450 Indy Main 16th place on 3 laps plus behind

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In NASCAR you've got to be within a percentage of the leaders pace or you get the black flag. Looks odd to see the 450 leaders at Indy battling for position in the closing laps overtaking riders that are going noticeably slower.

Bob Hannah suggested back in the day if you get lapped, you have to pull off. Glad they didn't make that a rule but would it make sense at 2 minutes left racers that are 3 laps or more down get the checkers? Don't give me the riders will get robbed of track time considering they are already getting more track time with timed mains plus the 450 class has twenty two riders after years of only having twenty.

What do you think about getting riders off the track that have been lapped three times at the end of the race?


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RalphS
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If you're lapped twice you should pull out of the race as you have become a race hazard.
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CPR
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You think lappers are bad now?
Put a rule in place like that and watch guys no longer cooperatively getting out of the leaders way.

It’s bound to happen on tracks like this with such short lap times, guys slow down to get out of the way, miss rhythm sections and the difference in speed is compounded. Before you know it, the leaders are on them again.

Focus should be building tracks with longer times, not creating rules to accommodate arena cross tracks.
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TXDirt
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Only 6 riders on the lead lap. Ridiculous. Black flag these road blocks.
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TXDirt
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Some guys only goal is to make the main. Every race you will see some quit after the start and just coast around for 20 minutes. Get them off the track.
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lumpy790
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3/19/2022 7:29pm
they are all paid by their finishing position so .... pay them how???
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Pay them in the order they were running in when time ran out. Not super complicated.
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CPR
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3/19/2022 7:41pm
TXDirt wrote:
Only 6 riders on the lead lap. Ridiculous. Black flag these road blocks.
In 2005 RC and Reed lapped up to 3rd, you only want the leaders in the race?
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3/19/2022 7:59pm Edited Date/Time 3/19/2022 8:04pm
TXDirt wrote:
Only 6 riders on the lead lap. Ridiculous. Black flag these road blocks.
CPR wrote:
In 2005 RC and Reed lapped up to 3rd, you only want the leaders in the race?
Yes but only for the last two minutes. Might actually add to the drama and help us cross over to mainstream entertainment. We are getting closer with Hulu and Netflix motorsports shows but I won't be happy until there is a 21st century MotoWorld with Dave Despain type show. Imagine a few minutes with only the highlights of various forms of motorcycle racing that's shown before Monday night football or some other stick and ball sport with huge audience.

And by highlights not listing all the finishes but show actually battles that anyone can get excited over. Have you caught the last two laps of a MotoGP race? Beyond exciting.
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nousername
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In NASCAR you've got to be within a percentage of the leaders pace or you get the black flag. Looks odd to see the 450 leaders...
In NASCAR you've got to be within a percentage of the leaders pace or you get the black flag. Looks odd to see the 450 leaders at Indy battling for position in the closing laps overtaking riders that are going noticeably slower.

Bob Hannah suggested back in the day if you get lapped, you have to pull off. Glad they didn't make that a rule but would it make sense at 2 minutes left racers that are 3 laps or more down get the checkers? Don't give me the riders will get robbed of track time considering they are already getting more track time with timed mains plus the 450 class has twenty two riders after years of only having twenty.

What do you think about getting riders off the track that have been lapped three times at the end of the race?


If there going to black flag them it needs to be before 3 laps down or it defeats the purpose as its very rare we see 4 laos down. I think it needs to be 2 laps down.
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JMR1976
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3/19/2022 8:02pm
Imagine if the lap times were longer!
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Racerman967
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3/19/2022 8:09pm
At the 8 minute left mark the riders from 17-22 are locked in and done. That leaves 5fewer riders to navigate.
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3/19/2022 11:29pm
TXDirt wrote:
Only 6 riders on the lead lap. Ridiculous. Black flag these road blocks.
I don't get it when people bitch about 15 riders on the gate in MXGP then bitch about lappers and want them black flagged in a Pro race.....if these lappers got black flagged then I ask how many riders would have finished? 6? 12?

These lappers will most likely lap most of us here on Vital and they are part of the event, filling gates, honing their skills with each passing event. Furthermore, It is part of the skill set of a top tier SX rider to plan his pass on lappers and it adds to the excitement of the race.

Really not looking for a argument with you fellow Vitard Members and I respect each and every opinion or question here but...

....why do some of you keep bringing this up? Would you prefer to have all the privateers removed from the pits/event before hand?

Will the racing be better when privateers are pulled off after spending $$$ on entry fees, hotel, mechanic and traveling to try make a main event?

We will end up with thinned out heat races and no LCQs....the whole damn program will be shortened...no day program, evening program may end up consisting of two main events with half empty gates. Spectators pay the ticket cost and get a couple hours racing with a handful of fast guys....

....meanwhile, the real privateers / lappers will be looking elsewhere for another series to try and get SX racing experience.

I'm not ranting but we need to appreciate these slow guys who are grinding to try and qualify, then more grinding to try and stay on the same lap as the leaders...them more grinding until they get picked up by a team....

Appreciate and thank them and support them where you can because without them our Sport is dead!

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Robgvx
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3/20/2022 1:16am
Just wait until MXGP later today…
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3/20/2022 2:20am
I absolutely disagree that if you're lapped you should pull off, but if you're down 2 or 3 laps, that might be a different story. Being that much slower makes you a danger to others.
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3/20/2022 2:46am
Average lap times of both mains

45.720 = Eli Tomac
45.824 = Justin Barcia
45.906 = Marvin Musquin
46.027 = Chase Sexton
46.031 = Cooper Webb
46.180 = Malcolm Stewart
46.771 = Jason Anderson
47.484 = Dean Wilson
49.374 = Vince Friese
49.603 = Ryan Breece

46.407 = Jett Lawrence
46.662 = Cameron Mcadoo
47.908 = RJ Hampshire
48.004 = Pierce Brown
48.145 = Mitchell Oldenburg
48.520 = Enzo Lopes
49.058 = Kyle Chisholm
49.824 = Jordon Smith
49.862 = Cullin Park
49.940 = Jace Owen
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flarider
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3/20/2022 3:51am
Pay them in the order they were running in when time ran out. Not super complicated.
What happens with something like the "Webb Incident?"

Lappers are still racing, they're just racing other lappers.

Lappers are part of racing
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flarider
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3/20/2022 3:57am
I can picture this in my head, the stadium floor gets more and more empty to where it's only six riders all spread out, each hopping each obstacle effortlessly for the last eight to ten minutes

and a quiet line starts forming to leave
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Max Petro
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3/20/2022 4:02am Edited Date/Time 3/20/2022 4:03am
The king didn’t get 72 wins with lappers pulling off the track, it’s part of racing.
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rob27ma
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3/20/2022 4:18am
How about they reduce the number of riders that qualify for the main down to 15?
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disbanded
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3/20/2022 4:53am
Shit thread, just like the thousands of others before you to post the same dumb thing.
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Mr. Afterbar
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3/20/2022 5:00am
There was a large separation last night due to the difficulty of the ruts. Settle down on canceling all the privateers you bunch of Nancy’s. Can’t see any true fan wanting riders removed from the race. Lapper ruined your favorite riders race? Too bad. I bet Barcia has too, but he’s still out there.
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Brad460
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Last night seemed to be the worst for lappers…while I agree to an extent lappers are part of racing, it looked to me that many of them were just tooling along with no effort.

For example, Bogle has great speed (he led for a bit last week)- why is he rolling around out there getting lapped multiple times?

Maybe it’s black flag if your about to get lapped twice? If your getting lapped 2 or 3X it’s time to re-evaluate your wanna-be career.
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RaceFace58
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3/20/2022 7:12am
CPR wrote:
You think lappers are bad now? Put a rule in place like that and watch guys no longer cooperatively getting out of the leaders way. It’s...
You think lappers are bad now?
Put a rule in place like that and watch guys no longer cooperatively getting out of the leaders way.

It’s bound to happen on tracks like this with such short lap times, guys slow down to get out of the way, miss rhythm sections and the difference in speed is compounded. Before you know it, the leaders are on them again.

Focus should be building tracks with longer times, not creating rules to accommodate arena cross tracks.
Exactly. Your lap times suffer when you’re pulling over 5 times a lap to let guys by. Make this a rule and watch how they won’t even leave the good line when being lapped.
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RaceFace58
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3/20/2022 7:17am
Pay them in the order they were running in when time ran out. Not super complicated.
How about just have them draw poker hands and pay them in the order that works out? It would only be a few hundred difference from 17-22. Same with the points, who cares right?
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Gravel
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3/20/2022 7:23am
RalphS wrote:
If you're lapped twice you should pull out of the race as you have become a race hazard.
Yes, this. We’re talking about professional racing. Race forward, do work, push yourself. I hate seeing riders at the highest level of pro racing out there giving a half assed effort.

Lapped twice should = black flag
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Gravel
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3/20/2022 7:26am
CPR wrote:
You think lappers are bad now? Put a rule in place like that and watch guys no longer cooperatively getting out of the leaders way. It’s...
You think lappers are bad now?
Put a rule in place like that and watch guys no longer cooperatively getting out of the leaders way.

It’s bound to happen on tracks like this with such short lap times, guys slow down to get out of the way, miss rhythm sections and the difference in speed is compounded. Before you know it, the leaders are on them again.

Focus should be building tracks with longer times, not creating rules to accommodate arena cross tracks.
RaceFace58 wrote:
Exactly. Your lap times suffer when you’re pulling over 5 times a lap to let guys by. Make this a rule and watch how they won’t...
Exactly. Your lap times suffer when you’re pulling over 5 times a lap to let guys by. Make this a rule and watch how they won’t even leave the good line when being lapped.
If you’re getting lapped 5 times a lap you’re out of contention and it’s time to pull off.
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3/20/2022 7:31am
or we could take this outrage and direct it at FELD and have them build tracks with a minimum 1m lap time. Buy more dirt. Longer lap times would dramatically cut down on the lappers.
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Bruce372
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3/20/2022 7:53am
Cancel culture!
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TXDirt
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3/20/2022 8:16am Edited Date/Time 3/20/2022 8:34am
Guys start rolling around right after the start. Every race. They quit from the beginning.

///edit

Keep the 450 LCQ and pay winner $2,500. It’s some of the most exciting racing at times.

Make it it’s own thing. Pay the winner or top 3 or whatever. But they don’t go to the main event.

When you have guys literally quit after the gate drops and roll around for 20 minutes make no sense.

Yes, lappers are part of racing. But seeing guys quit after the start and roll around is ridiculous.
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mooch
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3/20/2022 9:21am
or we could take this outrage and direct it at FELD and have them build tracks with a minimum 1m lap time. Buy more dirt. Longer...
or we could take this outrage and direct it at FELD and have them build tracks with a minimum 1m lap time. Buy more dirt. Longer lap times would dramatically cut down on the lappers.
With stadium floors having only so much square footage, how do tracks with longer lap time get built? I'm personally not seeing space being wasted. Only options I see are either running the track up into the stands or outside the stadium, not sure how possible those options are at each venue.
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