Philly mudder

Johnny Ringo
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4/11/2025 5:56am

Im old enough to remember mud races in the 90s and 00’s

Toughen the fuck up

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truck
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4/11/2025 6:26am

Im old enough to remember mud races in the 90s and 00’s

Toughen the fuck up

I find this to be a very lazy response to this topic. The criticisms have nothing to do with being soft. It's about adding a level of chaos and random chance to a series that already has enough of both. You could add nails to the track and see who rides better with flats but that wouldn't make anyone tougher or mean that the results were a better indicator of who the best guy was. A track that the best guys in the world can barely get around is the same thing. 

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Johnny Ringo
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4/11/2025 6:54am Edited Date/Time 4/11/2025 6:55am

Im old enough to remember mud races in the 90s and 00’s

Toughen the fuck up

truck wrote:
I find this to be a very lazy response to this topic. The criticisms have nothing to do with being soft. It's about adding a level...

I find this to be a very lazy response to this topic. The criticisms have nothing to do with being soft. It's about adding a level of chaos and random chance to a series that already has enough of both. You could add nails to the track and see who rides better with flats but that wouldn't make anyone tougher or mean that the results were a better indicator of who the best guy was. A track that the best guys in the world can barely get around is the same thing. 

I guess I don’t really care how you “find” my response.

So should we cancel/postpone outdoors that are muddy too?

These are the best guys in the world in the premier series in the world. Having challenging conditions is fine. Maybe go watch basketball or something.

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truck
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4/11/2025 7:09am Edited Date/Time 4/11/2025 7:10am

Im old enough to remember mud races in the 90s and 00’s

Toughen the fuck up

truck wrote:
I find this to be a very lazy response to this topic. The criticisms have nothing to do with being soft. It's about adding a level...

I find this to be a very lazy response to this topic. The criticisms have nothing to do with being soft. It's about adding a level of chaos and random chance to a series that already has enough of both. You could add nails to the track and see who rides better with flats but that wouldn't make anyone tougher or mean that the results were a better indicator of who the best guy was. A track that the best guys in the world can barely get around is the same thing. 

I guess I don’t really care how you “find” my response.So should we cancel/postpone outdoors that are muddy too?These are the best guys in the world...

I guess I don’t really care how you “find” my response.

So should we cancel/postpone outdoors that are muddy too?

These are the best guys in the world in the premier series in the world. Having challenging conditions is fine. Maybe go watch basketball or something.

So add nails for a few rounds? 

I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race with a muddy track. What we had in foxboro last week didn't even resemble supercross. Also don't have the option to have indoor MX and avoid the issue entirely like you do with SX.

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The Shop

Johnny Ringo
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4/11/2025 7:17am
truck wrote:
I find this to be a very lazy response to this topic. The criticisms have nothing to do with being soft. It's about adding a level...

I find this to be a very lazy response to this topic. The criticisms have nothing to do with being soft. It's about adding a level of chaos and random chance to a series that already has enough of both. You could add nails to the track and see who rides better with flats but that wouldn't make anyone tougher or mean that the results were a better indicator of who the best guy was. A track that the best guys in the world can barely get around is the same thing. 

I guess I don’t really care how you “find” my response.So should we cancel/postpone outdoors that are muddy too?These are the best guys in the world...

I guess I don’t really care how you “find” my response.

So should we cancel/postpone outdoors that are muddy too?

These are the best guys in the world in the premier series in the world. Having challenging conditions is fine. Maybe go watch basketball or something.

truck wrote:
So add nails for a few rounds? I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race...

So add nails for a few rounds? 

I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race with a muddy track. What we had in foxboro last week didn't even resemble supercross. Also don't have the option to have indoor MX and avoid the issue entirely like you do with SX.

Millville 06 resembled normal motocross? High Point 97? Loretta’s 2020?

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truck
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4/11/2025 7:25am
I guess I don’t really care how you “find” my response.So should we cancel/postpone outdoors that are muddy too?These are the best guys in the world...

I guess I don’t really care how you “find” my response.

So should we cancel/postpone outdoors that are muddy too?

These are the best guys in the world in the premier series in the world. Having challenging conditions is fine. Maybe go watch basketball or something.

truck wrote:
So add nails for a few rounds? I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race...

So add nails for a few rounds? 

I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race with a muddy track. What we had in foxboro last week didn't even resemble supercross. Also don't have the option to have indoor MX and avoid the issue entirely like you do with SX.

Millville 06 resembled normal motocross? High Point 97? Loretta’s 2020?

You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. 

You ever order a large amount of fill dirt? Lot of rocks and nails and trash.... Premiere series, why not see who the true tough guys are, right? 

You can like mud races if you want but the soft/tough guy rationale is old man yells at clouds territory. 

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Johnny Ringo
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4/11/2025 7:30am
truck wrote:
So add nails for a few rounds? I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race...

So add nails for a few rounds? 

I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race with a muddy track. What we had in foxboro last week didn't even resemble supercross. Also don't have the option to have indoor MX and avoid the issue entirely like you do with SX.

Millville 06 resembled normal motocross? High Point 97? Loretta’s 2020?

truck wrote:
You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. You...

You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. 

You ever order a large amount of fill dirt? Lot of rocks and nails and trash.... Premiere series, why not see who the true tough guys are, right? 

You can like mud races if you want but the soft/tough guy rationale is old man yells at clouds territory. 

You’re changing the subject with the weird nails in the dirt thing. It’s not the same.

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William
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4/11/2025 7:31am

Im old enough to remember mud races in the 90s and 00’s

Toughen the fuck up

I think a lot of people just prefer to see the races in dry conditions. I dont enjoy mud races nearly as much either.

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4/11/2025 7:58am
truck wrote:
You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. You...

You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. 

You ever order a large amount of fill dirt? Lot of rocks and nails and trash.... Premiere series, why not see who the true tough guys are, right? 

You can like mud races if you want but the soft/tough guy rationale is old man yells at clouds territory. 

I feel like you are the old man yelling at clouds here. I think the great majority of fans prefer dry tracks. Feld isn’t making it rain. The schedule is what it is. Your scenario of adding nails would only make sense if Feld was requiring the tracks to be muddy. 

You can’t change the weather, if it rains and it’s muddy you have three options. 1) enjoy for what it is 2) don’t watch it 3)watch it and complain about it on multiple threads. I chose option 1 you chose option 3. 

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Zycki11
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4/11/2025 8:12am
truck wrote:
So add nails for a few rounds? I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race...

So add nails for a few rounds? 

I don't find the MX / SX comparison compelling either. Muddy MX track is more or less the same race with a muddy track. What we had in foxboro last week didn't even resemble supercross. Also don't have the option to have indoor MX and avoid the issue entirely like you do with SX.

Millville 06 resembled normal motocross? High Point 97? Loretta’s 2020?

truck wrote:
You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. You...

You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. 

You ever order a large amount of fill dirt? Lot of rocks and nails and trash.... Premiere series, why not see who the true tough guys are, right? 

You can like mud races if you want but the soft/tough guy rationale is old man yells at clouds territory. 

I think most are actually missing it.  They can't postpone the race etc. It either runs, or it is cancelled and MAYBE made up at a different date which has happened I believe one time. Feld can't rent the stadium so on so forth just on a whim, everything has to line up. So they are going to race if they can race. 

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Falcon
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4/11/2025 8:14am

Let's consider the alternative to hosting a muddy Supercross. 

Firstly, what do you propose they do? Just rain it out and tell everyone to go home? Remember, tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars were spent getting all the dirt in there, all the teams to show up, and all the support personnel - all of whom rely on that show's attendance for a portion (or all) of their paycheck. It's extremely difficult or impossible to reschedule the race, so that's out. 
"Just schedule the race somewhere with a dome" doesn't seem so hard, but apparently the schedules for those venues won't permit. Also, the venues we have now probably have hosting agreements throughout some future date - you can't just cancel on them without just cause or pay a penalty. 

I'll further remind everyone that this is not baseball. The historic tradition of Motocross, of which Supercross is an offshoot, is "run the race, rain or shine." 

For me, it's pretty simple: accept an occasional mud race and revel in the variety.

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Kyzer138
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4/11/2025 8:17am

Nobody forces you anti-mud people to watch the race. 

Bring on the rain for Philly

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Zycki11
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4/11/2025 8:28am
Kyzer138 wrote:

Nobody forces you anti-mud people to watch the race. 

Bring on the rain for Philly

LMAO watching you saying that while looking at your profile picture made me laugh pretty good

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truck
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4/11/2025 8:42am

I have at no point advocated for canceling or not watching a race. 

Nobody prefers mud races. Agreed? The entire day is fingers crossed that a championship isn't altered by a mechanical failure. We have 8 minute mains. Bikes destroyed, on and on.... These are things that nobody wants!!! The tough guy routine is just lame and has nothing to do with it. 

It's about mitigating risk. Several rounds in the northeast in the spring in open air stadiums is a choice that greatly increases the chances of mud races. It's not random, it's predictable. If you think it makes me soft or whiny for pointing out that we got races that nobody wants because of choices that were made, so be it.

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-MAVERICK-
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4/11/2025 9:09am

Updated Schedule 

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MX Culture
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4/11/2025 9:13am

Just cancelled my flight, I'm out. 

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Magoofan
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4/11/2025 9:15am

Im old enough to remember mud races in the 90s and 00’s

Toughen the fuck up

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^  vvvvvvvvvvv

darts-bulls-eye-2369711651 6.gif?VersionId=0HO8J1I3Hl74aaelJrrNTiVqZVsz

 

I miss the old guard..... "fans" are going downhill and dragging the sport with it.  

 

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yak651
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4/11/2025 9:15am

Any journalist interview Bondo to ask what he’s planning to do different to improve the broadcast if there is another Mudder? Or we just going to run with the “it’s hard bro” excuse two weeks in a row?

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MX Culture
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4/11/2025 9:18am Edited Date/Time 4/11/2025 9:19am
truck wrote:
They would have to be early season rounds because of scheduling but gotta be 10 or so MLB stadiums that also have a roof. Milwaukee comes...

They would have to be early season rounds because of scheduling but gotta be 10 or so MLB stadiums that also have a roof. Milwaukee comes to mind. Syracuse and San Antonio also have enclosed venues that would work. 

Funny story..

2004-ish, Supercross banquet in Vegas, Sunday night after the final round. One of the top guys at Feld (I think it was Clear Channel then) tells me that there will be a SX in Milwaukee at Miller Park within 2 years. LOL. It's been 21 now, should I still be waiting?

I'm hoping that the new Bears stadium in Arlington Heights happens and we can get a race there sometime in the future.

DD

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4/11/2025 9:20am
truck wrote:
I have at no point advocated for canceling or not watching a race. Nobody prefers mud races. Agreed? The entire day is fingers crossed that a championship...

I have at no point advocated for canceling or not watching a race. 

Nobody prefers mud races. Agreed? The entire day is fingers crossed that a championship isn't altered by a mechanical failure. We have 8 minute mains. Bikes destroyed, on and on.... These are things that nobody wants!!! The tough guy routine is just lame and has nothing to do with it. 

It's about mitigating risk. Several rounds in the northeast in the spring in open air stadiums is a choice that greatly increases the chances of mud races. It's not random, it's predictable. If you think it makes me soft or whiny for pointing out that we got races that nobody wants because of choices that were made, so be it.

The guys up front in points are crossing fingers to hold their positions, the guys behind in points are crossing fingers to make points up. Same track conditions for everyone. Certainly not predictable, it is just a part of racing. I don’t hope for mud but when it happens I like to see how it all unfolds and it makes the upcoming rounds even more exciting.

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4/11/2025 9:52am
Bow977 wrote:

Mud races are horrible to watch 

Supercross yes, real moto no.

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OleTex2
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4/11/2025 10:05am
truck wrote:
I have at no point advocated for canceling or not watching a race. Nobody prefers mud races. Agreed? The entire day is fingers crossed that a championship...

I have at no point advocated for canceling or not watching a race. 

Nobody prefers mud races. Agreed? The entire day is fingers crossed that a championship isn't altered by a mechanical failure. We have 8 minute mains. Bikes destroyed, on and on.... These are things that nobody wants!!! The tough guy routine is just lame and has nothing to do with it. 

It's about mitigating risk. Several rounds in the northeast in the spring in open air stadiums is a choice that greatly increases the chances of mud races. It's not random, it's predictable. If you think it makes me soft or whiny for pointing out that we got races that nobody wants because of choices that were made, so be it.

TheMilkman wrote:
The guys up front in points are crossing fingers to hold their positions, the guys behind in points are crossing fingers to make points up. Same...

The guys up front in points are crossing fingers to hold their positions, the guys behind in points are crossing fingers to make points up. Same track conditions for everyone. Certainly not predictable, it is just a part of racing. I don’t hope for mud but when it happens I like to see how it all unfolds and it makes the upcoming rounds even more exciting.

Perfectly said. 

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Kevin852
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4/11/2025 10:16am

I actually like the mud races. It shows how good the are. I mean for Webb to jump the finish line double the last few laps is bonkers. It is not about how "fast" they are or are not going. It is about watching their skill come out. Supercross has been raced, rain or shine, since the beginning. That is part of the intrigue in my opinion. 

Bring on Philly, rain or shine.  

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Flatliner
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4/11/2025 10:16am

With mud rounds,  there's a limit to what's possible, especially outdoors.  I've been to several races in person that were shortened to one moto.

 

Millville 06 would have been a one moto day had those rains came earlier.

mx 219
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4/11/2025 10:57am Edited Date/Time 4/11/2025 11:04am

Just a guess on my part.... last year Philly was PACKED. My guess is FELD finally saw the draw for NE fans (there are more people on the East coast, I've preached this for years regarding start times years ago). I believe the attendance they saw last year is why they went from 2 northeast rounds, to 4 for 2025. Last year they had Foxborough and Philly too, although they were later in the year. Foxborough was the 2nd weekend in April and Philly was the last weekend in April. This year it is:

 1st weekend - Foxborough, 2nd weekend - Philly, 3rd weekend - East Rutherford, last weekend - Pitt.

If you look at tickets, Philly sales are okay, Pitt is about sold out. East Rutherford looks to be about the same as Philly. I wont be surprised if they drop back to 2 or 3 northeast rounds for next year. If they can get a dome for one of them, I'm sure they will.

 

ratonmacias
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4/11/2025 11:05am

how many mud races does the full series get?  maybe 3 or 4 per year? its part of mx and sx. many championships are won and lost in those conditions. its up to the teams and riders to prepare accordingly. 

I read people wanting to make mx and sx more professional and then the riders and teams say they just ran the same bike for those ugly conditions at Foxborough.

 

Shaned9326
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4/11/2025 11:15am
yak651 wrote:
Any journalist interview Bondo to ask what he’s planning to do different to improve the broadcast if there is another Mudder? Or we just going to...

Any journalist interview Bondo to ask what he’s planning to do different to improve the broadcast if there is another Mudder? Or we just going to run with the “it’s hard bro” excuse two weeks in a row?

I already told them Just watch any MXGP race and take many notes!!

4/11/2025 11:41am

Disregard all the screen shots about the weather i’ve put in here, i’ve been looking at the weather for pittsburg thus whole time. 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️

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LungButter
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4/11/2025 11:54am
truck wrote:
You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. You...

You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. 

You ever order a large amount of fill dirt? Lot of rocks and nails and trash.... Premiere series, why not see who the true tough guys are, right? 

You can like mud races if you want but the soft/tough guy rationale is old man yells at clouds territory. 

How do they easily avoid it?

Maybe you should take your expertise and go work for Feld since you have all the easy answers.

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Flatliner
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4/11/2025 12:33pm
truck wrote:
You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. You...

You're changing the subject. Just because one discipline has to deal with it doesn't mean another discipline should choose to when they can easily avoid it. 

You ever order a large amount of fill dirt? Lot of rocks and nails and trash.... Premiere series, why not see who the true tough guys are, right? 

You can like mud races if you want but the soft/tough guy rationale is old man yells at clouds territory. 

LungButter wrote:

How do they easily avoid it?

Maybe you should take your expertise and go work for Feld since you have all the easy answers.

Let's not pretend feld hasn't made mistakes,  9 whoops,  dragon backs.

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