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Very concerning on the moto scene in So Cal.
Interesting Video on the current So Cal Moto Scene
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Cool video and thanks for sharing. Man, Piru and escpecially Zaca look like incredible tracks! As a kid, I often dreamed of riding at Saddleback one day. Sure looked fun. I hear there is a subdivision there now as is the case with Carlsbad?
...I can't even go to any SoCal track on a Saturday or Sunday, as they are packed to the gills with riders.
I ride during the week, and every So Cal track I ride at still gets a couple hundred riders even on a Monday or Tuesday - Moto is FAR from dead in Southern California.
In most cases we have noise complaints, mismanagement, and insurance problems that close these tracks and prevent new ones from opening.
So I have a question - Ski resorts have lots of injuries and a few deadly ski accidents each season, and are still able to operate with insurance. Why is the ski Industry not losing their resorts and slopes? I would guess that they have money and legal power behind them to help keep these resorts open.
Dirt bike riders and potential track owners are dumb and cheap, and most likely would not be willing to pay what it takes to form an organization to protect their interests.
What about the AMA you say? well IMO the AMA is a bunch of self-serving dumb asses who don't really care about California motocross enough to form a track defense team or insurance fund to try and prevent these track closures.
one more thing. - all you guys who complain about a 30 dollar track fee need to see the prices they charge for green fees or lift tickets. Tracks are not raking in the money - Perris Raceway had to get a Go Fund Me page up to repair a fucking generator, as their water and diesel bills are 12 grand a month each.
I've definitely been wondering about the ski resort paradigm in contrast to moto tracks. From what I understand, real estate sales / development is what really drives ski resorts - I wonder if that gives them deeper pockets to fight off lawsuits.
42 resorts. That’s how. They can afford insurance.
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But, but, but, the AMA promotes the motorcycling lifestyle and protects the future of motorcycling...
Ski resorts to moto tracks = really big apples to orange seeds (barely). Mammoth Mountain (admittedly one of the ten largest ski resorts in the US) single day - adult ski passes cost 179.00 mid week and 219.00 weekends. I roamed through a bunch of sites and could not get an average of skiers on the mountain, but the ski lift capacity is able to move 53,330 skiers PER HOUR. You do the math. Kirkwood Ski Resort (a small, somewhat out of the way resort) (where I usually ski) the mid week lift ticket price is $143.00. (I buy season passes). Kirkwood can move 16,??? something. And most ski resorts are corporate now a days. Point is, $$$, for lawyers and insurance. Are you willing to pay $150.00 a day to ride a moto track?
Lmao i lose it when people post dumb shit.
go sit at Glen Helen on a Thursday from 8 am to dark & report back to me that moto is dead. Glen Helen on 1 thursday gets more riders coming through than 3-4 days (maybe even more) at other tracks I’ve been to in other states.
Go to pala on a Monday or Tuesday it’s packed.
Moto is not dead in So Cal, but the space where you can have a track is getting harder to find and driving folks further out into the hinterlands. But, that has been the story forever in So Cal as the development spreads inland.
As for brands, Fox Racing actually relocated to So Cal from Nor Cal a few years ago (despite this guy saying something different), TLD, PC, FMF, O'neal, Alpinestars, 100%, One Industries, Thor, and many, many other brands are still located in So Cal and warehousing /shipping products from the region. Not to mention Honda, KTM, Kawasaki all still have race shops in So. Cal, as does Yamaha (when they are west coast based).
This is somewhat of a clickbait video, but the insurance and finding land for new tracks is a real....
Saddleback is still open land, Carlsbad is all industrial units now and an Amazon delivery truck parking lot . I live 5 minutes from there and it still depresses me to drive up that way .
Moto track operators in So Cal do not seem to consider additional profit generators besides gate fees.
Look at Fox Raceway, still primitive, but the leader in infrastructure - they have a cafe, a parts shop, and a Fox gear store that generates more income for them. Add some bike wash bays that are pay to use and you can generate more income.
Spend some money and add some real bathrooms - My wife will NOT go to a track where she has to pee in a disgusting, overflowing Porta Potty (looking at you, Cahuilla Creek).
Charge vendors a fixed fee to set up in at the track on Saturdays and Sundays for tire changes, food trucks, add some paved parking and places for family and friends to watch riders on the track instead of making them stand in the fucking mud and dust - make coming to the track a family thing - again look at golf and ski areas, they have lots of stuff for non skiers and golfers to do while their family is on the course or the ski hill.
Have a lawn or shade or a space where people can watch and spend money at a tee shirt store or a food vendor or something while they are there. If you build it, they will come out. There is so much a track could do to generate more income and stay financially strong, but track operators around here don't seem to think like that.,
Not being a jerk at all, but you can do all of that and doesn't change the fact the average guy would go down the street to save $10 in gate fees. A country club moto scene sounds great on paper, but moto tracks have always been on cheap land and the successful ones have mostly been family land for generations.
I think they spend their time and money on Harley guys and their bullshit.
I am forced to be an AMA member and as a result, I get their magazine every month, and you can look through the issues and see that Motocross is the red-headed step child.
Street stuff gets 90 percent of the page space every month. The AMA just seems to tolerate moto, I doubt if they would care back in Mid Ohio if all So Cal Tracks went away.
I would love any AMA guy who reads this to chime in and prove me wrong, but they cant, because they don't do shit for us out here other than take our fees.
The Harley stuff is what they mean by "the motorcycling lifestyle"
Zaca was awesome. During winter everything around the track was green, the drive up there was great and the dirt during winter was incredible.
Piru was cool because it was close and we could ride after school until dark. The track pretty much never changed though because of the land it was on, they were really limited with track changes. Jumps changed, but most of the layout was the same. Spent a lot of time there and I do really miss it.
A single day lift ticket on the weekend is $299 at Deer Valley or Park City. Many other resorts are well above $200 for the same type of ticket. I think that helps them afford insurance.
Well here ya go - nuclear meaning lawsuits north of $10M
MX noise kills any chance at partnering with real estate developers like ski resorts. Ever been to a ski resort? They’re largely quiet.
The sking industry is trying its hardest to be an elitist activity. Capacity is capped so now you price out the working class to make the service levels tolerable for the upper classes. This is the playground of lawyer types.. Dingy / dusty mx tracks are fodder… you don’t hear about golf courses getting sued either.. see a pattern 🤔
Pit Row
I think you missed the point of the video then. His point was the track closures and not so much of rider turnout.
MX tracks make peanuts compared to a ski resort. Ski resorts can afford the insurance policies. For example my local resort sold 660 season passes the weekend before they opened in November, $1,495 a pop, roughly $990k, that is just scratching the surface of revenue..
Yup, seems to me like these resorts charge enough for lift tickets that they can afford good insurance. I was in South Lake Tahoe for a couple of days in July of '23, and Heavenly wanted $85 to ride to the top of the mountain just to see the view during the off season. During the season, I think it's $200-something.
wut... can you name any tracks that have been closed due to noise? I can not,residential developement for financal gain is different. And ski resorts are loud all night long, unless you consider turbo diesel snowcat motors quiet, FYI the "new ones" are regulated to 104db, hmmm almost identical to a mx bike... Pre def era machies are much louder. I've been in and around the ski industry my whole life and now put more miles in a cat then anyone else in the state for snowmobile trail grooming, have a pulse on the in's and out's.
And hank many, many, ski resorts have no private real estate and are on leases through the forest service with no real estate near.
Zaca - no contest, there is no better drive to an MX track than that drive up the coast.
"you don’t hear about golf courses getting sued"...
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/golf/2022/04/24/family-sues-country-club-golf-balls-damaged-house/50134855/
Got to be one of the prettiest tracks ive ever laid eyes on. You guys did not undersell it when describing it. Look at that dirt!
Zaca was hands down the best track west of the Mississippi.
Paging Sondra or Marc Peters:
Theres 34 million people in California of course a few tracks are full of Pro Practicers .
My opinion is Motorcycle racing is dead and Motocross soon to follow.
Supercross, I guess they can keep that freak show going with talented paid riders and no privateers.
I'd like Sondras opinion and Marc, cause they, fucking know more than anyone on here.
I believe most ski resorts are on US Forestry land and leased to the operating company, similar to Glen Helen. The moto lawsuits that have been happening are now directly targeting the land owner as well as the operating company making it too risky for the land owner to lease the land out for a track. Insurance companies are now digging through the corporate veils of many of the track owners instead of just the track operator as in the past.
There is also real estate that comes with a ski resort. Multi million dollar houses alongside the hill, hotels with restaurants and shops etc. creating revenue for the town they are settled in. This also creates more jobs and more people move to ski towns to live (even though the cost of living is higher than what the average resort personnel can afford but that’s a different topic altogether).
I love moto but even if you owned millions of acres, it would be a hard sell to get those types of businesses to buy into the idea of a “moto resort”.
Moto is still alive and well and will always exist in some shape or form but I don’t think it can be commodified like other sports with its high cost of entry and an increasingly lack of accessibility.
Ski resorts get sued plenty, but ski resort owners/operators are far more sophisticated than motocross track owners/operators and do a better job of protecting themselves from liability.
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