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So the main take away is newer chassis are too stiff now?
Keefer: your memory didn't fail you regarding how good the bike is but it definitely let you down concerning the little lever above the clutch - that would be a hot start lever, NOT a compression release.😄 I know, it comes with getting old, right?
Stiffness: one of the casualties of the production rule. Hard to make a platform for top pros on SX tracks and MX tracks that resemble SX tracks that also works for the average Joe.
And this opinion isn't surprising to a lot of people. One of the benefits of having a decent sized collection that spans 40 years is that you don't have to rely on looking back through rose-colored glasses; you know what they're really like and the truth is that they haven't constantly improved over the last 40+ years since the evolution revolution of the early '80s. There has been refinement, not redifinement in most areas, and in a number of cases the bikes have regressed and take years to come back to the point where they are improving again.
You would be correct sir. My fault. Got a little too excited. As soon as I said it, I meant to go back and say hot start. I just forgot to edit that part out. The Racer X video has more info than this vid and all the riding/beauty/action shots. This was just a little taste. Was such a fun test to do and very eye opening. Fortunate that Zeb allowed me to take his machine and Jim Haeseker for refurbing (0.5 hours to start but he went through complete bike), it truly is beautiful. I would love to continue to do more of these types of tests as it’s a little different and interesting to me so I would think it’s interesting to most of you.
When will the RacerX video be out?
Looking forward to that and hopefully more of these types of videos
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That should be live tomorrow morning hopefully.
That pic with the RMZ… I think that was the best era of Pala layouts. There used to be a super fun over-sized roller section where you could ski jump into it. I wish they’d bring back the “old school” layouts
Interesting thread what would you guys say an 08 CRF450 with 490 big bore kit is worth? I have no idea. Including the stock 450 jug and bbl, stg2 web cam, heavy steahly flywheel, mild port job, fmf full mega bomb, Boysen XWing, RD Powerbowl on a perfectly jetted carb, a LoudMouth intake, linkage pull rod, valved for a 50 exp motocross and is still a verified holeshot monster that is super easy to ride. Wonder if I should sell it, put it in a museum, or keep racing it. Valves in spec, fresh top end recently, only 300 hrs plus or minus 400 or so before hr meter installed
For those of us who grew up on XR75s they sure as hell will. Great memories as a 13 yo kicking over one of those the first time after rebuilding it myself and hear it purr, when I finally got a YZ100 changing top ends was a breeze, but I finally switched back to 4T’s in 2004 and forgot how much I liked working with valves, cams, buckets and shims
Awesome video and idea Kris. Fantastic content.
Wow I never knew! Thanks!
https://motocrossactionmag.com/2008-honda-crf450r-unveiled/
What a score. An eessentially brand new '07
That is one nice looking bike. 08 special edition. ✅🏁
Kris - Just bustin' your chops, sir. I've got several years on you, so I'm lucky if I don't confuse the brake and the clutch.😄
Question: you mentioned "front tire contact feel when leaning" in your review. One of the things I noticed early on in the evolution of the 4Ts was how the manufacturers seemed to be taking weight off the front end in an effort to make them feel lighter but at the expense of front end bite and "contact feel" that you mentioned. It's the primary reason I could never get 100% comfortable on my '03 CRF450 - the front end always felt vague (especially compared to my '03 YZ450) and never planted, especially on hard pack (red clay with dust was the worst). I could hit a corner several times in a row and be fine and then it would unexpectedly push/wash on me and ruin my confidence in it. When Honda revised the chassis for the '05-'08 models, it felt like they got the balance right between front end feel and the lighter feel when leaning it side to side (roll).
Your thoughts?
And it's also interesting that Honda resisted making a monster 450 engine for years, insisting the smoother engine was better for lap times and less tiring, but the mags hammered on how they were 5 HP down, blah, blah, blah, so they built a beast for the masses... and now we hear how it's too strong (like the latest YZF) for most people and they try to tame it. Sometimes more isn't better?
Test ideas - the '93 CR250 (forks sucked) but would love hear your thoughts on its handling when equipped with good legs... and also one of the original Full Floaters and the performance of that rear suspension now that we've had 40+ years of development to compare it to.
Great job and thanks for putting out this sort of stuff. 👍
Don't forget, when the YZ400F first came out the bike was applying so much more pressure on the front, especially with the massive engine braking. The tires of the day that were designed for 2-strokes were wearing quickly and irregularly, getting angled, feathered knobs if you rode on hard pack. Dunlop designed a 4-stroke specific front tire for a time. I believe it was the K490F-A.
Yeah, almost like the wear you see on the front tires of the wheelie-boys street ridden bikes.
I had the original YZ4F in '98 and it was also a top heavy beast to go along with that planted front end (and IIRC, that K490F-A wasn't exactly great, but I could be confusing it with another Dunlop; seems like it had stiffer sidewalls). But you're right, it was like a car with a bad front end alignment grinding down the tires. My '03 YZ450 was a huge improvement over it and it had a noticeably more planted feeling (and confidence inspiring) front end compared to my '03 CRF450, regardless of tires, set-up, etc., but the CRF had lighter-feeling steering (and the seat was much kinder to my tush than the YZF 😄). It just seemed like a lot of the early thumpers were trading front end traction and feel for lighter feeling steering - probably to lessen the disparity compared to 2Ts and not be so tiring to the rider.
Edit: forgot to mention the '06YZ450. I loved that bike - it was so thin and small feeling and the engine was soooo smooth - but it lost the front end traction of the '03. I tried everything to get that front end to bite like the '03 and never could. It felt lighter but lost the front end feel.
I spent more time on my 03 than any bike I owned before or since. Stock, it was loose and wallowed in the front like you said. I spent some time with factory connection team guy getting it dialed and before I switched to the next gen, it was as good as anything I’ve raced since. I still consider it the best turning/suspended bike I’ve ever raced. I could ride it forever without getting tired. I’ve yet to get the same flat turn feeling from anything since the 03. I didn’t put as much effort into setting up my 05 though. I got it to a point where I was fine, and ran it, but it never did everything as well as the 03.
Check your Instagram messages. I sent you something you might be interested in..
Next Gen bikes up to 98 2 strokes are nearly as good as modern 2 strokes. Lap times don't lie. And my 2006 Crf 450 was my first 4 stroke after many years of 2 strokes going back to CZs and Montesas.
I'm glad Keefer did this expose on older bikes. It shows how far we have come, buy not really.
Thanks Mr Keefer!!
Pit Row
I was fortunate to be there yesterday when Kris swung a leg over the 07 and when he stepped off. He was ripping on the track, as usual, and made the 07 look great. The best part was seeing how excited he was when the helmet came off. So many immediate comparisons and reactions. Thanks, Kris
K
Thanks for your feedback
Reed rode Yamahas from 02-08, Suzuki 2009, Kawi 2010, then Honda 2011 on his own team and gathering factory parts for Salt Lake City. No doubt in my mind on your assessment of the bike.
I wonder how many 05-08 era CRF450R's Honda sold? They have to be some of the best selling mx bikes of all time, they are everywhere.
Chad had a stock 08 CRF in his shop and anytime he went to a new team or MFG, he would ride them back to back with the 08 before choosing since he loved it so much. Or so the legend says.
SO Suzuki isn't so crazy for not pushing development after all?
Great video! It's the most entertaining in a while.
Kenny apparently doesn't think so.
I won’t buy a new 4 stroke that doesn’t have a button. I am lazy and I’m proud.
Sorry, it's August - you'll have to wait until June to be proud.😃
Jason Thomas... nothing stock
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