Who Is the Greatest Rookie of All Time? | McGrath or Lawrence

Joey Bridges
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12/25/2024 2:13pm
FeetUp wrote:

Marty Tripes….. hell, he won the 1st Superbowl at 16 😮

soggy wrote:

Against plummers and electricians. 

I kid sort of. 

ATKpilot99 wrote:

Gary Jones , Jimmy Weinert , Rex Staten , Brad Lackey , Jim Pomeroy to name a few of those plumbers and electricians . 

And Jaroslav Falta.

Who was pretty much unbeatable back then.

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soggy
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12/25/2024 2:23pm

After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a whole. 

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bens 152
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12/25/2024 2:39pm
soggy wrote:
I’d have to give it to Lawrence from a 30,000 ft view. He went undefeated in his rookie 450 Mx season then won SX championship his...

I’d have to give it to Lawrence from a 30,000 ft view. He went undefeated in his rookie 450 Mx season then won SX championship his rookie 450 season. Hard to compete with that. 

For overall season, that’s probably true. I was more focused on SX. Thanks for responding 

To focus more on sx is silly, dirt bikes man. Racing dirt bikes. These guys work their whole life for it, combine them both. 

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stewie94
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12/25/2024 2:41pm
soggy wrote:
After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a...

After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a whole. 

ehhhh I might be dumb & ignorant here but I felt MC wasent nothing special and tht stew along with TP199 revolutionized SX  , granted at the young age i got introduced to the sport  it was RC , DV , TP 199 , reed & stew so i was prolly growing up watching a outta prime smoked MC , but after seeing the comments i gotta school myself on MC back in the day 

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The Shop

soggy
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12/25/2024 2:47pm
soggy wrote:
After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a...

After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a whole. 

stewie94 wrote:
ehhhh I might be dumb & ignorant here but I felt MC wasent nothing special and tht stew along with TP199 revolutionized SX  , granted at...

ehhhh I might be dumb & ignorant here but I felt MC wasent nothing special and tht stew along with TP199 revolutionized SX  , granted at the young age i got introduced to the sport  it was RC , DV , TP 199 , reed & stew so i was prolly growing up watching a outta prime smoked MC , but after seeing the comments i gotta school myself on MC back in the day 

While MC wasn’t necessarily scrubbing he brought/established bmx style in SX where he was soaking up jump faces, wheel tapping, and trying to stay lower then everyone else. The whole sports progression would have been slowed if MC didn’t come along. 

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aees
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12/25/2024 3:22pm

12 month? 
Dungey. Who else won SX, MX, Mxon?

Lawrence second. Perfect season MX, SX champ.

Sorry but MC doesn't have the MX championship. Perfect season MX does beat Mxon win I feel like given how few has pulled a perfect MX season.

Lawrence won one race in Mxon. MC had a fourth as best and didnt even count his second race. Also no MX wins. 

MC had one ex 450 champ on the line (Stanton, right?) for SX. Jett had 4.

It's pretty clear looking at facts who is the all time best rookie. 

You can't count what they did after, if we are talking about best rookie. Something about vaccum I think 😁
 

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CPR
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12/25/2024 3:25pm

If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. 
He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet he absolutely cleaned up in his one and only 125/ 250 year. 
Then he waltzed into the premier class the next year, won A1, and preceded to give RC (who’d dethroned the King) nightmares by winning more rounds than him. In the end he was only seven points from dethroning the GOAT because of one or two rookie mistakes.

If someone came in and did the same now, it would blow people’s minds.

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Johnny Ringo
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12/25/2024 3:28pm Edited Date/Time 12/25/2024 3:29pm
CPR wrote:
If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet...

If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. 
He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet he absolutely cleaned up in his one and only 125/ 250 year. 
Then he waltzed into the premier class the next year, won A1, and preceded to give RC (who’d dethroned the King) nightmares by winning more rounds than him. In the end he was only seven points from dethroning the GOAT because of one or two rookie mistakes.

If someone came in and did the same now, it would blow people’s minds.

Yep, Chad’s rookie year is underrated. Had more wins than Jett did too (or did they tie?). And won 6 in a row

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CPR
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12/25/2024 3:39pm
CPR wrote:
If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet...

If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. 
He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet he absolutely cleaned up in his one and only 125/ 250 year. 
Then he waltzed into the premier class the next year, won A1, and preceded to give RC (who’d dethroned the King) nightmares by winning more rounds than him. In the end he was only seven points from dethroning the GOAT because of one or two rookie mistakes.

If someone came in and did the same now, it would blow people’s minds.

Yep, Chad’s rookie year is underrated. Had more wins than Jett did too (or did they tie?). And won 6 in a row

Both had 8 wins I think, both also won A1. Reedy was more consistent, only finishing off the podium twice, but despite that didn’t get the title like Jett, 

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Spoonguy
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12/25/2024 3:45pm
FeetUp wrote:

Marty Tripes….. hell, he won the 1st Superbowl at 16 😮

soggy wrote:

Against plummers and electricians. 

I kid sort of. 

Pretty certain World Champs were in that race Tripes won. Bradshaw won the Montreal SX at 15, later won Osaka at 16 against Johnson. I really don't think winning regional championships can compare to those achievements. I think even Barnett, Lechein and a few others were winning main events well before the age MC and Lawrence were.

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Mit12
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12/25/2024 4:01pm

MC.

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Moto Nomad
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12/25/2024 4:56pm Edited Date/Time 12/25/2024 4:57pm
ATKpilot99 wrote:
Final Standings 20241 Jett Lawrence 2 Cooper Webb  (2x champ )3 Chase Sexton  (1 x champ)4 Eli Tomac  (2 x champ )5 Jason Anderson  (1 x champ )6...

Final Standings 

2024

1 Jett Lawrence 

2 Cooper Webb  (2x champ )

3 Chase Sexton  (1 x champ)

4 Eli Tomac  (2 x champ )

5 Jason Anderson  (1 x champ )

6 Justin Cooper

7 Ken Roczen

8 Justin Barcia

9 Hunter Lawrence 

10 Malcolm Stewart

1993

1 Jeremy McGrath 

2 Mike Kiedrowski 

3 Jeff Stanton  (3 x champ )

4 Damon Bradshaw

5 Steve Lamson

6 Brian Swink 

7 Mike Craig 

8 Cliff Palmer 

9 Guy Cooper 

10 Jeff Emig 

Wow, that's actually interesting. People used to say MC was racing for a few years when the field was not that stacked. Lawrence certainly faced a much more formidable field in 2024 than MC did in 1993. Kiedrowski was never even much of a 250 SX guy. Stanton and Bradshaw were obviously burned out a bit during that season. 

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12/25/2024 5:14pm
FeetUp wrote:

Marty Tripes….. hell, he won the 1st Superbowl at 16 😮

soggy wrote:

Against plummers and electricians. 

I kid sort of. 

This literally one of the more retarded, uneducated thing ever posted on vital.   

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jemcee
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12/25/2024 5:26pm
soggy wrote:
After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a...

After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a whole. 

While I can never compare eras and stuff and I honestly don't have an opinion on whose was better..

Could there be an argument that Jett's may have been harder due to MC changing the sport? Like he's racing a field of riders that grew up on the MC style.. 

But I guess the question isn't what was the hardest year to win haha 

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Johnny Ringo
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12/25/2024 5:27pm
CPR wrote:
If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet...

If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. 
He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet he absolutely cleaned up in his one and only 125/ 250 year. 
Then he waltzed into the premier class the next year, won A1, and preceded to give RC (who’d dethroned the King) nightmares by winning more rounds than him. In the end he was only seven points from dethroning the GOAT because of one or two rookie mistakes.

If someone came in and did the same now, it would blow people’s minds.

Yep, Chad’s rookie year is underrated. Had more wins than Jett did too (or did they tie?). And won 6 in a row

CPR wrote:
Both had 8 wins I think, both also won A1. Reedy was more consistent, only finishing off the podium twice, but despite that didn’t get the...

Both had 8 wins I think, both also won A1. Reedy was more consistent, only finishing off the podium twice, but despite that didn’t get the title like Jett, 

Chad got his 8 in one less race, too. They only did 16 back then. Then dominated 04. 

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loftyair
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12/25/2024 5:40pm

I'm such an old-school fan. But by numbers alone, Jett wins.

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STVMCQN
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12/25/2024 5:41pm

Yep, Chad’s rookie year is underrated. Had more wins than Jett did too (or did they tie?). And won 6 in a row

CPR wrote:
Both had 8 wins I think, both also won A1. Reedy was more consistent, only finishing off the podium twice, but despite that didn’t get the...

Both had 8 wins I think, both also won A1. Reedy was more consistent, only finishing off the podium twice, but despite that didn’t get the title like Jett, 

Chad got his 8 in one less race, too. They only did 16 back then. Then dominated 04. 

By Reed’s own admission, he emulated MC’s style.

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yamahaha131
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12/25/2024 5:49pm

If neither went on to win another title, Lawrence. Having the convenience of hindsight, MC hands down. 

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soggy
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12/25/2024 6:24pm
soggy wrote:
After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a...

After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a whole. 

jemcee wrote:
While I can never compare eras and stuff and I honestly don't have an opinion on whose was better..Could there be an argument that Jett's may...

While I can never compare eras and stuff and I honestly don't have an opinion on whose was better..

Could there be an argument that Jett's may have been harder due to MC changing the sport? Like he's racing a field of riders that grew up on the MC style.. 

But I guess the question isn't what was the hardest year to win haha 

I agree it’s impossible to compare eras. 
 

I do think it’s much harder to be an originator. Which I think MC was. I don’t think Jett is in that category.  In the end Jett will have a good shot at statistically being one of the best racers ever. People that grew up watching him will view him as the best. And older folks will lean towards riders of there generation. Ultimately it all says more about the person opining then the rider in question. 

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Denn700
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12/25/2024 6:43pm
CPR wrote:
If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet...

If you’re only talking SX, then honourable mention to Chad Reed. 
He adopted MC’s style, but came in as a foreigner without much big SX experience, yet he absolutely cleaned up in his one and only 125/ 250 year. 
Then he waltzed into the premier class the next year, won A1, and preceded to give RC (who’d dethroned the King) nightmares by winning more rounds than him. In the end he was only seven points from dethroning the GOAT because of one or two rookie mistakes.

If someone came in and did the same now, it would blow people’s minds.

Yep, Chad’s rookie year is underrated. Had more wins than Jett did too (or did they tie?). And won 6 in a row

CPR wrote:
Both had 8 wins I think, both also won A1. Reedy was more consistent, only finishing off the podium twice, but despite that didn’t get the...

Both had 8 wins I think, both also won A1. Reedy was more consistent, only finishing off the podium twice, but despite that didn’t get the title like Jett, 

Ricky won 7 races. Chad won 8. Ezra Lusk won Phoenix.

Chad had one bad round where his seat fell off.

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12/25/2024 7:28pm
FeetUp wrote:

Marty Tripes….. hell, he won the 1st Superbowl at 16 😮

soggy wrote:

Against plummers and electricians. 

I kid sort of. 

UpTiTe wrote:

This literally one of the more retarded, uneducated thing ever posted on vital.   

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played against plumbers and carpenters. Anyone that knows basketball knows Jordan is the greatest basketball player ever by a mile. 

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12/25/2024 9:03pm

If neither went on to win another title, Lawrence. Having the convenience of hindsight, MC hands down. 

This is my answer. Also probably doesn't help that I was born in 95😂

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KurtJ99
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12/25/2024 9:05pm
ATKpilot99 wrote:
Final Standings 20241 Jett Lawrence 2 Cooper Webb  (2x champ )3 Chase Sexton  (1 x champ)4 Eli Tomac  (2 x champ )5 Jason Anderson  (1 x champ )6...

Final Standings 

2024

1 Jett Lawrence 

2 Cooper Webb  (2x champ )

3 Chase Sexton  (1 x champ)

4 Eli Tomac  (2 x champ )

5 Jason Anderson  (1 x champ )

6 Justin Cooper

7 Ken Roczen

8 Justin Barcia

9 Hunter Lawrence 

10 Malcolm Stewart

1993

1 Jeremy McGrath 

2 Mike Kiedrowski 

3 Jeff Stanton  (3 x champ )

4 Damon Bradshaw

5 Steve Lamson

6 Brian Swink 

7 Mike Craig 

8 Cliff Palmer 

9 Guy Cooper 

10 Jeff Emig 

Limiting this just to SX as OP poised the question, and just to argue against the above facts (my feelings don't care about facts) 😉

Stanton was a 3x champ on the same bike in '93 AND Kiedrowski had finished 2nd (one better than Stanton) in '92.

2024 Eli coming off injury, Jason didn't have a good 2023, Chase and Cooper were on new bikes. Nobody had their "A" game ready for Jett. 

So McGrath competition could be called relatively stronger. 

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Darrin Willis
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12/25/2024 9:09pm
soggy wrote:

Against plummers and electricians. 

I kid sort of. 

UpTiTe wrote:

This literally one of the more retarded, uneducated thing ever posted on vital.   

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played...

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played against plumbers and carpenters. Anyone that knows basketball knows Jordan is the greatest basketball player ever by a mile. 

Well said. As an old guy it actually pisses me off 20 year old mxers don't know Who The hurricane was. And if they do they say a 14 th place local pro from today could beat him. 

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12/25/2024 9:38pm
UpTiTe wrote:

This literally one of the more retarded, uneducated thing ever posted on vital.   

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played...

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played against plumbers and carpenters. Anyone that knows basketball knows Jordan is the greatest basketball player ever by a mile. 

Well said. As an old guy it actually pisses me off 20 year old mxers don't know Who The hurricane was. And if they do they...

Well said. As an old guy it actually pisses me off 20 year old mxers don't know Who The hurricane was. And if they do they say a 14 th place local pro from today could beat him. 

No that’s a 14th place125 rider . Look at the Lap times at LL most yrs the 125,s r the fastest.  83-88 250,s where not fast , ever ride 1 ? But really man what a weird thread .  Todays sx tracks r much easier and Jett doesn’t hv any comp . Chase that’s it ELi too but he’s 32 or more.  I don’t think Jett would win in the 90,s on a 2st.  Huffman is way better technically & he only got 1 win. And he weighed nothing.  I just watched Troy,Ohio 125 hottest race ever . Huffman won both motos with a huge lead.  

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12/25/2024 9:49pm
soggy wrote:

Against plummers and electricians. 

I kid sort of. 

UpTiTe wrote:

This literally one of the more retarded, uneducated thing ever posted on vital.   

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played...

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played against plumbers and carpenters. Anyone that knows basketball knows Jordan is the greatest basketball player ever by a mile. 

LeBron is not the best. Neither is Jordon anyone who says mj is the best believes the hype on him .  He shot non stop ball hog all of his teammates hated him , etc.  Lew Al cinder Kareem , Bill Russel has more championships, Wilt  Chamberlin  most dominant player . That’s the top 3. Mj is a soft cry baby Sydney Moncrief schooled him

On every play for yrs , 5,11 isaha Thomas shut mj down. Mj still hate Isaha Chicago south side kid played him too hard.  

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Sandusky26
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12/26/2024 2:45am
UpTiTe wrote:

This literally one of the more retarded, uneducated thing ever posted on vital.   

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played...

It's the trendy new thing to say to downplay previous era's all time greats. JJ Reddick said LeBron James is better than Jordan because Jordan played against plumbers and carpenters. Anyone that knows basketball knows Jordan is the greatest basketball player ever by a mile. 

LeBron is not the best. Neither is Jordon anyone who says mj is the best believes the hype on him .  He shot non stop ball...

LeBron is not the best. Neither is Jordon anyone who says mj is the best believes the hype on him .  He shot non stop ball hog all of his teammates hated him , etc.  Lew Al cinder Kareem , Bill Russel has more championships, Wilt  Chamberlin  most dominant player . That’s the top 3. Mj is a soft cry baby Sydney Moncrief schooled him

On every play for yrs , 5,11 isaha Thomas shut mj down. Mj still hate Isaha Chicago south side kid played him too hard.  

Come on man, MJ is the best.

I know you were rockin Air Jordan's back in 89.

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Neverclear
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12/26/2024 8:06am Edited Date/Time 12/26/2024 8:10am

Nothing against Jett but it's MC all day for me. Today's tracks are much better designed & the bikes are way better.

There's a video on YouTube of a track in '95/96 that had a complete whoop section around a curve. Those tracks were gnarly & dangerous, and every week was different.

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12/26/2024 8:15am
Team403 wrote:

JMB

Right. His 1990 SX season in 250cc category was not so bad...

😉

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therealhammer
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12/26/2024 8:29am
soggy wrote:
After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a...

After further thought it has to be MC just for the way he changed how people ride SX and his influence on the sport as a whole. 

Hard to put weight into that as Jett influence hasnt been realized yet... I would assume a whole crop of young kids are changing their technique to be like Jetts . 

 

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