Wilson Wall jump

Barrzy256
Profile picture for user Barrzy256
Posts
178
Joined
5/22/2011
Location
Bristol, GB
Barrzy256 8/26/2017 7:38am
8/26/2017 7:38am
People moan how tracks are dangerous and riders are getting pushed to there limits etc etc...So they change the track to make it safer for the riders and people still moan. Mental
kott0n
Profile picture for user kott0n
Posts
673
Joined
10/4/2016
Location
Vancouver, WA, USA
kott0n 8/26/2017 8:11am
8/26/2017 8:11am
jamma10 wrote:
The problem is if it really saved almost 2 secs a lap like Wilson said it did then it would have become a 'must-do' for everyone.
Good thing these are the most elite riders in the US.

Having obstacles that seperate riders is not new. The fact that someone was doing it, cleanly, means it's possible. Finding lines like this is WHAT MAKES it interesting.

You want to be .5 seconds a lap faster than Dean? You better find something he's not doing and go for it.
MotoX85
Profile picture for user MotoX85
Posts
2198
Joined
10/9/2011
Location
Centralia, IL, USA
MotoX85 8/26/2017 9:30am
8/26/2017 9:30am
DC wrote:
There aren't enough ambulances to take care of the carnage we would have seen if everyone had to jump that like Dean was doing. It was...
There aren't enough ambulances to take care of the carnage we would have seen if everyone had to jump that like Dean was doing. It was incredible to watch, and scary. Sorry that it bums some of you out, but picking guys up all day from something that tempting and also risky is not something any of us enjoy doing. I made the call and I stand by it, there are plenty of other cool things out there to jump, but this one would have gotten bad once the track started getting rough and race-speeds picked up. Sorry.

DC
Racer X
So you take all the obstacles out of the track that seperate the racers willing to try new and different lines because you think the racers are too stupid to know their own abilities. So some of the riders are not hitting the Godzilla jump, people are wadding on it right and left and it has huge kickers on the face......Are you taking that out next.

And we wonder why the AMA series and riders are falling WAY BEHIND the GP riders.

Completely BS call and penalizes all the riders who think out of the box. Hell my 16 yr old B rider saw that line and said someone was going to hit it and then Wilson did. But let's bull doze it so the "worlds" best don't hurt themselves.
Old-Man
Profile picture for user Old-Man
Posts
8019
Joined
10/21/2011
Location
Colorado springs, CO, USA
Old-Man 8/26/2017 9:36am
8/26/2017 9:36am
Crush wrote:
There is no shortage of jumps at that track, that's for sure. It could do with a few less if anything.
Reminds me of Kenworthy's, Loved racing there just because of the jumpsSmile

The Shop

See All »
MX Guy
Profile picture for user MX Guy
Posts
2710
Joined
7/18/2016
Location
Southern, CA, USA
Fantasy
482nd
MX Guy 8/26/2017 9:45am
8/26/2017 9:45am
DC wrote:
There aren't enough ambulances to take care of the carnage we would have seen if everyone had to jump that like Dean was doing. It was...
There aren't enough ambulances to take care of the carnage we would have seen if everyone had to jump that like Dean was doing. It was incredible to watch, and scary. Sorry that it bums some of you out, but picking guys up all day from something that tempting and also risky is not something any of us enjoy doing. I made the call and I stand by it, there are plenty of other cool things out there to jump, but this one would have gotten bad once the track started getting rough and race-speeds picked up. Sorry.

DC
Racer X
"If everyone had to jump that..."

I missed the part where someone was holding a gun to forty riders' heads telling them to jump that
jamma10
Profile picture for user jamma10
Posts
10573
Joined
8/24/2008
Location
Bristol, GB
jamma10 8/26/2017 10:05am
8/26/2017 10:05am Edited Date/Time 8/26/2017 10:12am
jamma10 wrote:
The problem is if it really saved almost 2 secs a lap like Wilson said it did then it would have become a 'must-do' for everyone.
kott0n wrote:
Good thing these are the most elite riders in the US. Having obstacles that seperate riders is not new. The fact that someone was doing it...
Good thing these are the most elite riders in the US.

Having obstacles that seperate riders is not new. The fact that someone was doing it, cleanly, means it's possible. Finding lines like this is WHAT MAKES it interesting.

You want to be .5 seconds a lap faster than Dean? You better find something he's not doing and go for it.
I tend to agree with you, but I think you have to judge each obstacle differently. The potential consequences for clipping that particular hump a lttle too hard could be catastrophic - what happens when someone gets a little weary and tired towards the end of the race, doesn't quite get the bounce they need so the back wheel clips a little too hard and kicks them over the bars and into that next hump? That's a neck breaker right there.

Im not normally one for wanting to tone things down, I think tracks should definitely be tough. I just happen to think they made a good decision this time.
reynardfan1
Profile picture for user reynardfan1
Posts
825
Joined
7/28/2014
Location
Gretna, NE, USA
reynardfan1 8/26/2017 11:10am
8/26/2017 11:10am
Motofinne wrote:
I 100% understand you decision DC, but i don't agree with it. I think these riders have to use their own brain and understand if they...
I 100% understand you decision DC, but i don't agree with it.

I think these riders have to use their own brain and understand if they are able to do it or not just like any other obstacle.

I'm with you! Quit equalizing the sport...riders will learn to ride within their limits...

You dumb it down and it takes away how spectacular some of the talented riders are..

Lame choice...

Stewey in his prime would have killed it and we would have been in awe...

Andy_Greenney 8/26/2017 11:28am
8/26/2017 11:28am
Definitely the right call on this occasion, incredible to watch but the ambulances would be VERY busy.
Andy_Greenney 8/26/2017 11:30am
8/26/2017 11:30am
MX Guy wrote:
"If everyone had to jump that..."

I missed the part where someone was holding a gun to forty riders' heads telling them to jump that
The time difference between jumping it and not was the gun to the forty rider heads
DC
Profile picture for user DC
Posts
3889
Joined
5/1/2009
Location
Morgantown, WV, USA
DC 8/26/2017 12:39pm
8/26/2017 12:39pm Edited Date/Time 8/26/2017 12:41pm
I got to press day at 2:05, drove eight hours from WV. As soon as I walked on the track someone said to go check out that section. Wilson jumped it that lap. I immediately radioed the track crew to bring the tractor over and change it between sessions. It was too dangerous. Period. I was a pro rider and I am at almost every race. I know an ass-buster when I see it. I would have changed it before Dean or anyone else got out there, I just wasn't there in time.

I will make the call for safety every time I see something that is too sketchy for outdoor motocross. I am sorry if that disappoints you, but I'd rather not watch someone wad themselves up for your entertainment when it's avoidable.

It was a wall jump that belonged on a slower SX track, not a fast outdoor track, so we removed it as soon as I saw it. Our sport is dangerous enough as it is.

DC
Racer X
ocscottie
Profile picture for user ocscottie
Posts
69092
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Redding, CA, USA
ocscottie 8/26/2017 1:06pm
8/26/2017 1:06pm
DC wrote:
I got to press day at 2:05, drove eight hours from WV. As soon as I walked on the track someone said to go check out...
I got to press day at 2:05, drove eight hours from WV. As soon as I walked on the track someone said to go check out that section. Wilson jumped it that lap. I immediately radioed the track crew to bring the tractor over and change it between sessions. It was too dangerous. Period. I was a pro rider and I am at almost every race. I know an ass-buster when I see it. I would have changed it before Dean or anyone else got out there, I just wasn't there in time.

I will make the call for safety every time I see something that is too sketchy for outdoor motocross. I am sorry if that disappoints you, but I'd rather not watch someone wad themselves up for your entertainment when it's avoidable.

It was a wall jump that belonged on a slower SX track, not a fast outdoor track, so we removed it as soon as I saw it. Our sport is dangerous enough as it is.

DC
Racer X
Well said Davey.
Thisusernameisavailable 8/26/2017 1:29pm
8/26/2017 1:29pm
DC wrote:
There aren't enough ambulances to take care of the carnage we would have seen if everyone had to jump that like Dean was doing. It was...
There aren't enough ambulances to take care of the carnage we would have seen if everyone had to jump that like Dean was doing. It was incredible to watch, and scary. Sorry that it bums some of you out, but picking guys up all day from something that tempting and also risky is not something any of us enjoy doing. I made the call and I stand by it, there are plenty of other cool things out there to jump, but this one would have gotten bad once the track started getting rough and race-speeds picked up. Sorry.

DC
Racer X
MX Guy wrote:
"If everyone had to jump that..."

I missed the part where someone was holding a gun to forty riders' heads telling them to jump that
Absolutely agree with you MX Guy.

You ride the terrain in front of you as fast as you feel confident in doing so.
If it's not for you today, you'll lose time. Which means you're not the fastest guy today.
Suck it up and work on growing skills if you want to be that good.

Or we can bulldoze it in to a straightaway so everyone can go the same speed, wide open in 5th...?
scrubbin627 8/26/2017 1:55pm
8/26/2017 1:55pm
Impressive riding from Dean-o here. Very cool

I think it should have stayed. I can see DC's point but of all the dangerous obstacles in the series and you doze this? Ill just take your word for it I guess...
MotoX85
Profile picture for user MotoX85
Posts
2198
Joined
10/9/2011
Location
Centralia, IL, USA
MotoX85 8/26/2017 3:24pm
8/26/2017 3:24pm
Well numerous people were not jumping into the whoops before the big uphill over the mechanics tunnel.....take that out.

Lots of 250 riders where not getting over the step up triple, VERY unsafe, take that out next.

But we have no problem with the 200 ft triple at Glen Helen that every pro said was stupid and un racey or the 180 ft jump at Hangtown, that nobody did.

Complete bullshit call and it definately makes people wonder if certain riders are favored and if you show any creativity with lines that those riders can't do, they'll change the track so you can't have an edge.
Overdrive
Profile picture for user Overdrive
Posts
1614
Joined
7/13/2008
Location
Fort Myers, FL, USA
Overdrive 8/26/2017 3:31pm
8/26/2017 3:31pm
It was the right call without a doubt, as the day wore the track down it would have claimed riders before it ended up being something that couldn't be done anyway.

JC21
Profile picture for user JC21
Posts
41
Joined
6/29/2017
Location
AU
JC21 8/26/2017 3:41pm
8/26/2017 3:41pm
Yeah I don't get removing it - I mean there were other sections where multiple actual accidents occurred but they remained.

Sure, remove things for safety (I'm no fan of big jumps myself), but if a section that no one crashed on is removed, surely any kind of reasonable logic would suggest sections where crashes are common needed to be fixed too, no?
yak651
Profile picture for user yak651
Posts
9014
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Appleton, WI, USA
Fantasy
1371st
yak651 8/26/2017 6:36pm
8/26/2017 6:36pm
Would think comments like this would open MX Sports up to liability if people get hurt on a section that others said was dangerous and nothing is done about it. It's been said that neck braces, chest protectors and other items can't be required because it would open the governing body to liability if someone is hurt after wearing the required gear. Now we have a promoter removing one section of the track in the name of safety but leaving others where people are crashing? Did anyone crash in that section before it's removal?

Pit Row

See All »
yak651
Profile picture for user yak651
Posts
9014
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Appleton, WI, USA
Fantasy
1371st
yak651 8/26/2017 7:12pm
8/26/2017 7:12pm
inthebadboycorner wrote:
The tracks are too dangerous as it is.
I get that, but then why be ok with 150' jumps, especially those with blind landings and then glorify them by calling them Kong? Something seems to be a little off in the thought process when a technical jump that maybe the top 5-10 will try is taken out but large jumps that every privateer that is trying to qualify must hit with having a lap of practice to size it up is backwards
305FC250
Profile picture for user 305FC250
Posts
427
Joined
9/18/2016
Location
Miami, FL, USA
305FC250 8/26/2017 8:02pm
8/26/2017 8:02pm
inthebadboycorner wrote:
The tracks are too dangerous as it is.
yak651 wrote:
I get that, but then why be ok with 150' jumps, especially those with blind landings and then glorify them by calling them Kong? Something seems...
I get that, but then why be ok with 150' jumps, especially those with blind landings and then glorify them by calling them Kong? Something seems to be a little off in the thought process when a technical jump that maybe the top 5-10 will try is taken out but large jumps that every privateer that is trying to qualify must hit with having a lap of practice to size it up is backwards
Get out of here with all that simple logic.
jorgechavez 8/26/2017 8:11pm
8/26/2017 8:11pm
MotoX85 wrote:
Well numerous people were not jumping into the whoops before the big uphill over the mechanics tunnel.....take that out. Lots of 250 riders where not getting...
Well numerous people were not jumping into the whoops before the big uphill over the mechanics tunnel.....take that out.

Lots of 250 riders where not getting over the step up triple, VERY unsafe, take that out next.

But we have no problem with the 200 ft triple at Glen Helen that every pro said was stupid and un racey or the 180 ft jump at Hangtown, that nobody did.

Complete bullshit call and it definately makes people wonder if certain riders are favored and if you show any creativity with lines that those riders can't do, they'll change the track so you can't have an edge.
Oh my..

Can we please take out the trash and get this guy out of here?

Not shocking that in 2017 decisions that are made to keep people safer are met by negativity.
MotoX85
Profile picture for user MotoX85
Posts
2198
Joined
10/9/2011
Location
Centralia, IL, USA
MotoX85 8/26/2017 10:27pm
8/26/2017 10:27pm
MotoX85 wrote:
Well numerous people were not jumping into the whoops before the big uphill over the mechanics tunnel.....take that out. Lots of 250 riders where not getting...
Well numerous people were not jumping into the whoops before the big uphill over the mechanics tunnel.....take that out.

Lots of 250 riders where not getting over the step up triple, VERY unsafe, take that out next.

But we have no problem with the 200 ft triple at Glen Helen that every pro said was stupid and un racey or the 180 ft jump at Hangtown, that nobody did.

Complete bullshit call and it definately makes people wonder if certain riders are favored and if you show any creativity with lines that those riders can't do, they'll change the track so you can't have an edge.
jorgechavez wrote:
Oh my.. Can we please take out the trash and get this guy out of here? Not shocking that in 2017 decisions that are made to...
Oh my..

Can we please take out the trash and get this guy out of here?

Not shocking that in 2017 decisions that are made to keep people safer are met by negativity.
Why, am I telling the truth again. We all know today's society can't handle that. Let's just suck each others ass and it will all just go away.
DC
Profile picture for user DC
Posts
3889
Joined
5/1/2009
Location
Morgantown, WV, USA
DC 8/27/2017 5:44am
8/27/2017 5:44am Edited Date/Time 8/27/2017 5:46am
The jump should not have been built that way in the first place. It was in there for one press-day session and I asked that it be removed for the safety of all the riders, pro and amateur alike, not because I wanted to ruin anyone's entertainment. The track had plenty other obstacles and all were safe enough in my opinion to give the riders a good challenge, the fans some great entertainment, and we didn't have any catastrophic injuries. Had that jump stayed in, I fear we would have had people that were below Dean's talent (and maybe even right there with Dean's talent, or maybe even Dean) feel they needed to jump it and then clip it and crash and land on their heads or necks into the next jump. It was my decision and I will make it every time. I know it would have been cool to see guys try to jump that all day, but it would have been tragic to see anyone miss. I have to pick enough guys (and kids) up off race tracks as it is, but that doesn't mean we should make motocross ever more risky. I didn't want to do it all weekend over an unplanned obstacle like a fourth-gear, bunny-hopped wall jump.

If you guys don't fire me, I will be back for many years to come and you can count/insult on me to make the same decision. See you at the races.

DC
MX Sports
mx317
Profile picture for user mx317
Posts
5395
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
USA
mx317 8/27/2017 6:02am
8/27/2017 6:02am
MotoX85 wrote:
Well numerous people were not jumping into the whoops before the big uphill over the mechanics tunnel.....take that out. Lots of 250 riders where not getting...
Well numerous people were not jumping into the whoops before the big uphill over the mechanics tunnel.....take that out.

Lots of 250 riders where not getting over the step up triple, VERY unsafe, take that out next.

But we have no problem with the 200 ft triple at Glen Helen that every pro said was stupid and un racey or the 180 ft jump at Hangtown, that nobody did.

Complete bullshit call and it definately makes people wonder if certain riders are favored and if you show any creativity with lines that those riders can't do, they'll change the track so you can't have an edge.
There is a difference in jumps designed to be jumped and jumps not designed to be jumped.
TeamGreen
Profile picture for user TeamGreen
Posts
37573
Joined
11/25/2008
Location
Thru-out, CA, USA
TeamGreen 8/27/2017 6:35am
8/27/2017 6:35am
loftyair wrote:
Motocross, take most the jumps out.
Sears Point
Carlsbad
Saddleback

Were they NOT "Motocross"?
colintrax
Profile picture for user colintrax
Posts
4695
Joined
8/25/2015
Location
Taylorsville, GA, USA
colintrax 8/27/2017 9:17am
8/27/2017 9:17am
DC wrote:
The jump should not have been built that way in the first place. It was in there for one press-day session and I asked that it...
The jump should not have been built that way in the first place. It was in there for one press-day session and I asked that it be removed for the safety of all the riders, pro and amateur alike, not because I wanted to ruin anyone's entertainment. The track had plenty other obstacles and all were safe enough in my opinion to give the riders a good challenge, the fans some great entertainment, and we didn't have any catastrophic injuries. Had that jump stayed in, I fear we would have had people that were below Dean's talent (and maybe even right there with Dean's talent, or maybe even Dean) feel they needed to jump it and then clip it and crash and land on their heads or necks into the next jump. It was my decision and I will make it every time. I know it would have been cool to see guys try to jump that all day, but it would have been tragic to see anyone miss. I have to pick enough guys (and kids) up off race tracks as it is, but that doesn't mean we should make motocross ever more risky. I didn't want to do it all weekend over an unplanned obstacle like a fourth-gear, bunny-hopped wall jump.

If you guys don't fire me, I will be back for many years to come and you can count/insult on me to make the same decision. See you at the races.

DC
MX Sports
I'm not so against taking that jump out in the name of safety, but aren't the unreasonably large jumps just, if not more, unsafe? Aren't rough tracks dangerous?
I can tell you I've taken more hard diggers from a rough track than any obstacle on it. At some point we have to draw a line as to what's too dangerous and what's not. Because if I had your job, the wall jump Deano was doing wouldve stayed, but the Godzilla jump wouldve never been built. I'd also put forth more effort into training, and holding flaggers accountable.

My opinion here, create a group of riders you can talk to about the tracks and decide what stays/goes. If you're the only one who feels the jump is too dangerous, you're probably wrong. However if all the riders agree with you, well us fans have no place to stand. Because at the end of the day, it's the riders risking injury/death. Not me, or you, or 99% of this forum.

IMO, call up Tomac, Seely, Tickle, Cianciarulo, J Martin, and Oldenburg. They seem to be pretty reasonable guys, and represent a decent variety of speed and style. I'm sure they'd be happy to be part of a safety committee.
shmacky78
Profile picture for user shmacky78
Posts
277
Joined
12/18/2011
Location
Dayton, OH, USA
shmacky78 8/27/2017 10:28am
8/27/2017 10:28am Edited Date/Time 8/27/2017 10:28am
And to think my only complaint was that there wasn't enough porta pottys yesterday ..
DC
Profile picture for user DC
Posts
3889
Joined
5/1/2009
Location
Morgantown, WV, USA
DC 8/27/2017 10:47am
8/27/2017 10:47am Edited Date/Time 8/27/2017 10:50am
Colintrax, I had a safety crew: Eli, Blake, Jeffrey, Zach and Jeremy were all out there for press day. Before the second session I told them it was taken out. None of them wanted it back in. And the Godzilla Jump had a mellow, flat landing, not s sharp lip. It was designed to be jumped and, like a triple in SX, many jumped it.

Can you think of any other high-speed wall jumps on a current National track? They don't exist for a reason. We talk to a wide variety of riders at every race, and use their input to craft and groom the tracks.

I appreciate everyone's input but I'm going to stick by decision and carry on. Thanks for watching or attending Ironman. Like Herlings, I thought it was a really good and safe track.

DC
NV825
Profile picture for user NV825
Posts
2192
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Carson City, NV, USA
NV825 8/27/2017 11:27am
8/27/2017 11:27am Edited Date/Time 8/27/2017 11:28am
After seeing Wilson's IG post, I immediately thought that's a high speed endo into the next lip just waiting to happen. I think the factory guys would have handled it throughout the day but the carnage from the privateers would have been pretty severe by leaving it there.

Did any 450 guys possibly size up the finish line jump for jumping all the way to the next single after where they were all landing?
kkawboy14
Profile picture for user kkawboy14
Posts
11486
Joined
6/5/2015
Location
USA
kkawboy14 8/27/2017 11:30am
8/27/2017 11:30am
So there are guys complaining that a SX jump was taken out of a MX track?

Post a reply to: Wilson Wall jump