2026 450 Shootout

10/21/2025 8:47am

I've got a 2023 KX450 got a pro circuit pipe bunch of other aftermarket parts on it but I've weighed my bike three different times on two different scales and it's a legitimate $232 lb without gas That's about 3 and 1/2 lb lighter than stock and it's noticeable to me and it's noticeable in a good way and I guarantee you if I could drop my bike down to 225 lb I would do it which I can do if I want to spend about $3,000 on titanium and a select few other carbon fiber parts.. Would it make it a ill handling bike? I doubt it.. It might, but I don't think I'm fast enough to notice that a 10 lb lighter bike suddenly handles worse because it's lighter than it was stock.. All I've noticed so far with a 3 and 1/2 lb reduction is all positive..just my pov!

1
1
GrapeApe
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Mc Kinney, TX US
10/21/2025 8:49am
Maybe so.. but I guarantee you if you ask 10 racers if they would rather race a bike that weighed 240lbs or one the weighed 225lbs...

Maybe so.. but I guarantee you if you ask 10 racers if they would rather race a bike that weighed 240lbs or one the weighed 225lbs 9 out of 10 would choose the lighter bike!

EAmato88 wrote:
You cant confidently say that though. What if that 15 pounds had a severe affect on handling, you think they would still choose the lighter bike...

You cant confidently say that though. What if that 15 pounds had a severe affect on handling, you think they would still choose the lighter bike? I think not. For yours people have complained about front end feel on AER equipped KTM's and most people know its due to the fork being light weight. If it was possible or profitable to make a 450 weigh 225 pounds, dont you think they would do it?

The KTM's back in 2019-2020 2021 ECT did weigh somewhere around $22 to 225 lb and let's not forget all the highest level factory riders bikes...

The KTM's back in 2019-2020 2021 ECT did weigh somewhere around $22 to 225 lb and let's not forget all the highest level factory riders bikes that are sub 230lbs which I guarantee you a bunch of them are close to 224 225 lbs so I don't know all the top pros and the top amateurs are making their bikes as light as possible I guess you can say they'd know a thing or two about how about by candles and feels It may choose to drop weight on all their bikes

Theoretically there is an ideal weight for performance, reliability and cost. The current bikes could maybe lose a pound or two but nothing drastic before one or all of those three areas are affected.

 

1
MPJC
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2016
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10/21/2025 9:39am

I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to be around 10 pounds. But I can notice relatively small changes in suspension settings. 

9
1
3strokemx
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10/21/2025 10:09am
MPJC wrote:
I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to...

I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to be around 10 pounds. But I can notice relatively small changes in suspension settings. 

You're not considering a correlated variable.............  You are getting more tired while your bike becomes lighter.

5

The Shop

Luxon MX
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Fantasy
10/21/2025 10:30am

Ah, the great weight debate…

It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to slow down (brakes), easier to corner, easier to handle/throw around, etc. This is simply not debatable, it’s just physics. Regardless of whether you can feel it or not, it’s there. A lighter bike will take less effort to ride faster.

Some might argue that a heavy bike is more stable, and that is sort of true. Ideally, a bike’s un-sprung weight would be insignificant relative to the sprung weight and you’d get a lot of stability that way as the wheels would just react to the ground without much movement in the chassis/rider. But that’s not the case on a heavy bike, nor a light bike as the un-sprung weight is always going to be a significant portion of the sprung weight. Properly tuned suspension is the best you can hope for on either case. And in either case, you’re not changing the rider weight, so an overall lighter bike is still winning in stability. 

As @GrapeApe mentions, for an OEM bike you’ve got to optimize performance, weight, and reliability for a set cost. You can only get so far with that as you’re cost limited, so there’s not a lot of room to lose weight. The KTM 2016-2022 chassis was really light, but in 2023 they revised things to make them more reliable, most notably the wheels/spokes as there were lots of complaints about the spokes coming loose and breaking. That added weight, but regained the needed reliability. 

But that doesn’t mean there’s no room for weight savings. On that same 2023 chassis, KTM revised the linkage bearings, bolts, etc. so the bearings and seals in the knuckle were all the same and shared bearings and seals with the swingarm and other parts of the bike. This cut costs, but those bigger bolts and bearings were a lot heavier. In 2025, they simply went back to the 2016 bearing design and spun it as reducing rigidity, which was total horseshit. They just needed some marketing nonsense to justify their design change (reversion to the old design once they realized they screwed up). 

10
Saz
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10/21/2025 10:43am
MPJC wrote:
I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to...

I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to be around 10 pounds. But I can notice relatively small changes in suspension settings. 

Personally on an MX tank I don' t tend to notice the difference personally, but on an off road tank I can definitely feel it. Not a world ending issue, just kind of like a 'huh, interesting "

2
1
10/21/2025 11:01am
MPJC wrote:
I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to...

I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to be around 10 pounds. But I can notice relatively small changes in suspension settings. 

The funniest thing is when you actually go ride, you get dirt on your bike. Especially if you are riding a track thats actually prepped, you can have 20 lbs of dirt on your fenders, swingarm, etc lol. 

Spending all this $ on titanium shit to save 3lbs has always been the dumbest thing to me. 

9
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3strokemx
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10/21/2025 11:16am Edited Date/Time 10/21/2025 11:17am

Losing 1lb of rider weight = dropping 3.14lb of bike weight.  I can't explain the physics but it's true if you're over 30 years old.

2
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3strokemx
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10/21/2025 11:18am Edited Date/Time 10/21/2025 11:26am
MPJC wrote:
I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to...

I'm amazed that anyone can notice a few pounds. I can't notice a difference between a full vs almost empty fuel tank, and that's got to be around 10 pounds. But I can notice relatively small changes in suspension settings. 

The funniest thing is when you actually go ride, you get dirt on your bike. Especially if you are riding a track thats actually prepped, you...

The funniest thing is when you actually go ride, you get dirt on your bike. Especially if you are riding a track thats actually prepped, you can have 20 lbs of dirt on your fenders, swingarm, etc lol. 

Spending all this $ on titanium shit to save 3lbs has always been the dumbest thing to me. 

your muddy bike would still be 3lb lighter with the Ti

3
4
GPrider
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10/21/2025 11:18am
The funniest thing is when you actually go ride, you get dirt on your bike. Especially if you are riding a track thats actually prepped, you...

The funniest thing is when you actually go ride, you get dirt on your bike. Especially if you are riding a track thats actually prepped, you can have 20 lbs of dirt on your fenders, swingarm, etc lol. 

Spending all this $ on titanium shit to save 3lbs has always been the dumbest thing to me. 

so true, the whole conversation is silly worrying about a couple pounds and then hitting a fresh prepped track it all goes out the window!

3
Saz
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10/21/2025 11:26am
3strokemx wrote:

Losing 1lb of rider weight = dropping 3.14lb of bike weight.  I can't explain the physics but it's true if you're over 30 years old.

Rider weight is such a big factor. Im 240 pounds I matched speed with a guy who was probably 100 pounds lighter than me on the same jump on us both on 450s. He cleared it, I came up short maybe 10 feet. When Im on my 250f Im wringing the life out of it, especially here at altitude to clear anything. 

Trying to get back to my fighting weight of 220 anything lower and my life is miserable trying to maintain.

1
1
Timo
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10/21/2025 1:34pm
Luxon MX wrote:
Ah, the great weight debate…It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to...

Ah, the great weight debate…

It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to slow down (brakes), easier to corner, easier to handle/throw around, etc. This is simply not debatable, it’s just physics. Regardless of whether you can feel it or not, it’s there. A lighter bike will take less effort to ride faster.

Some might argue that a heavy bike is more stable, and that is sort of true. Ideally, a bike’s un-sprung weight would be insignificant relative to the sprung weight and you’d get a lot of stability that way as the wheels would just react to the ground without much movement in the chassis/rider. But that’s not the case on a heavy bike, nor a light bike as the un-sprung weight is always going to be a significant portion of the sprung weight. Properly tuned suspension is the best you can hope for on either case. And in either case, you’re not changing the rider weight, so an overall lighter bike is still winning in stability. 

As @GrapeApe mentions, for an OEM bike you’ve got to optimize performance, weight, and reliability for a set cost. You can only get so far with that as you’re cost limited, so there’s not a lot of room to lose weight. The KTM 2016-2022 chassis was really light, but in 2023 they revised things to make them more reliable, most notably the wheels/spokes as there were lots of complaints about the spokes coming loose and breaking. That added weight, but regained the needed reliability. 

But that doesn’t mean there’s no room for weight savings. On that same 2023 chassis, KTM revised the linkage bearings, bolts, etc. so the bearings and seals in the knuckle were all the same and shared bearings and seals with the swingarm and other parts of the bike. This cut costs, but those bigger bolts and bearings were a lot heavier. In 2025, they simply went back to the 2016 bearing design and spun it as reducing rigidity, which was total horseshit. They just needed some marketing nonsense to justify their design change (reversion to the old design once they realized they screwed up). 

This may be true when talking about physics, but does 10lbs really matter on a dirt bike? I race a YZ450FX and at the beginning of the season I was out of shape, had double arm/wrist surgeries in the fall, I was so tired the last hour I couldn't stand. This summer I could stand until the last 30 min or so, and this fall I could stand the whole race. Fast forward to a couple weeks ago I could easily outride everyone I was riding with, even though I was on the heaviest bike. I'd say personal fitness and seat time are way more important than a 225lb bike.       

1
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30minmotos
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Rising Sun , MD US
10/21/2025 1:47pm
Luxon MX wrote:
Ah, the great weight debate…It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to...

Ah, the great weight debate…

It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to slow down (brakes), easier to corner, easier to handle/throw around, etc. This is simply not debatable, it’s just physics. Regardless of whether you can feel it or not, it’s there. A lighter bike will take less effort to ride faster.

Some might argue that a heavy bike is more stable, and that is sort of true. Ideally, a bike’s un-sprung weight would be insignificant relative to the sprung weight and you’d get a lot of stability that way as the wheels would just react to the ground without much movement in the chassis/rider. But that’s not the case on a heavy bike, nor a light bike as the un-sprung weight is always going to be a significant portion of the sprung weight. Properly tuned suspension is the best you can hope for on either case. And in either case, you’re not changing the rider weight, so an overall lighter bike is still winning in stability. 

As @GrapeApe mentions, for an OEM bike you’ve got to optimize performance, weight, and reliability for a set cost. You can only get so far with that as you’re cost limited, so there’s not a lot of room to lose weight. The KTM 2016-2022 chassis was really light, but in 2023 they revised things to make them more reliable, most notably the wheels/spokes as there were lots of complaints about the spokes coming loose and breaking. That added weight, but regained the needed reliability. 

But that doesn’t mean there’s no room for weight savings. On that same 2023 chassis, KTM revised the linkage bearings, bolts, etc. so the bearings and seals in the knuckle were all the same and shared bearings and seals with the swingarm and other parts of the bike. This cut costs, but those bigger bolts and bearings were a lot heavier. In 2025, they simply went back to the 2016 bearing design and spun it as reducing rigidity, which was total horseshit. They just needed some marketing nonsense to justify their design change (reversion to the old design once they realized they screwed up). 

Timo wrote:
This may be true when talking about physics, but does 10lbs really matter on a dirt bike? I race a YZ450FX and at the beginning of...

This may be true when talking about physics, but does 10lbs really matter on a dirt bike? I race a YZ450FX and at the beginning of the season I was out of shape, had double arm/wrist surgeries in the fall, I was so tired the last hour I couldn't stand. This summer I could stand until the last 30 min or so, and this fall I could stand the whole race. Fast forward to a couple weeks ago I could easily outride everyone I was riding with, even though I was on the heaviest bike. I'd say personal fitness and seat time are way more important than a 225lb bike.       

I just love how it mattered literally the entire time right up until the bikes got all the dumb ass electronics and gained a bunch of weight then the marketing and mags started on about how weight doesn’t matter lol.


And now you all repeat it…

8
1
10/21/2025 2:08pm

I’m surprised no one has considered how much easier/better feeling a 250f rides compared to a 450. What’s the weight difference between the ktm 250 and 450? A few lbs? If rotational mass is that noticeable, I’d feel like a lighter bike would also be noticeable. I will say how light a bike feels while riding is much more important than what the scale says 

6
Timo
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Wichita, KS US
10/21/2025 3:32pm
Luxon MX wrote:
Ah, the great weight debate…It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to...

Ah, the great weight debate…

It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to slow down (brakes), easier to corner, easier to handle/throw around, etc. This is simply not debatable, it’s just physics. Regardless of whether you can feel it or not, it’s there. A lighter bike will take less effort to ride faster.

Some might argue that a heavy bike is more stable, and that is sort of true. Ideally, a bike’s un-sprung weight would be insignificant relative to the sprung weight and you’d get a lot of stability that way as the wheels would just react to the ground without much movement in the chassis/rider. But that’s not the case on a heavy bike, nor a light bike as the un-sprung weight is always going to be a significant portion of the sprung weight. Properly tuned suspension is the best you can hope for on either case. And in either case, you’re not changing the rider weight, so an overall lighter bike is still winning in stability. 

As @GrapeApe mentions, for an OEM bike you’ve got to optimize performance, weight, and reliability for a set cost. You can only get so far with that as you’re cost limited, so there’s not a lot of room to lose weight. The KTM 2016-2022 chassis was really light, but in 2023 they revised things to make them more reliable, most notably the wheels/spokes as there were lots of complaints about the spokes coming loose and breaking. That added weight, but regained the needed reliability. 

But that doesn’t mean there’s no room for weight savings. On that same 2023 chassis, KTM revised the linkage bearings, bolts, etc. so the bearings and seals in the knuckle were all the same and shared bearings and seals with the swingarm and other parts of the bike. This cut costs, but those bigger bolts and bearings were a lot heavier. In 2025, they simply went back to the 2016 bearing design and spun it as reducing rigidity, which was total horseshit. They just needed some marketing nonsense to justify their design change (reversion to the old design once they realized they screwed up). 

Timo wrote:
This may be true when talking about physics, but does 10lbs really matter on a dirt bike? I race a YZ450FX and at the beginning of...

This may be true when talking about physics, but does 10lbs really matter on a dirt bike? I race a YZ450FX and at the beginning of the season I was out of shape, had double arm/wrist surgeries in the fall, I was so tired the last hour I couldn't stand. This summer I could stand until the last 30 min or so, and this fall I could stand the whole race. Fast forward to a couple weeks ago I could easily outride everyone I was riding with, even though I was on the heaviest bike. I'd say personal fitness and seat time are way more important than a 225lb bike.       

30minmotos wrote:
I just love how it mattered literally the entire time right up until the bikes got all the dumb ass electronics and gained a bunch of...

I just love how it mattered literally the entire time right up until the bikes got all the dumb ass electronics and gained a bunch of weight then the marketing and mags started on about how weight doesn’t matter lol.


And now you all repeat it…

I had light 250 2-strokes back in the day, still no issues with a 25lbs heavier fx.

1
Timo
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10/21/2025 3:34pm
I’m surprised no one has considered how much easier/better feeling a 250f rides compared to a 450. What’s the weight difference between the ktm 250 and...

I’m surprised no one has considered how much easier/better feeling a 250f rides compared to a 450. What’s the weight difference between the ktm 250 and 450? A few lbs? If rotational mass is that noticeable, I’d feel like a lighter bike would also be noticeable. I will say how light a bike feels while riding is much more important than what the scale says 

I have a 250f and two 450's, I don't ever feel this difference in rotational mass everyone talks about. I do notice how much shorter the gearing is on the 250's, sooo much shifting...

1
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mxaniac
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10/21/2025 3:47pm
3strokemx wrote:

Losing 1lb of rider weight = dropping 3.14lb of bike weight.  I can't explain the physics but it's true if you're over 30 years old.

I think it's from all the pie.

1
MPJC
Posts
2016
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CA
Fantasy
10/21/2025 3:55pm
I’m surprised no one has considered how much easier/better feeling a 250f rides compared to a 450. What’s the weight difference between the ktm 250 and...

I’m surprised no one has considered how much easier/better feeling a 250f rides compared to a 450. What’s the weight difference between the ktm 250 and 450? A few lbs? If rotational mass is that noticeable, I’d feel like a lighter bike would also be noticeable. I will say how light a bike feels while riding is much more important than what the scale says 

I rode my buddy's fairly new CRF250RX this past weekend. It's heavier than the motocross model since it has the kickstand, bigger tank, and I'm not sure what else. I suspect it's heavier on the scale than my 2017.5 KTM 450 factory edition but it feels lighter to ride. The rotating mass certainly makes a difference in the feeling of weight, especially in low speed corners. My 450 just felt like more bike, even if it's lighter on the scale. But it's not a huge difference. My 450 by no means felt like a tank when I got back on it.

2
mxaniac
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10/21/2025 4:01pm
Luxon MX wrote:
Ah, the great weight debate…It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to...

Ah, the great weight debate…

It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to slow down (brakes), easier to corner, easier to handle/throw around, etc. This is simply not debatable, it’s just physics. Regardless of whether you can feel it or not, it’s there. A lighter bike will take less effort to ride faster.

Some might argue that a heavy bike is more stable, and that is sort of true. Ideally, a bike’s un-sprung weight would be insignificant relative to the sprung weight and you’d get a lot of stability that way as the wheels would just react to the ground without much movement in the chassis/rider. But that’s not the case on a heavy bike, nor a light bike as the un-sprung weight is always going to be a significant portion of the sprung weight. Properly tuned suspension is the best you can hope for on either case. And in either case, you’re not changing the rider weight, so an overall lighter bike is still winning in stability. 

As @GrapeApe mentions, for an OEM bike you’ve got to optimize performance, weight, and reliability for a set cost. You can only get so far with that as you’re cost limited, so there’s not a lot of room to lose weight. The KTM 2016-2022 chassis was really light, but in 2023 they revised things to make them more reliable, most notably the wheels/spokes as there were lots of complaints about the spokes coming loose and breaking. That added weight, but regained the needed reliability. 

But that doesn’t mean there’s no room for weight savings. On that same 2023 chassis, KTM revised the linkage bearings, bolts, etc. so the bearings and seals in the knuckle were all the same and shared bearings and seals with the swingarm and other parts of the bike. This cut costs, but those bigger bolts and bearings were a lot heavier. In 2025, they simply went back to the 2016 bearing design and spun it as reducing rigidity, which was total horseshit. They just needed some marketing nonsense to justify their design change (reversion to the old design once they realized they screwed up). 

I agree with everything you said, but it's also true that weight is one of several factors involved in a direction change.  At low speed a heavy bike will always feel like a heavy bike, but the current gen Honda is both heavier, and lighter feeling than just a few generations back when at speed. They've all done a really good job in recent times at playing the 2 liter bottle turned into a rocket game.

https://www.timhesterberg.net/water-bottle-rockets/how-to-make

1
Kyle978
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Dirt, NM US
10/21/2025 4:06pm

All I know is the current 450’s are fuckin sickkkk.

6
Forty
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10/21/2025 4:06pm

I've never been a weight weenie on MX - but I'm a huge weight weenie on MTB - 

 

For MX - a good rider triangle and properly set suspension is all I need, if I feel confident, weight of the bike isn't a thing - hell, I did a lot of good riding and winning on my 2009 yz450f - fer krist sake! 

2
PRM31
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10/21/2025 4:12pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2025 4:12pm

At ~193lbs, an early 80s RM125 felt REALLY light compared to the bikes today. Between the weight and the engine feel there is almost no comparison. But bikes today are really good overall.

Luxon MX
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Fantasy
10/21/2025 5:02pm
Luxon MX wrote:
Ah, the great weight debate…It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to...

Ah, the great weight debate…

It all boils down to simple physics. A lighter bike takes less energy to, and therefor is, faster to accelerate, faster to slow down (brakes), easier to corner, easier to handle/throw around, etc. This is simply not debatable, it’s just physics. Regardless of whether you can feel it or not, it’s there. A lighter bike will take less effort to ride faster.

Some might argue that a heavy bike is more stable, and that is sort of true. Ideally, a bike’s un-sprung weight would be insignificant relative to the sprung weight and you’d get a lot of stability that way as the wheels would just react to the ground without much movement in the chassis/rider. But that’s not the case on a heavy bike, nor a light bike as the un-sprung weight is always going to be a significant portion of the sprung weight. Properly tuned suspension is the best you can hope for on either case. And in either case, you’re not changing the rider weight, so an overall lighter bike is still winning in stability. 

As @GrapeApe mentions, for an OEM bike you’ve got to optimize performance, weight, and reliability for a set cost. You can only get so far with that as you’re cost limited, so there’s not a lot of room to lose weight. The KTM 2016-2022 chassis was really light, but in 2023 they revised things to make them more reliable, most notably the wheels/spokes as there were lots of complaints about the spokes coming loose and breaking. That added weight, but regained the needed reliability. 

But that doesn’t mean there’s no room for weight savings. On that same 2023 chassis, KTM revised the linkage bearings, bolts, etc. so the bearings and seals in the knuckle were all the same and shared bearings and seals with the swingarm and other parts of the bike. This cut costs, but those bigger bolts and bearings were a lot heavier. In 2025, they simply went back to the 2016 bearing design and spun it as reducing rigidity, which was total horseshit. They just needed some marketing nonsense to justify their design change (reversion to the old design once they realized they screwed up). 

Timo wrote:
This may be true when talking about physics, but does 10lbs really matter on a dirt bike? I race a YZ450FX and at the beginning of...

This may be true when talking about physics, but does 10lbs really matter on a dirt bike? I race a YZ450FX and at the beginning of the season I was out of shape, had double arm/wrist surgeries in the fall, I was so tired the last hour I couldn't stand. This summer I could stand until the last 30 min or so, and this fall I could stand the whole race. Fast forward to a couple weeks ago I could easily outride everyone I was riding with, even though I was on the heaviest bike. I'd say personal fitness and seat time are way more important than a 225lb bike.       

It absolutely matters. The laws of physics don't just turn off because it's a dirt bike...And of course being in shape makes a huge difference. There's a few posts in this topic that seem to frame this as an either or scenario, which is very much isn't. You can lose weight, get in better shape, re-valve your suspension, whatever else, AND get a lighter bike. All will make you faster. Debating what is more important is fine, but arguing that the weight of the bike is irrelevant just isn't right. 

10 pounds off a 230 pound bike is more than 4%. That's significant! Think about what you're doing when hitting a whoop section, when the bike gets kicked out, when scrubbing a jump, when going through ruts, etc.; you're basically wrestling this 230 pound machine the whole time you're riding it. If you're wrestling a 220 pound machine instead, it gets that much easier, plus it accelerates and brakes faster. And the faster a rider you are, the more important this is as you're effectively wrestling it harder. If you're just rolling around in a parking lot, weight doesn't matter much. But if you're really pushing it around a moto track, it makes a big difference. 

5
Vet57
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10/21/2025 11:07pm
mxaniac wrote:

I think it's from all the pie.

Did someone mention pie ?

1
mx317
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TN US
10/22/2025 6:56am
3strokemx wrote:

Losing 1lb of rider weight = dropping 3.14lb of bike weight.  I can't explain the physics but it's true if you're over 30 years old.

Well, I've lost 153 lbs of bike weight lol

2
Timo
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10/22/2025 6:57am
Luxon MX wrote:
It absolutely matters. The laws of physics don't just turn off because it's a dirt bike...And of course being in shape makes a huge difference. There's...

It absolutely matters. The laws of physics don't just turn off because it's a dirt bike...And of course being in shape makes a huge difference. There's a few posts in this topic that seem to frame this as an either or scenario, which is very much isn't. You can lose weight, get in better shape, re-valve your suspension, whatever else, AND get a lighter bike. All will make you faster. Debating what is more important is fine, but arguing that the weight of the bike is irrelevant just isn't right. 

10 pounds off a 230 pound bike is more than 4%. That's significant! Think about what you're doing when hitting a whoop section, when the bike gets kicked out, when scrubbing a jump, when going through ruts, etc.; you're basically wrestling this 230 pound machine the whole time you're riding it. If you're wrestling a 220 pound machine instead, it gets that much easier, plus it accelerates and brakes faster. And the faster a rider you are, the more important this is as you're effectively wrestling it harder. If you're just rolling around in a parking lot, weight doesn't matter much. But if you're really pushing it around a moto track, it makes a big difference. 

I didn't mean it turns off the laws of physics, I meant that the difference in effort required between them is insignificant in an amateur level, even in a 2+ hour race if the rider is in decent shape. I'd argue that rider physical shape, weight placement, engine character, and chassis comfort are more important than +/- 15lbs total bike weight. I'll also take a bike that weighs more that I don't have to touch the spokes in 200 hours of smashing into rocks and roots. Shoot, my cheater tires I put on my bike probably added 10lbs...

2
3strokemx
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2306
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9/2/2010
Location
US
10/22/2025 7:08am
3strokemx wrote:

Losing 1lb of rider weight = dropping 3.14lb of bike weight.  I can't explain the physics but it's true if you're over 30 years old.

mx317 wrote:

Well, I've lost 153 lbs of bike weight lol

Feels like you're riding a pitbike now, doesn't it? 😅

1
1
GPrider
Posts
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La Mesa, CA US
10/22/2025 8:06am
Luxon MX wrote:
It absolutely matters. The laws of physics don't just turn off because it's a dirt bike...And of course being in shape makes a huge difference. There's...

It absolutely matters. The laws of physics don't just turn off because it's a dirt bike...And of course being in shape makes a huge difference. There's a few posts in this topic that seem to frame this as an either or scenario, which is very much isn't. You can lose weight, get in better shape, re-valve your suspension, whatever else, AND get a lighter bike. All will make you faster. Debating what is more important is fine, but arguing that the weight of the bike is irrelevant just isn't right. 

10 pounds off a 230 pound bike is more than 4%. That's significant! Think about what you're doing when hitting a whoop section, when the bike gets kicked out, when scrubbing a jump, when going through ruts, etc.; you're basically wrestling this 230 pound machine the whole time you're riding it. If you're wrestling a 220 pound machine instead, it gets that much easier, plus it accelerates and brakes faster. And the faster a rider you are, the more important this is as you're effectively wrestling it harder. If you're just rolling around in a parking lot, weight doesn't matter much. But if you're really pushing it around a moto track, it makes a big difference. 

but it is just as important as to where that 4% is on the bike. 10 lbs, or 4% hanging off the rear up high is different than in the center of the bike down low. So the theory is not apples to apples. I don't think 4% is relevant. I will take the 4% low and centered over 2% up high and back. Your statement is true on paper, but in the real world its really minor and probably not noticeable to any of us if the weight is distributed properly. 

1
30minmotos
Posts
698
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Location
Rising Sun , MD US
10/22/2025 9:27am
Luxon MX wrote:
It absolutely matters. The laws of physics don't just turn off because it's a dirt bike...And of course being in shape makes a huge difference. There's...

It absolutely matters. The laws of physics don't just turn off because it's a dirt bike...And of course being in shape makes a huge difference. There's a few posts in this topic that seem to frame this as an either or scenario, which is very much isn't. You can lose weight, get in better shape, re-valve your suspension, whatever else, AND get a lighter bike. All will make you faster. Debating what is more important is fine, but arguing that the weight of the bike is irrelevant just isn't right. 

10 pounds off a 230 pound bike is more than 4%. That's significant! Think about what you're doing when hitting a whoop section, when the bike gets kicked out, when scrubbing a jump, when going through ruts, etc.; you're basically wrestling this 230 pound machine the whole time you're riding it. If you're wrestling a 220 pound machine instead, it gets that much easier, plus it accelerates and brakes faster. And the faster a rider you are, the more important this is as you're effectively wrestling it harder. If you're just rolling around in a parking lot, weight doesn't matter much. But if you're really pushing it around a moto track, it makes a big difference. 

GPrider wrote:
but it is just as important as to where that 4% is on the bike. 10 lbs, or 4% hanging off the rear up high is...

but it is just as important as to where that 4% is on the bike. 10 lbs, or 4% hanging off the rear up high is different than in the center of the bike down low. So the theory is not apples to apples. I don't think 4% is relevant. I will take the 4% low and centered over 2% up high and back. Your statement is true on paper, but in the real world its really minor and probably not noticeable to any of us if the weight is distributed properly. 

Straw man argument.🤷‍♂️

1
10/22/2025 10:17am
EAmato88 wrote:
You cant confidently say that though. What if that 15 pounds had a severe affect on handling, you think they would still choose the lighter bike...

You cant confidently say that though. What if that 15 pounds had a severe affect on handling, you think they would still choose the lighter bike? I think not. For yours people have complained about front end feel on AER equipped KTM's and most people know its due to the fork being light weight. If it was possible or profitable to make a 450 weigh 225 pounds, dont you think they would do it?

The KTM's back in 2019-2020 2021 ECT did weigh somewhere around $22 to 225 lb and let's not forget all the highest level factory riders bikes...

The KTM's back in 2019-2020 2021 ECT did weigh somewhere around $22 to 225 lb and let's not forget all the highest level factory riders bikes that are sub 230lbs which I guarantee you a bunch of them are close to 224 225 lbs so I don't know all the top pros and the top amateurs are making their bikes as light as possible I guess you can say they'd know a thing or two about how about by candles and feels It may choose to drop weight on all their bikes

EAmato88 wrote:
Youre still comparing apples to oranges. Factory teams are combining light bikes with all of the FACTORY components to go with it and the support that...

Youre still comparing apples to oranges. Factory teams are combining light bikes with all of the FACTORY components to go with it and the support that it takes to make the bike work. How many hundreds of hours of testing and tuning goes into that factory 220lb bike? Most of vital probably cant count that high. Not to mention 99.9% of dirt bike riders in this world would ride a factory bike and hate it. Thats not even addressing what it could cost to use materials that would allow weight to drop that low. You cant build factory bikes for the public......

I'm not comparing apples to oranges or anything like that I'll simply give an examples of factory level riders making their bikes light as possible and you go off on this r&d and factory bike components and all this crap and whatever I also give examples of your average racer Would choose a lighter bike over a heavier one as well.. I don't know maybe you're one of those guys that just likes to argue for argument's sake but I'm not into all that I'll just simply stating I wish the bikes were lighter and then you got everybody chiming in about performance and rideability and the budget of the high level factor riders and blah blah blah.. My original post wasn't anything about factory level bikes being lighter My original post was about I wish the bikes were lighter because they've become so heavy period so don't tell me I'm comparing apples to oranges cuz you obviously don't know what the hell you're talking about You just arguing for the sake of argument I guess hell I don't I'm done here

2

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