't see on the broadcast, but they shouldn't hold it against riders for not seeing the one they highlighted on the broadcast. 

Cole saw it 🤷‍♂️

What if Deegs checked up and then was landed on breaking an arm or something. Would you want the rider that landed on him penalized or just nah, that moto didn’t count so no big deal? Pretty sure the penalty was to get guys to pay attention

Deegan and Jo were penalized positions because they made passes jumping it. I believe the other riders that jumped it will just get the points penalty Deegan and Jo also got. 

Impeccable sarcasm here, gave me a chuckle 😃 

I only have about 25 years experience in flagging and communication that includes Imsa and SCCA sports car, Indy car, Motorcycle Road racing, and about 15 years in MX.

One thing you should never do is use the wrong flag as a substitute for one you aren't qualified to have. There's a good reason there isn't a red flag in every flaggers kit.

I would have had every flagger, who didn't  have a red flag, wave the yellow.

This isn't a comment on the penalty as I haven't seen it, but wrong flag or not, they should have had wheels down. 

Now flagger placement is a whole different discussion. 

If you don't enforce rules, they will be ignored. Unfortunately if the rules are poorly written then they don't serve anybody. Trace amounts of lead could be from distribution, solder joints in the fuel pump, brass or diecast parts etc. which is why fuelgate became an issue. It was a poorly written rule. Personally, I don't think the no jumping on a medical flag is poorly written. The riders need to be trained line Pavlov's slobbering dog to check up when that flag is out, and exceptions don't further that agenda.

I did have some dude yelling at me last year at a vet national at Walshoughal for not slowing down on the medical flag enough. Thing was, I'm old and the eyeballs don't transition from light to dark very well. It was right where you go in the shade and it took me too long to see the flag. Had I been penalized, I would have been pissed, but rules are rules and it wouldn't have been wrong. Enforcement can never be ambiguous.

Fuelgate was an issue because it was managed inconsistently and backpedaled when someone threw a tanty. This is not that. 
However I do agree that the rules must be enforced. But the issue is many are poorly defined and open to interpretation, which leads to further inconsistencies.

Deegan cheating the sky is blue move along.

I doubt Pelletie will loose any sleep knowing you have had it with him 🤣 

both were robbed today.....doubt they even saw the flagger?

maybe some lights setup around every major jump??

You guys know Pelletier is my boss, right?

This is Vital, Mike .  🙄

Lol

In this day a LED WiFi traffic light would be a great addition in both SX and MX.

Honestly, I feel the AMA is finally starting to get things sorted out. Stick to the rule book, and if it's a poorly written rule, revise it and move on. But for the love of Pedro, just be consistent.

I am torn on my opinion of this penalty. On one hand, I like that they are strict with 0 tolerance for not abiding by a red cross flag.  But on the other hand, I do not feel like they should use it in the case of a restart like that, UNLESS a rider is down and they are using it for the normal purpose of safety.

  It will be interesting to see how the penalties get handed out when they will directly impact a title. So far they have been for show penalties with them not really impacting much. 

In the case of Jett's penalty, who knows how that may have impacted the title if Sexton had not gone down and he had kept that slight advantage in points leading into SMX. With last year's title being a tie, 1 point would have changed the results  , that single point per position could be worth a lot!

 As it is, it seems ridiculous to penalize them in the final results of the moto.  I think a more fair way to penalize may be to change up the start positions instead. So instead of Deegan getting first pick or however they lined them back up, penalize him so he gets second pic. I get it that it is a restart and technically the same race. But if they are going to throw red cross flags for a red flagged race without a rider down, I think that the penalty should be in position of the running order and only impact the restart lineup. If it was for a downed rider, perhaps they have the penalty as is. But during a red flag restart, it seems wrong and again, not in the spirit of the rule. 

 But really, is this a normal thing or did the flagger grab the wrong flag? I don't remember ever seeing the red cross for a restart/red flagged moto. But might just be easy to forget if nobody was penalized before. I remember them using red cross flags after the finish of a race on jumps they were worried about some riders rolling and others jumping. And they were doing the wheels on the ground first lap of practice for a bit.  But the wheels on the ground right there seemed strange and like a mistake.  

     But that said, even if the flagger used the flag by mistake, they need to be strict with the penalty. So its hard for me to say I disagree with them being penalized. As long as EVERYBODY who did it was also penalized with the proper penalty. 

That I agree on, very hard to see it and pure luck some riders picked i up.

You cant have some riders jumping and some not. Its a danger in itself that they jumped, when others didnt.

Only thing i agree on is where the flagg was positioned, it was Impossible to see for some riders and that needs to be taken into consideration. Depending on the line you used, you would have to turn your head where you dont normally look to see it.

If flagg is issued in a non proper way, it needs to be disregarded.

They already have systems for cars that are similar to the one I've been saying should be developed for SX/MX.  With LED's that indicate a flag . I've seen a couple systems. One had a small screen that also would transmit a message like" yellow flag crash in corner 2  stay high".  And one had a more simple setup with just a few LEDs that could change colors depending on what flag was displayed.  I'll try and find them again and post them here.

THE RULEBOOK ACTUALLY SAYS 2 POSITIONS AND SPOT GAINED  PLUS 5 POINTS

This is one of the simple ones.  It would be good for full track red flags  as it is.  As far as I know it wouldn't work for localized flags.  Some sort of timing loops or GPS  system would need to be integrated to have the localized sections  trigger the system.  

I would think that You could come up with a simple way to add in either what side to go to, or what to avoid.  Have it light up in an arrow pointing to whichever side of the track to avoid.   

Have it flash blue as the leaders come up behind You.  

Flash Red for red cross, solid red for red flag.

In SX they could flash the leader lights in red on all the bikes if a race is red flagged. 

 I'm not sure where You would mount them. Maybe make a special bar pad cover they could be inside and make them somewhat flexible. Like rope lights and similar are flexible and would not be a hard chunk of plastic or metal. 

But it sounds like they are working on spotters and a way to talk to the riders instead.  

I've seen others that are more involved. This one is one of the least expensive and most simple that I saw.

This system would do everything needed. The in car part would be a little hard to put on a bike in a place that would be easy to see. But the system allows for localized flags, sending live penalty info, etc.