MXA Shootout Winner? YZ250? (Contains Spoiler)

FGR01
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FGR01 12/8/2014 11:30am
12/8/2014 11:30am
Micahdogg wrote:
Some guys prefer to adjust their clutch. Never seen a ktm guy prefer to upgrade their clutch to those silky smooth cables though.
That's probably due mostly to the fact that it is practically impossible to adapt a cable clutch to a KTM, unlike the other bikes that have ready made, bolt-on hydro-clutch kits for them (Magura).
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Zracer 12/8/2014 11:52am
12/8/2014 11:52am
Micahdogg wrote:
Some guys prefer to adjust their clutch. Never seen a ktm guy prefer to upgrade their clutch to those silky smooth cables though.
FGR01 wrote:
That's probably due mostly to the fact that it is practically impossible to adapt a cable clutch to a KTM, unlike the other bikes that have...
That's probably due mostly to the fact that it is practically impossible to adapt a cable clutch to a KTM, unlike the other bikes that have ready made, bolt-on hydro-clutch kits for them (Magura).
Yes , that is why. Ironically , its the same reason most KTM owners dont run Harley flatheads either.
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Micahdogg 12/8/2014 12:11pm
12/8/2014 12:11pm
FGR01 wrote:
That's probably due mostly to the fact that it is practically impossible to adapt a cable clutch to a KTM, unlike the other bikes that have...
That's probably due mostly to the fact that it is practically impossible to adapt a cable clutch to a KTM, unlike the other bikes that have ready made, bolt-on hydro-clutch kits for them (Magura).
Nothing is impossible. If only we had a subforum to hook up all the KTM owners who want a cable operated clutch, I'm sure they could figure it out. Until then they will all have to settle.
FGR01
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FGR01 12/8/2014 12:30pm
12/8/2014 12:30pm
FGR01 wrote:
That's probably due mostly to the fact that it is practically impossible to adapt a cable clutch to a KTM, unlike the other bikes that have...
That's probably due mostly to the fact that it is practically impossible to adapt a cable clutch to a KTM, unlike the other bikes that have ready made, bolt-on hydro-clutch kits for them (Magura).
Micahdogg wrote:
Nothing is impossible. If only we had a subforum to hook up all the KTM owners who want a cable operated clutch, I'm sure they could...
Nothing is impossible. If only we had a subforum to hook up all the KTM owners who want a cable operated clutch, I'm sure they could figure it out. Until then they will all have to settle.
"Nothing is impossible. "

Anticipation of a response like this is exactly why I used the word practically in front of the word impossible.

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Micahdogg
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Micahdogg 12/8/2014 12:44pm
12/8/2014 12:44pm
I noticed that you used "practically." I extrapolated your intent and played honey badger instead. Thanks.
FGR01
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FGR01 12/8/2014 1:03pm
12/8/2014 1:03pm
Good work. Keep up the fight.
Harry Backmon 12/8/2014 1:08pm
12/8/2014 1:08pm
Micahdogg wrote:
I noticed that you used "practically." I extrapolated your intent and played honey badger instead. Thanks.
Laughing Laughing Laughing Cheerful Cheerful Cheerful
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Micahdogg 12/8/2014 1:21pm
12/8/2014 1:21pm
Flava loves the hyro.



deltamotocross 12/8/2014 2:48pm
12/8/2014 2:48pm
It won on the basis of feel. Kinda makes me wander whats in store for the 450 shootout. You know what bike they said was all about feel last year..
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IceMan446 12/8/2014 2:54pm
12/8/2014 2:54pm
Micahdogg wrote:
Flava loves the hyro. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/12/08/73117/s1200_flava.jpg[/img]
Flava loves the hyro.



So does my YZ250.

Keep the Hydro and the horrible suspension.

Ill take the Cable and the SSS stuff.
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Micahdogg 12/8/2014 3:35pm
12/8/2014 3:35pm
Really didnt mxa say they basically couldnt give a win to a bike that had no updates? In the 250f side they basically said last years #1 is next years #5 if it gets no updates. Well, the yz finally got "updates" so...they pretty much had to say it was the winner. The yz is still a hell of a bike imo.
deltamotocross 12/8/2014 4:56pm
12/8/2014 4:56pm
Anyone who knows anything at all about real motocross racing, knows its not horsepower that wins races, its suspension and handling. Unless your just at a really massive, massive horsepower disadvantage, the better handling bike with superior suspension is gona be the bike that makes winning easier.
And suspension superiority is pretty cut and dried, but superior handling is more personal. Some like stability, others like agility.
I think the Yamaha blends all the performance catagories better than the KTM.
This is the very reason I chose the Honda 450 over the more powerful bikes. Its an excellent blend with the lightest weight, and the most overall potential. .
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rcannon 12/8/2014 5:48pm
12/8/2014 5:48pm
I woudl have loved to see Yamaha's next generation yz 250 model. The yz 125 motor, itself, got way smaller, physically, for 2005. I;m sure the 250 version is ready, but was never produced. Thats one thing you see with the ktm. Their 250 motor looks like it woudl fit into a shoebox.

I really dont know why they did not go with the 09 swingarm, larger axle, and rear hub. I did that to my 06 and the new parts were 4 lbs lighter than the old . Swingarm, hub, axle, and brake caliper. 100% bolt on, too.
rocketsocks26 12/8/2014 6:06pm
12/8/2014 6:06pm
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006!!! Yea it is a great bike but the ktm dramatically looks better, has better breaks, motor,quality of parts,and way better resale over the dated yamaha.
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ratonmacias 12/8/2014 6:18pm
12/8/2014 6:18pm
rocketsocks26 wrote:
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006...
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006!!! Yea it is a great bike but the ktm dramatically looks better, has better breaks, motor,quality of parts,and way better resale over the dated yamaha.
how much did you pay for a can of beer in 2005?

do you pay the same for the same can today?

are you quitting beer?
ratonmacias
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ratonmacias 12/8/2014 6:20pm
12/8/2014 6:20pm
i dont know your inflation rates but how much should a 5200 bike from 2006 be today?
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wow123 12/8/2014 6:45pm
12/8/2014 6:45pm
Micahdogg wrote:
Flava loves the hyro. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/12/08/73117/s1200_flava.jpg[/img]
Flava loves the hyro.



i got one of his hour meters too!
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JW381 12/8/2014 6:51pm
12/8/2014 6:51pm
rocketsocks26 wrote:
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006...
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006!!! Yea it is a great bike but the ktm dramatically looks better, has better breaks, motor,quality of parts,and way better resale over the dated yamaha.
I think you are wrong.

Both bikes look great, the KTM does have better BRAKES but the Yamerha has more widely liked suspension, I think the motor is debatable as to which is actually better, would also disagree that KTM has better quality parts, and I'm not at all sure how you came to the resale value conclusion.

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nytsmaC
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nytsmaC 12/8/2014 7:12pm
12/8/2014 7:12pm
When you are talking $5200 for an 06, what time of year was that? Were the 07's almost out, or was it in 05? And is $7k really the best deal you can make on a 15?

Not trying to bust your balls, just curious if we're comparing apples to apples here.
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holeshot413 12/8/2014 7:24pm
12/8/2014 7:24pm
CR250Rider wrote:
Isn't it great that a +10 yr old 2 stroke can still be such an awesome bike today? Put a pipe and VForce4 on that thing...
Isn't it great that a +10 yr old 2 stroke can still be such an awesome bike today?

Put a pipe and VForce4 on that thing and ride! Smile
I am racing my restored sorta 2005 yamaha YZ 250 and loving it!
rocketsocks26 12/8/2014 7:32pm
12/8/2014 7:32pm
Nystsmac, i just came across the sales receipt the other day, i bought it in feb 06. Im not bashing the bike n will 100% agree the suspension is better, i have ohlins on my 15 lol, i love the yamis, its just my personal opinion, i like the ktm alot better. I like that its very easy to work on, the quality of their bikes is top notch, brakes , ergos, Handeling, looks its just a hot bike! Yes it took ktm along time to catch up, but its 2014 and 2006 happend and was along time ago! Iol ktm has the spotlight now lol. Im laughing as i type so please no one take anything personal.we all have our own preferences n taste. Anyhow, look out for my build that im doing now on my bike ( the 15 250sx) im getting parts in daily, i will post pics as i start building.
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Joko 12/8/2014 7:49pm
12/8/2014 7:49pm
rcannon wrote:
I woudl have loved to see Yamaha's next generation yz 250 model. The yz 125 motor, itself, got way smaller, physically, for 2005. I;m sure the...
I woudl have loved to see Yamaha's next generation yz 250 model. The yz 125 motor, itself, got way smaller, physically, for 2005. I;m sure the 250 version is ready, but was never produced. Thats one thing you see with the ktm. Their 250 motor looks like it woudl fit into a shoebox.

I really dont know why they did not go with the 09 swingarm, larger axle, and rear hub. I did that to my 06 and the new parts were 4 lbs lighter than the old . Swingarm, hub, axle, and brake caliper. 100% bolt on, too.
09 linkage too?
rcannon
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rcannon 12/9/2014 5:06am
12/9/2014 5:06am Edited Date/Time 12/9/2014 5:35am
Linkage was odd. My new, 09 arm came with a linkage so I used that. The was 1mm length difference between the 09 linkage arms and older arms.... I dont remember which was longer or shorter.

So, yes..I used the linkage but there was no need to. That was one part that switched over...Maybe the only one. I THINK the 09 linkage was longer and the rear of the bike sat just a touch lower.

Oh, I remember also needing a longer bolt for the linkage to swingarm mount. The 09 needed the 09 bolt in this spot. The rest crossed over.

I did need arm, hub, axle, brake caliper and axle. Chain adjustor blocks, too. Could have gotten by with using rear wheel, axle, and brake caliper from older bike on new arm.

Back then, they were parting brand new bikes out on ebay, so I was able to use new parts and the th ecost was under 400 for everything.
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jpred 12/9/2014 6:47am
12/9/2014 6:47am
rocketsocks26 wrote:
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006...
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006!!! Yea it is a great bike but the ktm dramatically looks better, has better breaks, motor,quality of parts,and way better resale over the dated yamaha.
ratonmacias wrote:
how much did you pay for a can of beer in 2005?

do you pay the same for the same can today?

are you quitting beer?
Good point!
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YZ125H1 12/9/2014 8:08am
12/9/2014 8:08am Edited Date/Time 12/9/2014 8:08am
rcannon wrote:
Linkage was odd. My new, 09 arm came with a linkage so I used that. The was 1mm length difference between the 09 linkage arms and...
Linkage was odd. My new, 09 arm came with a linkage so I used that. The was 1mm length difference between the 09 linkage arms and older arms.... I dont remember which was longer or shorter.

So, yes..I used the linkage but there was no need to. That was one part that switched over...Maybe the only one. I THINK the 09 linkage was longer and the rear of the bike sat just a touch lower.

Oh, I remember also needing a longer bolt for the linkage to swingarm mount. The 09 needed the 09 bolt in this spot. The rest crossed over.

I did need arm, hub, axle, brake caliper and axle. Chain adjustor blocks, too. Could have gotten by with using rear wheel, axle, and brake caliper from older bike on new arm.

Back then, they were parting brand new bikes out on ebay, so I was able to use new parts and the th ecost was under 400 for everything.
They should have set them up from the factory like this it would have saved them money and a few lbs. I heard the finally dropped the TI spring from the YZ line that bike used to have some trick stuff on it.
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Digger29 12/9/2014 8:21am
12/9/2014 8:21am
Just because I've owned back to back KTM's I'm in no way a KTM fan boy but my gut feeling here is that seeing as Yamaha finally kind of updated their 2 stroke line up that MXA felt obligated to show them a little love. I've ridden a number of YZ250's and they're definitely decent bikes BUT I wouldn't take one of them over my 07 RM250 and my KTM is way better than my RM was. I've raced almost every yr RM250 since the early 80's & I'd would more than likely buy an RM250 if Suzuki came out with a totally new one and not a warmed over 08 as Yamaha has been doing for the last 10yrs. Just my .02 cents :-)
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YZ125H1 12/9/2014 9:37am
12/9/2014 9:37am
Digger29 wrote:
Just because I've owned back to back KTM's I'm in no way a KTM fan boy but my gut feeling here is that seeing as Yamaha...
Just because I've owned back to back KTM's I'm in no way a KTM fan boy but my gut feeling here is that seeing as Yamaha finally kind of updated their 2 stroke line up that MXA felt obligated to show them a little love. I've ridden a number of YZ250's and they're definitely decent bikes BUT I wouldn't take one of them over my 07 RM250 and my KTM is way better than my RM was. I've raced almost every yr RM250 since the early 80's & I'd would more than likely buy an RM250 if Suzuki came out with a totally new one and not a warmed over 08 as Yamaha has been doing for the last 10yrs. Just my .02 cents :-)
This is my main gripe with Yamaha we have asked for years for certain improvements and they finally updated the plastics. If they don't want to change the bike then why make it? The 15 is nice, but I think they could have added more bells and whistles to entice more buyers. I like how KTM isn't willing to let their 2 stroke line fall victim to stagnant R&D. This at least creates some friendly competition to update competitors bikes every so often or at least keep them still being made.
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FI2T 12/9/2014 2:16pm
12/9/2014 2:16pm
rcannon wrote:
I woudl have loved to see Yamaha's next generation yz 250 model. The yz 125 motor, itself, got way smaller, physically, for 2005. I;m sure the...
I woudl have loved to see Yamaha's next generation yz 250 model. The yz 125 motor, itself, got way smaller, physically, for 2005. I;m sure the 250 version is ready, but was never produced. Thats one thing you see with the ktm. Their 250 motor looks like it woudl fit into a shoebox.

I really dont know why they did not go with the 09 swingarm, larger axle, and rear hub. I did that to my 06 and the new parts were 4 lbs lighter than the old . Swingarm, hub, axle, and brake caliper. 100% bolt on, too.
^^^^ How can Yamaha miss stuff like this! I guess the same way they let Polaris kill them in the utv category. I have been a Yamha guy for a long time and would love to buy a "new" 2stroke.... unfortunately for all of us Yamaha is asleep at the wheel in so many (not all) aspects of their business. I'll keep my 07yz250 cause its better then their regurgitatated 2015!
nascarnate326 12/9/2014 6:02pm
12/9/2014 6:02pm
rcannon wrote:
I woudl have loved to see Yamaha's next generation yz 250 model. The yz 125 motor, itself, got way smaller, physically, for 2005. I;m sure the...
I woudl have loved to see Yamaha's next generation yz 250 model. The yz 125 motor, itself, got way smaller, physically, for 2005. I;m sure the 250 version is ready, but was never produced. Thats one thing you see with the ktm. Their 250 motor looks like it woudl fit into a shoebox.

I really dont know why they did not go with the 09 swingarm, larger axle, and rear hub. I did that to my 06 and the new parts were 4 lbs lighter than the old . Swingarm, hub, axle, and brake caliper. 100% bolt on, too.
FI2T wrote:
^^^^ How can Yamaha miss stuff like this! I guess the same way they let Polaris kill them in the utv category. I have been a...
^^^^ How can Yamaha miss stuff like this! I guess the same way they let Polaris kill them in the utv category. I have been a Yamha guy for a long time and would love to buy a "new" 2stroke.... unfortunately for all of us Yamaha is asleep at the wheel in so many (not all) aspects of their business. I'll keep my 07yz250 cause its better then their regurgitatated 2015!
Try being a Kawasaki fan. They only have 2 big bikes now. No reason they could make a two stroke.
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MotoX85 12/9/2014 6:27pm
12/9/2014 6:27pm
rocketsocks26 wrote:
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006...
I love the yamaha. But theirs not a chance in hell im gna pay over $7k for the same bike i paid $5200 for in 2006!!! Yea it is a great bike but the ktm dramatically looks better, has better breaks, motor,quality of parts,and way better resale over the dated yamaha.
You paid $5200 for a 2006 YZ125, I got my 13 125 for $5600 OTD and a 2015 YZ250 for $6200 OTD.

Got no problem with the KTMs and if we were not on YZs, that is what we would be riding. But there is no comparison between cornering, handling, suspension, weight (don't care what the mags tell you). The motors on the 1/4 liters are about the same and the 1/2 liter the KTM has a small advantage of about 2 HP. I can fix a motor faster than I can fix handling and suspension. As for the clutch, I know some people like the hydros and to each his own, but on a 2 smoke (especially a 125) it is almost a must to have a cable to be able to feel the feathering of the power.

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