Why they hit Eject

Edited Date/Time 2/23/2013 3:35pm
Why is it that most racers, if they seem to come up short or lose it in the air, hit the eject button? I'm sure I will get blasted for being an idiot or a noob, but I raced a few years locally on minis and superminis, but am just a fan now. I never understood why you would want to get away from the bike in the air? It would seem the bike would take the hit better than your legs, head, or back would. Heard RC and Fro say during the Zach Bells crash that it was good he got away from the bike. Why?
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GuyB
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2/22/2013 9:57pm Edited Date/Time 2/22/2013 9:58pm
In Zach's case, I'd guess what Fro meant was that it was good he got away from it so that it didn't land on him.

From conversations I've had with riders, they seem to always prefer staying with it...as long as they're on top of it.
malachi177
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2/22/2013 9:59pm Edited Date/Time 2/22/2013 10:00pm
GuyB wrote:
In Zach's case, I'd guess what Fro meant was that it was good he got away from it so that it didn't land on him. From...
In Zach's case, I'd guess what Fro meant was that it was good he got away from it so that it didn't land on him.

From conversations I've had with riders, they seem to always prefer staying with it...as long as they're on top of it.
RC was notorious for never letting go of the bars...even when running into a boat at Daytona...lol
2/22/2013 10:07pm
Follow up to GutB, it seems like you'd wanna stay with it as long as possible; however, is there a benefit ejecting off the bike or a rational of thought to why guys do it?
malachi177
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2/22/2013 10:14pm
The fear of having a +200 pound heavy thing hammering you into the ground would be the likely answer.

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zehn
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2/22/2013 10:33pm
malachi177 wrote:
The fear of having a +200 pound heavy thing hammering you into the ground would be the likely answer.
This. Is it really that hard to conclude this? Broken ankles vs. broken ankles and a broken back from the bike landing on you.
2/22/2013 10:42pm
malachi177 wrote:
The fear of having a +200 pound heavy thing hammering you into the ground would be the likely answer.
zehn wrote:
This. Is it really that hard to conclude this? Broken ankles vs. broken ankles and a broken back from the bike landing on you.
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and clear for all the sarcastic jackasses on the forum. You hit a triple doing 50 plus mph, and eject off the bike 18 feet in the air bc you are gonna come up short. My question is how is that better than staying on the bike?
zehn
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2/22/2013 10:47pm
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and...
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and clear for all the sarcastic jackasses on the forum. You hit a triple doing 50 plus mph, and eject off the bike 18 feet in the air bc you are gonna come up short. My question is how is that better than staying on the bike?
Oh. Well in that case, it's probably in an effort to protect their grill. Barcia took a big headshot a couple weeks ago from shorting a triple.

Honestly, I don't know why people do this. I've seen it happen too. I think it's because they are noobs and just freak out mid-air.
Trauma
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2/22/2013 11:15pm
malachi177 wrote:
The fear of having a +200 pound heavy thing hammering you into the ground would be the likely answer.
zehn wrote:
This. Is it really that hard to conclude this? Broken ankles vs. broken ankles and a broken back from the bike landing on you.
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and...
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and clear for all the sarcastic jackasses on the forum. You hit a triple doing 50 plus mph, and eject off the bike 18 feet in the air bc you are gonna come up short. My question is how is that better than staying on the bike?
You wouldn't, if you believe you are going to case it wheels first then use the suspension. If it's going to go into the face of the landing in an endo then do what RV did in St. Louis, eject. I'd argue than anyone ejecting on the first example did so out of panic.
MX690
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2/22/2013 11:17pm
Yep if your coming up short or over jumping hitting the eject button is the last thing you should do. I was always told to drive that fucker into the ground because the suspension will absorb a hell of a lot more impact than your body will. But as far as Zach's crash I think it was the completely right thing to do, that crash was not normal.
Motoxdoc
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2/22/2013 11:20pm
malachi177 wrote:
The fear of having a +200 pound heavy thing hammering you into the ground would be the likely answer.
zehn wrote:
This. Is it really that hard to conclude this? Broken ankles vs. broken ankles and a broken back from the bike landing on you.
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and...
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and clear for all the sarcastic jackasses on the forum. You hit a triple doing 50 plus mph, and eject off the bike 18 feet in the air bc you are gonna come up short. My question is how is that better than staying on the bike?
First of all, it doesn't looks like zehn and malachi were being sarcastic....but rather serious.
Second of all, no one is doing 50+ mph over a triple in SX.
and Last, every situation is different, but for the most part it's reflexes coupled with what the rider thinks will result in the least amount of injury. If a rider isn't prepared to land on his bike safe and securely (Zach Bell) it's better to get away from it.
2/22/2013 11:31pm
zehn wrote:
This. Is it really that hard to conclude this? Broken ankles vs. broken ankles and a broken back from the bike landing on you.
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and...
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and clear for all the sarcastic jackasses on the forum. You hit a triple doing 50 plus mph, and eject off the bike 18 feet in the air bc you are gonna come up short. My question is how is that better than staying on the bike?
Motoxdoc wrote:
First of all, it doesn't looks like zehn and malachi were being sarcastic....but rather serious. Second of all, no one is doing 50+ mph over a...
First of all, it doesn't looks like zehn and malachi were being sarcastic....but rather serious.
Second of all, no one is doing 50+ mph over a triple in SX.
and Last, every situation is different, but for the most part it's reflexes coupled with what the rider thinks will result in the least amount of injury. If a rider isn't prepared to land on his bike safe and securely (Zach Bell) it's better to get away from it.
Maybe, but what I was trying to do in this post is get some educated racer perspective on why guys bail midair when its seems counterproductive to do so. And yes I know they're prob not hitting 50 mph in sx rythm sections, was just trying to illustrate a perspective verbally.
zehn
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2/22/2013 11:42pm
Like was said before, sometimes you just panic and do things without thinking them through, or without the time to think them through. Split second decisions often aren't the best ideas.
Motoxdoc
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2/22/2013 11:55pm
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and...
NO SH"T. No one wants to have a bike land on them, and that's not what I'm talking about. Let me make it really simple and clear for all the sarcastic jackasses on the forum. You hit a triple doing 50 plus mph, and eject off the bike 18 feet in the air bc you are gonna come up short. My question is how is that better than staying on the bike?
Motoxdoc wrote:
First of all, it doesn't looks like zehn and malachi were being sarcastic....but rather serious. Second of all, no one is doing 50+ mph over a...
First of all, it doesn't looks like zehn and malachi were being sarcastic....but rather serious.
Second of all, no one is doing 50+ mph over a triple in SX.
and Last, every situation is different, but for the most part it's reflexes coupled with what the rider thinks will result in the least amount of injury. If a rider isn't prepared to land on his bike safe and securely (Zach Bell) it's better to get away from it.
Maybe, but what I was trying to do in this post is get some educated racer perspective on why guys bail midair when its seems counterproductive...
Maybe, but what I was trying to do in this post is get some educated racer perspective on why guys bail midair when its seems counterproductive to do so. And yes I know they're prob not hitting 50 mph in sx rythm sections, was just trying to illustrate a perspective verbally.
You can now say you have an "educated racer perspective" on why guys bail midair!......as far as "when it seems counterproductive"......that wasn't in your original post. But I can answer that too. It's because they have bad instincts!
lostboy819
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2/23/2013 12:01am
Why is it that most racers, if they seem to come up short or lose it in the air, hit the eject button? I'm sure I...
Why is it that most racers, if they seem to come up short or lose it in the air, hit the eject button? I'm sure I will get blasted for being an idiot or a noob, but I raced a few years locally on minis and superminis, but am just a fan now. I never understood why you would want to get away from the bike in the air? It would seem the bike would take the hit better than your legs, head, or back would. Heard RC and Fro say during the Zach Bells crash that it was good he got away from the bike. Why?
I say MOST riders don't hit the eject. Most of the ones I see ride it out . Don't know what races you have been watching.
2/23/2013 12:03am Edited Date/Time 2/23/2013 12:36am
zehn wrote:
Like was said before, sometimes you just panic and do things without thinking them through, or without the time to think them through. Split second decisions...
Like was said before, sometimes you just panic and do things without thinking them through, or without the time to think them through. Split second decisions often aren't the best ideas.
I agree.

The animal part of your brain makes all (or most) of the decisions in a situation like that, and it basically just ends up being a split second reaction. In Zach's case it was totally different because he didn't really make the decision to bail. Rather his feet got dragged off the lip of the jump, throwing all his momentum in the opposite direction from the bike.

But in most cases - whether to bail or not to bail just comes down to animal instincts within the moment rather than a logical decision (though with that said, sometimes the decision is good).
kzizok
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2/23/2013 2:40am
To answer your question to what you heard , I really don't think there is a "general" hard fast rule that was implied in the broadcast. Personally, I just think Emig miss-spoke with a generalizing comment that was actually for a specific situation. In Bells' situation, in that instance, to get away from the bike probably was the best decision. We all want less damage and he thought tossing the bike would help and it probably did. It is simply the humans' "fight or flight" phenomenon.
ando
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2/23/2013 2:45am
I'd be surprised if any of them make conscious, considered decisions about whether it's better to bail out or hang on.
tns
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2/23/2013 3:17am
Bailing mid air has always been a no no, but coming into the face of a jump short and exiting through the bars if you can get yourself over the lip and slide down the down ramp is a reasonable risk rather than going in with the bike and then having no control of your ejection.Chads big crash was a good example what would of happened if he stayed on it.
MR. X
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2/23/2013 3:37am Edited Date/Time 2/23/2013 3:38am
Has anybody ever had enough time to calculate in midair which would be better once you know its coming , you hardly have enough time to complete the phrase"OH SHIT"
Robgvx
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2/23/2013 3:45am
Let me see. Stay with the bike and maybe save it, or bail in the air and remove all doubt.
2/23/2013 3:53am Edited Date/Time 2/23/2013 3:54am
I agree. The animal part of your brain makes all (or most) of the decisions in a situation like that, and it basically just ends up...
I agree.

The animal part of your brain makes all (or most) of the decisions in a situation like that, and it basically just ends up being a split second reaction. In Zach's case it was totally different because he didn't really make the decision to bail. Rather his feet got dragged off the lip of the jump, throwing all his momentum in the opposite direction from the bike.

But in most cases - whether to bail or not to bail just comes down to animal instincts within the moment rather than a logical decision (though with that said, sometimes the decision is good).
About Bells getoff.. the way his feet came off and his body swung around.. for a second it looked a lot like a FMX trick, then he let go. Obviously it was an accident, his foot caught on the dirt and came off. Could an experienced FMX guy have pulled that one back?
MR. X
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2/23/2013 4:07am
It worked ok for reed at milleville in 2011 , to let go in the air.
Shawn142
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2/23/2013 4:17am
Chad Reed's crash at Dallas last year is a perfect example of why you try and get away from the bike. He cracked vertebra, ribs, and tore his ACL by not getting away from the bike when nosing in. Guys hit the ejection button in hopes of avoiding putting themselves in this situation, because a broken ankle or two is always better than the alternative of possible back injury. Especially with the higher speeds and heavier bikes these days.

2/23/2013 4:21am Edited Date/Time 2/23/2013 4:27am
I agree. The animal part of your brain makes all (or most) of the decisions in a situation like that, and it basically just ends up...
I agree.

The animal part of your brain makes all (or most) of the decisions in a situation like that, and it basically just ends up being a split second reaction. In Zach's case it was totally different because he didn't really make the decision to bail. Rather his feet got dragged off the lip of the jump, throwing all his momentum in the opposite direction from the bike.

But in most cases - whether to bail or not to bail just comes down to animal instincts within the moment rather than a logical decision (though with that said, sometimes the decision is good).
About Bells getoff.. the way his feet came off and his body swung around.. for a second it looked a lot like a FMX trick, then...
About Bells getoff.. the way his feet came off and his body swung around.. for a second it looked a lot like a FMX trick, then he let go. Obviously it was an accident, his foot caught on the dirt and came off. Could an experienced FMX guy have pulled that one back?
Interesting question. I'm not an FMX rider but I don't think even a good freestyle guy could've saved it.

The reason for this is because when a rider does a trick, whether it's a whip or nac nac etc; regardless of what it is, they're following an arc of momentum. It's like RV throwing a big whip vs getting cross rutted on a jump. He may be completely sideways more on an intentional whip - but it's a controlled arc or line of momentum. Whereas if the bike is thrown out sideways from a kicker, rut or bump off the face of a jump... well then there's only so much he can do to correct that.

Be interesting if an FMX guy could chip in here. But that's just my personal guess anyway.
Aaryn234
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2/23/2013 4:42am
Here is an example for you.

A couple of weeks back Freestyle Cam Sinclair had something happen as he was about to hit a ramp to pull a back flip.

He was already committed to the trick, but with something happening with the bike he did not have the drive he needed to
A - Complete the trick
and
B - Make the down ramp!

He was launched wheel high across the gap from the up ramp to the down ramp,

He had two choices, stay with the bike which was going to hit the flat face of the down ramp, or try to bail over the bike and make the very start of the down ramp (The flat part that before it starts to go down)

He made the smart choice to bale in that situation, His bike did not make the gap, but he was able to push off the bike and get him self feet first to the flat part of the down ramp.

He smashed his ankle and foot, but was better then smashing head first with is bike into the face of the down ramp!

NOW

If he left the jump with even less momentum, and there was no chance what so ever he or the bike was going to make the gap and both were going to be falling from the sky on to the flat ground below. Staying with the bike and letting the suspension take up some of the energy of the flat land would have probably been the better option.

All depends on the situation. If the bike is going to aid to reduce the impact stay with it, If it is not going to aid in any way, get as far away as possible to lessen the chances of a second impact as the bike follows through!

If you want to see some pretty gnarly pics of Sincs foot during surgery check out his facebook, Twitter or instagram page!
CamP
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2/23/2013 5:02am Edited Date/Time 2/23/2013 5:03am
If you find yourself in an unrecoverable endo, it's often best to hit the eject button. I had a crash last year on a 70 footer that was similar to Phil Niccoleti's crash video. About the same size jump. Instead of riding it out, I hit the eject button and landed in the landing zone on my feet, with a parkour style tumble at the end. Fortunately, I didn't get pegged by my cart wheeling bike and I walked away. I used up a couple of my 9 lives on that one.
Shawn142
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2/23/2013 5:11am
And as it happens.. this week's Racerhead has an entire section dedicated to this type of thing because of Bell's crash.


JT: Wanted to weigh in on the incredible Zach Bell crash of last Saturday night. Crashing sucks. That’s just how it is and always will be. Having said that, there are definitely different types of crashes and varying degrees of it. Every single one of us that has ever swung his leg over a bike has sampled the dirt at some point, some more than others. Honestly, some do it more gracefully than others. To me, crashing without injuring yourself is an art form, something that Ricky Carmichael himself was exceptional at. Being able to roll out of the crash and the awareness of your extremities’ location mid-tumble is a skill that most would like to have. The sudden stop is something that we all try to avoid and where you find most injuries occur.

Most times, I could see a crash coming my way at least a few seconds before I was on the ground. Things go awry, I attempt to save it and that didn’t always work. Those few seconds pre-crash can give me time to do a few key things:

Get away from that flipping ball of hot metal I was previously steering.
Look for a relatively soft spot to splat.
Configure my body in the least lawn dart-ish way possible.
While those things sound like common sense, it happens in a flash and most people tend to close their eyes and hope for the best. Of course, during those few seconds, a few things roll through your mind. Usually, it's a few choice words that aren’t appropriate here.

Next, you wonder where your insurance card is and who can drive your truck home from the airport.

Finally, I always remember thinking, Man, that ground is coming at me fast. Once I did actually hit the ground, there was always that short time where you did the whole-body assessment. I always was praying that nothing started pulsating with pain. There is always a short window where nothing seems to hurt, and then if you are indeed injured, your body lets you know quickly. Getting off the track is always a huge priority for me, as many injuries have occurred after the initial crash. If all of these have happened and you are good to go, tracking down the expensive piece of art work I just destroyed is next on the list. Sometimes it waited right where I crashed and other times I had launched it into the neighboring county. Oops.

Crashing is one of the only negatives of this great sport, and learning how to escape injury can be a valuable tool.

Ping: Crashing, much like life, is similar to a box of chocolates. That’s right, Forrest, you never know what you’re gonna get. I’ve had massive, high-speed get-offs that I walked away from (Phoenix ‘02) and I’ve low-sided in a tight turn and broken my wrist (approximately nine different events). Some happen before you know what hit you and others seem like they are happening in slow motion.

Zach Bell’s fall from Texas airspace last Saturday night was a slo-mo. Any time something goes bad on a jump you have to make the decision to stay on or eject. If you can land on the bike and use the travel to help absorb the landing, that is the best answer. For Zach, that wasn’t an option. He was half off the bike and it was going to land nose-down and sideways. Sometimes you have the clarity to spot a Tuff Block and aim for it. Other times all there is below you is rock hard ground. Most riders' reaction upon impact is to scurry off the course, and I think that threw a lot of people off with Bell’s crash because he lay perfectly still for a while. Maybe he was doing a self-assessment for injury or maybe he was just in shock. Either way, it’s incredible that he walked away.

I’ll say this: Zach started wearing a chest protector under his jersey recently, and I’ll bet he is glad he had it on. There is one thing you can control about a crash it’s the amount of protective equipment you have on when it happens.
davis224
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2/23/2013 5:44am
If you arent going to land wheels down or like stated above, too far over into an endo where the bike is going to be crushing you, you'd be silly not to bail. I've only had to bail a couple times, the one that comes to mind was a jump coming out of a corner that I didn't quite turn enough for, I was going to land on the very steep but soft side of the landing, rather than risk landing then rolling with my bike down the side and catching a footpeg to the stomach or back, I ejected and safely plopped into the soft dirt while my bike flipped over.
nc97
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2/23/2013 5:50am
Ive ejected a few times becouse I didnt want to hurt my bike with my headLaughing
WhKnuckle
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2/23/2013 5:53am
In Bell's case, he didn't have to make a decision to eject or try to ride it out. He started ejecting before he ever hit the jump. By the time he was in the air, he already wasn't going to land on top of the bike.

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