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3/26/2009
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wildomar, ca, CA
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Racing Rumor
Heard that anderson has a custom feeling frame, something about the way his mechanic polishes it to weaken the metal for more flex.
funny thing is i cant go back and find a photo where his frame is not polished, there has to be some vitards out there that want to rip my head off, so lets hear it is this possible? is it just looks?
Poll
Does said mechanic polish it with a grinder?
The polishing would be to disguise where material has been removed, or just to make it look pretty. I don't know the intent but polishing alone is not going to change frame flex characteristics. lol
I'm no expert but I have to call BS on that.
Unless you polish it for 57 years.
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Where did you "hear" this rumor? Pretty sure you would visibly notice a difference in the shape of a frame that has enough material being removed to be able to feel a difference on the bike. Although, could be a complete placebo effect and JA really thinks there is a difference when scientifically there really couldn't be lol. Its happened many times before with others.
I used to hear the same thing a lot back in like 2010 but I always thought it was people just making shit up.
This is an old trick, i Remember reading in Mxa I believe. Quick google and an old article came up from vital in 2010
I heard the aluminum in his frame is helium impregnated…much lighter than normal aluminum.
Isn’t the Kawi already known to be the a great “feeling” frame? Comfy with good balance of flex and stiffness? Don’t think this rumor is true.
Teams often make changes that don't actually do anything physically, but make the rider happy mentally. And if the rider's happy and putting out faster lap times, then it doesn't much matter if it made a physical change or not (unless it was for the worse or dangerous, which happens on occasion).
"Those tires are matched perfect and staggered special."
As a long time road race guy I follow what you're saying.
Perception is reality after all.
Can you possibly elaborate on more specific examples of what you're referring to ?
like those damping stickers ppl used to put on their bikes. i think chad reed did? cant remember
https://axxios-tech.com/bike/?lang=en
When you polish it bend it, don't break it.
Did this to my buddies 450
My three current favorites:
1) Changing bolt torque to change "feel": Unless you're massively changing torque (to the point where parts slip or the bolt breaks), the only bolt this would apply to is the lower triple clamp pinch bolts.
2) Floating rear axles: There's nothing floating about it once you tighten the axle nut to spec.
3) Titanium vs Steel bolts for a different feel: Typically you hear about riders saying titanium is too stiff, yet titanium is actually half the stiffness of steel. Even if thickness is increased (in an axle for example), the part is usually far less stiff than steel part.
There are lots of other examples where people claim that knocking the sharp edges off a part change the feel, but it's such an insignificant change, there's no way anyone is noticing it.
We've done testing where the rider ended up riding two identical sets of triple clamps, yet felt a difference because they were expecting to feel a difference... There's a huge mental aspect to this sport, which makes tuning and testing interesting at times!
Hmmmmm…
I’m just guessing here…
But, special frame prep might be secondary to fork settings, front end feel and “chassis balance”…
All of which is from suspension settings.
But, what if I’m wrong?
“My mechanic used the wrong grit when polishing the frame, really ruined my race”
Pit Row
Would factory teams not be mad not to change bits about the frame if they wanted . Yes there is a production rule. But it really doesn't seem to be policed . Like herlings was using a longer frame in mxgp (where he is allowed). But it's not like it was so much longer you'd notice it by just looking at it . Like 10 mm on a frame or swinging arm are going to make a big difference,. But you d have to take them off and measure to notice . Maybe I am wrong, do they strip down frame s and make sure they are fully stock ? Then also they could build a frame exact same but use thinner or thicker alloy in place s . Unless the ama cuts the frame apart they ll never find out .
Don Prudhomme's team used to throw a towel over the fuel cell of his funny car.
Everyone wondered what they were hiding.
Wasn't shit, they were fucking with people's heads.
Polishing to disguise modifications, maybe.
Polishing to promote frame flex.... nah.
Some of the stuff I hear guys say they can feel is so far fetched like you said the sharp edges on parts or grades of bolts. Wasn't there some guys claiming being able to feel a difference in polishing the cast stock triple clamps on some bikes possibly removing the small casting marks? I just feel like stuff like the humidity in the air or the temperature would have a more drastic effect or maybe the amount of dirt that gets stuck to the tires or under the fenders.
I had a bunch of people on Instagram telling me that changing torque values of their suspension linkage by a few lb-ft made a significant change in the "feel". I drew them a simple, but effective drawing to disprove their theory. None of them would have any part of it... Including some big name pros and their respective practice mechanics.
Heliums cant even get pregnant bro what are you talking about
Luxon said it well earlier. The idea behind this kind of thing is absolutely hogwash. Bikes are held together by friction, friction is created by bolts forcing parts together. Unless you replace the bolts with pins, the only difference is in your head.
The exception here would be conical bearings like steering stems.
Until the AMA comes up with a template, teams will cheat, it’s a fact.
RC went through 4 frames his first year at Honda until they got him a chassis he liked.
But polishing to create flex? Naw. Polish it to hide a mod, possible.
I'd be curious to know your process. I've done a few but yours looks fantastic.
I would suppose there is nothing stopping a factory team from having the frame made with various internal thickness variations and then welding it up as a production frame to test frame flex and handling.
Has anyone every been caught and penalized with a production rule violation on a frame?
As uptite mentioned, the modified frame pieces may not look cosmetically like production units, so polishing them and giving a BS reason would distract people.
Placebo effect. Can cure illness so no surprised that people "notice" differences that are in fact all in their head.
Killer discussion but will we ever know the truth....hahaha
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