Lawrence brothers starts.

motomike137
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Edited Date/Time 6/30/2024 2:23pm

What kind of black magic has Honda got going on with those 450's on the starts? Hunter was never a holeshot artist and Jett not really either. Suddenly they look like Don Garlits and John Force every time they leave the gate.

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MxAddic
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6/30/2024 12:26pm

No magic, just good technique and the right kind of controllable power.

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zehn
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6/30/2024 12:30pm

Someone mentioned they have a perfectly dialed launch control system, not sure how true that is but they really have it working, whatever it is!

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oldnescVet
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6/30/2024 12:37pm

A bike and a half in 50’. I couldn’t believe it!

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lumpy790
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6/30/2024 12:41pm

Alessi taught them well!

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The Shop

Stewyeww
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6/30/2024 12:42pm

The Honda 250's were underpowered compared to other 250's so there starts had to be perfect to have a chance in the smaller bike class. Now there on the 450 that have more equal power to the rest, they are blitzing them. 

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Not hillbilly
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6/30/2024 1:07pm

Watching closely, you can see they both almost always get off the gate very quickly. But I think their real advantage is getting lots of power to the ground. The start maps on their bikes seem to put down a ton of power while limiting wheel spin. They seem to just out drag all the other bikes… except for Phil’s Club MX YZF!

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6/30/2024 1:11pm

Honda's start technology is making the other manufacturers look like beginners.  They are getting top 5 starts or hole shots no matter what kind of jump they get out of the gate.  I remember last year on one of the east coast nationals I saw Jett get a very very late jump yet he ended up nearly hole shot'ing.  Those bikes are hooked up.

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Tumic
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6/30/2024 1:25pm

Not demanding 1000hp out of the bike will also translate to a better start.

Both of them run a engine with smooth power delivery and that will get better traction then a bike that the rider want to be a rocketship.

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Tumic
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6/30/2024 1:48pm

Since Honda moved away from their own electronics and started to use GET, people in here should be able to understand that ALL the top teams that use GET have the same electronics. 
 

There is no secret sause going on there. 

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6/30/2024 1:49pm
Tumic wrote:
Since Honda moved away from their own electronics and started to use GET, people in here should be able to understand that ALL the top teams...

Since Honda moved away from their own electronics and started to use GET, people in here should be able to understand that ALL the top teams that use GET have the same electronics. 
 

There is no secret sause going on there. 

Ahh, yes there is.

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TeamGreen
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6/30/2024 2:13pm
What kind of black magic has Honda got going on with those 450's on the starts? Hunter was never a holeshot artist and Jett not really...

What kind of black magic has Honda got going on with those 450's on the starts? Hunter was never a holeshot artist and Jett not really either. Suddenly they look like Don Garlits and John Force every time they leave the gate.

I heard this from my super-secret industry sources…

The brothers have been training at Luke AFB on a Highly Classified RAAF cross-training contract utilizing the latest AI at the F-35 Training Center. 

Beyond that? There’s not much more I could tell you…or else…well, you know…

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motomike137
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6/30/2024 2:28pm

For the doubters if you don't think that a company with the resources and pride in their racing results like Honda has isn't working every possible angle you would be in the dark badly. The other big teams are likely doing the same but Honda seems to have an advantage right now.

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971_Fan
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6/30/2024 2:28pm Edited Date/Time 6/30/2024 2:48pm

They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as Jett. 

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Chris_Buehler
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6/30/2024 2:38pm
971_Fan wrote:
They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as...

They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as Jett. 

Facts. Going back to last summer, he's in the top 3 just about every start. It's insane. I'm only talking mx though. His sx starts are really good too but not off the charts like outdoors. I expect him to be at the front every start now

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6/30/2024 2:42pm
971_Fan wrote:
They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as...

They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as Jett. 

I can't believe there are guys here who think this is all just skill and there's no Honda secret sauce involved.  I don't think we've ever seen such a string of great starts in outdoors.  Honda has it figured out and it's not just the brothers skill that does it.  

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8tensolutions
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6/30/2024 3:16pm
971_Fan wrote:
They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as...

They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as Jett. 

I can't believe there are guys here who think this is all just skill and there's no Honda secret sauce involved.  I don't think we've ever...

I can't believe there are guys here who think this is all just skill and there's no Honda secret sauce involved.  I don't think we've ever seen such a string of great starts in outdoors.  Honda has it figured out and it's not just the brothers skill that does it.  

100% this is accurate.  The mapping, engine characteristics, gearing, and testing all of that is a huge part.  I do think the confidence they have because of all that along with their talent (same with Nicoletti) plays a large part.

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6/30/2024 3:25pm Edited Date/Time 6/30/2024 3:25pm
971_Fan wrote:
They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as...

They have something figured out with the bike, and it's more than just technique. I have never seen a rider get as good as starts as Jett. 

I can't believe there are guys here who think this is all just skill and there's no Honda secret sauce involved.  I don't think we've ever...

I can't believe there are guys here who think this is all just skill and there's no Honda secret sauce involved.  I don't think we've ever seen such a string of great starts in outdoors.  Honda has it figured out and it's not just the brothers skill that does it.  

There is no skill involved any more on the pro scene. Sad really, there would be skill if grates, holeshot devices, and start maps and rpm dashbaords were removed/banned. Also there would be less first turn crashes like detroit for example because everyone is so even to each other now except a few guys that get really good starts. the only skill now is reaction time it seems.

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Tumic
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6/30/2024 3:25pm
I can't believe there are guys here who think this is all just skill and there's no Honda secret sauce involved.  I don't think we've ever...

I can't believe there are guys here who think this is all just skill and there's no Honda secret sauce involved.  I don't think we've ever seen such a string of great starts in outdoors.  Honda has it figured out and it's not just the brothers skill that does it.  

Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing without any proof.

All the teams have the same hardware, some execute it better than others. 
 

I guess the Alessi brothers had the unicorn stuff to that nobody can tell what it is but everybody seem to know that it’s there?.

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slowgti
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6/30/2024 3:40pm
Tumic wrote:
Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing...

Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing without any proof.

All the teams have the same hardware, some execute it better than others. 
 

I guess the Alessi brothers had the unicorn stuff to that nobody can tell what it is but everybody seem to know that it’s there?.

Custom firmware in the ecu is very common these days. Honda has some very large brained folks there, they do amazing electronic engineering in other race disciplines. It’s not a stretch to think they are borrowing tricks from a department at the other end of the hallway to get a head start at developing start mapping and gear cut strategy. 

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Tumic
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6/30/2024 3:44pm
slowgti wrote:
Custom firmware in the ecu is very common these days. Honda has some very large brained folks there, they do amazing electronic engineering in other race...

Custom firmware in the ecu is very common these days. Honda has some very large brained folks there, they do amazing electronic engineering in other race disciplines. It’s not a stretch to think they are borrowing tricks from a department at the other end of the hallway to get a head start at developing start mapping and gear cut strategy. 

That’s still nothing ”magical” that some in here want to belive.
They don’t have any special componets that make the starts better. It just comes down to a good map and someone who can let the clutch out at the right time. 

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slowgti
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6/30/2024 3:48pm
Tumic wrote:
That’s still nothing ”magical” that some in here want to belive. They don’t have any special componets that make the starts better. It just comes down...

That’s still nothing ”magical” that some in here want to belive.
They don’t have any special componets that make the starts better. It just comes down to a good map and someone who can let the clutch out at the right time. 

I generally agree, although there is more to it than just a start map though. 

Kiernan mx
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6/30/2024 3:50pm
Stewyeww wrote:
The Honda 250's were underpowered compared to other 250's so there starts had to be perfect to have a chance in the smaller bike class. Now...

The Honda 250's were underpowered compared to other 250's so there starts had to be perfect to have a chance in the smaller bike class. Now there on the 450 that have more equal power to the rest, they are blitzing them. 

Absolutely 👌👌👌

6/30/2024 3:53pm

According to the Mandarin, the starts are remote controlled by guys in Japan, so there’s the secret!!!

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971_Fan
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6/30/2024 4:12pm
Tumic wrote:
Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing...

Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing without any proof.

All the teams have the same hardware, some execute it better than others. 
 

I guess the Alessi brothers had the unicorn stuff to that nobody can tell what it is but everybody seem to know that it’s there?.

You can take the best starters in history, from Donnie Hansen to Mike Alessi, and it's not even close to the starts Jett gets. There is practice and technique for sure, but there is something Honda has with the bike that is supplemental in a big way. 

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OleTex2
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6/30/2024 5:27pm
Tumic wrote:
Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing...

Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing without any proof.

All the teams have the same hardware, some execute it better than others. 
 

I guess the Alessi brothers had the unicorn stuff to that nobody can tell what it is but everybody seem to know that it’s there?.

slowgti wrote:
Custom firmware in the ecu is very common these days. Honda has some very large brained folks there, they do amazing electronic engineering in other race...

Custom firmware in the ecu is very common these days. Honda has some very large brained folks there, they do amazing electronic engineering in other race disciplines. It’s not a stretch to think they are borrowing tricks from a department at the other end of the hallway to get a head start at developing start mapping and gear cut strategy. 

Yep. For those who may ask, firmware is software that resides on the hardware itself. Corrections and improvements can be included in later versions. 

OldTech
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6/30/2024 5:55pm
Tumic wrote:
Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing...

Then please tell me what Honda have from GET in the electronics that the other teams are missing.. this is just another thread of people guessing without any proof.

All the teams have the same hardware, some execute it better than others. 
 

I guess the Alessi brothers had the unicorn stuff to that nobody can tell what it is but everybody seem to know that it’s there?.

slowgti wrote:
Custom firmware in the ecu is very common these days. Honda has some very large brained folks there, they do amazing electronic engineering in other race...

Custom firmware in the ecu is very common these days. Honda has some very large brained folks there, they do amazing electronic engineering in other race disciplines. It’s not a stretch to think they are borrowing tricks from a department at the other end of the hallway to get a head start at developing start mapping and gear cut strategy. 

OleTex2 wrote:

Yep. For those who may ask, firmware is software that resides on the hardware itself. Corrections and improvements can be included in later versions. 

Are we still talking about the HRC Hondas or meds from Mexico?

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6/30/2024 6:14pm

You can thank Dan Truman and GET. 

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Bultaco
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6/30/2024 6:23pm
What kind of black magic has Honda got going on with those 450's on the starts? Hunter was never a holeshot artist and Jett not really...

What kind of black magic has Honda got going on with those 450's on the starts? Hunter was never a holeshot artist and Jett not really either. Suddenly they look like Don Garlits and John Force every time they leave the gate.

TeamGreen wrote:
I heard this from my super-secret industry sources… The brothers have been training at Luke AFB on a Highly Classified RAAF cross-training contract utilizing the latest...

I heard this from my super-secret industry sources…

The brothers have been training at Luke AFB on a Highly Classified RAAF cross-training contract utilizing the latest AI at the F-35 Training Center. 

Beyond that? There’s not much more I could tell you…or else…well, you know…

Well played.  

Love the irony of "super secret at Luke AFB".....smack dab in the middle of Phoenix/Chandler metro area.

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PRM31
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6/30/2024 6:25pm Edited Date/Time 6/30/2024 6:31pm

ECUs designed directly for starts is the norm in road racing. Clearly the rider still has to time the gate for MX, then the ECU controls power to the ground using the TC to get the ideal rate of spin. I don’t know if they are using throttle, ignition, or a combination to control the power. Honda (GET) clearly has this dialed. 

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