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Used to not mind the bloke, but in recent years he has become very tough to tolerate.
Definitely comes across very conceited
Big business has always ripped off small guys. Moto companies aren't any better.
Don Richardson's book on Amazon is a great read on how tough it is to beat the corporations, lawyers, patent office workers, private equity and how they rip peoples ideas off for profit all the time! The motorcycle industry isn't any better than Microsoft.
IT'S AN EYE OPENER!
It's a great read and cheap to buy on Amazon.
Want to play in the Big Leagues ? Try reproducing the Rolex , or Harley Davidson logos. A cease and desist order will be the least of your problems when they are done with you. Both companies are VERY aggressive in protecting their name. I don’t care for either product, but they both have headhunters whose full time job is to seek out companies / individuals trespassing on their logo’s and products.
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This is the truth.
A very good friend of mine had a plastic fab-shop, he'd make custom parts and signs and things.
He had a Harley at the time, and he made himself a cool mirrored plastic Harley sign which was a direct copy of their logo, and had it hanging in his shop.
He had it for quite a while until someone drove by and saw it through an open roll-up door. The guy went in to look at it, my buddy thought he was just admiring it. He wasn't, he told him that he could be in some deep trouble. My buddy explained that it was the only one in existence, and had no plans to make or sell any.
It didn't matter, it was hanging where people in public could see it...sometimes.
Anyway, it's in his garage now.
I don’t think your buddy could have been in any trouble for publicly displaying it if there were no plans to produce and sell to public.
Is HD gonna go after people that have a visible HD tattoo?
Besides his bad takes on Shimoda, why wouldn't he have any credibility?
I would imagine Enzo has a trademark on that and if they don't they should definitely seems pretty shady
A friend of mine was making these gun stands where it displays the gun standing up by its mag and has that guns manufacturer name carved out in bold letters. It was a really well done display but just made a few as a hobby. He was contacted by a major brand and they said, we can either sue you or hire you. He made some good money working for them.
😆
I’ve mentioned before that I had a graphics company for 10 years pre-Covid so I do have some experience in this area. Bearing in mind, I got out a bit about six years ago now :-
Most “small” graphics companies are not licensed/ do not have permission to use the logos they produce. They may with the small accessories companies but not the main players or MFG’s.
It’s often times very difficult to locate and speak with the correct person relating to getting licensed and it’s very expensive (depending on the company) and there are a lot of requirements you need to be able to meet.
Anytime you produce any logo whatsoever without seeking approval of the owner of that logo you are effectively breaking copyright trademark law.
I became very friendly with one of the trademark lawyers at Honda and she was very helpful in educating us on the whole process of becoming licensed, why they have to defend the use of their logo, etc. etc..
In fact, she helped us realize that we were better off out of the graphics business, and in large part that’s why we wound it down.
if anybody’s got any graphics related questions or whatever I’m always ready to help with any answers just DM me.
And now e bike segments are shit with the cheating motors and lack of class 1 actually being class 1. Strava is a joke anyway. Obscure segments, trail changes don't make the prior segment obsolete, pelotons on the road etc etc. Compare yourself to yourself and your buddies who aren't cheating and it's great.
I would estimate it at about 50%. Some graphics companies just slap logos on and get away with it until someone notices. I would imagine that some OEMs take the position that "It's free advertising, so why mess with it?" (And in fact, that was Suzuki Motor America's unofficial position up until someone higher on the chain than I changed his mind in about 2015.)
To answer some other questions I see above:
-Technically, it is the graphics company that is violating the trademark if they produce a RedBull, Chevrolet, or Kawasaki logo without permission. When a single consumer (That's you, Sandberm) pays someone to make a custom, one-off logo, he is simply commissioning an art work. The graphics company is taking the risk and breaking the law by agreeing to make the decals. In one-off cases, it's usually not worth the time and effort to sue. However, if that kit looks great and the company decides to mass-market it, any of the logoed companies can intervene and will usually send a cease-and-desist letter. I can't imagine a world wherein they would come after the guy riding his Kawasaki at Chicken Licks Raceway, and worst case scenario, they could only ask you to remove the graphics. You could tell them to pound sand, too, as far as I can imagine.
-Most companies are protecting the integrity of their logos as well as the quality of their brand. Since Joe Blow Graphics Co. doesn't necessarily have the vector file drawings of the logo and does not know the Pantone colors involved, sometimes the logos can look wonky. (You've probably seen cheap knockoff products that have "iffy" logos.) There is an entire protocol surrounding the usage of the company logo: color, size, exact shape, outlines allowed, which color to use on which color backgrounds, etc.
-Man, Red Bull is CRAZY about their logo. Up until recently, they did not want anyone other than their officially sponsored athletes to have a logo. I remember when my friend Billy Laninovich rode for Red Bull KTM, he was not allowed to give away his worn jerseys or hats - anything with the logo on it. This is the only company I know of that doesn't license their image to help increase brand awareness, and to their credit, they do a great job without any help.
EDIT: Red Bull still only licenses their logo for use on the Factory Edition KTMs and various, tightly-controlled satellite branding. AFAIK, you still have to prove you own an FE before you can buy the part that has that logo on it.
PS - I think Strava now can tell if you're on an e-bike and they DQ your KOM if you're riding one. 😉
If you are sponsored by a company and required to run their logo, do they explicitly grant you license to run their logo? Is that transferable? A sponsored rider will need to request the logos of their sponsors when a printer makes their graphics, but that means the sponsored rider needs transferable rights for that to be legal.
I suspect to strictly meet all the legal requirements is an untenable goal for most shops.
All that aside, Lee Albrecht at MotoConcepts does some great looking artwork. I saw a set of custom Surron graphics he did just yesterday that was outstanding.
Yes, a sponsored rider is implicitly allowed to use the company's logo. I don't know about how the transferability works in the exact legal sense, but I have a strong guess that the sponsor waives any claim against the graphics company in this case.
Paul should worry about the customer satisfaction or at the very little communication from his company for faulty parts his company sells. I thought it it was weird my throttle would stick at times with freshly installed lock on grip set, I come to find out randomly that they had an updated throttle cam for my CRF as the original was poorly manufactured. I Messaged him personally and the company's website with no answers or communication again i found randomly it was a problem. Stickers are low level problems.
The company that owns Ironman has sent people to Kona before to the tattoo shops and done exactly this.
Pit Row
Who remembers Paul Perebinos from the early 2000's Florida moto scene? Nationals and SX. I believe he also did a GP in The Czech Republic because his family is from there originally.
Depending on the company. Sometimes they send the files directly to the graphics shop with a branding guide and terms of use agreement . By using the logo on a set of graphics You are agreeing to the terms of the agreement. Sometimes it will specify that You only have the right to reproduce ONLY for riders that are sponsored by them. And even specify the locations the logos need to go on the bike/gear.
A local team had a deal with the NE Patriots that I did some graphics with Pats logos on them for. I can not remember the exact term , a letter of release or something like that. It was many years ago now. But they gave me a letter that allowed me to print the approved design for the team. And they had to OK the design and wanted to see printed samples as a part of the process. I should look and see if I still have it in my files.
Some aftermarket brands websites will have their logo files available for download and they will allow them to be used as long as You follow the branding guidelines . Branding guidelines generally specify the colors to use and when to use which colors, no modifications to colors,design or proportions are other common ones. SOme show examples of how not to use them and how to. as far as backgrounds and colors go. Some will restrict the use of them in specific ways like not being used on designs with vulgar or sexual explicit artwork, Or with alcohol brands , or other scenarios.
I'll attach an example of a branding guideline.
Didnt it take Renthal nearly a decade to mimic what Odi has produced? But cloth barpads
I think they maybe tried, couldn’t make anything better and then just copied it.
I’ve not really seen anyone rip something off in this way before, usually you can see some DNA in competitor products, but this is like they didn’t think anyone would notice.
Yikes.
I haven't ridden in years but love following the races.
You fellas saying Renthal copied some technology?
To the folks downvoting posts by englishman, Falcon and The last Sasquatch; just because it’s not what you want to hear, it doesn’t make them wrong.
The real problem is that there's a manufactured scarcity for cool vintage looks. I bet if Honda licensed a 96 factory graphic kit for current models they would sell enough to cover the cost every year for the last 20 years, the people that buy these would pay an extra $20 or $40 if it was licensed and high quality.
Kinda my thoughts as well. What an odd thing to get mad about.
their mtb stuff doesn't seem to be all that great. there's some great stuff getting put out by the germans and polish, even fellow Brits at Hope. Renthal...idk.
I own an agency that specializes in branding, and I think the key question is this:
Are the graphics selling because they feature the logo? If so, the seller is profiting from someone else's brand without permission from the logo owner. That's a problem, especially if the logo is already incorporated into the design and the customer isn't adding it themselves.
Likewise, if a company is charging customers to add a logo they don't have permission to use, that's also problematic.
Could it be viewed as "free publicity"? Sure. But brand owners invest significant time and money developing brand standards that govern how their logos, colors, typography, spacing, and orientations are used. Those guidelines exist to protect the integrity and consistency of the brand. Unauthorized use can undermine that effort and create confusion about what is and isn't officially associated with the company.
Think of how Redbull built its brand by protecting it so much that no one could have helmets but athletes; stickers and plastics were absolutely not allowed to be given to fans. No one dared touch RedBull.
The opposite side is Monster, who will give their logo to anyone to plaster it and are really nice with "licensing," as most of the time they will just send an email saying Go for it, no need for paperwork, profit all you want, get it out there.
The full floater!
For the most part people aren’t choosing the graphics because of the small sponsor logos. They are only there so it doesn’t look weird. If they replaced the “RENTHAL” logo with something that looked similar but wasn’t the brand’s exact logo people would still buy it. It would just be kind of weird. Literally nobody is running out to buy these graphics based solely on the bitchin sponsor logos.
This is far from the example someone else gave using NFL logos (which I think is infringement). I think companies like Renthal should appreciate the free advertising they’re getting instead of being butt hurt someone else is making a dollar from a sticker that happens to include their logo. They aren’t competing against each other. I totally get it if someone is making a knock off product, but that isn’t the case here.
Post a reply to: MotoConcepts Paul Perebijnos