More Bad News for JS7

7/28/2014 10:13am
After reading JS7's instagram/twitter/whatever it was post, I'm interested to hear his side of the story when he's able to talk about it. We all know what happened, but I don't think anyone knows why it happened. It's just a bunch of rumor, speculation and accusations of him being a cheater. There are always two sides to every story, and I like to hear both sides and determine myself which story to believe before passing judgement on someone. Anyone have more than one kid? When one comes to you crying about something the other did, do you just instantly punish the other one, or do you ask him/her what happened to get both sides and then make a decision about who to punish? Same thing, we need to hear both sides before passing judgement.
zook11
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7/28/2014 10:14am
davistld01 wrote:
Team Alessi for sure. The Stewart family is far from the dysfunctional bunch at Team Tony. Big James has never had a public meltdown, has never...
Team Alessi for sure. The Stewart family is far from the dysfunctional bunch at Team Tony. Big James has never had a public meltdown, has never gone on a radio show and accused everybody short of God for their troubles, and has never had any kids disrespect other riders like Jeff did with that stupid "lasergate" thing.

I applaud James for being real...and being a real person. I'm not saying rules weren't broken...but I am saying that he has been made an example of, and has become the subject of a huge witchhunt because of this PED deal. I sincerely hope...as a fan of JS7, that he either can rise above all this and kill it in 2015...or has the maturity to retire knowing that he wasn't a cheater but was forced into retirement by our "little sport" mentality.
Outsider wrote:
I would bet good money that a whole bunch of JS7 "fans" were hoping this PED testing would have caught "the other guy"... sorta backfired eh...
I would bet good money that a whole bunch of JS7 "fans" were hoping this PED testing would have caught "the other guy"... sorta backfired eh?

Bummer all the way around, imo.
rcm406 wrote:
It would've caught the other guy, if only, oh nevermind!:whistle: :P On a serious note, this testing has turned into one big clusterfuck! I was hoping...
It would've caught the other guy, if only, oh nevermind!Whistling Tongue

On a serious note, this testing has turned into one big clusterfuck! I was hoping it would catch the hardcore PED users and if it was James, then so be it, but there are so many grey areas and dysfunctional protocol that I wish they would've never started! I wouldn't want RV or any other rider for that matter going through what James is going through right now. It's a bunch of BS.
What's even more pathetic you you following me around every post I make. Get a life.
APLMAN99
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7/28/2014 10:15am
MxKing809 wrote:
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me. I got on dart board because he was trying to play it...
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me.

I got on dart board because he was trying to play it off like it was all just bullshit. Which it's not. There was an event at Millville, that's not debatable. What have I said to smear him that is not true?

And are you guys really going to say that a personal nurse qualifies as the medical official in the rule book? Come on.... You know they are referring specifically to on-staff medical workers provided for everyone. How is it fair that a rider can pay for a nurse that can individually call for an IV 'legally' then reinstate him to race? That's such a blaring conflict of interest it's scary. It also undermines the rules, which I'm sure doesn't make the organizers happy.
APLMAN99 wrote:
It's starting to appear that you have an agenda here. You posted the rule, but it seems like you haven't actually read it. There is no...
It's starting to appear that you have an agenda here. You posted the rule, but it seems like you haven't actually read it. There is no mention of "medical official" as being the person with the ability to initiate an IV and then clear a rider later. It's "medical personnel" for a reason, which is why it later differentiates what occurs when the "event medical director" sees a rider and recommends a course of action. The fact that they specifically show a difference between what can or will occur between seeing "medical personnel" and "event medical director" shows that they are not the same, nor were they intended to be.



MxKing809 wrote:
With that understanding then, MXSPORTS is totally fine with riders using IV's between motos as long as they hire medical personnel for their own staff. My...
With that understanding then, MXSPORTS is totally fine with riders using IV's between motos as long as they hire medical personnel for their own staff. My point is that while that may be interpreted from the rules, I don't believe that is the intent of the rule..... And furthermore, doing so circumvents the intent to keep non-medical emergency IV's from being used to gain an advantage.
You are focusing on what you believe to be the "intent", while ignoring the actual rule itself. Words have meaning. That's an important concept. The words in the rule certainly would seem to make it rather easy to hydrate between motos. That's simply the way it is written. Your assumptions about intent are simply your desirable view, not necessarily those of the people who make the rules.

The intent of the rule could very well be to make sure that a medically qualified person administer the IV in case anything were to go wrong. That would certainly be a reasonable assumption given the wording.

It simply appears that your refusal to actually want to follow the rule as written over some vague "intent" is more of a jihad aimed at a rider who probably did follow this particular rule by using appropriate "medical personnel". Those sorts of personal feelings are why rules are important, rather than just relying on "intent".
bigborefan
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7/28/2014 10:16am
bigborefan wrote:
therealjs7 2 days ago So bummed I'm not gonna be at Washougal tomorrow but looking forward to getting healthy and finishing this series fighting for more...
therealjs7
2 days ago
So bummed I'm not gonna be at Washougal tomorrow but looking forward to getting healthy and finishing this series fighting for more wins. It's been a tough couple months for me but through the process I've still enjoyed racing. Not gonna lie, it's taken a huge toll on my body and it shut down on me last Saturday... But as bad as things were, I know it allows us as a team to become stronger. I'll never stop fighting even when there's nothing left, I'll still fight! I wanna thank all my sponsors for supporting me through these hard times. It shows that the people that support me are truly behind their athletes on and off the track and I sincerely thank all of them for that. My family has been with me through this also and I want to say I love you guys very much. My Fans.... I know it's been super hard to understand what's going on and you guys have been in the dark with most of the stuff going on but trust me... if I could speak about it I would but I couldn't and still can't... It's all going to come to light soon and I can't wait to explain what's going on to all of you. Through all this the hardest thing has been the feeling that I let thousand of fans down and it's been really hard on me personally... You guys are what I live and race for so to have the feeling of letting you down has hurt deeply... But I can tell that you guys are still with me and that means a lot! Thank you so much for your support from the bottom of my heart! I love & respect everyone of y'all. Sometimes the strongest people are the ones who love beyond all faults, Cry behind close doors & fight battles no one knows about. James Stewart JS

I don't know which group has more drama, Team Alessi or JSE.
davistld01 wrote:
Team Alessi for sure. The Stewart family is far from the dysfunctional bunch at Team Tony. Big James has never had a public meltdown, has never...
Team Alessi for sure. The Stewart family is far from the dysfunctional bunch at Team Tony. Big James has never had a public meltdown, has never gone on a radio show and accused everybody short of God for their troubles, and has never had any kids disrespect other riders like Jeff did with that stupid "lasergate" thing.

I applaud James for being real...and being a real person. I'm not saying rules weren't broken...but I am saying that he has been made an example of, and has become the subject of a huge witchhunt because of this PED deal. I sincerely hope...as a fan of JS7, that he either can rise above all this and kill it in 2015...or has the maturity to retire knowing that he wasn't a cheater but was forced into retirement by our "little sport" mentality.
I think our "little sport" wants to go mainstream, why, so DC can make more money I guess, but that's a different debate.

Drug testing was brought in to make it a big boy, legitimate sport, and it backfired when JSE got popped. How is it a witch hunt? He's either guilty or he's not. We will just have to wait and see what the penalties are.

The dilemma is there is no easy way out. You let JSE slide and it shows the rules are a joke. You ban him and Feld loses money, at least that's the rumor.

JSE imploded on his own. I don't think anyone forced him into it.

The Shop

APLMAN99
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7/28/2014 10:18am
SEE ARE125 wrote:
After reading JS7's instagram/twitter/whatever it was post, I'm interested to hear his side of the story when he's able to talk about it. We all know...
After reading JS7's instagram/twitter/whatever it was post, I'm interested to hear his side of the story when he's able to talk about it. We all know what happened, but I don't think anyone knows why it happened. It's just a bunch of rumor, speculation and accusations of him being a cheater. There are always two sides to every story, and I like to hear both sides and determine myself which story to believe before passing judgement on someone. Anyone have more than one kid? When one comes to you crying about something the other did, do you just instantly punish the other one, or do you ask him/her what happened to get both sides and then make a decision about who to punish? Same thing, we need to hear both sides before passing judgement.
I beat all my kids equally!

They haven't come to me with a disagreement in years........



MxKing809
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7/28/2014 10:22am Edited Date/Time 7/28/2014 10:23am
APLMAN99 wrote:
It's starting to appear that you have an agenda here. You posted the rule, but it seems like you haven't actually read it. There is no...
It's starting to appear that you have an agenda here. You posted the rule, but it seems like you haven't actually read it. There is no mention of "medical official" as being the person with the ability to initiate an IV and then clear a rider later. It's "medical personnel" for a reason, which is why it later differentiates what occurs when the "event medical director" sees a rider and recommends a course of action. The fact that they specifically show a difference between what can or will occur between seeing "medical personnel" and "event medical director" shows that they are not the same, nor were they intended to be.



MxKing809 wrote:
With that understanding then, MXSPORTS is totally fine with riders using IV's between motos as long as they hire medical personnel for their own staff. My...
With that understanding then, MXSPORTS is totally fine with riders using IV's between motos as long as they hire medical personnel for their own staff. My point is that while that may be interpreted from the rules, I don't believe that is the intent of the rule..... And furthermore, doing so circumvents the intent to keep non-medical emergency IV's from being used to gain an advantage.
APLMAN99 wrote:
You are focusing on what you believe to be the "intent", while ignoring the actual rule itself. Words have meaning. That's an important concept. The words...
You are focusing on what you believe to be the "intent", while ignoring the actual rule itself. Words have meaning. That's an important concept. The words in the rule certainly would seem to make it rather easy to hydrate between motos. That's simply the way it is written. Your assumptions about intent are simply your desirable view, not necessarily those of the people who make the rules.

The intent of the rule could very well be to make sure that a medically qualified person administer the IV in case anything were to go wrong. That would certainly be a reasonable assumption given the wording.

It simply appears that your refusal to actually want to follow the rule as written over some vague "intent" is more of a jihad aimed at a rider who probably did follow this particular rule by using appropriate "medical personnel". Those sorts of personal feelings are why rules are important, rather than just relying on "intent".
It's not a personal jihad... Believe me. I would HATE to see James go down like this. He is one of the more recognizable figures in the sport and we need him to push it more into the mainstream.

I've always had the understanding that IV hydration was not allowed mid program. You and I can debate semantics and intent, but until DC, GuyB or someone else with actual knowledge of the inner working and intent of the rules chimes in, we will just keep going in a circle.
Moto75
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7/28/2014 10:22am
Moto75 wrote:
Funny, that's kind of why I jumped on you in the first place. MxKing809 wrote: "No, it's a rider breaking a rule.... That's explicitly written in...
Funny, that's kind of why I jumped on you in the first place.

MxKing809 wrote: "No, it's a rider breaking a rule.... That's explicitly written in the rules. If you IV after practice/ during motos, you're done for the day. Period. How is breaking rules (allegedly) and getting caught bullshit?

Edit: so now GuyB and JT$ have pretty much agreed it happened.... Wow. Is he that arrogant that he feels he's above the law??"


You wrongfully accused him of breaking the rules, misleading people & saying he's so arrogant that he feels above the law. You did this all while having a copy of the rule, but never having read it or understood it. This happens all the time unfortunately.
MxKing809 wrote:
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me. I got on dart board because he was trying to play it...
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me.

I got on dart board because he was trying to play it off like it was all just bullshit. Which it's not. There was an event at Millville, that's not debatable. What have I said to smear him that is not true?

And are you guys really going to say that a personal nurse qualifies as the medical official in the rule book? Come on.... You know they are referring specifically to on-staff medical workers provided for everyone. How is it fair that a rider can pay for a nurse that can individually call for an IV 'legally' then reinstate him to race? That's such a blaring conflict of interest it's scary. It also undermines the rules, which I'm sure doesn't make the organizers happy.
When reading rules, there is no room for "you know they are referring to". Medical Personnel is just that, it does not say who needs to be employing the medical professional - which is why i said it's harder to define. The AMA can't leave themselves liable for being the only qualified medical care. Then they could become liable if something happend to a rider & they didnt repond timely. So, the wording needs to be open ended to avoid liability.
MxKing809
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7/28/2014 10:27am
Moto75 wrote:
Funny, that's kind of why I jumped on you in the first place. MxKing809 wrote: "No, it's a rider breaking a rule.... That's explicitly written in...
Funny, that's kind of why I jumped on you in the first place.

MxKing809 wrote: "No, it's a rider breaking a rule.... That's explicitly written in the rules. If you IV after practice/ during motos, you're done for the day. Period. How is breaking rules (allegedly) and getting caught bullshit?

Edit: so now GuyB and JT$ have pretty much agreed it happened.... Wow. Is he that arrogant that he feels he's above the law??"


You wrongfully accused him of breaking the rules, misleading people & saying he's so arrogant that he feels above the law. You did this all while having a copy of the rule, but never having read it or understood it. This happens all the time unfortunately.
MxKing809 wrote:
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me. I got on dart board because he was trying to play it...
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me.

I got on dart board because he was trying to play it off like it was all just bullshit. Which it's not. There was an event at Millville, that's not debatable. What have I said to smear him that is not true?

And are you guys really going to say that a personal nurse qualifies as the medical official in the rule book? Come on.... You know they are referring specifically to on-staff medical workers provided for everyone. How is it fair that a rider can pay for a nurse that can individually call for an IV 'legally' then reinstate him to race? That's such a blaring conflict of interest it's scary. It also undermines the rules, which I'm sure doesn't make the organizers happy.
Moto75 wrote:
When reading rules, there is no room for "you know they are referring to". Medical Personnel is just that, it does not say who needs to...
When reading rules, there is no room for "you know they are referring to". Medical Personnel is just that, it does not say who needs to be employing the medical professional - which is why i said it's harder to define. The AMA can't leave themselves liable for being the only qualified medical care. Then they could become liable if something happend to a rider & they didnt repond timely. So, the wording needs to be open ended to avoid liability.
My point is: I don't believe the goal of the rule is being achieved by top riders hiring their own medical staff to satisfy the rule.
newmann
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7/28/2014 10:28am
Wow, Vital has just hit a new all time low.
How so? Seems the internet does as good a job policing the sport as the ones who are supposed to.
APLMAN99
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7/28/2014 10:32am
bigborefan wrote:
therealjs7 2 days ago So bummed I'm not gonna be at Washougal tomorrow but looking forward to getting healthy and finishing this series fighting for more...
therealjs7
2 days ago
So bummed I'm not gonna be at Washougal tomorrow but looking forward to getting healthy and finishing this series fighting for more wins. It's been a tough couple months for me but through the process I've still enjoyed racing. Not gonna lie, it's taken a huge toll on my body and it shut down on me last Saturday... But as bad as things were, I know it allows us as a team to become stronger. I'll never stop fighting even when there's nothing left, I'll still fight! I wanna thank all my sponsors for supporting me through these hard times. It shows that the people that support me are truly behind their athletes on and off the track and I sincerely thank all of them for that. My family has been with me through this also and I want to say I love you guys very much. My Fans.... I know it's been super hard to understand what's going on and you guys have been in the dark with most of the stuff going on but trust me... if I could speak about it I would but I couldn't and still can't... It's all going to come to light soon and I can't wait to explain what's going on to all of you. Through all this the hardest thing has been the feeling that I let thousand of fans down and it's been really hard on me personally... You guys are what I live and race for so to have the feeling of letting you down has hurt deeply... But I can tell that you guys are still with me and that means a lot! Thank you so much for your support from the bottom of my heart! I love & respect everyone of y'all. Sometimes the strongest people are the ones who love beyond all faults, Cry behind close doors & fight battles no one knows about. James Stewart JS

I don't know which group has more drama, Team Alessi or JSE.
davistld01 wrote:
Team Alessi for sure. The Stewart family is far from the dysfunctional bunch at Team Tony. Big James has never had a public meltdown, has never...
Team Alessi for sure. The Stewart family is far from the dysfunctional bunch at Team Tony. Big James has never had a public meltdown, has never gone on a radio show and accused everybody short of God for their troubles, and has never had any kids disrespect other riders like Jeff did with that stupid "lasergate" thing.

I applaud James for being real...and being a real person. I'm not saying rules weren't broken...but I am saying that he has been made an example of, and has become the subject of a huge witchhunt because of this PED deal. I sincerely hope...as a fan of JS7, that he either can rise above all this and kill it in 2015...or has the maturity to retire knowing that he wasn't a cheater but was forced into retirement by our "little sport" mentality.
bigborefan wrote:
I think our "little sport" wants to go mainstream, why, so DC can make more money I guess, but that's a different debate. Drug testing was...
I think our "little sport" wants to go mainstream, why, so DC can make more money I guess, but that's a different debate.

Drug testing was brought in to make it a big boy, legitimate sport, and it backfired when JSE got popped. How is it a witch hunt? He's either guilty or he's not. We will just have to wait and see what the penalties are.

The dilemma is there is no easy way out. You let JSE slide and it shows the rules are a joke. You ban him and Feld loses money, at least that's the rumor.

JSE imploded on his own. I don't think anyone forced him into it.
I think you missed on the Coombs just wanting to get rich part. Don't know him personally but have been "around" him twice and the guy just seemed to love what he is doing, not just a guy in it for the money. For all I know, he might not actually be making a ton of it either. Most people simply assume that because a business looks successful that the owners are making money hand over fist. That's not usually the case and you hear about a lot of "successful looking" businesses shuttering up all the time. Coombs seems to have a slightly different view on where he'd like the "sport" to be in the next 10 or 20 years than I do, but I have no doubt that his intentions are good and not as self-enriching as some might think.

As for Stewart, it seems that there is a certain element of wanting to burn this guy for anything that can be found, whether it was a rule violation or not. From a rational standpoint, it would initially appear that the Adderall testing was indeed a violation, and should be punishable. The question in my mind is whether or not the violation was procedural, or whether it was using a substance illegally (if no current prescription existed).

On the alleged violation concerning the nurse, it would initially appear that he was following the rule as written by having medical personnel available to administer the IV.

One question that comes to mind is who at the AMA divulged this information and are the guilty of a HIPAA violation? A rider's medical information being shared with someone who doesn't have a medical need to know could be a serious issue for someone.
GuyB
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7/28/2014 10:39am Edited Date/Time 7/28/2014 10:40am
bigborefan wrote:
I think our "little sport" wants to go mainstream, why, so DC can make more money I guess, but that's a different debate. Drug testing was...
I think our "little sport" wants to go mainstream, why, so DC can make more money I guess, but that's a different debate.

Drug testing was brought in to make it a big boy, legitimate sport, and it backfired when JSE got popped. How is it a witch hunt? He's either guilty or he's not. We will just have to wait and see what the penalties are.

The dilemma is there is no easy way out. You let JSE slide and it shows the rules are a joke. You ban him and Feld loses money, at least that's the rumor.

JSE imploded on his own. I don't think anyone forced him into it.
It was brought it after the teams voted unanimously for it.
Silliker269
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7/28/2014 10:40am
My question is how did she not know to keep it on the down low ?! Common people get your ducks in a row !!
GuyB
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7/28/2014 10:50am
My question is how did she not know to keep it on the down low ?! Common people get your ducks in a row !!
Common? Are you speaking Canadian?
MxKing809
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7/28/2014 10:53am
My question is how did she not know to keep it on the down low ?! Common people get your ducks in a row !!
GuyB wrote:
Common? Are you speaking Canadian?
GuyB, can you add some insight to the overall goal of the rule? Is MxSports ok with riders using IV's?
captaincrunch
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7/28/2014 10:53am Edited Date/Time 7/28/2014 10:55am
APLMAN99 wrote:
I think you missed on the Coombs just wanting to get rich part. Don't know him personally but have been "around" him twice and the guy...
I think you missed on the Coombs just wanting to get rich part. Don't know him personally but have been "around" him twice and the guy just seemed to love what he is doing, not just a guy in it for the money. For all I know, he might not actually be making a ton of it either. Most people simply assume that because a business looks successful that the owners are making money hand over fist. That's not usually the case and you hear about a lot of "successful looking" businesses shuttering up all the time. Coombs seems to have a slightly different view on where he'd like the "sport" to be in the next 10 or 20 years than I do, but I have no doubt that his intentions are good and not as self-enriching as some might think.

As for Stewart, it seems that there is a certain element of wanting to burn this guy for anything that can be found, whether it was a rule violation or not. From a rational standpoint, it would initially appear that the Adderall testing was indeed a violation, and should be punishable. The question in my mind is whether or not the violation was procedural, or whether it was using a substance illegally (if no current prescription existed).

On the alleged violation concerning the nurse, it would initially appear that he was following the rule as written by having medical personnel available to administer the IV.

One question that comes to mind is who at the AMA divulged this information and are the guilty of a HIPAA violation? A rider's medical information being shared with someone who doesn't have a medical need to know could be a serious issue for someone.
There would be no HIPPA violation because there wouldn't be a confidential agreement with a private, hired nurse with mx sports or whoever.
GuyB
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7/28/2014 10:56am
MxKing809 wrote:
GuyB, can you add some insight to the overall goal of the rule? Is MxSports ok with riders using IV's?
Did you really just ask that? Blink
MxKing809
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7/28/2014 11:00am
MxKing809 wrote:
GuyB, can you add some insight to the overall goal of the rule? Is MxSports ok with riders using IV's?
GuyB wrote:
Did you really just ask that? Blink
Well kind-of.....

They're obviously not ok with it....but the rules create some ambiguity. Do you maybe see a rule change coming after the season to align the rules more with their goal?
steve_97060
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7/28/2014 11:02am
I was going to make a smart ass comment about some of these questions and comments, but then I figured why bother, carry on..
flamenco
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7/28/2014 11:08am
APLMAN99 wrote:
I think you missed on the Coombs just wanting to get rich part. Don't know him personally but have been "around" him twice and the guy...
I think you missed on the Coombs just wanting to get rich part. Don't know him personally but have been "around" him twice and the guy just seemed to love what he is doing, not just a guy in it for the money. For all I know, he might not actually be making a ton of it either. Most people simply assume that because a business looks successful that the owners are making money hand over fist. That's not usually the case and you hear about a lot of "successful looking" businesses shuttering up all the time. Coombs seems to have a slightly different view on where he'd like the "sport" to be in the next 10 or 20 years than I do, but I have no doubt that his intentions are good and not as self-enriching as some might think.

As for Stewart, it seems that there is a certain element of wanting to burn this guy for anything that can be found, whether it was a rule violation or not. From a rational standpoint, it would initially appear that the Adderall testing was indeed a violation, and should be punishable. The question in my mind is whether or not the violation was procedural, or whether it was using a substance illegally (if no current prescription existed).

On the alleged violation concerning the nurse, it would initially appear that he was following the rule as written by having medical personnel available to administer the IV.

One question that comes to mind is who at the AMA divulged this information and are the guilty of a HIPAA violation? A rider's medical information being shared with someone who doesn't have a medical need to know could be a serious issue for someone.
At this point in your argument I would ask is a private nurse (RN, LPN, etc) allowed by law to 'release' a patient to continue in an athletic activity that caused the medical problem in the first place? ... My inclination is to say 'no', which would give weight to the 'intent' that the wording is unintentionally unspecific simply to encompass officially sanctioned on-track personnel such as Dr. Bodner, or licensed emergency personnel on, or off, track. However, even if a nurse is legally able to do so, it is a shady deal to ask him/her to do so, or even to just be there as cover, IMO. But, I am not set on one opinion, just have initial perspectives.
7/28/2014 11:12am Edited Date/Time 7/28/2014 11:13am
2.4 INTRAVENOUS HYDRATION

At no time during the event may a rider receive any type of intravenous hydration, unless such hydration is deemed medically necessary by medical personnel as a result of an emergency medical situation (i.e., heat stroke) encountered by the rider during, or as a result of participating in, any practice, qualifier, moto race or other activity in the event.


I think you guys are honing into the wrong words in the rule.

Can Stewart really make the argument that an IV was "medically necessary" as a result of an "emergency medical situation" every weekend? Was James anticipating a medical emergency each race?


It's nearly impossible to prove that James was taking bags between motos but this situation looks absolutely horrible for him. Is hydration immediately after the race day is finished so important that he would hire and fly a nurse to every event?
enketchum
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7/28/2014 11:13am
Why hasn't Mattews posted in this thread? I thought this year was going to be different for James?

And where is Raining Yellow? 'They' need to stop taking IVs between motos
huck
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17024
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Mountain Home, AR, USA
7/28/2014 11:13am
My question is how did she not know to keep it on the down low ?! Common people get your ducks in a row !!
GuyB wrote:
Common? Are you speaking Canadian?
You common folks just don't understand.... Wink


bigborefan
Posts
1472
Joined
3/8/2008
Location
Urbana, IL, USA
7/28/2014 11:31am
APLMAN99 wrote:
I think you missed on the Coombs just wanting to get rich part. Don't know him personally but have been "around" him twice and the guy...
I think you missed on the Coombs just wanting to get rich part. Don't know him personally but have been "around" him twice and the guy just seemed to love what he is doing, not just a guy in it for the money. For all I know, he might not actually be making a ton of it either. Most people simply assume that because a business looks successful that the owners are making money hand over fist. That's not usually the case and you hear about a lot of "successful looking" businesses shuttering up all the time. Coombs seems to have a slightly different view on where he'd like the "sport" to be in the next 10 or 20 years than I do, but I have no doubt that his intentions are good and not as self-enriching as some might think.

As for Stewart, it seems that there is a certain element of wanting to burn this guy for anything that can be found, whether it was a rule violation or not. From a rational standpoint, it would initially appear that the Adderall testing was indeed a violation, and should be punishable. The question in my mind is whether or not the violation was procedural, or whether it was using a substance illegally (if no current prescription existed).

On the alleged violation concerning the nurse, it would initially appear that he was following the rule as written by having medical personnel available to administer the IV.

One question that comes to mind is who at the AMA divulged this information and are the guilty of a HIPAA violation? A rider's medical information being shared with someone who doesn't have a medical need to know could be a serious issue for someone.
I got no clue about Coombs. I should of just blanketed the entire MX industry.

And I agree about business. i went to Millville. Told a buddy, on one hand I bet they are making a killing, just looking around at all the people. On the other hand, i bet they lose their ass. looking at the workers, buildings, etc.

As for JSE, you could make an argument that he skirts the letter of the law. Maybe that's why people call foul on him. And so far isn't he the first and only rider to fail a test?

He's a non-factor right now anyway. The 2 Hondas and 2 KTMs are more than making up for the loss of JSE on the track. I am going to three outdoor nationals this year, just to watch the Big 4 battle it out.
Moto75
Posts
344
Joined
3/19/2014
Location
Somewhere in, AZ, USA
7/28/2014 1:01pm
MxKing809 wrote:
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me. I got on dart board because he was trying to play it...
This whole thread is about him possibly breaking a rule: it's not just me.

I got on dart board because he was trying to play it off like it was all just bullshit. Which it's not. There was an event at Millville, that's not debatable. What have I said to smear him that is not true?

And are you guys really going to say that a personal nurse qualifies as the medical official in the rule book? Come on.... You know they are referring specifically to on-staff medical workers provided for everyone. How is it fair that a rider can pay for a nurse that can individually call for an IV 'legally' then reinstate him to race? That's such a blaring conflict of interest it's scary. It also undermines the rules, which I'm sure doesn't make the organizers happy.
Moto75 wrote:
When reading rules, there is no room for "you know they are referring to". Medical Personnel is just that, it does not say who needs to...
When reading rules, there is no room for "you know they are referring to". Medical Personnel is just that, it does not say who needs to be employing the medical professional - which is why i said it's harder to define. The AMA can't leave themselves liable for being the only qualified medical care. Then they could become liable if something happend to a rider & they didnt repond timely. So, the wording needs to be open ended to avoid liability.
MxKing809 wrote:
My point is: I don't believe the goal of the rule is being achieved by top riders hiring their own medical staff to satisfy the rule.
MxKing809 wrote: What have I said to smear him that is not true?

You said he broke the rule, Period. That he feels above the rules. - These are what I would call smearing if proven untrue.


But, your argument is slowly changing to something I can agree with.

I believe the intent of the rule is to avoid IV's unless medically necessary & to avoid a performance advantage. The rule, as it is written can easily be exploited by riders to create a performance advantage. But in a sport with allot of money at stake, lawyers are sure to follow & they will go by the rule as it is written. Discussing intent is pointless.


For the conspiracy aspect, here's something I believe could be true. Stewart's performance fell off right around the time the positive result was exposed. At that time, a possible scenario is: Stewart was advised to stop taking the drug & that a retest would be likely. If that retest came back negative, it could cast a favorable light for leniency in his appeal of the failed test. It brings back the well beaten to death argument of whether Adderall creates a performance advantage.
Question
Posts
3178
Joined
6/26/2014
Location
FR
7/28/2014 1:11pm
DonM wrote:
I call BS....Stewart wasn't at Washougal
pilotdude wrote:
Yes, it seems like it would be hard to lose a credential at a race you don't even go to.

I started to question from the second half of the first sentence. "I can't divulge my resource"? My source(s) !

Well somebody tricked U buddy.
7/28/2014 2:00pm Edited Date/Time 7/28/2014 5:35pm
Ramrod wrote:
Well, Stewy is getting older and it's hard to stay near the top without some extra help?
he's not as old as Reed.

+ this thread is shit and most of the posters here are garbage. This site is full of a-holes who aren't fit to lick the mud off Stewies tires, so they hope against hope he's done something wrong and they can climb on a high horse and feel like somebody for 2 minutes on vital. Then it's back to their meaningless lives as nobodies.
FALCON70
Posts
60
Joined
5/17/2009
Location
Conover, NC, USA
7/28/2014 2:22pm
we all have seen when top players of any sport walkout or there is a lockout. Or the sport is protesting. 'THEY NEVER RECOVERED.'
Basketball, baseball, football in late 80's and early 90s. These sports where bigger and more money. one by one fans stoped going, sponsors started pulling out. Their ticket sells went from sold out, months later you can get their tickets at a gas station. tour de france television wise probably had less viewers than in previous years.
Just think motocross is smaller than those sports.

We all shouldn't let this happen to our sport. we race, thats what we do is. we race. we see a mountain we find a way through it.

also there is stuff that you can buy off the shelf at any health store or big box store today thats legal this year. But, next year it is not legal. Just think if they say a rider can't take a energy drink. energy drink is consider a drug or unfair advantage.

On the other hand a rider should be like yea this is what I was taking proscribed or off the shelf. Now I'm not and I did another test its all out of my system lets continue racing.
suspension and all the fines is all bull shit and all hype. it don't hurt the player but it hurts the sport.



JUST DOCKED THEM SOME POINTS, BUT LET THEM CONTINUE RACING.


"IT'S WHAT WE DO, WE RACE" quote by BIG JAMES STEWART
hvaughn88
Posts
8361
Joined
6/19/2013
Location
Conway, AR, USA
7/28/2014 2:26pm
FALCON70 wrote:
we all have seen when top players of any sport walkout or there is a lockout. Or the sport is protesting. [b]'THEY NEVER RECOVERED.[/b]' Basketball, baseball...
we all have seen when top players of any sport walkout or there is a lockout. Or the sport is protesting. 'THEY NEVER RECOVERED.'
Basketball, baseball, football in late 80's and early 90s. These sports where bigger and more money. one by one fans stoped going, sponsors started pulling out. Their ticket sells went from sold out, months later you can get their tickets at a gas station. tour de france television wise probably had less viewers than in previous years.
Just think motocross is smaller than those sports.

We all shouldn't let this happen to our sport. we race, thats what we do is. we race. we see a mountain we find a way through it.

also there is stuff that you can buy off the shelf at any health store or big box store today thats legal this year. But, next year it is not legal. Just think if they say a rider can't take a energy drink. energy drink is consider a drug or unfair advantage.

On the other hand a rider should be like yea this is what I was taking proscribed or off the shelf. Now I'm not and I did another test its all out of my system lets continue racing.
suspension and all the fines is all bull shit and all hype. it don't hurt the player but it hurts the sport.



JUST DOCKED THEM SOME POINTS, BUT LET THEM CONTINUE RACING.


"IT'S WHAT WE DO, WE RACE" quote by BIG JAMES STEWART
are you saying football hasn't recovered? I hope not, because that's not even close to being true.
enketchum
Posts
4397
Joined
2/6/2012
Location
Pasadena, CA, USA
7/28/2014 2:41pm
Oh no, no more talk about Docking
7/28/2014 3:14pm
Just to throw more fuel on the fire incase it hasn't been mentioned, the Asterisk Medical Unit provides free IVs after the races. Has to be a hell of a lot cheaper than hiring a nurse and flying her to the race each weekend.


"It can't be proven that he was taking it between motos, be we all know he was" - Matthes

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