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Full disclosure: I am only about 75% of the way through the podcast, but there's one thing I'd like to point out. Jase mentions that he was told off the record by other promoters that a National now brings in "7 figures". Bud is quick to say that it's not about making money. If that's the case, why was $80,000 in tickets (at GH's inflated $80 value) enough to sink the whole thing? What's 80 grand when you stand to bring in over a million?
As for the MSSports/DMG/NPG thing, I see how one could feel betrayed by the Coombs family for that. It's painfully obvious that this is the real reason why Bud is so difficult. But then again, if there are 11 other promoters that are happy to have been "betrayed", then the issue is solely with Bud's ego.
Maybe it's time that someone else puts in a bid for GH.
"Maybe it's time that someone else puts in a bid for GH."
The last time they attempted a national, two years ago, it was the intent with having someone else run the National portion. Which was Myron Short who puts on Fox. It was set for him and Lori to work together on it, without Bud's oversight. As DC mentioned, that didn't last long. I do have the sticker made for that National, the intention was there, but we ended up with a Fox Raceway 2 that year instead. Now the schedule is down to 11 rounds.
I don't think DC is the issue at all. Motocross is bigger than GH and Bud Feldkamp. To have to deal with this crusty old man and his need to feel like he's calling the shots is such small dick energy is pathetic. It's obvious now that there's no chance for GH to be on the schedule until Bud is dead and gone. And even then, it seems with Jr that the apple didn't fall far from the tree.
It's a shame, maybe in 2037 when the lease is up, the manufacturers and industry guys can team up and take the lease over to run GH.
I only see one man acting like a child. I think we should all be more upset about scheduling GP up against the nationals in 2010 and trying to buy riders away from the Nationals. The more I listen to these podcasts, the more respect I have for DC’s patience.
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Don't forget the free ride day/watch party GH had trying to siphon off paying spectators from Pala a couple years ago.
But it was for charity? lol
Basically, the fees going directly to MXS consist of the 100k sanctioning fee plus the value of the 3500 tickets they want to be provided (which of course has a significant value). Of course, none of this takes into account the other expenses Glen Helen Raceway incures by having the event...pro purse of $70k, track/labor costs, etc...
And ALL the other tracks don't have to "incur" these costs? If you want to be taken seriously, address the elephant in the room that's been brought up many many times. You guys are seemingly the only track/promoter standing on this soap box.
Yes, MXS can do what they want with the tickets that are allotted to them...we don't really have any control of then once they are promised as part of a contract. The reason we were pushing so hard to keep that number low at 1250 is exactly for that reason. If they wanted to sell them or give them away, that was their business. However, when we start getting higher numbers of allotted tickets, then it starts to eat into the revenue for GH. Maybe I wasn't clear in that point. There is an exact outline of the "negotiation" process in 2018 on the GHR website.
Again, just trying to get the information out there as to why there was no National after 2018. As much as people want to talk about the "podium" incident as being the reason, that simply isn't true. MXS and GH entered into contract negotiations AFTER the podium incident and simply were not able to agree on the ticket issue.
This isn't about money/giving MXS tickets, it's a pissing contest between Bud and MXS. GH is in a unique position to run races every weekend of the year, and two open practice days a week which are well attended, not to mention private rentals on the off days to amortize track and labor costs over a 12 month period. I know it ain't cheap to run a track, but GH pulls in far more money on a weekly/monthly basis than any track in the country.
My god what a douchebag Bud is. Eli should have laughed in his face.
Do it right now, ok? Come on, come and do it for me.
How about Fuck off! What a joke!
Is the 3500 tickets the same for the other tracks?
Alright, I'm just gonna say it and you can say whatever you want about the tickets, but the bottom line is you aren't having a National anymore because Bud is an arrogant dickhead. Period.
It's laughable you'd think anyone would believe it was over a couple thousand tickets that are gonna go to Industry Insiders and a few friends and family members. EVERY OTHER TRACK gives away the same tickets and makes it work.
It looked like there was probably 50k people at RedBud this year, I don't think Tim Ritchie coulda given 2 shits about the tickets that were given away at Industry Services. He's probably still counting the money he made, you could be doing the same if Bud would pull his head out of his ass.
Is it down to 11 rounds because they couldn't find a venue, or because it just made sense to lose a round of MX to make room for the SMX playoffs?
Irrelevant. Based on the history of the track and it's location, aside from Bud, Glen Helen should be one of those 11
The agreement was to drop an outdoor round to accommodate the SMX schedule.
I agree.
But ML seemed to be implying that the reason we have 11 is because there are only 11 tracks. I was looking for clarification on that.
In order for the 3 round SMX playoffs to work, MX Sports gave up one of the nationals. So it was really only adding two events, and one if you factor in that Feld wanted to bring back the Monster Cup, but won’t.
Pit Row
One thing that seems to be forgotten. The entire industry is based in Southern California. I'm sure the 3,500 ticket allotment is going to people like higher ups at American Honda, and FMF, Dunlop tires, etc. Maybe the allotment is a bit higher than the other tracks, but the demand is also much higher as well.
Not to mention, quit saying "it isn't about the money." Then mentioning multiple times "fiduciary responsibility" and "cutting into GH revenue." Make up your fuckin mind, Bud.
At 1250 tickets that would not leave many available for riders family. A maxed out entry of 90 riders per class, 2 mechanics = 540 tickets right there. If You add the 4 passes that were the limit a rider could purchase at one point, that is 1260 passes.
As far as I know tracks never sell the type of pass that You would need to be inside the pits with your rider all day. The tickets they are selling are not to the average viewer. Are you saying that they should purchase those to resell? Do they purchase extra tickets on top of the free ones so they can sell the passes at Will Call?
As far as Southwick goes . the VFW leases the track out . The last time the lease came up for bid, the founder of Planet Fitness was the winner. I'm not sure how Keith Johnson ended up running he track and how involved Mike Grondol is or is not now. I know that they really like having the national there. And as a local , I always thought it was cool to ride on the same track as the national guys . They were fine for the year or 2 they did not have a national.
The local school makes enough money off selling parking that they pay for all the sports team uniforms/safety stuff for the high school. And the town was very supportive of the event because of all the money it brings in to the area. Even the local races are welcomed with the stream of racers buying gas, food and hotels. Southwick is very unique in many ways though. But I imagine that the impact a national has money wise is similar in other areas that have them.
Unadilla for many years only had the National and built a second track to have the am races on. They have a GNCC and some other races now though. And every time I have gone, all the local businesses are happy to see the racers coming into town or driving through on the way. A friend lived in a small town right off rt 80 and all the team rigs would pass right by his house on the way out there. He was an hour or more away and even that town saw a boost on the race weekend. With gas station and restaurant owners putting out signs racers welcome! The benefit of all that money locals get helps in a lot of ways. More people than the track are able to do well. I often see people who live on the road that You leave a race from , out front having a yard sale, or selling drinks to people in traffic.
I've been to many nationals and spoke with track owners, friends of track owners, officials from other countries version of the AMA, etc. And funny enough the only complaints that stick out money wise were about the MXON. And the BIG percentage of $$ they take from a large amount of tickets. Along with the high fees charged to hold the race itself. Mafia was the way they described dealing with Youthstream. I'm sure that MX sports is not perfect and there are things that they would like to change and that the tracks also would like to change.
After reading through and listening to everything, it sounds like it is just a stubborn track owner who is holding a grudge because they lost out on the bid. Like it has been said multiple times, every other track is still holding a national. If it was so bad, if they did not make any money off the race . You would think there would be at least 1 other track that would have not been able to agree on the terms. Bud should just admit that there is nothing that could be negotiated . His problem is not with the terms, it is with the Guy that is running MX sports. Hiding behind some number of tickets or the other things just seems petty .
With the big boost in tickets being sold the past 2 seasons , it sounds like MX sports is doing the right thing and helping tracks get more people coming out to watch in person. The increase in sales more than covers the difference in tickets that Glen Helen is saying they would provide. Never mind the increased amount of shirts and food they would sell. If they are so special , they should sell many more tickets than other tracks and be impacted even less.
So about 1000 tickets is the only thing stopping a Glen Helen National from coming back?? Other tracks are seeing a 50% increase in sales according to Gypsey tales over the sales prior to the 21 or 22 season.
If Glen Helen is truly coming on here to get the true reason out of why they are not having a national. It sure sounds like they have not given that reason yet. Perhaps that was the reason in the past. But it seems like it shouldn't be an issue now.
I haven't seen anyone point to the podium incident as the reason, it's just an example of what a pain in the ass it is to work with Bud and how he places his whims over the series and its broadcast partners.
ITS NOT ABOUT THE MONEY!!!!!!!
(it's about the power Bud doesn't have)
Ding ding ding...that's all that podium clip shows. Narcissistic delusion is all I see in that clip 🤯
I said this earlier in the thread, but when Jase mentioned that other tracks are bringing in "7 figures" from hosting a National Bud specifically said that it was not about the money. If that is true, why are the tickets such a sticking point? By your own numbers, GH's final offer was 1250 tickets (worth $100k at your $80 claimed $80 value) and MXS' was 2500 tickets ($180k). If Bud claims money doesn't matter, why is he squabbling over $80k?
Once thing I'm confused about with this whole thing is Bud stating, multiple times, it's not about the money. It's about the fans. Meanwhile he wants to sell VIP experiences that deviate from every other National in an effort to...make more money. If it was about the fan experience, then don't charge, make it first come first serve. If you have 100 spots available, let people enter into a lottery for them.
It seems like Bud is looking for ways to milk more out of the fans, riders, and industry as a whole. Which is fine, it's a business, it should operate like one. But then he makes verbal deals and gets frustrated when he has no recourse because there's nothing written down. Why was he mad about Tomac going directly to the podium? Because a bunch of fans paid money for an experience that promised and was unable to deliver on.
If someone at MX Sports agreed with Bud about doing what he asked, Bud should have requested his contract be amended to reflect that. Add a clause that states if for whatever reason (intentional or otherwise) they are unable to meet the demands of the contract then they will be financially responsible to reimburse fans for their experience...so if Bud charges $100 extra for that experience and has 100 spots available...and anything prevents it from being what the fans paid for, Bud doesn't have to eat the $10,000 loss of revenue. That prevents Bud from approaching the winner of the race on the podium while Live TV is scrambling to get the podium speeches in before time is out.
Bud, get a good lawyer. Sounds like legal representation would have prevented so many headaches in your life. It could have provided you protection on the NPG dealing as well as the Nationals. You seem like a guy that cares about the sport. Your track is one of, if not the most iconic in the world.
As hard as it is, forget the past and move forward. Get things in writing this time and make a deal. The industry wants to see a national at Glen Helen. You will have record attendance and make a shit load of money. If any other national track promoters are in here, get together and talk to Bud. Intervention.
My valuable contribution to this is that in my experience, guys with mustaches like that one are usually assholes.
...Forget the nationals, I'd be happy if Bud bought a Rock Picker for the tracks...
Fuckin' a man!
Make it happen Bud! Prove that you care more about the sport than about money and petty bullshit and give us the race we want! Hell, I'll even buy VIP tickets!
GH races were epic.... the drag races up the hills...the sketchy moments on the downhills....the massive booter jumps....40 bikes going through Talladega.....that was motocross.
Make. It. Happen.
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