Does Gallagher Penalize Webb?

GuyB
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GuyB 3/17/2019 9:09am
3/17/2019 9:09am
WoodsRacer wrote:
You have to be crazy to penalize Webb for this.... But I guess we are dealing with Gallagher here so anything crazy is possible...
But it’s also what the OP is ASKING FOR.

For the record, I think the idea of penalizing him for this is beyond dumb.

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disbanded
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disbanded 3/17/2019 9:10am
3/17/2019 9:10am Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 9:11am
Squirrelings wrote:
It’s a no brainer, but if you have no brain....
Maybe post a thousand more times until we get it
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500guy
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500guy 3/17/2019 9:14am
3/17/2019 9:14am
GuyB wrote:
But it’s also what the OP is ASKING FOR.

For the record, I think the idea of penalizing him for this is beyond dumb.

I think it's worth looking at, He cut across the corner and made the pass.
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JM485
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JM485 3/17/2019 9:16am
3/17/2019 9:16am
The guy jumped over the tough blocks to make the pass, you can't just have guys doing that come on. I don't think he should lose a position, but maybe just dock him a couple seconds to set the precedent that it's not OK to do without screwing with the results this weekend since it made no difference in the grand scheme of the race.
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TropicPilot 3/17/2019 9:19am
3/17/2019 9:19am
To me, this is why a decision needs to be made definitively. Webb did cut underneath this Tuff Block and make the pass. I'm glad I don't have to make the call. It could the difference in a tight championship.

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Tarz483
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Tarz483 3/17/2019 9:29am
3/17/2019 9:29am Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 9:31am
Too Many Lawyers for sure .
Guy lands on a tough block some how doesn't crash comes immediately back onto the track and still makes the corner
.
Ive seen much much bigger track cuts with no penalties.


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Press516
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Press516 3/17/2019 9:31am
3/17/2019 9:31am
It's a tough call... I've watched it 6 times and think that CW should have given the position back and then passed ET again, which I am confident he would have. Since he didn't, I can see the penalty being valid. It's my opinion that he exceeded the track boundaries in the process of passing another rider.
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face biter
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face biter 3/17/2019 9:31am
3/17/2019 9:31am
Rules are best understood and applied if emotion is left out of the situation, regardless of how well Webb recovered from the initial situation ( and in my opinion he did an amazing job of not only saving it, but not actually hitting Tomac ) by continuing the pass at that point in time he did gain an advantage.
It doesn’t matter if someone intentionally breaks a rule or does it unintentionally, rules and consequences are published to help provide a means to regulate an activity.
I would be surprised if the AMA isn’t already reviewing the situation, and would be even more surprised if a protest or two hasn’t been filed or is pending. This may not be a pleasant situation for the riders and teams involved, but learning situations and or rule enforcement aren’t always going to be an enjoyable experience.
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bvm111
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bvm111 3/17/2019 9:34am
3/17/2019 9:34am
How do some of you come up with cut the corner to gain advantage from that?

He clearly lost some control of the motorcycle, probably a cross rut.

He saved not only his ass but Eli’s by stopping as soon as he did, after running over a tuffblock

Eli hesitated and cooper accelerated... it’s a race after all.

Why do you feel you are better equipped to make the call than he race officials? You guys must watch a lot of NCIS and feel there is always a mystery to be solved or something, let it go it’s a complete racing incident and non issues.
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JM485
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JM485 3/17/2019 9:44am
3/17/2019 9:44am
bvm111 wrote:
How do some of you come up with cut the corner to gain advantage from that? He clearly lost some control of the motorcycle, probably a...
How do some of you come up with cut the corner to gain advantage from that?

He clearly lost some control of the motorcycle, probably a cross rut.

He saved not only his ass but Eli’s by stopping as soon as he did, after running over a tuffblock

Eli hesitated and cooper accelerated... it’s a race after all.

Why do you feel you are better equipped to make the call than he race officials? You guys must watch a lot of NCIS and feel there is always a mystery to be solved or something, let it go it’s a complete racing incident and non issues.
It's obvious he didn't mean to do it, I don't think anyone is arguing that, it's the point that he jumped over the tough blocks and got way more inside of Tomac than he ever could have staying within the track boundaries. If you let this go then it becomes acceptable to jump way inside like that to make a pass. Like I said before, just dock him a couple seconds to set the precedent but not alter the race results, it was a non-issue in the overall outcome of the race so no need to dock positions or anything like that.
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ruy
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ruy 3/17/2019 9:45am
3/17/2019 9:45am
Penalty and title for Tomac, maybe is the only way he get the title.
And Webb don´t do it again or you go to the jail
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mxridr
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mxridr 3/17/2019 9:47am
3/17/2019 9:47am
This is clear as day. He cut the track and made a pass in doing so. Dock a position.
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NewOldSchool
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NewOldSchool 3/17/2019 9:52am
3/17/2019 9:52am
Webb didn’t mean to cut part of the corner, it’s always an accident when a rider goes off the track but that’s not the question the question is did he gain an advantage? When I first saw it I didn’t think anything was wrong with it but after reading the thread and rewatching today I do get the other side of the argument. I think this will be a tough decision for the powers that be.
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tingo
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tingo 3/17/2019 9:54am
3/17/2019 9:54am Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 9:58am
WoodsRacer wrote:
You have to be crazy to penalize Webb for this.... But I guess we are dealing with Gallagher here so anything crazy is possible...
GuyB wrote:
But it’s also what the OP is ASKING FOR.

For the record, I think the idea of penalizing him for this is beyond dumb.

Shocker that the other thread was clipped. The concept of a rider making a mistake, benefiting from it and being penalized for it is not beyond dumb, and I’m not crazy. I’m just a fan of enforcing the rules; this is a professional sport. Full disclosure, I do like Tomac more than Webb, but I’m also mature and rational enough that if the roles were reversed, I’d full support Tomac being penalized. Webb didn’t mean to pass Tomac in the crazy fashion he did, but he still did, and it’s against the rules. Feld may run this show, but that doesn’t mean it should be a circus.
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Zesiger 112
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Zesiger 112 3/17/2019 10:05am
3/17/2019 10:05am
Dock him the position, he will still be in points lead by a mile
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KHI Guy
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KHI Guy 3/17/2019 10:08am
3/17/2019 10:08am
At least nobody is claiming that he rode backward on the track and should be DQ'ed......yet. Blink
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Johnny Lock 3/17/2019 10:14am
3/17/2019 10:14am
Kawi15 wrote:
We have too many lawyers about. I guess I am just old and gray, but I can hardly believe that anybody thinks that Webb cut the...
We have too many lawyers about. I guess I am just old and gray, but I can hardly believe that anybody thinks that Webb cut the track.
My first thought when I started reading this thread too.
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mac3-d
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mac3-d 3/17/2019 10:22am
3/17/2019 10:22am
If Kawi doesn't protest does the AMA do anything or do they need prompting ?

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dimetime
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dimetime 3/17/2019 10:26am
3/17/2019 10:26am
WoodsRacer wrote:
You have to be crazy to penalize Webb for this.... But I guess we are dealing with Gallagher here so anything crazy is possible...
GuyB wrote:
But it’s also what the OP is ASKING FOR.

For the record, I think the idea of penalizing him for this is beyond dumb.

You and every reasonable, intellectually honest person agrees.

Vital argues over some incredibly dumb shit but honestly this is beyond stupid.

This has been fascinating and yet awful to watch. Some of you people are so blinded by bias l wouldn't listen to your opinion about literally anything.
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500guy
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500guy 3/17/2019 10:29am
3/17/2019 10:29am
mac3-d wrote:
If Kawi doesn't protest does the AMA do anything or do they need prompting ?
Nobody protested or it would already be reported, I think you only have like 1-2 hrs after the event to protest.

The results are final , nothing to argue about.
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URNSO2
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URNSO2 3/17/2019 10:44am
3/17/2019 10:44am
It’s simply a question of did Webb leave the track and if so did his entry back onto it give him an advantage. That’s how the rules are written.

The answer to this is based on what are the boundaries of the race track. It’s kind of like an out of bounds call in football but the call is or isn’t made until after the race.

People should be able to discuss this without personal attacks, getting emotional or getting political.

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Racer_Twentynine 3/17/2019 10:47am
3/17/2019 10:47am
I think a penalty needs to be issued to prevent riders from attempting passes like this in the future. We have sennit a few times already this year where a rider is able to chase someone down but not make the pass. With Webb pulling this off accident or not i could see others using this as a tactic when they cant make a pass. Not necessarily landing on a tough block but cutting a corner like that to make a pass.
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akillerwombat
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akillerwombat 3/17/2019 10:53am
3/17/2019 10:53am Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 10:55am
Racer_Twentynine wrote:
I think a penalty needs to be issued to prevent riders from attempting passes like this in the future. We have sennit a few times already...
I think a penalty needs to be issued to prevent riders from attempting passes like this in the future. We have sennit a few times already this year where a rider is able to chase someone down but not make the pass. With Webb pulling this off accident or not i could see others using this as a tactic when they cant make a pass. Not necessarily landing on a tough block but cutting a corner like that to make a pass.
Then why not issue the penalty when the first person uses this "don't crash by completely going over the tough block" pass method?

Clearly we can all agree it was a mistake and not a planned move.

This sport has enough big calls that are fucked up, let's focus on those first because Webb saved it and managed to do it without hitting Tomac. I say we let that shit slide.
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agn5009
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agn5009 3/17/2019 10:55am
3/17/2019 10:55am
Racer_Twentynine wrote:
I think a penalty needs to be issued to prevent riders from attempting passes like this in the future. We have sennit a few times already...
I think a penalty needs to be issued to prevent riders from attempting passes like this in the future. We have sennit a few times already this year where a rider is able to chase someone down but not make the pass. With Webb pulling this off accident or not i could see others using this as a tactic when they cant make a pass. Not necessarily landing on a tough block but cutting a corner like that to make a pass.
Nobody (except a few people here apparently) is dumb enough to try a move like that on purpose. 9 times out of 10 that ends in a disaster
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dimetime
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dimetime 3/17/2019 10:58am
3/17/2019 10:58am
All you guys just need to stop. It's now gotten embarrassing.

I know you all think you're the next Einstien but so sorry, sadly none of your are.

Just realize your entire premise of "track cutting" is just your immature bias and it means nothing.

There was no track cutting, so all your bent over backwards attempts to make so only exist in your minds. Knock it off.
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aeffertz
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aeffertz 3/17/2019 11:07am
3/17/2019 11:07am Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 11:12am
To the people saying "He should have entered back onto the track where he left", he couldn't have entered the track any sooner or safer than he did. He clips the landing with the rear tire and then lands on top of the tuff block, one wheel inside the block, one wheel outside of the block and then locks up his brakes.

To the people saying, he wouldn't have made the turn if Eli wasn't there, they never even made contact. Tomac thought he was going to get stuffed, so he gave the position up to Webb. Did he gain an advantage by almost crashing and missing the one tuff block? No, had he been two feet to the right like he was planning, the block pass would still be there. This was slower than landing clean on the other side of the tuff block he missed. I see no reason to penalize this.










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Track and Trail 3/17/2019 11:14am
3/17/2019 11:14am
Apparently Webb is a hero for saving it, making the corner, and not hitting Tomac instead of a cheater for making a pass after he knew he cut the track. He likely didn’t mean to cheat when he was in the air, but he sure as hell knew he was cheating when he hit the throttle and motored away from Tomac. He knew he cut. Passed anyway. Knowingly cheated. I dgaf about Tomac either.

If I were a jumpy guy like Bagget, I’d take these notes in blood. Next chance to cut a corner for a pass I’m sending it.

If you morans don’t see how letting this slide opens the door for more questionable passes, you can’t be helped.
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face biter
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face biter 3/17/2019 11:23am
3/17/2019 11:23am
aeffertz wrote:
To the people saying "He should have entered back onto the track where he left", he couldn't have entered the track any sooner or safer than...
To the people saying "He should have entered back onto the track where he left", he couldn't have entered the track any sooner or safer than he did. He clips the landing with the rear tire and then lands on top of the tuff block, one wheel inside the block, one wheel outside of the block and then locks up his brakes.

To the people saying, he wouldn't have made the turn if Eli wasn't there, they never even made contact. Tomac thought he was going to get stuffed, so he gave the position up to Webb. Did he gain an advantage by almost crashing and missing the one tuff block? No, had he been two feet to the right like he was planning, the block pass would still be there. This was slower than landing clean on the other side of the tuff block he missed. I see no reason to penalize this.










The last three pictures illustrate how he benefited from his off course excursion by making a pass while Tomac was not yet in a position to get on the gas very hard without putting himself on the ground.
But, we’re all human, riders, teams, sanctioning bodies, etc... are all going to make mistakes at times, and many of us will disagree.
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HD1200
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HD1200 3/17/2019 11:26am
3/17/2019 11:26am
dimetime wrote:
All you guys just need to stop. It's now gotten embarrassing. I know you all think you're the next Einstien but so sorry, sadly none of...
All you guys just need to stop. It's now gotten embarrassing.

I know you all think you're the next Einstien but so sorry, sadly none of your are.

Just realize your entire premise of "track cutting" is just your immature bias and it means nothing.

There was no track cutting, so all your bent over backwards attempts to make so only exist in your minds. Knock it off.
So what you're really saying is that beings you're the Smart one and whoever disagrees with your opinion are the dumb ones and in that case their opinion should never be considered? Ok, got it!
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