Rider illness - new thing?

7/9/2025 4:26am
sandman768 wrote:

Gonna need some more Aussies to fill the gate🦘

TeamGreen wrote:
Ya know…there might be something to all the Epstein-Barr stuff…just make sure you’re getting plenty of this…? 

Ya know…there might be something to all the Epstein-Barr stuff…just make sure you’re getting plenty of this…? 

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Bearuno wrote:
You ever had it, TG ?And, continued to partake of it?If so, you are (quite) different to most 'Mericans.It seems to scare them, or even, make...

You ever had it, TG ?

And, continued to partake of it?

If so, you are (quite) different to most 'Mericans.

It seems to scare them, or even, make them cry.

That said, as my Nan used to say "it tastes like Crushed Ants" , and, she might have had something with that. 

I love it, and I'm one of those lunatics that have it millimeters deep - none of that pathetic thin scrapes over toast that so many wimps go for!

I'm about to have 8 SAOs with Vegemite, while I watch Dopesick  - Vegemite is My OxyContin - well, Vegemite and Caramello Koalas!

The UK eats it too dont they? Maybe not the megemite brand but yeast extract. I saw John Cena trying some in a vid the other day. He wasnt a fan lol

Bearuno
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7/9/2025 5:31am Edited Date/Time 7/9/2025 5:33am
The UK eats it too dont they? Maybe not the megemite brand but yeast extract. I saw John Cena trying some in a vid the other...

The UK eats it too dont they? Maybe not the megemite brand but yeast extract. I saw John Cena trying some in a vid the other day. He wasnt a fan lol

The Poms have Marmite 😖.

Horrible stuff.............  but Vegemite, is the Ne Plus Ultra of 'Yeast Extracts'

Though, when you give thought to "Yeast Extracts", it makes one think : We Aussies are a Weird Mob! ***

 Like, 'Yeast Extract' will be  Yummy - who the hell thought  that ????

But, since so many  kids were, and are, still brought up on it, it remains a bit of a staple here - seems near on each generation  of immigrant influx that comes here, takes it up, as well as introducing their great cuisines - thank goodness. 

Vegemite is, The Food Of The Gods! : That, plus Tim Tams, Caramello Koalas, and Snakes Alive. 

No wonder I became a bloody Diabetic - though, somehow,  didn't 'acquire' it  until I was 63.......

*** There's a great old (short) Book and a  Movie, called 'They're a Weird Mob' written by, supposedly, at the time, an Italian by the name of Nino Culotta - but  really, by John O'Grady, from NSW. It deals with the weirdness encountered by an immigrant coming to Oz in the 50s, and it's a Classic - the book written in the 50s, the Movie made in 1966.

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JazzyJJ
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7/9/2025 10:04am
Spike33 wrote:
Call me an idiot but here is the issue: All these trainers, managers and riders are trying emulate what past racers did that experienced great success. But...

Call me an idiot but here is the issue: 

All these trainers, managers and riders are trying emulate what past racers did that experienced great success. But they are forgetting these riders were pumped to the gills with PEDs. The grind and training is too much for natural athletes. 

JazzyJJ wrote:
Please name prior riders that were "pumped to the gills" in comparison to the current flock. My guess is that PEDS came on the scene in...

Please name prior riders that were "pumped to the gills" in comparison to the current flock. My guess is that PEDS came on the scene in the 90s, when they did in most sports, and are likely still around today. I don't see any evidence that the usage has swung wildly one way or another. 

wildbill wrote:

When RC got svelte. 

Great, not trying to argue if he was or wasn't on shit, just that he wasn't on anything super compared to the current flock IMO 

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Moto Nomad
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7/9/2025 2:19pm

The season is too long with too many races. Throw in travel and training and these guys are pushing themselves to the limit for most of the year. It's too much IMO.

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The Shop

Kawboy14!
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7/9/2025 7:10pm

NO…..ever since leprosy 4000 years ago…..people have been getting sick

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T-MAC
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7/9/2025 7:22pm Edited Date/Time 7/9/2025 7:53pm

Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back in the day, if your body isn't training your brain is probably working overtime still. Recovery needs to be taken seriously, and it's a complete picture not just physically. 

Sitting on the couch while scrolling or posting on Instagram doesn't actually help you slow down and recover. While you're recovering you're watching all sorts of content or your competitors training or riding hard.

Body Brain connection is powerful.

 

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Kenny Banyan
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7/9/2025 7:39pm
danzar wrote:
I really don't remember a lot of riders missing rounds due to illness. There was always the random drop out for heat related issues during hot...

I really don't remember a lot of riders missing rounds due to illness. There was always the random drop out for heat related issues during hot races but it seems like so many guys are getting sick and missing races these days.

I have to agree. Riders have always gotten sick , but it definitely seems like a noticeable up tic the last few years. Maybe these guys are over training and their resistance is down because of it. Maybe we’re seeing it more than before because all these riders are training like savages. Maybe if they’re training more on the bike than they ever have before ,the extra dust might having something to do with it. Who knows, but I do agree 💯

truck
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Fantasy
7/9/2025 7:58pm Edited Date/Time 7/9/2025 8:01pm

Anyone catch Mosiman on pulp talking about doing his own thing for training being a deal breaker for him when he signed? He said he wanted to use people who are educated and can answer his questions. Insane that this is controversial for a professional sport but for this one it is. The main guy they all go to for everything is a chiropractor working well outside his scope of practice.... 

31 races with the way these guys train is just too much. There's not another sport that's this physically demanding that requires their athletes to compete this often and always on the road. 

One thing I'm surprised more guys don't do is fly private. I know it's expensive but so many guys in Florida you'd think they'd pool resources and make it happen. Fewer nights in hotels, skip the airport, more meals at home, etc would all help with overall health a lot. 

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7/9/2025 9:35pm

Professional international rugby players pretty much play year round depending on what leagues and tournaments they play in.  Some of the guys play their international schedule from July through Nov then also play 7s from December through May.  Travel all over the world. Meet fans all the time.   Beat the piss out of each other in games and train like insane MF'ers.  I know we like to think SX and MX is tough training (not saying it isn't), but I played Rugby in college and the training was brutal.  I played on our collegiate team and the club team, and the club team had local military guys, mostly special forces.  Easily the best shape of my life.  People think soccer players are in shape.  Lol.  Try sprinting from pile of bodies to pile of bodies going from aerobic to anaerobic while beating the piss out of people for (2) 40 minute halves plus injury time, continuous play.  Those guys don't get sick with EBV, etc.  Want to talk about tough, some people have no idea what tough is.

They do drink alcohol periodically and they also eat carbs.

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7/9/2025 9:45pm
T-MAC wrote:
Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back...

Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back in the day, if your body isn't training your brain is probably working overtime still. Recovery needs to be taken seriously, and it's a complete picture not just physically. 

Sitting on the couch while scrolling or posting on Instagram doesn't actually help you slow down and recover. While you're recovering you're watching all sorts of content or your competitors training or riding hard.

Body Brain connection is powerful.

 

It would be interesting to see how much more energy it took to race a moto on a 2stroke 250 vs 4 stroke 450

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T-MAC
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7/9/2025 9:53pm Edited Date/Time 7/9/2025 9:59pm
motokiwi wrote:

It would be interesting to see how much more energy it took to race a moto on a 2stroke 250 vs 4 stroke 450

Agreed. I also think two strokes made you want to flow a track better, and didn't create as bad of braking or acceleration chop. Four stroke stuff is point and shoot. I think tracks get way rougher now, and they also cut them so damn deep...Keep dilla grass haha!

Coupled with more racing, more travel, more effort and energy in social media presence, etc. It all adds up. More energy and effort on and off the track, and racing almost year round here.

I'm still a two stroke fella but I ride for fun!

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Metisse
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7/10/2025 8:18pm
TeamGreen wrote:

When did Epstein-Barr start becoming a common thing in our sport…

2008? 

Metisse wrote:
Prior to ~2001, recurrent ebv wasn't believed by most physicians to occur; if a person contracted mono, it was believed they could not get mono again...

Prior to ~2001, recurrent ebv wasn't believed by most physicians to occur; if a person contracted mono, it was believed they could not get mono again, and many people who told their doctors that "they felt like they have mono again" were disregarded - often they were told to seek professional counseling.  Some cases of cfs (chronic fatigue syndrome, sometimes called "Yuppie Flu" years ago) may have been recurrent/chronic ebv.  95% of the population tests + for ebv, and many people are exposed to it as young children, most without any symptoms; the primary test used for diagnosing ebv doesn't distinguish between prior infection, new infection, and recurrent infection.  A mega-study published in 2022 (tracking 10 million US military personnel over 20 years) linked ebv infection and ms (there were a few publications linking them going back 40 years, but they were small studies in comparison).   Many doctors/health care professionals (and trainers) began to take chronic/recurrent ebv seriously around 2010; the mega-study has resulted in more hcp's testing patients for ebv.  The only "cure" for ebv (resulting in a negative test result for a person previously testing +) afaik is a bone marrow transplant, with a cure-rate of ~25%, and generally not covered by insurance.  EBV's relationship with other diseases is unclear.  "More studies needed" genuinely applies with ebv.  Whether chronic/recurrent ebv is causing problems for many, or even for any, is debatable; that it does occur is much more certain.  Whether some trainers/physicians/hcps "suggest" recurrent ebv as a means to "recurrent" (and costly) treatments, including the sales of their own special "secret-ingredient" supplements..., well, be wary.  And remember, in the US, supplements aren't required to actually do anything.

(I'm not a diagnostic hcp; if I've stated anything that is wrong or needs to be updated, please correct me.  Ebv is not my field of study.  Apol for not providing refs - however, I checked the Wiki page for ebv AFTER writing this, and it's quite good, with refs, and I recommend it for anyone looking for more info.)

Newsweek.com published a story on EBV and its relationship to other illnesses today, July 10.  It is titled "Common Virus Found To Increase Cancer Risk," authored by Jasmine Laws; the article discusses EBV reactivation, and some recent research.  (Link won't post, apologies...)  "... when your immune system is challenged...  you're likely to see reactivation of EBV"  Dr. Henry Balfour Jr.  If you seem to "catch a cold" around tax time, during final exam week, when grant proposals are due, etc., (or, for some people, shortly AFTER a stressful time) you may be experiencing EBV reactivation.  

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TG130
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7/10/2025 9:32pm

Any of you old timers out there remember Brian Myerscough and his health related issues ? I think it was hypoglycemia. I don't think they had the   treatment down as well back then and it really derailed his career.

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Metisse
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7/11/2025 7:27am
TG130 wrote:
Any of you old timers out there remember Brian Myerscough and his health related issues ? I think it was hypoglycemia. I don't think they had...

Any of you old timers out there remember Brian Myerscough and his health related issues ? I think it was hypoglycemia. I don't think they had the   treatment down as well back then and it really derailed his career.

It was hypoglycemia.  It can result in vision problems (blurring, "double-vision,") and "brain-fog" when blood sugar levels crash, esp during intense activity.  Affordable otc blood glucose monitors provide an easy way to check it.  Treatment is tricky - needs to be individualized  to avoid pogoing blood sugar levels.  (Eating candy before a long moto might not be helpful for everyone.)  It's best to find an endocrinologist who works with long-distance runners/cyclists if you suspect that it is happening to you while riding. A good indicator is having sleep-issues, such as waking with night-sweats after 3-5 hours of sleep.

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Flatliner
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7/11/2025 7:35am
T-MAC wrote:
Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back...

Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back in the day, if your body isn't training your brain is probably working overtime still. Recovery needs to be taken seriously, and it's a complete picture not just physically. 

Sitting on the couch while scrolling or posting on Instagram doesn't actually help you slow down and recover. While you're recovering you're watching all sorts of content or your competitors training or riding hard.

Body Brain connection is powerful.

 

No they don't.  There's more accessible diet and training knowledge than ever before.  The teams have more resources now than at any point, ever.

You just said they can't decompress and recover because of social media,  wow.

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7/11/2025 8:12am
T-MAC wrote:
Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back...

Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back in the day, if your body isn't training your brain is probably working overtime still. Recovery needs to be taken seriously, and it's a complete picture not just physically. 

Sitting on the couch while scrolling or posting on Instagram doesn't actually help you slow down and recover. While you're recovering you're watching all sorts of content or your competitors training or riding hard.

Body Brain connection is powerful.

 

Flatliner wrote:
No they don't.  There's more accessible diet and training knowledge than ever before.  The teams have more resources now than at any point, ever.You just said...

No they don't.  There's more accessible diet and training knowledge than ever before.  The teams have more resources now than at any point, ever.

You just said they can't decompress and recover because of social media,  wow.

You think so ? I saw a vid of Hunter laying on the floor . Jett grabbed his foot & was pulling snapping his leg out of his hip.  They said they didn’t hv a trainer there .  They where in a workout room .  I deal with extreme fatigue 23-43 hrs 7 days a week for months straight . I ask for a iv or a system booster the dr acts like I she never heard of fatigue.  So you can be on your own.  The biggest entertainers get that , to keep the show going on world tours .  

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Flatliner
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7/11/2025 8:39am
T-MAC wrote:
Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back...

Riders nowadays have it much harder. Social media is toxic, and Instagram has us all scrolling constantly. Riders can never really decompress and recover like back in the day, if your body isn't training your brain is probably working overtime still. Recovery needs to be taken seriously, and it's a complete picture not just physically. 

Sitting on the couch while scrolling or posting on Instagram doesn't actually help you slow down and recover. While you're recovering you're watching all sorts of content or your competitors training or riding hard.

Body Brain connection is powerful.

 

Flatliner wrote:
No they don't.  There's more accessible diet and training knowledge than ever before.  The teams have more resources now than at any point, ever.You just said...

No they don't.  There's more accessible diet and training knowledge than ever before.  The teams have more resources now than at any point, ever.

You just said they can't decompress and recover because of social media,  wow.

You think so ? I saw a vid of Hunter laying on the floor . Jett grabbed his foot & was pulling snapping his leg out...

You think so ? I saw a vid of Hunter laying on the floor . Jett grabbed his foot & was pulling snapping his leg out of his hip.  They said they didn’t hv a trainer there .  They where in a workout room .  I deal with extreme fatigue 23-43 hrs 7 days a week for months straight . I ask for a iv or a system booster the dr acts like I she never heard of fatigue.  So you can be on your own.  The biggest entertainers get that , to keep the show going on world tours .  

In the case of jett and hunter,  they make millions per year.   Not investing in themselves with a trainer and or a nutrition expert would be short sighted.  The boys are young and fit....  but longevity is still a thing.

Star has an in house trainer.  KTM group does as well.  I suppose its up to any given rider weather they trust said trainer(s).

In your case,  getting a full blood panel should happen.  What's your iron at, your testosterone.   Many , many markers you can use to feel better.

 

Mitch payton used to buy guys running shoes and tell them they were out of shape.  A vo2 max was about the only test available (or known of at the time)  It's not harder now than it was then.

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GG121
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7/11/2025 8:46am

Third year of Supermotocross, the season is just too long. The GP guys look healthier because they don’t have supercross. Our guys look beat down and unhealthy. 

On a side, I wonder how often these illnesses are weird bacterial things or lung infections from breathing dust and dirt on a daily basis. 

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7/11/2025 9:23am
Flatliner wrote:
No they don't.  There's more accessible diet and training knowledge than ever before.  The teams have more resources now than at any point, ever.You just said...

No they don't.  There's more accessible diet and training knowledge than ever before.  The teams have more resources now than at any point, ever.

You just said they can't decompress and recover because of social media,  wow.

You think so ? I saw a vid of Hunter laying on the floor . Jett grabbed his foot & was pulling snapping his leg out...

You think so ? I saw a vid of Hunter laying on the floor . Jett grabbed his foot & was pulling snapping his leg out of his hip.  They said they didn’t hv a trainer there .  They where in a workout room .  I deal with extreme fatigue 23-43 hrs 7 days a week for months straight . I ask for a iv or a system booster the dr acts like I she never heard of fatigue.  So you can be on your own.  The biggest entertainers get that , to keep the show going on world tours .  

Flatliner wrote:
In the case of jett and hunter,  they make millions per year.   Not investing in themselves with a trainer and or a nutrition expert would...

In the case of jett and hunter,  they make millions per year.   Not investing in themselves with a trainer and or a nutrition expert would be short sighted.  The boys are young and fit....  but longevity is still a thing.

Star has an in house trainer.  KTM group does as well.  I suppose its up to any given rider weather they trust said trainer(s).

In your case,  getting a full blood panel should happen.  What's your iron at, your testosterone.   Many , many markers you can use to feel better.

 

Mitch payton used to buy guys running shoes and tell them they were out of shape.  A vo2 max was about the only test available (or known of at the time)  It's not harder now than it was then.

I had 2 big viles  of blood drawn for the 50+ test.  They don’t test for a lot of stuff tho like testosterone etc. Thousands of men in trucking die every yr from extreme exhaustion dr,s don’t want to deal with ya . I had a pal at a tanker co collapse dead when he walked in the Waffle House in Carlisle ,Pa.  EST 3 million lbs of odd freight dragged out my hand in 260 degree trailers , trucks r more physical than jackhammering.  The 3 hospital networks here are a joke here , blown acL & they say you pulled muscles in your leg.  I,m in a battle trying to heal & fight death fatigue now.  Gone since 88 trying to catch up too. 

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Pop Shmoke
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7/11/2025 10:15am

Overtraining

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T-MAC
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7/11/2025 2:09pm
Flatliner wrote:
In the case of jett and hunter,  they make millions per year.   Not investing in themselves with a trainer and or a nutrition expert would...

In the case of jett and hunter,  they make millions per year.   Not investing in themselves with a trainer and or a nutrition expert would be short sighted.  The boys are young and fit....  but longevity is still a thing.

Star has an in house trainer.  KTM group does as well.  I suppose its up to any given rider weather they trust said trainer(s).

In your case,  getting a full blood panel should happen.  What's your iron at, your testosterone.   Many , many markers you can use to feel better.

 

Mitch payton used to buy guys running shoes and tell them they were out of shape.  A vo2 max was about the only test available (or known of at the time)  It's not harder now than it was then.

Agreed if you have the money you should invest in yourself. These teams invest in trainers, like Aldon. His recipe worked with Ricky and others, but those guys also wrapped up and burned out early. I guess it also depends on what your goals are. Aldon himself hasn't ridden moto at a high level, he seems to turn riders into super lean road cyclists - not sure this is the best approach for moto? And not all the guys want to play the funny game of blood doping or whatever else may be going on behind the scenes to speed up recovery.

Training programs should not be one size fits all - every individual is different. And I mean beyond adjusting weight and reps.

Don't assume all trainers, medical professionals, or doctors are all excellent. Like any profession, there is good, ok, and bad. Our fringe sport does not really pull the best as the money is not there. I think surgeons enjoy our sport because they get to work on young athletic guys with gnarly injuries that are engaging for them to repair and learn from.

There is also a lot of trainers in this sport that aren't as qualified as we all believe they are. I think some of the better trainers are ex pro riders themselves, that have developed a healthy natural protocol.

The guys are traveling way more than ever, a lot more exposure to all sorts of stuff. And yes - it is hard to believe, but the keeping up with the Jones's effect online is much more significant than the Jones's next door of yesteryear. It takes a major toll on youth today.

Back in RC days you rode hard, trained hard, and got to recover without having to worry about media nearly as much as riders do now. Nowadays everyone is always on. Your social media platform/presence is arguably more important than race results (as much as this pains me to say personally). It adds a new element of stress that riders of previous generations did not have to deal with.

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T-MAC
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7/11/2025 2:11pm Edited Date/Time 7/11/2025 2:25pm
Metisse wrote:
Newsweek.com published a story on EBV and its relationship to other illnesses today, July 10.  It is titled "Common Virus Found To Increase Cancer Risk," authored...

Newsweek.com published a story on EBV and its relationship to other illnesses today, July 10.  It is titled "Common Virus Found To Increase Cancer Risk," authored by Jasmine Laws; the article discusses EBV reactivation, and some recent research.  (Link won't post, apologies...)  "... when your immune system is challenged...  you're likely to see reactivation of EBV"  Dr. Henry Balfour Jr.  If you seem to "catch a cold" around tax time, during final exam week, when grant proposals are due, etc., (or, for some people, shortly AFTER a stressful time) you may be experiencing EBV reactivation.  

Nice find. I bet the heart rate variability score of riders today is through the roof...They ping between extremes to find a happy medium, but this is not letting your body actually find a happy homeostasis, though it may appear so on the outside. Rest is a hugely important part of recovery. And recovery is more modified than ever to speed it up and minimize downtime - less natural than ever in my opinion.

This is the perfect recipe to blow your wad early. Not a coincidence you see more younger endurance athletes dying of heart failure in their  30s nowadays. We have more resources and knowledge and humans love to push things to the limit.

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7/11/2025 3:44pm

Jumping to conclusions maybe? Can’t this just be an outlier statistically and next year no one is sick.

Herr Lich
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7/11/2025 4:31pm
TbonesPop wrote:
Professional international rugby players pretty much play year round depending on what leagues and tournaments they play in.  Some of the guys play their international schedule...

Professional international rugby players pretty much play year round depending on what leagues and tournaments they play in.  Some of the guys play their international schedule from July through Nov then also play 7s from December through May.  Travel all over the world. Meet fans all the time.   Beat the piss out of each other in games and train like insane MF'ers.  I know we like to think SX and MX is tough training (not saying it isn't), but I played Rugby in college and the training was brutal.  I played on our collegiate team and the club team, and the club team had local military guys, mostly special forces.  Easily the best shape of my life.  People think soccer players are in shape.  Lol.  Try sprinting from pile of bodies to pile of bodies going from aerobic to anaerobic while beating the piss out of people for (2) 40 minute halves plus injury time, continuous play.  Those guys don't get sick with EBV, etc.  Want to talk about tough, some people have no idea what tough is.

They do drink alcohol periodically and they also eat carbs.

Agreed. But there has also been a lot of criticism in rugby circles - especially in New Zealand - about the ever expanding number of games they're required to play. It's definitely having an impact on player injuries and recovery times. 

But you see this push in every professional sport to put on more and more events to feed the TV/Internet beast. Not only is it unsustainable for the athletes it causes burnout in the fans. Having less events actually produces more anticipation and excitement, and therefore viewers. 

In terms of moto it should be: 12 SX, 12 MX, and 3 SMX. 

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